European Tourism To US Plunges (ft.com) 284
An anonymous reader shares a report: The number of European travellers visiting the US has fallen sharply as political and economic tension and fears of a hostile border under President Donald Trump threaten the world's most lucrative air routes.
Visitors from western Europe who stayed at least one night in the US fell by 17 per cent in March from a year ago, according to the International Trade Administration. Travel from some countries -- including Ireland, Norway and Germany -- fell by more than 20 per cent, an FT analysis of ITA data showed.
The trend poses a threat to the US tourism industry, which accounts for 2.5 per cent of the country's GDP. Some airlines and hotel groups have warned of waning demand for transatlantic travel and a "bad buzz" about visiting the US. The total number of overseas visitors travelling to the US dropped by 12 per cent year-on-year in March, the steepest decline since March 2021 when the travel sector was reeling from pandemic restrictions, according to the ITA data.
Visitors from western Europe who stayed at least one night in the US fell by 17 per cent in March from a year ago, according to the International Trade Administration. Travel from some countries -- including Ireland, Norway and Germany -- fell by more than 20 per cent, an FT analysis of ITA data showed.
The trend poses a threat to the US tourism industry, which accounts for 2.5 per cent of the country's GDP. Some airlines and hotel groups have warned of waning demand for transatlantic travel and a "bad buzz" about visiting the US. The total number of overseas visitors travelling to the US dropped by 12 per cent year-on-year in March, the steepest decline since March 2021 when the travel sector was reeling from pandemic restrictions, according to the ITA data.
Winning (Score:5, Insightful)
Are we great yet?
Re: Winning (Score:2)
I expect a lot of people are in our situation. I expect it to drop further. Being nice to people does translate to income. But I am probably preaching to the choir here.
Re:Winning (Score:5, Insightful)
This is exactly what America voted for. They just didn't know (realize) it at the time (despite plenty of warning by others around them).
Half of America knew perfectly well what the other half was voting for. Now we have to suffer for it along with them.
Re:Winning (Score:5, Insightful)
This is often claimed, but how could they not know? It was covered everywhere, and people opposed to Trump were yelling it from the rooftops.
I genuinely think the issue wasn't that they didn't know, it's that they didn't care. As long as MAGA was the party of "owning the libs" it didn't matter what the facts were.
I also think Republicans just don't in general think government is important. They don't understand its role, they treat it purely as a powerful entity to be swayed one way or another, rather than as an instrument that whose smooth and smart operation is critical to the well being of the people it serves. Indeed, many will be confused by that last sentence and the idea government serves to begin with. As a result they simply don't take seriously the idea that a government that's run by a fascist toddler is going to directly harm people. They look at communist regimes and think the problem was the government was "too big" (itself a rather handwavey phrase) rather than that it wasn't democratically accountable and had rotten people at the top.
And now, reluctantly, they're learning.
The most important thing the next non-fascist US government can do is introduce a single payer healthcare or, even better, a federally owned and operated national health service. Put good government directly into people's lives. Make it very clear that the people you vote for will have a direct impact on your welfare. If you want to ensure Americans make good decisions, you need to make sure they know they're the ones who'll face the consequences if they don't.
Re:Winning (Score:5, Interesting)
A lot of it is being freaked out by "woke". Talking to an acquaintance the other day here in Canada. While calling Trump crazy, he did say the only good thing that Trump did was attack the "woke". Then started ranting about queers, transvestites and such and how they've infiltrated the schools, women sports, passed laws about what you can say when it comes to pronons and such and for the first time in his life would vote Conservative. Didn't care about any other issues really, just attacking the "woke" Then he mentioned that now that he's retired and disabled, all he does is watch TV where he has become informed. He used to be pretty knowledgeable and fairly liberal until the last year or 2.
It's a problem, the right is very progressive when it comes to psychology and figuring out how to trigger peoples fears and such.
Re: (Score:2)
Re:Winning (Score:4, Insightful)
I agree, at least with most Canadian voters as generally we're literate and educated about the world. Seems it is a problem in the States where a surprising number of people are functionally illiterate and exposed to their propaganda about how special Americans are. And there are people here who get on the outraged bandwagon, often through social media. At that I think social media is one of the worse things to happen to society as all it does is fuel outrage to keep you there so they can serve up ads.
Re: Winning (Score:4)
Re:Winning (Score:5, Insightful)
It's about symbolism isn't it.
