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Have you ever driven a Tesla?
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts." -- Bertrand Russell
I still haven't ridden in one! (Score:2)
I don't know many people who drive one either. :/
Re:I still haven't ridden in one! (Score:4, Interesting)
I test drove a Model 3 and a Model X.
First thing to say about the Model 3 is that it's very, very low and small. The roof is low and it has the battery under the floor which raises that. Getting in and out was really awkward.
When you are in you have a recumbent driving position that I'm personally not a fan of. Otherwise it drives very well, smooth and responsive, great handling. It's not the quietest car though.
The Model X is much more comfortable. It's huge, a bit of a barge, but also extremely powerful and more nimble than you would expect. I really missed not having 360 cameras but would probably get used to the size eventually.
I also tried out the Audi Turd... Sorry, eTron. That thing is just stupid. Incredibly inefficient and it feels very heavy. Was not impressed with the interior either, didn't feel luxury and was extremely boring. The Jaguar iPace looks a lot better but I have not tried that.
Looking forward to the Honda e and might get a new 62kWh Leaf. The Leaf is just so frustrating... It badly needs a proper update. They downgraded the IC too, now it's got an analogue speedo instead of the excellent digital one that the old model had. Hopefully it gets the new ProPilot system soon, which allows you to go hands-off on certain roads.
I tried the Kia eNiro too. It's quiet, refined, drives well, plenty of space, decent interior although the dash plastic looked a bit cheap to me. The main problem is that they nerfed the UK spec, no app or LED headlights. Cancelled my order in the end, I'll wait for something better.
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Apart from that, I have to agree with most of what you wrote :)
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The Model 3 is about average height for a saloon, but most people here are driving hatchbacks or CUVs now... The thing is, the floor is higher than normal to accommodate the battery, so it is a little smaller than a typical ICE sedan of the same size.
I cancelled my Niro order, the First Edition was nerfed... Will stick with a used Leaf for now. Pre-order placed on a Honda e, but it better be cheap with a 125 WLTP range.
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Be nice.
I sometimes have disagreements with AmiMoJo, but do you see me name calling?
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Way, WAY over the edge of common decency.
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I also tried out the Audi Turd... Sorry, eTron
For those who didn't get the joke, 'etron' (with an accent that I'm not sure ./ would render) is french for 'turd'...
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Kind of blows the mind that they called it the Turd, especially as it is sold in France and other French speaking countries under the same name. Not to mention that it's become a joke everywhere else.
Re:I still haven't ridden in one! (Score:4, Interesting)
I know, right? At least with the Mitsubishi Pajero (Pajero = "guy who touches himself" in most Spanish-speaking countries), they renamed it the "Montero" in countries with significant Spanish-speaking populations. It's standard practice: if your product name is offensive or embarrassing in some language, rename it when you sell it there.
I forget, are they renaming the Kona in Portuguese-speaking countries (Cona = crude term for womens' genitals)? They've kept it as-is in Nordic countries (Kona = woman or wife, depending on the language), but that's only mildly amusing, not offensive.
ED: Yep, looks like it's called Kauai in Portugal [news.com.au]. Good move, Hyundai. :) Also from that article a few more that I hadn't heard of:
* Buick’s LaCrosse became the Allure in Canada because in Quebec, lacrosse means self-gratification. ;)
* Mazda’s Laputa was renamed in Spanish-speaking countries because “la puta” means “the prostitute”.
* Toyota Avalon was supposed to be the Toyota Centaur. But the Centaur was the name of an Australian hospital ship that the Japanese sunk (killing most onboard) in a big scandalous event during World War II. Since the Centaur was supposed to be sold in Australia...
* It happened in reverse when Toyota Australia developed a sport version of the Toyota Aurion, called the Toyota Chicane (as in, a serpentine curve on a race track). Problem is, in Japanese, a chikan is a pervert who gropes women on trains.
* Porsche considered retiring the 911 brand name after the 9/11 terrorist attacks in New York City (they polled the market, but the market said no, so they kept it).
It's funny that the one of these that everyone knows - the Chevy Nova ("no va" = "doesn't go") - is actually a myth. The Nova kept its name in Spanish-speaking countries and sold fine. The word "nova" exists in Spanish, with the same meaning as in English.
