Amazon Makes It Too Hard To Cancel Prime, Groups Tell Regulators (bloomberg.com) 95
A coalition of public interest advocates is asking U.S. regulators to investigate whether Amazon.com violates consumer protection laws with its process for canceling Prime subscriptions. From a report: In a letter to the Federal Trade Commission on Thursday, a group led by Public Citizen said the steps required to cancel Prime "are designed to unfairly and deceptively undermine the will of the consumer," and may violate both FTC rules as well as other consumer protection laws. The letter draws on a complaint by Norway's consumer protection agency, which on Thursday asked Norwegian regulators to determine whether Amazon violated local law.
Hard? No. Confusing? Yes (Score:5, Informative)
It's been a year since I cancelled my prime account, but I didn't find it the slightest bit difficult to find or complete. However, it was a little confusing. The wording kind of gave me the impression it would cancel my membership right away (even if I still had time left), which I assume is a deliberate attempt to try to get people to wait until the last day to cancel, and then hopefully forget during that time.
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This.
It's not unclear, they just ask you "Are you really really really really really sure?" and "Look at all the stuff you wont get anymore!" about 300 times.
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Companies are really fucking ballsy when they don't have to do these things face-to-face with someone that is visibly on the brink of punching them.
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Re:Hard? No. Confusing? Yes (Score:4, Informative)
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That's the method I used to cancel as well. :)
A LOT less things to click.
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They get really excited when you remove your last saved payment method ;) lol And you are not really canceling, you are choosing not to renew when your next renewal date comes up.
That how I "cancelled" mine. Well, I didn't have any saved payment method, and had never signed up for prime, so when they tried billing me they gave up and dropped the phony subscription again. Damn, you need to make sure that weasel company doesn't have your credit card details.
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If you have to do an internet search to find out how to cancel a service, it actually has been made harder than it should be. Something being made "hard" should be taken relative to how simple it should be.
Re:Hard? No. Confusing? Yes (Score:4, Informative)
I was looking forward to calling you an idiot for blindly assuming anything anti-cooperate must be true.
I went to amazon --> account settings --> prime membership.
There was a list of options and questions but canceling was not one of them. There was a "Don't see your question? Click here for more." choice. I chose it and was taken to this page which actually has a link for canceling your amazon prime account.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/help... [amazon.com]
Not that fucking hard
Then I clicked the link and was back on the page I before with no cancelation option.
Guess I was the fool for wanting better from Amazon.
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And with each level of marketing and management changes/approvals it got harder, until?
Remember! In the C-Suite, canceling, opting out and unsubscribing are not right until they don't work
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I went to amazon --> account settings --> prime membership, then chose "Manage Membership (update, cancel and more)", then a popup opened that gave me a link to cancel my membership. I clicked on it and then it took me to a page asking me if I was sure, and told me what I was going to be missing if I canceled.
I didn't confirm the cancellation from there.
Re: Hard? No. Confusing? Yes (Score:4, Insightful)
Try cancelling your cable or cell phone subscription online only without talking to anyone. Then tell me how hard it is.
Compared to traditional cable and phone companies, Amazon is a walk in the park. It's 3 clicks and 30 seconds, tops... Have done it many times.
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The existance of something harder doesn't excuse anything. Otherwise the cable and cell people would just say "OH Yeah? Try shutting a nuclear reactor down using only dental floss and half a gummy bear!".
Re: Hard? No. Confusing? Yes (Score:2)
Again, it's 3 clicks and 30 seconds.
How much easier do you need it to be?
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Apparently others have found it harder.
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I have, was super easy, barely an inconvenience. Just had to verify cancellation with strong authentication (mobileid or online bank verification).
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More than confusing, more like this
"But look, you found the notice, didn't you?"
"Yes," said Arthur, "yes I did. It was on display in the bottom of a locked filing cabinet stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying "Beware of the Leopard."
Arthur Dent hitch hiker guide to the galaxy
It kind of felt more like that, that they can be penalised for it, cool, stick it to the annoying arseholes.