While there are always a few obsessives on both sides who will make a fuss about absolutely anything, most people who voted for Trump (form what I can tell at least) are anti-woke not so much because they are overtly against equal rights or fair treatment or anything like that, but rather they resent what they see as the people in power being more concerned with the rights of minorities than with the well-being of the majority of working class people.
Like with so many things in politics, its about what it represents, and people tend to react to symbolic things emotionally rather than intellectually.
For what's worth, I tend to think that a lot of the immigration debate is the same. People (on the whole) don't overtly dislike immigrants or want to be mean to people, but they have concerns about the social and economic impacts. They resent the fact that for years politicians have been lied about it, and wont take them seriously – every election (here in the UK and the US) they promise to bring it down and every time they do nothing (or make it worse). The voters then become extremely frustrated, and immigration quickly becomes a symbolic representation for their frustration with politicians who can't be trusted.
Re: (Score:3)
Re: (Score:3)
For what's worth, I tend to think that a lot of the immigration debate is the same. People (on the whole) don't overtly dislike immigrants or want to be mean to people, but they have concerns about the social and economic impacts.
Good grief. This is just the good old "I'm not racist but..." then append "I wouldn't want one of _them_ marrying my daughter." or "can't they just live in their own neighborhoods and not come to mine" or "wouldn't they be happier if we set up a colony for them in a part of the world that they're not even from and shipped them all there." or "can't they just go away?" or "can't we just stop them from breeding so that the problem (which we just said didn't exist because we're not racist) can go away?" or "ca
Re:Winning (Score:4, Insightful)
Ancillary to that, it is yet another scarecrow set up by the right wingnuts so they can tilt at it until it falls over and then declare some sort of silly victory.
A prime example of this is the weekend Fox talk show host currently masquerading as head of DoD. Whenever he does something particularly stupid, he claims it is example of him returning DoD to the "warfighter" ethic. He's primarily a weekend talk show host (he came from Fox, la Presidenta saw him and thought he had the right gumby temperament to do whatever he's told) and the only time he spent in the military was in Iraq "where he served as a civil affairs officer,"
His major actions was to remove the chair of the Joint Chiefs of Staff on the ground of suspicion of being black, the head of the Navy on the ground of suspecting she was female, and recently removing the commander of the base in Greenland also on suspicion of her being female.
He's actually a DEI hire, Demented, Enfeebled, and Idiotic, so naturally he was a shoo-in for la Presidenta's alleged administration.
Re: (Score:3)
Fearmongering and creating evil 'thems' who are the cause of all problems has long been a powerful tool for gaining power
Yeah, I'm a gun owner. I'm used to being treated that way.
Re:Winning (Score:5, Informative)
Hermann GÃring explained it. Tell people they are being attacked, keep them fearful. Woke, trans people, immigrants, The Left, keep inventing new things to terrify them with, and promise that you will address them.
Re: (Score:3)
>Liberal-leaning social media such as reddit and twitter started banning the conservatives because "toxic", "mysoginistic" etc.
Good. Do you know the types of posts you are defending? I hope so because then I can call you a scumbag.
>It's way more than woke.
Ah yes, the good old new definition, made up by MAGA, at least I know which team you are batting for. FYI, there is very little that is "woke", in the MAGA terminology of over the top sensitivity and reaction. I think that you will find the reaction
Re: (Score:3)
This is often claimed, but how could they not know? It was covered everywhere, and people opposed to Trump were yelling it from the rooftops.
Bill Ackman, in an interview with Bloomberg [bloomberg.com], had this to say of the markets tanking:
"I don't think this was foreseeable. I assumed economic rationality would be paramount."
The man supposedly graduated magna cum laude from Harvard which means he should have at least two brain cells, but if he truly did not see this coming he must have been self-deluding. The orange goon was telling everyone what he would do. To say this was unforeseeable is willful blind
Re:Winning (Score:5, Informative)
This is often claimed, but how could they not know? It was covered everywhere, and people opposed to Trump were yelling it from the rooftops.
I genuinely think the issue wasn't that they didn't know, it's that they didn't care. As long as MAGA was the party of "owning the libs" it didn't matter what the facts were.
First, you underestimate the extent to which mainstream conservatives (and even centrists) embed themselves inside the right-wing new bubble -- which is extraordinarily all-encompassing, from Fox/Breitbart/OAN/etc to social media bots to talk radio to podcasters (and in some cases alleged paid Russian assets) like Joe Rogan, Ben Shapiro, et all.