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Lol, was just googling these for some more detail. ;) The Laputa for example was apparently renamed after its launch in Spain, due to complaints from distributors. To make it worse, the initial ads stated that Laputa provided "a smooth, comfortable ride, was lightweight and featured an impact-absorbing body." ;)
There've apparently been quite a few blunders in Spain. American Motors introduced the "Matador", which is associated with the controversy around bullfighting and means killer, while Nissan introduc
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no app or LED headlights.
Good, LED headlights can fuck off.
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They are okay if they are properly implemented. Matrix LED are the best, they literally create a cut-out around other vehicles while still lighting up everything else.
Re: I still haven't ridden in one! (Score:2)
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Bjorn Nyland did a lot of testing and at speed the M3 is one of the louder EVs. Just not as well insulated against road noise I guess.
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It’s interesting about the eTurd feeling heavier, since it’s lighter. I think Audi and BMW often adjust steering feel and suspension to give a heavier feel because the target customers tend to feel more premium and safer. I’ve heard BMW owners say “they are safer because they’re heavier” - which is of course is all kinds of wrong.
I wonder if it’s adjustable by the owner or require programming by the manufacturer.
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Autopilot cannot just randomly be auto-updated. Software updates come in bundles. You decide when/if to install them. And it cannot be while the vehicle is in motion. I'm not sure what EAP version you were on, or what settings you had it on, so I can't comment any more about its behavior for you.
If acceleration is too fast for you, there's a "Chill Mode" setting. There's also a Valet Mode if you really want to lock things down.
"what's going to happen when the pedal position sensor gets a little worn ou
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"Electronic locking doors that might fail to open in the case of an emergency or electrical failure creeped me out. " - You're used to new cars not having electronic locking doors? How are you posting on Slashdot from the 1970s?
It seems I'm also writing from the 1970s. After this I'll be driving home in my (apparently also 1970s) Toyota Prius. It is equipped with electronic door locks. It also has physical latches and a mechanical key to unlock the doors in case of a power failure. Here in the 1970s things do sometimes fail.
I envy you future folks who don't have to worry about battery failures.
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So does the Model 3. So what's the question here, again?
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** Physical latches, not a "mechanical key", because there's no point to the latter.
Infinite Energy (Score:2)
"what's going to happen when the pedal position sensor gets a little worn out down the road?" - There are multiple sensors in the pedal. Brakes override accelerator. Standard stuff.
Well, there goes my idea of holding down the go pedal (can't call it gas anymore) and the break pedal at the same time to generate infinite energy off regenerative breaking!
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It is road/tire noise, not wind noise. It drops a lot on winter tires. Some other EVs like the E-Tron come standard on winter tires.
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I don't know many people who drive one either. :/
I don't know anyone who owns a Tesla, so I haven't even been in a passenger in one either.
It's loads of fun (Score:2)
Cannot stand to drive gas cars anymore
Among the many missing options, this was mine, too (Score:2)
Cannot stand to drive gas cars anymore
Though more precise might be to say that I changed my life and environment to eliminate driving from my life. (Well... I still see lots of cars.)
No, I'm not complaining about the missing options. (I'm sure that used to be against the rules.) I'm complaining that the polls seem to have become remarkably inane of recent years. I suspect that reflects the actual priorities of the latest "owners" of the portable debt that is Slashdot, but I wonder why they care so little about our opinions that they pose such m
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I've submitted a couple, but I get the impression that my perspective is off in some way (or ways). I don't recall that any of my suggested polls has ever been run. (Some of my Ask Slashdot topics have been run (though with limited degrees of success, nothing like the current movie story), and several of them would have been suitable as polls.)
However, from a still ongoing discussion I started over on Ars Technica, I do have a fresh idea that might not stink. I think that jobs is a recurring area of interes
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Cannot stand to drive gas cars anymore
Go karts are loads of fun. Doesn't mean they should be your main vehicle.
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Neither should a tractor. [cleantechnica.com]
Re: It's loads of fun (Score:2)
Reading that I now realize that most people shouldn't be driving cars.