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My car cam with Satellite radio, free for a year or something. I was like thats cool. Then it ran out, and I was like how much and they said $80 a year or something. I said it wasn't worth it. So they made a deal down to $20 for the year, which I took. Then after that year was over, trying to renew they gave me $160 a year and didn't go down... So I canceled after 1/2 hour of people saying how useful it is... While I was perfectly fine with my local stations.
The problem today is we have too many services
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Yes. The car SiriusXM sales people are terrible. They offer a "super sweet deal", which isn't really that great of a deal. It should just be the price. They will almost ALWAYS give you that deal. The problem is that you have to say "no" every time the duration of the deal is up. It's not worth it to have something in your car you can easily get in other ways.
Re: Hard? No. Confusing? Yes (Score:2)
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Every time I rent a car, it's always some cheap Chevy or Kia with XM radio and it always sounds AWFUL. Maybe clearer than FM radio but really, really flat. Too compressed. Internet streaming has always sounded way better to me.
How much of that is the music service and how much is cheap speakers with a cheap amp in a cheap car?
Re: Hard? No. Confusing? Yes (Score:2)
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And a lot of these companies won't even LET you cancel online. You need to call a number so they can try to strongarm you into renewing. Recent experiences I've had include both Sirius XM and DirecTV but I'm sure there are a thousand others.
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It's likely Netflix will never be $500 forever. It's like $90 per year, so a "forever" plan will likely be $5000 or so (50+ years) unless they limit the subscription to say, one person. A single person (single stream) lifetime might be $2000 or so, with lifetime defined as your pe
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I like the way TiVo does it. Lifetime plans aren't unreasonable. Back when I was using them (sometime around 2002) the lifetime plan was only around 2.5 years worth of monthly fees (which was probably a good thing, because I only used it for about that long before getting into MythTV). Its a bit more now...lifetime is about 3 years of monthly fees or 3.5 years of annual fees. Of course, they have additional revenue streams in that you have to buy their hardware, so it's not a perfect comparison to some of t
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90*30 = $2700. They stick in an account getting 4% above the inflation cost of their service and they get their money every year.
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The report mentions "confirmshaming" many many times. I've never heard of this before, it sounds like they're trying to start something new.
If they HID the option or buried it somewhere the averate user wouldn't look, or required you to jump through hoops (clicking a few confirmation boxes is NOT "jumping through hoops") then I'd agree more, but the process is intuitive, straight-forward, and quick.
Trying to cancel services over the phone (like cable tv) is much worse. You can't do it online, and you're g
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I think it would be perfectly fair for companies to make cancel procedures as simple as the 'unsubscribe' mandate for email - e.g., no bullshit one and done.
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I've always thought that cancellation procedures should be just as easy as signing up. If you can sign for something with a few mouseclicks, then cancelling it should be just as easy. If signing up for cable TV required spending hours on the phone, navigating menus, being put on hold, multiple transfers, and arguing with the sales reps that yes, you really really truly honestly do want to subscribe to cable, then they could continue their current bullshit.
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So if you sign up , select your plan and fill in your payment details. You would then have to select your plan and fill in your payment details to cancel?
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Yup, I use my free monthly trial that it gives you once a year, and you can cancel immediately and it still applies until the end. But you get a few steps of "Are you SURE?" prompts which imply that it will end immediately, all until the last one finally makes it clear it won't.
Years ago the flow was different such that it was clear from the start it would continue until the end of the month.
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It's been a year since I cancelled my prime account, but I didn't find it the slightest bit difficult to find or complete. However, it was a little confusing. The wording kind of gave me the impression it would cancel my membership right away (even if I still had time left), which I assume is a deliberate attempt to try to get people to wait until the last day to cancel, and then hopefully forget during that time.
I think that for many people, that's a distinction without a difference. Most of the people on here are pretty tech savy and can fairly easily navigate the labyrinth of prompts and confirmations they put up. I suspect a lot of less technical people get so confused they simply give up. If something is so confusing that you can't accomplish it, doesn't that mean it's hard to successfully complete?