Second, you underestimate the extent to which the majority of Americans actively avoid exposing themselves to political information -- and therefore are more likely than anyone else to be exposed only to misinformation that they pick up from social media and other virally-spread channels -- and we know that the misinformation that is out there is very heavily biased to the right (especially, in particular, in favor of Trump) due to its primary source being Russian propaganda ministries.
I can't count the number of people I've either spoken to or seen interviewed by media sources who say that they don't have the time/energy/motivation to put forth the effort required to sift through "politics," and who then go on to say that some lie being promulgated by Trump sounds like it makes sense. These are the people whose willful ignorance drove them to overlook the obvious threats Trump poses to the economy, national security, democracy, and their own financial well-being, and to vote for the worst candidate in modern memory to run for the position.
I am shocked! (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
I've always wanted to visit Central America, perhaps they'd give me a free ticket to El Salvador.
Why would anyone visit the US right now when they can catch a train to Nuremberg any time?
Re:I am shocked! (Score:5, Insightful)
There's also "we're going to attack your economy because America fuck yeah!" and "we're going continually threaten to conquer one or more members of the EU", with a side order of, "we're going to help that brutal expansionist dictator to your east take over a country on your borders". Oh, and who can forget, "We're withdrawing the military support we deliberately forced you to be dependent on, and call you parasites for that dependency then get angry when you start to take care of your own defense".
Any money you give to the US is likely to be used to fund an attack on your own country at some point, whether economic or military.
Re: (Score:2)
No this happened before that. For the first time since the war countries have actual travel advisories in affect on the USA. Now those advisories are minor, mostly just advice to take care if you're LGBTQ, or to try and arrange for extra documentation if your passport has an X under gender (which is internationally recognised but recently resulted in people being turned around at the USA border).
But the point is people only read the headlines, and the headline was "travel advisory has been updated for the U
Re: (Score:3)
Re:I am shocked! (Score:5, Insightful)
>Nobody "forced" Europe to rip AmeriKKKa off on NATO.
The USA did, as part of an economic and political strategy that made it the top world power for decades.
>Totally tell us to fuck off and go your own way!
The entire world is now working on that, congratulations.
> get busy repairing our heavily damaged, nearly bankrupt country.
Oh. Bad news. The US has going down the shitter due to mismanagement as the 1% steal everything they can. You're not going to repair anything, Trump & Co are now ripping the copper wiring out of the walls. It's over, you're fucking done.
The GOOD news (for the Trump cult) is that they're too brainwashed to understand this and will be happy and cheer on the failure of the US as if it's a success.
Re:I am shocked! (Score:5, Informative)
I even saw an article where one of the 'gang' tattoos used by ICE as an example is actually on a 44 year old brit, apparently pulled from an Instagram post.
https://www.bbc.com/news/artic... [bbc.com]
It is very unlikely that he's a member of Tren de Aragua, South American gang.
Why is this relevant? He had been planning a trip to Miami, but now probably won't come due to fear of non-judicial imprisonment.
Re:I am shocked! (Score:5, Interesting)
More an indictment of law enforcement "intelligence".
There is a boogie-man around every corner to justify stricter and stricter laws, and always more farcical threats that somehow omit very present threats (such as foreign policy).
I've seen police task force materials on everything from Dungeons & Dragons to Insane Clown Posse to Satanism, and seeming secret societies form within law enforcement (Vampire Hunter 2000 was just wild. And now we have the thin blue line.).
It's brand of cultural enforcement dressed as benevolent concern, and making stuff up and fearmongering is far easier than proper investigation.
Re: I am shocked! (Score:2)
News report last week one of the El Salvador âoedeporteesâ was picked for his Golden State Warriors tattoo.
BBC is actually pretty good (Score:3)
I've found that the BBC is actually indeed a good source of facts.
In this case, it's pretty easy: They post a picture of the guy, including his tat, and the US document in question, with the line "Open source material has depicted TdA members with a combination of the below tattoos:", with the guy's tat listed under "Clocks".
Which has the problem that it raises doubts about the document, if they're not actually using TdA member tattoos, but random ones pulled off the internet, apparently including a Britis
Re:I am shocked! (Score:4, Insightful)
because the bbc is a gear source of facts.
