Peloton Got Trapped in Its Trillion-Dollar Fantasy (bloomberg.com) 85
Fueled by manic demand during the early days of Covid, Peloton spent the next two years chasing a dream of fitness dominance. From a report: If Peloton's story thus far were a Peloton class, it would be a high-intensity one, perhaps even a Tabata ride. Everyone would pedal as fast as they could, recover for not long enough, then do it again, as a charismatic figure on the screen urged them on with promises of transformational personal growth and of the massiveness of the total addressable market of subscription fitness. Midway through, the instructor would announce that the 20-minute class would actually go for an hour. Here and there, riders would injure themselves. There would be technical issues with the machines. At the end, right after recommending a five-minute post-ride stretching class and intoning his mantra -- "We're not a stationary bike company, we're not a treadmill company, we are an innovation company that is at the nexus of fitness, technology, and media!" -- the instructor would announce his transition to a new role at the company. It would be exhilarating and entertaining, but perhaps not a ride you'd want to do every day.
[...] The bring-your-own-bike model holds evident appeal for Barry McCarthy (new CEO), who's less interested in the physical machines than in his company's content. "The magic happens in the tablet," he says. He muses that perhaps the Peloton screen should be an open platform where third-party programmers can place apps. Or maybe the company could try the inkjet printer business model, offering machines for cheap and making money through higher monthly subscription fees. At the moment, you can ride your bike even if you're not paying for classes. McCarthy plans to experiment with making those payments mandatory. (On March 10, the company announced such a test, saying it would create a monthly subscription that combines the price of its hardware and content and lacks an upfront hardware payment.) In all of this, McCarthy says he'll let the data be his instructor. It's a familiar narrative: Startup founder gives way to the bean counters and market researchers. Peloton, more than perhaps any other company, trades on charisma -- of its instructors, of its corporate leadership, of its hardcore users cheerfully touting the brand. But even cults need accountants.
[...] The bring-your-own-bike model holds evident appeal for Barry McCarthy (new CEO), who's less interested in the physical machines than in his company's content. "The magic happens in the tablet," he says. He muses that perhaps the Peloton screen should be an open platform where third-party programmers can place apps. Or maybe the company could try the inkjet printer business model, offering machines for cheap and making money through higher monthly subscription fees. At the moment, you can ride your bike even if you're not paying for classes. McCarthy plans to experiment with making those payments mandatory. (On March 10, the company announced such a test, saying it would create a monthly subscription that combines the price of its hardware and content and lacks an upfront hardware payment.) In all of this, McCarthy says he'll let the data be his instructor. It's a familiar narrative: Startup founder gives way to the bean counters and market researchers. Peloton, more than perhaps any other company, trades on charisma -- of its instructors, of its corporate leadership, of its hardcore users cheerfully touting the brand. But even cults need accountants.
Can't understand the huffing and puffing (Score:3)
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I know a bunch of people that bought them, both before the pandemic and during. They tend to be the kind of people that like Soul Cycle as opposed to actually riding a bike. Peleton is priced just like Soul Cycle... stupidly expensive.
During the pandemic we bought a fancy spin bike (Compass)... it was the only kind in stock. (Both my wife and I do like to ride our bikes and to spin.) The think is crap; the console broke, and without that the bike is useless. They sent a replacement console... didn't so
Why not just bike? (Score:2)
They tend to be the kind of people that like Soul Cycle as opposed to actually riding a bike. Peleton is priced just like Soul Cycle... stupidly expensive.
Checking the price... LOLWUT?!?!?
For the same amount of money, I could buy 2 decent quality bicycles.
What's wrong with these people?!? What's in the mind of somebody ready to put 2~3x the price of a bicycle into a "not-a-bike" device, just to pedal on it?
Why not just spare the money and go do some actual bicycle riding?
(Oh yeah, I get it: On your side of the Atlantic pond, large cities tend to be more populous than several of our European countries. So one can't "just get out" and ride a bit in the nature.
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I love to ride (and walk) outdoors, but more to enjoy the ride than to exercise-- that is where spinning can be nice. I can burn 7-900 calories per hour doing it, while a bike ride is closer to 350-400. A relaxed ride could be half that.
Re: Can't understand the huffing and puffing (Score:2)
Those tablet subscriptions are essential for your health considering the BMI Covid link. Should be mandatory for all citizens actually.
Why do people assume Peloton or Pfizer or any Corporation would lie to increase their sales ??
They have watertight peer reviewed studies, probably hundreds of them, with at least a few showing real benefits.
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Up until a few years ago, it was safe to assume that someone using the word âoepelotonâ was talking about either competitive bicycle racing (the term refers to the main pack of riders) or a French-speaking countryâ(TM)s military (it means âoeplatoonâ).