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Maybe things have improved a bit. Few years ago when I cancelled my prime subscription it was during a heated IM conversation with a support rep who was I had to tell 6 different times that I wanted my prime account cancelled with immediate effect and no deal they could offer would entice me back.
I eventually had to escalate the whole matter to executive customer support who finally did wat the line agent couldn't/wouldn't... confirm my cancellation.
Granted, I didn't reach out initially to cancel, but the i
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That sounds like me trying to get my money back from a travel agent for the Delta airlines roundtrip flight to Hawaii last April that Delta canceled due to COVID... excuse me, they didn't *cancel the flight*, they merely suspended service. So no, they didn't have to refund my money, I just didn't understand the rules. I had a customer service agent (for the travel agency, not Delta) twice play a game where they put me on hold, contacted their "air department", then came back on and assured me that I was c
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Yeah. They really try to convince you to stay but it's not difficult at all. I canceled Prime trials twice. Once even after the trial ended and it entered into regular paid service, and they even refunded me the month that already began.
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It's actually different from how it used to be. It took me several minutes to get to the actual screen to cancel my Prime membership this week. You can get into a circular path that leads to nowhere. You get on your account page, and there is no button to cancel. You search for cancelling Prime, and it shows you a button that mentions cancelling Prime, but that just takes you back to the Prime benefits page that has no button to cancel Prime.
The only way I could cancel Prime was to go the support/help p
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It's been a year since I cancelled my prime account, but I didn't find it the slightest bit difficult to find or complete. However, it was a little confusing. The wording kind of gave me the impression it would cancel my membership right away (even if I still had time left), which I assume is a deliberate attempt to try to get people to wait until the last day to cancel, and then hopefully forget during that time.
You start out by saying there's no problem, then reveal that, oh wait, yeah there was a problem
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No. I started out by saying it wasn't hard to cancel, but then pointed out that while I was completing the process it was unclear when it would take effect after. The process of cancelling, though, was easy.
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I just cancelled mine (they gave me a second free trial! weird. I have had an account since their bookstore days, though) and it was easier than I remember, though still slightly confusing. Maybe they've made recent changes. When you go to subscriptions, prime is there. When you click manage, it offers you a link to go to your prime account, and you can cancel your membership from the resulting page. I believe you can also get there another way, by going to prime and selecting your account or something, but
well it's hard to beat comcast (Score:2)
https://time.com/2985964/comca... [time.com]
I get calls all the time letting me cancel (Score:3)
I mean come on, they seem to call me every month when they are going to bill me, and give me a chance to cancel. I just have to give Apu my name and credit card number to prevent it...
It's hard to (Score:4, Insightful)
I tried living without Amazon for 3 months in 2018 and crawled back. The convenience of KNOWING when I am getting something AND being able to get it in a very short time did me in. I would have paid a little more at other web sites for the fast delivery, but nobody can guarantee it like Amazon. I hate them, but don't know how to do without them.
No. Getting in my car an hopping from store to store to comparative shop, or be told they don't have what I'm looking for is not an option.
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Getting in my car an hopping from store to store to comparative shop, or be told they don't have what I'm looking for is not an option.
Amazon isn't the only company with a website though. It may not be the same everywhere, but many local shops now offer information on their own websites, respond to emails and a few even offer an online chat, which is more than Amazon does. So it can be worth sometimes to compare and not run straight to Amazon.
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Yes, he beats me, but he always apologizes and buys me nice things.
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I've had more things late with Amazon Logistics than UPS/FedEx/USPS combined.
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I guess it depends where you live. First I'm in Canada and amazon.ca is poor on products, and more often the price is astronomic, like $100 for what would be a $10 item, I know its robots who compute price, but in Canada it's a non-sense.