I appreciate that disparaging news sources that don't align with the MAGA narrative is part of the MAGA playbook, but has it ever occurred to you to look into articles that go against what you expect, rather than just writing them off? Irrespective of if you disagree with their editorial leaning, the BBC is generally an excellent source of facts because they name their sources. With only 60 seconds and a search engine you can track down the US DHS web page that is shown and do a reverse search of the image to see that it was indeed originally posted by the account of a Nottingham, UK, based tattoo artist. Maybe that's all too much work for you, and just slagging off news sources that don't repeat that sounds of your echo chamber is much easier, but if you try it you might learn something in the process.
Re: (Score:2)
Are you telling me that the prospect of random ICE detention without due process does not attract tourists?
Ya, but... On the upside, your return trip is paid for by ICE !! (on the down side, it's to El Salvador)
Also phone searches etc.. (Score:5, Insightful)
We will not let you in as you made jokes of our orange dictator...
Re: I am shocked! (Score:4, Informative)
Or foreign students, or foreign workers.
Re:I am shocked! (Score:5, Informative)
I'll add to that...
anyone want to go to a country where:
-they'll deport their own people "accidentally"....apparently a green card doesn't qualify you for protection, nor does a court order...
-removed due process for anyone they deem to be a non-citizen
-they are happy to arrest/deport people based off of a tattoo... (I guess the only amendment that matters is the 2nd one)
-send armed cops to schools to arrest kids for deportation
-arrest students that speak out against the administration
-are happy to confiscate your electronics and copy the data, access your social media accounts (ICE & CBP).... within 100 miles of the border (usually at the point of entry) and if they don't like what you said about the current administration- block access and send you back.
-local population calls ICE on their own co-workers and friends
-dismantling peoples rights (especially due process, privacy, and what were once cemented constitutional rights)
-dismantling the courts
-puppets running LEO's, Intel agencies and DOJ
-where people are openly racist
-where child marriage is legal in 37 states (banned in only 13)
-where leadership is actively talking about annexing Canada and Greenland - two allies that have bled, and lost their own people in the aid of the War on Terror.
-where leadership has started trade wars with nearly EVERY country on the planet for no reason, and with no plan
-local population providing active/tacit support for these actions
-god help you if you don't have medical insurance while traveling and get sick/injured/shot
for people that likely had ancestors that died/fought authoritarian rulers - Nazis, Russians... they'd be leaving healthier food at home, safer streets at home, health care systems...
What VALUE is there in traveling to the US? Where the US administration has called your people "parasites", "free loading", and "Pathetic"...
Re: (Score:3)
So many deals! So many wins! (Score:4, Insightful)
Now that the hotels are empty I guess there will be deals for Americans to do more domestic travels.
Let those Orbitz deals fly!
*The above comment was brought to you by said no one ever dot com*
Re: (Score:2)
Like 5% cheaper than last year, but still more expensive than 2022: https://data.bls.gov/timeserie... [bls.gov]
A lot of the hotel pricing being expensive has to do more with cartel-like behavior rather than just empty rooms.
Re: (Score:2)
While I do not agre on all your points, one factor that makes a socity disintegrate is a falling number of people personally invested into making things work well. That is not even a financial thing. That is "I want this thing to work well here for everybody!". The mindless and unfounded US patriotism ("We are better than everybody else!"), is a poor substitute that comes with severe problems (some nicely observable at this time) and long-term devolution into a non-functional state becasue learning from oth
Re: We've got too many people disconnected (Score:3)
The "end stage capitalism" people are just as bad. They're happily awaiting an economic collapse that's of their own imaginings and telling everyone around them that it's impossible to fix anything without a totalitarian communist state.
Re: (Score:2)
Are your more of a Nazi guy or a KKK guy?
Natural wonders and cultural emptiness (Score:2, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Not true, we have "truck nuts", except in Idaho, Idaho governor signs bill criminalizing public breast exposure and ‘truck nuts’ [idahocapitalsun.com].
Re: Natural wonders and cultural emptiness (Score:2)
That's sort of laughable. Out culture is so dominant across the globe, it's essentially a weapon.
Re: (Score:2)
That's sort of laughable. Out culture is so dominant across the globe, it's essentially a weapon.
You can spread something across the globe that doesn't exist. I'm pretty sure you are confusing the word culture with something else.
Re: (Score:2)
To be fair, bits of it. Californian and New York culture mostly.