A vehicle is a tool. You use it to haul people and things to different places. You can make it a rather comfortable and luxurious tool. Failing to optimize for your comfort does not diminish the utility of a car or truck, it still does what it is supposed to do.
(Disclaimer: I still maintain a throughly used pickup truck as my primary commute vehicle. The amount of money and energy that required for a replacement is still substantially mor
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Same here. Not to mention diesel! It seems so outdated; the EV is better in each and every way.
Re: It's loads of fun (Score:2)
Cars vs Smartphones (Score:2)
I'm sure next month when Apple announces their latest point revision to the iPhone, there's going to be no end to the comments from the peanut gallery about how nobody needs a $1k+ phone, and that the $200 Motorola du jour is all anyone really needs. Yup, so all I need to do is not buy a new smartphone for the next 30 years and that Tesla is mine. /s
On a serious note, I've never driven a Tesla for the same reason I've never wasted a realtor's time by looking at mansions. That shit is way out of my price r
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Re: Cars vs Smartphones (Score:2)
Re: Cars vs Smartphones (Score:2)
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Surprisingly, it turns out that the batteries, when properly cared for, last a very long time... Likewise when charging, keep the pack above freezing to reduce the damage.
That's one of the things that concerns me about electric vehicles. We have months of sub-freezing temperature, and will usually have a few stretches of sub-zero temperatures as well.
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The BMS takes care of that for you; it's not something you have to think about. The BMS won't let the pack drop below it's minimum storage temperature (which is very low regardless, and you'll probably never touch it), and it will properly throttle the pack for charging based on the pack's temperature until it's heated. Recent M
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>ub-freezing temperature, and will usually have a few stretches of sub-zero now that's redundant !
Fahrenheit, not Celsius.
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Indeed - for a more technical explanation, the intercalation rate in the anode is highly temperature dependent; lithium ions just don't want to slot into the gaps in the graphite when it's cold. If you try to intercalate lithum ions faster than the anode can take them, you plate out lithium metal, and that's a bad thing. So charging has to be very throttled at low temperatures - including charging from regen - until the pack is warmed up.
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Tesla battery capacity as a factor of time really seems to level off [cleantechnica.com] at around 90%. Even after 200k+ miles. They do a very good job of battery maintenance.
Of course there are a lot of factors that go into this, not the least of which is how often you supercharge your car and how frequently you top it up to 100%. Teslas by default only charge to 80% capacity (a well known technique for getting the longest life out of any LiOn battery). And rapid charging instead of trickle charging the car will also shor
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"I've never driven a Tesla for the same reason I've never wasted a realtor's time by looking at mansions. That shit is way out of my price range"
There is considerable evidence from multiple sources that the "Total Cost Of Ownership" (TCO) of the base model 3 is less than a Camry or an Accura.
* https://loupventures.com/tesla... [loupventures.com]
This TCO has the base Model 3 costing a little more than Camry/Accord/Optima/Malibu - but when you assume Tesla's new insurance plan - which will reduce insurance costs by ~$1000 - it'
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That is even taking into account the fact that the regressive Idaho government charges almost $500 rather than the normal $160 to register the car for two years.
Colorado charges about 2.3% of MSRP for first year or two of registration. That makes plates on an $85,000 Tesla about $2,000. You are getting off easy at $500 for two years :)
Jesus Christ is there anything that isn't nickle and dimed in america? Seems literally everything is chargable extra.
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I never drove one... (Score:3)
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If we have to make them make noise then we ought to do the same to bicycle as well.
After striving to make vehicle quieter since their conception we finally do then . . .
Re: I never drove one... (Score:2)
Bicycles donâ(TM)t present a comparable hazard, because (a) a cyclist has lower mass and therefore causes less damage in an accident, (b) a cyclist has better visibility (being outdoors rather than inside a comfy cockpit), and (c) a cyclist is more likely to be paying attention, since in any collision heâ(TM)s likely to get injured.
Thereâ(TM)s nothing unreasonable about requiring electric cars to generate a small amount of noise at low speeds. It doesnâ(TM)t need to be obnoxious, just e
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(a) a cyclist has lower mass and therefore causes less damage in an accident
But kinetic energy is proportional to the square of the velocity:
1/2 m v^2
so fast bicycles are still bad...