Second, I live at a distance walk to a WM, 3 groceries, 3 drugstores, 2 dollar stores, 1 home hardware store, and multiple others kind of stores anyway. A 10 minute drive brings me to maybe 6 wal-mart, dozens of groceries and hardware stores. I have access to everything I w
Not hard (Score:2)
Google "how to cancel amazon prime"
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I'm so sorry that nobody wants to be associated with your sedition. It must be terrible to have to live under an elected government and have voices other than your own taken into consideration.
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Not to Trump supporters, it's not.
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....just tell them you're a Trump supporter.
They'll disconnect you themselves in the great purging of Badthink(tm).
It's not going to be long before that's enough to simply disconnect/deplatform you from all social media systems.
But it will not stop them from harvesting any and all personal information they possibly can to feed their advertising machine. How else would they so consistently serve you ads for stuff you just bought (and will never need to buy again) and stuff you've never shown the slightest interest in, but never anything you might actually want to buy now.
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People like being a victim. It gives a certain moral authority. They don't like the actual persecution part of it, but it's nice to just imagine some persecution and enjoy the satisfying feeling that comes with suffering for a good cause.
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...says the Left, who has literally spent the last 7 months demonstrating, protesting, wrecking businesses, burning police stations, seceding whole neighborhoods from US cities, based on outrage and victimhood.
Not ironic or hypocritical at all, no sir.
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Your suggestion that some drunk rednecks wearing bull horns and carrying signs are "an attempted coup" is revealing of much, including a massive snowflake complex.
More damage has been done, and vastly more people have been killed in BLM riots, all with the tacit (or explicit*) approval of the media, the new president, and the Left in general.
*using language MUCH more incendiary than that Trump is being blamed as "inciting" for.
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No, they really weren't. That's what CNN is telling you, sure.
But I don't recall them shooting anyone, bunkering in the capital, or being beseiged out of it. I liked especially when these "terrorists" and "coup leaders" were asked to leave, they did, AND THEY EVEN STAYED BEHIND THE VELVET LINE GUIDES. Yes, quite a "coup" they were managing. Clearly, they were hardcore. LOL
No, it was *precisely* the same dynamic of massive BLM protests that got out of hand and broke shit.
You and CNN are just desperately
Not surprising (Score:2)
They pushed it onto the costumers in about the same ridiculous way. One always had to turn it off twice on checkout and it was never clear from the messages if one would now become a Prime member or not.
As if to make matters worse did scam phone calls make use of Amazon's ridiculous practises and told their victims that Amazon had increased the fees or that one is now a prime customer.
Not hard (Score:5, Funny)
I just cancelled those book burners. You have to click through a bunch of "are you sure?", "are you really sure?", "we're not sure we heard you. Are you positive?" type dialogs. But, it's just clicking.
But, maybe Amazon should have a patent on one-click cancellation.
Thanks for reminding me (Score:1)
As usual it was about 3 clicks. Not hard,
THE PURGE (Score:4, Interesting)
Try cancelling XM or TiVO (Score:2)
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I agree with SiriusXM. They don't allow you to cancel online, so you have to call and talk to a retention specialist. The very people that are trained and skilled in the way of getting you to continue paying for services you don't want. At least the last 4 times I've called to cancel, they have offered me 1/2
Video is Damning (Score:5, Interesting)
The video they provided is pretty damning ... If that's really how it works, it's fucking disgusting.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?... [youtube.com]
Re: Video is Damning (Score:3)
It is a bit suspicious they made a video with their own mockups instead of an actual screen capture. It is a bit inconsistent too, it implies this is the flow is for monthly users (since one step is suggesting the switch to yearly), but then says it will end in 2 months. I am pretty sure when you cancel you don't get charged again, nor are refunded (except new unused memberships), so you just get to use the remainder of your current paid subscription. I have cancelled once, it was not particularly hard - ha
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"It is a bit suspicious they made a video with their own mockups instead of an actual screen capture."
You are right that it does introduce a question of credibility -- which led me to say "if this is true then..." that might not have been necessary if it was an actual screen cap. I'd have preferred to see a real screen cap; but i also think the produced animated aesthetic is more "watchable" and illustrative of the point than some guy filming himself using his phone.