View from the outside (Score:2)
I would not second this statement wholeheartedly, the united states due to their short existence have naturally a smaller cultural foot print, that's true.
However on the other hand, native americans have such a long spanning history, that is also being researched by historians, and sometimes is preserved by the survivers of a "genocide".
Even the dark spots of your history are part of the culutural heritage.
But also many americans have contributed to the contemporary cultural history, and also entering the w
Not just Europe (Score:5, Interesting)
Re: (Score:3)
Re:Not just Europe (Score:5, Interesting)
I'm Canadian and I love parts of the USA. NYC is awesome and so is Chicago.
But there's no way I'm traveling to or through the US for the foreseeable future. My holidays will be spent in Canada, Europe or Asia.
Re: Not just Europe (Score:2)
"Thailand... child friendly..."
I see what you did there...
This is what the right wing wants (Score:4, Insightful)
Of course that's not gonna happen. You'll note, for example, that through all of this we're still ramping up H1-Bs, and that the only students sent away are Muslims who protested the war in Gaza (boy I just triggered the fuck out of somebody...).
But feelings don't care about your facts. There's a thing called "Mythic Truth". It means a truth more than true. A truth that doesn't have to be actually real or true because the ideal is so important that it's reality's job to fall in line. And the right wing is all about that.
If you've ever wondered how they can maintain cognitive dissonance it's easy. They don't experience it. It's true doublethink. Orwell didn't make it up, he just wrote about it.
Re: (Score:2)
hell even a lot of the conservatives want it. Isolationism. For the rest of the world to fuck off because they don't understand it and they don't want to.
Hell, half the country doesn't be here with the other half -- yet, they won't leave. Maybe we all have Stockholm syndrome [wikipedia.org]. :-)
Re: (Score:2)
You'll note, for example, that through all of this we're still ramping up H1-Bs,
I have a theory Trump doesn't actually care about immigration, he just talks about it to get votes.
The theory is based on his actions. Other than a few high profile deportations, he still hasn't built the wall, and Mexico hasn't paid for it. H1 visas seem to be increasing.
Re:This is what the right wing wants (Score:5, Insightful)
I have a theory Trump doesn't actually care about immigration, he just talks about it to get votes.
Good you noticed. People seem confused by how trump position on things changes suddenly and it random. The problem is they think that he actual has a position on things. They are overthinking it. The reality is he only cares about his ego and bank balance. When you view his actions from the point of how something affects his bank balance and how people view him then his actions make much more sense.
Re: This is what the right wing wants (Score:2)
Oh, I don't know about that. Nativism appears to be his True North.
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Have you ever read the text "the only moral abortion is my abortion"? It is the same kind of thing. Oppressive rules are there for the others.
Re: (Score:3)
Yep, pretty much accurate. The problem with isolationism is that you get left behind and slowly things stop working. The only model that somewhat works is the one used in North Korea where they tell people that they are doing much better than everybody else (sounds familiar?) and limit trade and communication excessively. But even an orwellian nightmare like that is not really isolated and goes for a long-term collapse.
I can inderstand why expecially the religious fuckups want that isolation though. It mus
I live in the border zone (Score:3)
I live in the 100-mile border zone. But I certainly wouldn't travel to any part of the US with a lot of border activity right now. Especially the Southern border. There's been a slow eroding of rights since 9/11.
Re: (Score:2)
But I certainly wouldn't travel to any part of the US with a lot of border activity right now. Especially the Southern border.
Yes, especially after this: Trump authorizes military to take control of federal land along US southern border [cnn.com]:
President Donald Trump sent a memorandum to four federal department heads Friday night instructing them to allow the military to use and take jurisdiction of federal land along the US-Mexico border. The memo states that the Defense Department should be provided jurisdiction over lands including the Roosevelt Reservation – a 60-foot-wide swath of land along the border ...
Migrants who cross in this area would be put into “holding” for trespassing onto a military property until the Department of Homeland Security could arrive to pick them up and deport them — putting the military in the position of effectively detaining migrants, something that is traditionally a law enforcement function.
The memo further states that, “members of the Armed Forces will follow rules for the use of force prescribed by the Secretary of Defense.”
That last paragraph is, um... interesting, given it's Hegseth.
Re: I live in the border zone (Score:2)
Biden deported more people than Trump, numb nuts.