Re: I never drove one... (Score:2)
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...but one almost drove over me in a parking lot. Electric cars should make some noise, to alert pedestrians of the danger.
While they are at it, gas powered cars with a good exhaust should make some noise when coasting, to alert pedestrians of the danger. Why wasn't this fixed decades ago? ... unless paying attention is considered a good alternative.
Re:I never drove one... (Score:4, Informative)
In the EU they are now required by law to make noise at low speed. I haven't heard a tesla yet but the Renault Zoe makes a nice low whirring noise in town.
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In the EU they are now required by law to make noise at low speed. I haven't heard a tesla yet but the Renault Zoe makes a nice low whirring noise in town.
When will motorbikes be forced to make a 'nice low whirring noise' too instead of their current moronic rocket engine noise ?
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Usually you can hear their air conditioners if not the motor.
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There is more than enough sound pollution as it is; one of the best things with EVs is that you don't hear your neighbor leaving early in the morning. I'd welcome a "soft horn" for alerting pedestrians in situations where it is necessary without needing to skare the living daylight out of them the regular horn, though. But I guess that is what the sound system is for.....
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First time I ever saw a Prius was in a parking lot when it hit me as it was backing out of a parking place. I wasn't even mad since I was so amazed at a completely quiet car.
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Oh yes, we desperately need to legislate noisier vehicles due to the hundreds of blind people run over every day by cars they can't hear coming.
And then for people who are deaf and blind we need to have strong scents that cars blow in front of them so they can smell them coming.
And if they can't smell, we need to legislate cars to have at least 7' of clearance so they can just drive over the people who are deaf and blind and can't smell. But for that one guy who is deaf, blind, and 7' 6" tall, we're going t
No, but I plan to test drive one... (Score:2)
2 years (Score:2)
I don't need/want a car (Score:2)
I have a better life since I kicked my car habit, nowadays I ride an electric assist bicycle. In fact I have two, my second bike is a trike!
I like technology, but only when I have control ov (Score:2)
My sister has one, I drove it about 10 feet in her driveway and was very put off by the vendor-locked software, vendor-locked maps, vendor-locked network connection.
I still feel that I have control over my tech and can get privacy when I want it. (it is getting harder and harder).
If I owned one of those cars, it would mean surrendering a part of my soul to the tech overlords.
Now, I read that Tesla is open-sourcing a lot of stuff. Does that mean we might get control ?
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Range & Need to get rid of big centre console (Score:2)
I test drove a Model X last year.
For the most part the vehicle is a nice ride.
My biggest complaint about driving it is the huge middle display console - it's difficult to navigate when you're new to the vehicles and a distraction while driving; I think that could have been done a lot more effectively with individual controls. A friend said that he thought they did that to save money, but on a $100k+ vehicle, I don't think it would make that much of a difference.
In talking to people, it seems like the Tesla
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The new "Raven" Model S does 370.
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Yeah, you're not the first person to say that.
When I say "honest 400 miles on a charge", wouldn't consider it unless it was advertised as being at least 500 (or more). Friends with Teslas and Bolts complain about mileage dropping with heat on (Teslas) and air condition (Bolts).
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The EPA numbers are actually pretty accurate for most real-world driving on average, although it depends entirely on how you drive. Are you insisting on 400 miles range in the middle of a cold January winter night in northern Minnesota during a blizzard? Define your conditions better. :) Speed, road conditions, temperature, wind speed/direction, payload, etc.
Also, it'd help if you could explain how exactly you came to this 400 mile limit. I mean, six hours on an interstate, really?
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I am surprised how many people seem to need to go ~400 miles non stop on a daily basis. Do you guys pee in a bottle while driving? You can't have kids, that's for sure.