"I have cancelled once, it was not partic
what is so hard (Score:2)
sign into prime, click on accounts and list, click on prime membership, then click on cancel. Why is that so hard?
The only thing I can think of is it is not an immediate cancellation and takes effect at the end of the current subscription (billing period).
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sign into prime, click on accounts and list, click on prime membership, then click on cancel. Why is that so hard?
You are probably: bright; used to working with IT systems; have a good command of English; can read well; ... There are many who are not as fortunate as you, these people find it much harder and feel worried that they might do something wrong.
It's Easy & Obvious (Score:2)
Only "hard" part is Amazon mentions features you'll lose if you cancel. I don't think being reminded what you won't get if you won't pay for is "hard," as if people don't know what they want when it comes to something so simple.
Cookie policies and convenience (Score:2)
The amount of inconvenience and confusion they are putting into cookie dialogs is astounding these days. There is a knowhow building around it. Recently I found I had been clicking 'accept All' buttons assuming they were 'accept proposed settings'.
Google is horrible in what you have to do to opt out of things.
GDPR is a relief in that respect in that opt out has to be the default but you may still be clicking the wrong option.
There have always been hurdles for unsubscribing as well, that was the case before
2 kinds of Cancel (Score:2)
I recently cancelled Prime. People should know that there are actually 2 different types of cancel. If you go through the website, then they will just not automatically recharge you when your Prime expires. You will still have access to Prime until then and you won't receive any money back.
However, you can also Chat with a customer service rep and ask them to cancel your membership immediately and refund you the unused portion. I did this option and it only took a few minutes.
Easy to cancel (Score:2)
This is easy. Try canceling Comcast cable subscription or Satellite TV subscription.
You know when it will arrive, but... (Score:1)
The Darth Vader mask I intended to wear for my daughter's birthday party was supposed to arrive on Friday. It didn't. I pleaded with Amazon Customer Services to deliver it on Saturday morning.
It was "delivered" by being dumped in the access road of the estate sometime on Saturday afternoon. A neighbor's kids found it and brought it to me, bless them.
Amazon account deletion followed. Now I buy from Amazon only if there is no alternative. I am willing to spend quite a bit of time looking for an alternative be
Pandemic or not (Score:2)
Dark patterns are impossible to regulate (Score:1)
Almost Impossible (Score:1)
SiriusXM is notoriously hard. (Score:2)
Now when I see the horror stories about SiriusXM, and read their fine print. Well let us just say it looks like a pain in the ass so they won't be getting any subscription from me. Which is a shame because the 6 months free on my new car was enjoyable music. Oh and I had to block their telemarketing number...
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this... I cancelled Sirius a couple months ago and it took over an hour and i *HAD* to chat with a sales rep who tried to sell me several more packages despite telling him more than 10 times to fuck off and cancel my subscription
The can do what they want! (Score:2)
Amazon is a private network! They can do whatever they want! Don't like it, start your own Amazon!
Took me about 12 seconds (Score:2)
I don't get the fuss over how hard it is to do this, assuming you can read and operate a computer and have at least an average IQ.
I don't use prime constantly, because I don't need it - most of the time, I'm happy to wait an extra day or two and more often than not, the order tends to arrive before the due date.
But I do take advantage of the free trials they tend to send me every six months or so and recently, the 0.99 1 week trial, just to get a cheaper delivery. Cancelled the renewal as soon as my order w
Lots of services do this (Score:2)
Comparing to what? (Score:1)
Not just Amazon (Score:2)
I had this problem with Netcom back in the mid 1990s.
Had to get a conference call between them and my bank to get them to stop charging my credit card. Wasted half a day just to get them to stop charging me $50/month for something I wasn't even getting.
Jack Welsh made this part of GE Culture. Paraphrasing: "Customer service is a cost center. It doesn't generate profits. Spend as little as possible on customer service and put more money into sales and marketing to maximize profits."
They all bank on the lazin