Re: (Score:2)
Shocking. (Score:2)
People find car accidents interesting to watch from a distance -- not from the backseat.
I'm surprised (Score:2)
As a Canadian I'm probably biased - I would have thought the percentages would be at least double those stated in TFS.
Not to worry though - with the job ICE has been doing rounding up all those makeup artists, pro soccer players, and innocent fathers of young children and shipping them off to a Salvadoran hellhole, the US will be safe and welcoming for tourists of all skin colours Real Soon Now!
Re:I'm surprised (Score:4, Insightful)
Most trips are planned weeks to months in advance, I expect the numbers to be different after a few months.
Don't worry (Score:2)
Probabaly not near the bottom (Score:3)
Since getting voted in it has got much worse with trump actively attacking allied countries and making it clear we were no longer welcomed friends. I would expect those numbers to look even worse in a few months once those already booked trips have completed.
Then there is the tourism tacked on to business trips. Something I often did. If the USA no longer wants to import stuff then the amount of businesses trips in support of that is also going to fall.
So the money I saved by not going the CES is now going to be used for a trip to Japan.
Problems are at the border (Score:5, Informative)
Coming from Europe, I travelled quite a lot to the US between 2006 to 2012 or so, when I was visiting conferences and the like. Loved every trip *once I got in*. I mean, in general friendly people, lots of wonderful sights you have seen in movies, great outdoors (still would like to visit Grand Canyon and Yellowstone), but until you get to that point it's a pain.
Even coming from a visa waiver country, the whole ordeal at border was just painful. I don't particularly have a problem with them taking fingerprints and whatnot as such, but always the 2-4 hour lines, in general hostile attitude from the agents and the overall paranoia just gives the first impression where the whole country says go away. Lessons learned after very first trip where after landing at JFK I was to change planes bound for San Diego: Always transit at European side of the pond so you are on your way to your final destination directly, because there's no telling how much time you'll be spending waiting to even get processed.
Anyway, that was traveling for "work". I was getting paid and reimbursed for my time. As a tourist, especially with family, I have just been back for the two solar eclipses in 2017 and 2024. It takes literally a celestial event to go through that ordeal which is getting into the US when you are paying for your own trip.
Frankly, on every trip, I have always been worried that some clerical error or just nastiness from an agent who needs to fill out some quota suddenly results in ENTRY REJECTED stamp and spending a day or two at the airport before getting departed.
But.. until now the general expectation has been that at worst case they'll just put you on the next flight back home. Now you might apparently be stuck on some detention center in the middle of nowhere for a month and just disappear if they have a bad day. And yeah, I'm a white guy so even the Family Guy meme with the color chart doesn't isn't part of it. I'm sure people with darker skins have even more to worry about.
I hope that by the time I'm retiring and have lots of free time, things are looking up again. A long-time dream has been to just visit every state in the lower 48 - just fly in to Boston or Miami, buy a car, drive through east coast and then start heading west in some funny zigzag pattern until departing from somewhere in the west coast several month later. There's just so much to see and experience, and having a common language and connected highway system to make transportation easy is a huge perk. Here's to hoping.
Re:Problems are at the border (Score:5, Informative)
This.
Having been to quite a number of places, including some that are usually not deemed beacons of liberty and democracy, I can safely say that US border officials are easily the most arrogant, condescending, dismissive and generally unpleasant lot. And it doesn't strike me as some clever psychological strategy designed to improve security either, they genuinely seem to think of foreigners coming in to their country as primitive provincial supplicants, about to be graciously allowed a glimpse onto The Light.
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Every time I've had to go through a US border, it's like they are purposefully trying to pick a fight, just for their own amusement. No other country does this.
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The US border was the only place I've ever found a person dense enough to not understand the concept of an airline curtesy hotel and find it incredibly suspicious that someone would have a border stamp with Arabic written on it stamped in and out on the same day. Like dude, Dubai is one of the biggest airline hubs in the world, and if your layover with Emirates Business is more than a couple of hours you get a hotel and airport transfer included automatically.
Imagine getting treated like a suspected terrori
Fly from Canada (Score:4, Informative)
While they can ask to search your devices etc. in order to assess your US entry eligibility you have the option to decide not to go to the US and leave the clearance area at any point. I find it a much nicer way to enter the US: the border guards can still give you a thorough inspection but, provided you are honest with them, you are free to leave if you think the inspection is getting too thorough.