My experience with the Tesla is that long trips doen't take any longer than with the diesel van we had before. Rest stops and eating takes the same time. If anything, we shave 5-10 minutes off each trip, since fueling the van took time, and you I to stand there filling it. Now we just plug the Tesla in and go eat. The car is fully charged eve
I get it (Score:2)
We have a Bolt, and the main problem I've encountered is that in rural areas, the charging stations are spaced adequately if you are driving through, on your way to somewhere else, but not enough if you are driving around. For example, I have relatives ~110 miles away from me, which is risky to do round-trip without charging, however the nearest charging station in that direction is ~150 miles away, so I'd have to add more than an hour of driving plus charging time to every trip. Instead we just take the ot
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Yes, charging stations are as readily available as gas stations are, but that is changing every day. For the few years I have owned a Tesla (in Norway) the SupreChargers (SC) have grown tremendously in availability. Our first trip to visit relatives far away required a detour (with new and exciting scenery) that made the trip an hour longer than usual. Since then there are now several SC along the route, and lots and lots of other operators providing generic fast charging.
Incentives are making EVs very popu
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If I'm expected to operate controls while simultaneously operating a vehicle (regardless of whether it's on autopilot or not), I want to be able to do it by feel. At worst, a glance then by feel. I want to know by feel that I've got the right control, and I want to know by feel that I've moved it.
I rented a Peugeot which had a touch screen for everything including climate control. Bouncing around the wilds of Scotland on what passes for an A road up there, the amount of concentration it took was downright d
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Agreed.
Define "Tesla" (Score:4, Insightful)
Yep. Tried one (Score:3)
, A model S in the morning. Then I drove an I-Pace in the afternoon.
Bought the I-Pace. The Tesla is NOT a Luxury Car. The Jag is a total joy to drive especially on twisty mountain passes.
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It is not just about range. Just comparing stats gives you only half the story. Driving both for around 100 miles on the same day convinced me that the Jag was the right one for me. The 'S' was just too low to the ground for my bad hips and knees (too many spils when I used to race motorcycles). The Jag also has Android Auto/Car Play as standard. I got the HUD option which is brilliant. This are not offered on any Tesla.
Then the Jag dealer was 10 miles away. Tesla? 40+ miles. Then the final straw was that
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I'm not sure (Score:2)
I slept through it.
Have friends with them but haven't driven one. (Score:2)
I could barely fit. With the seat all the way back, it still felt tight with the steering wheel hitting my knees. My head was clearly touching the headliner and that was with the seat all the way back and somewhat reclined.
Waiting on a decently priced Model S.
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Weird...how tall are you - and did you play with ALL of the car seat controls? I'm 5'10" and "cuddly" (OK 200lbs) and I had no problems with the driving position at all. Admittedly, my existing car is a MINI Cooper - so I'm used to a smaller car - but even so, I think you'd have to be a six-footer to have issues with it.
I'm also bothered by the fact that you said that "My head was clearly touching the headliner"...the Model 3 doesn't have a headliner...there is one more or less one continuous sheet of
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I know, seriously. Even my 203cm / 6'8" brother in law doesn't come close to hitting his head on the ceiling or having his knees hit the steering wheel in a Model 3. And headliner... what?
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I find very few cars fit me well. I did sit in the Model X and loved it. But again, I'm not rich.
Drove one...ordered one...my thoughts on it. (Score:3)
My son got one a couple of months ago - and after spending a day playing around with it - I'm hooked. I just recently ordered a model 3 with the "full self-drive" option (which right now is really just a more powerful computer - and has more value than JUST some hoped-for-future-upgrade) - and it should be here in a couple of weeks.
The advance that this car represents is more than just "An electric car" and more than "A car that's actively moving towards full self driving" and more than a 5.5 second 0-60 time.
I mean - let's pretend it's NOT an electric car and it DOESN'T have self-driving stuff...let's just review it as if it had a gasoline engine and regular cruise control.
I'd still have been wowed enough to order one.
Just to sit in the thing and see the interior that's utterly devoid of weirdly labelled buttons and knobs - just one big touch screen for just about everything. Every smallest thing is automated. That you can control it from your phone almost as well as from sitting inside the thing. That it has "Dog Mode" so you can leave the car unattended with your dog inside and it'll keep the temperature safe.
Every tiny detail about what a car should be has been re-thought.
Consider that it has a burglar alarm ("sentry mode") that's actually USEFUL...so instead of just pointlessly making a loud noise (which everyone else in the world just shrugs off as a false alarm) when it's already too late - it sees suspicious behavior around the car - it pings your cellphone - it records 360 degree video AND it plays loud music (which, admittedly, everyone will ignore).