Perhaps as a result of this I've always found US immigration in Canada very polite, professional and yes thorough on ocasion, although since they are based in Canada for an extended period perhaps it's also Canada rubbing of off on them a little!
The damage to the US will be broad (Score:5, Interesting)
I think that most of the US just doesn't get how well off they are and why. The US is, by far, the wealthiest country that has ever existed. There are problems - the distribution of wealth is quite out of wack - but even the middle class have high incomes compared to other places.
Trump's focus on trade deficits while ignoring all the other ways the US makes money from the rest of the world is going to dramatically reduce this wealth. When someone in Spain buy a Coca-Cola, the drink isn't made in the US or consumed there, but part of that money goes to the profits of Coca-Cola and gets moved to the US (and distributed as dividends/rise in stock price). This isn't counted in the trade deficit.
Tourism is similar. A visit to New York by a foreigner is only "noticeable" via the exchange of foreign currency to dollars, it doesn't "count" as part of the trade equation. There are other things, such as foreign students coming to American universities which transfer a lot of money to the US.
In a few short months that Trump has undone about 80 years of goodwill from the rest of the world (I know, plenty of people didn't like the US before this, but his actions are dramatically increasing that population). This will reduce, possibly substantially, the wealth the US now enjoys. Tourism will go down, fewer students will choose to study in the US, many people will boycott US products, people will pay higher prices for goods ... all this because Trump is focused on a metric that gives a very limited view of the real amount of trade that is happening.
I guess all those new factory jobs will be filled by people formerly in tourism.
Re: (Score:3)
If the USA were attacked by a foreign power, the USA could invoke NATO countries for help. It wouldn't even be the first time (happened after 9/11).
men?
As the USA refuses foreign countries to hold military bases within the USA, so we would not be able to help a lot or that would take a lot of time.
are they going to supply 50% of the arms
No because the deal was Europe subsidizes the US arms industry by purchasing weapons from USA, trading for the pledge that USA would help Europe in case of need. As a consequence, Europe has a relatively smaller defen
No one wants to go where I live (Score:5, Informative)
I Live in Scandinavia,
And the office talks goes like this:
"Did you hear about that poor British tourist that got detained because there was some ESTA issues, she spent 19 days in jail, in an AMERICAN Jail?".
"Yeah, not going there, we've cancelled the family trip to the US".
Etc.
I was planning to go as well as I have a couple of favorite towns I visit over there, but yeah - no one of us is going to America again in that state they're in right now, we do feel their pain, and we have a lot of friends over there. But we ain't going.
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Fun fact I live in Germany .. well that is not the fun fact .. but that its nothern Germany, bordering Denmark with ports having ferries to Sweden and Finland, and many of my fellow colleagues spend their summer holidays in "Scandinavia".
Canceled my trip. (Score:3)
Had a 12 day motorcycle trip planned through northern border states. Cancelled it all when things started to go sideways. The US is off of my list, probably for at least the next four years. Being in western Canada, I'm not starved for alternatives. I've rerouted through the Rock Mountains.
I'm 54, freshly retired, and looking to spend some money traveling. The US has opted out of that business. They never had my booze business... I'm a Guinness and peaty scotch guy. But where I can I avoid buying US. First time in my life I'm boycotting anything...
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Just to make it clear, you're the bad guys, America. You have no reason to complain that Canada is reacting negatively. Canadians have every right to express anger at their hostile US neighbor that wants to destroy their economy and steal their country. You deserve what little pain Canada can give in return. That does not make you the victim, snowflake.
Montana is fuuuuuuuucked (Score:4, Insightful)
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I did that when I was around 20. Some truely spectacular things, especially the national parks. These days, I regard the US as a no-go zone. Such a pity.
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Re:Montana is fuuuuuuuucked (Score:5, Insightful)
Just for the next four years?
Are you sure about that?
Can you imagine this bunch saying, "Yeah, we lost fair and square -- here are the keys" after the next election?
After the Jan 6 debacle I figured that if the US was silly enough to put Trump back into office they'd never get him back out. And here we are so....
So they've got a law that stops married women (Score:3)
And that's a pretty minor form of voter suppression compared to the Big Three. Which is broken voting machines, challenging voter registrations and challenging signatures.
The key is picking your voters and the Republican party is great at that. And by the time their voters realize that it's a big club and they ain't in it it'll be too late.
I wish I could argue with you (Score:3, Insightful)
Hopefully it doesn't bleed outside our borders much more. If we're crazy enough to elect something like Trump we're crazy enough to go to war with nuclear powers. I'm genuinely surprised the rest of the world didn't step in and interfere with our elections to counteract what Russia d
Re:Montana is fuuuuuuuucked (Score:4, Interesting)
So the economic peril is much greater then just tourism, it threatens the food supply as well. So while your savings turn to trash, food prices will go through and there may be be food shortages.
The question is whether the dumbass Trump supporters will ever understand that they screwed themselves, or will they find some other minority to blame? And even if they suddenly "wake up", to coin a phrase, is it already too late? Unfortunately for those of us who saw Trump as the fascist dictator he is, everyone is going to get kicked in the crotch no matter how your voted.
Fuck around and find out.
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Rosie O'Fonnel is in Scotland and Ellen Degenerous is in England(?), what is the attraction?
Well I can't say it will have a massive effect but I suppose those are two reasons for Brits to visit the USA.
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Rosie O'Fonnel is in Scotland and Ellen Degenerous is in England(?), what is the attraction?
Less crime and guns, people more happy overall. You should get out more.
Re: Why come to America? (Score:2)
Two unattractive older peogressive talkshow hosts are your examples.
Hmmm. It's almost as if your problem is with their identity rather than anything they ever said or did.
Why are nativists so obsessed with identity politics? Fuck, they're worse than the progressives ..
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By the way, I'm not going to define misogyny for you, you'll have to look it up yourself. I have serious doubts you know what it means.
(The previous statement was a way of calling you dumb. I'm not sure that you could understand that if I didn't spell it out.)
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Posting as Anonymous Coward shows how proud you are of the USA and how sound you think your argument is.
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"we'll take their money again" .. as it happend some days ago.
And we will manipulate Mr. Trump by reminding him who he owes money
Enjoy your ignorant independence!
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Some Europeans do have a pretty long memory - I haven't visited ever since dubya made the borders a really hostile place.
Re: Hotels barely recovered from covid - good job (Score:2)
That's about $1000/bottle, which doesn't sound super crazy compared to what is often a standard bottle service fee of around $300 before the pandemic. Ridiculous, yes, but I don't think it's evidence of anything except bottle service is expensive, festivals are expensive, and VIP packages are expensive.
Re: Not quite accurate (Score:2)
Well after the last month or so, European markets have remained far more stable than the US, all while the Euro is getting stronger against the dollar.
Sure, we spent 4 years of Biden pulling far out in front of all the other world economies,.but now that we've got Trump, all that's been reversed. If the real reason were economic, we would expect European tourism to US to start picking up significantly later this year.
On the other hand, if the reason is political, it will remain low for the foreseeable futur
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Economy in Europe has split into two parts, and only one of them has deteriorated a lot. Upper middle class with proper education, language skills and work ethics does very well, it's just the other half which drags down the GDP/capita numbers. This poor half was not going to the USA anyway, and the rich half certainly won't be willing to put up with ICE/CBP shenanigans and a government (cheered on by the general population) openly hostile to Europeans when planning a holiday trip.
Re: Not quite accurate (Score:3)
News to me. Here in Denmark we seem to be doing quite well.
Eggs are trivially easy to come by, too.
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You haven't heard that Europeans are booking less international travel, what you heard is they are booking fewer trips TO THE USA. Also your hypothesis would lead to a slow decline over the past years, which isn't what is happening.
What we see is a sharp decline TO THE USA and RIGHT NOW. People are cancelling family trips to the USA without even a refund. And we also know very well the reason, as this is a topic of conversation at family dinners.
Travellers are afraid of anti-foreigner policies, legal risks
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And what kind of argument is "I am at this very moment...", a supposed single case, vs the reporting of the Financial Times? You really think that will convince anyone? Clearly it is you w
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Love him or hate him, Trump is a legend. He'll go down in history like Henry the 8th and Hitler. He's iconic. Someday Mar-a-Lago will be a great museum where people can see the legendary bathroom where he stuffed secret documents, and ketchup stains on the ceiling. Tourists will be able to touch his golf cart.
But first we have to survive the son of a...
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I want to see the legendary show:
"Donald and the Trumpets - Blowing your Mind"
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Bold of you to assume ATC is sufficiently staffed to land the plane safely.