When you go to "refuel" at a Tesla supercharger - the charger and the car talk to each other - the cost of charging goes to whatever credit card you told the car to use. As you bring the charger "nozzle" towards the car, the "gas flap" opens as if by magic. The car and charger negotiate current versus battery temperatures. Heck, as you drive towards the charging station, the car starts pre-warming/cooling the batteries for optimum charge temperature.
In the event of a crash - you have 360 video from the car so it's clear why the accident happened and who's fault it was...it saves realtime video to a USB card if you plug one into it.
Then...no oil changes...the service interval is "NEVER!"...aside from tires and wiper blades - there is essentially nothing that runs out or wears out.
There are REALLY subtle things going on that you'll never even notice - so, for example, you have regenerative braking which absorbs kinetic energy and dumps the waste energy into the battery. But what happens if the battery is fully charged? No more regenerative brakes? Well, the Tesla reserves a certain amount of battery capacity specifically for regenerative braking capacity - and (of course) you still have old-school brake pads.
While you're waiting for your car to charge - there are video games. There is a car racing game (kinda like MarioKart) where you drive using the Tesla's actual controls. More games are added every month or so.
It was recently found that the old 40 bit encryption between keyfob and car wasn't enough to prevent high-tech thieves from stealing cars. So they did a live software update to both car and keyfob(!) to push that to 80 bits...and just yesterday, they did another update to make the 80 bit encryption even better. There is no other car on the entire planet where you get that kind of post-sales service. NONE.
There is very much to be loved here.
(Oh - and it is all-electric and it does self-drive better than any other car you can buy - and literally is improving with new self-drive upgrades every month or so).
Sorry if this reads like a Tesla advert...except they don't advertise - ever - so you avoid the $1000 or so you pay on any other kind of car for the cost of all of the bloody annoying adverts they used to persuade you to buy it.
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It's worth saying that all this has down-sides too. For example, the over-the-air updates mean that your car suddenly drives differently sometimes. The autopilot changes behaviour, roads it was previously fine with are suddenly death-traps as it tries to drive you into a barrier.
The quality of the software is questionable too. The windscreen wipers are still janky for a lot of people (they use the camera instead of a $5 rain sensor). The only way to control them manually is via the touch screen, so it's a b
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Right... So you can have manual but not automatic wipers, and the one-pedal mode isn't actually one pedal. That's pretty much what I said.
It's a great car but we have to be honest about it's flaws. The lack of a rain sensor and the strange omission of a one pedal mode are notable. I wonder if the one pedal thing is because they don't have electronic control of the friction brakes, which it requires.
Hilarious (Score:2)
I am more likely to drive a Tesla than promote Slashdot on Facebook as the ad at the top of the front page encourages me to do. I am not sure whether you can even buy a Tesla in my country.
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What country? I assume one with a coastline ;)
My car is a Tesla .. (Score:2)
Never (Score:2)
even seen one.
Cars are so 20th century (Score:2)
Really, I rather go by train, tram, bus, light rail, subway/tube etc. or by bike. However, that works only well in densely populated areas. Still never owned a car.
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There is about nothing of that in north america... train are for freight or take 10h to do 500km, tram was destroyed by cars companies, light rail is inexistent except few big cities, as are subways. Bike is nice in town. For everything else you need a car. In Canada we do not talk distance but time, we don't say "it's 30 kms away" we say "it's 30 minutes away", country is so large, you can do 50km to visit a relative every week-end or even do 50km to go to a restaurant or some shopping.
This poll brought to you by Tesla (Score:2)
Most pointless poll ever.
Re: CowboyNeal option? (Score:2)
Try taking off your Peril-Sensitive Sunglasses.
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Had a 2014 RWD Model S; gave that to my wife's parents when we bought a 4WD Model X last month. We drove the S from California to New York and back, as well as several other half-way across the country trips for a total of 150k miles, 75-80% of which have been long-distance trips (I work from home; my wife commutes via bicycle most of the time). We spent this last winter up skiing in the mountains every weekend. We've camped in the car, including when stuck in a snowstorm that dumped 10 feet of snow overnig
Re: No (Score:2)