It's not a unit of military, my friend Singe Mangerlefromage tells me it's the standard unit for negotiating a surrender: "A peloton is approaching us with a white flag sir".
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Especially "Peloton" has been a ridiculously over-hyped phenomenon. To me it seems as if they put tons of money into bribing media folks to write about their pretty mundane unable-to-move-anywhere-cycles.
Said a guy that has never taken a class on a Peloton. For such a passionate opinion, you'd think that a micron of data, like using the device and participating in a class would be at the core of the statement. I own one. It got me through the pandemic. It wasn't just a trainer, my mind and my "heart" need exercise. 2020 would have been a darker winter without the classes and the community that Peloton incorporates. The product is solid, it has a sea of sensors, the magnetic fly wheel control is smooth, it
Yup, and the iPhone was just a fancy Palm Pilot (Score:3)
I really can't understand the rage about all these fancy exercise regimes. I mean there are figuratively tons of aerobics and calisthenics videos on the internet. That is, if you're still or were paranoid about catching the virus. Otherwise, you can just walk or jog like in the pre-pandemic.
Try it and you'll see what the hype is about. Is it overhyped?...maybe, but there's actual substance to connected fitness. As you said, exercise videos have been around since we had VCRs. However, consider this perspective: Fitness is not easy for most. Motivation is not easy for most. Motivation to push yourself further is very valuable to most with fitness goals. Peloton has done what it's predecessors have failed to do: deliver a sticky experience. Most people who buy one keep using it even a ye
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Mod parent up. I'm not a peloton fan, and don't want one, but he's described exactly right why peloton is 'valuable'.
We all know tons of people with Gym memberships who never go to the gym, a room full of exercise equipment collecting dust, and a shelf / bookmark folder / pinterest board full of exercise videos they never look at.
Peloton managed to get people to actually keep use it, and for an exercise company that's really kind of the whole point.
Motivation is hard.
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Peloton managed to get people to actually keep use it, and for an exercise company that's really kind of the whole point.
The opposite is true: The best customers of fitness companies pay for some membership while not actually using it, and still keep paying for memberships or new equipment because they only ever get fatter.
In this aspect, fitness companies are very much like dating sites, which also profit from not succeeding to find partners for their customers.
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That's really only true for places like gyms. Peleton doesn't make more money from people who don't use their equipment, because it's not like someone else can use it. The content is mostly a fixed cost.
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The best customers of fitness companies pay for some membership while not actually using it
You are right to the extent that a customer who pays the membership and doesn't show up or use any of the gyms resources is, in a vacuum, the most profitable customer the gym could have.
But most people who never use the gym do eventually clue in and want to get off the subscription. (Even if only to sign up to a different gym or service in the hope that it will work instead). And yes, this is why gyms are infamous for their high pressure sales tactics, contracts, and making cancelling so difficult -- becaus
Nope, they want you to use it (Score:2)
Peloton managed to get people to actually keep use it, and for an exercise company that's really kind of the whole point.
The opposite is true: The best customers of fitness companies pay for some membership while not actually using it, and still keep paying for memberships or new equipment because they only ever get fatter. In this aspect, fitness companies are very much like dating sites, which also profit from not succeeding to find partners for their customers.
There's no advantage to you not using it, beyond some bandwidth and CDN fees. I think there are a few reasons Peloton wants you to stay engaged:
1. Recurring revenue: If you don't use it, you're more likely to cancel.
2. Upsells: They will sell you Peloton-branded fashion, weights, water bottles, even necklaces. They also have new devices coming out this year they'll hope to sell you, like a machine vision trainer and a rowing machine.
3. Network effect: The more users on the platform, the more
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The more users on the platform, the more fun the competition is.
"Competition" is exactly where gyms fail the most often. It is why some women-only gyms found a niche, because they don't like to work out in front of a bunch of type-A macho men. People don't play WoW for competion (at least on PvE side) and will quit WoW when they get pressured into doing PvP. I want a gym where everyone is an overweight slob and no motivational speakers are present and no one is trying to sell me anything. I am perfectly happy doing 10% worse than yesterday. I want to be able give u
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Peloton managed to get people to actually keep use it
Did they? Or was it just that people didn't have to commute to the office which kills their motivation to do anything?
I did a great many things during lockdown that I never had the will before to do and since returning to the office I'm finding the will is gone once more.
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Well, in my case I'm glad that I'm able to get motivated by a much cheaper system. I have a simple flat text file that I've been adding to for 20 years. Every day, I add a line indicating what fitness activities I did. Most often, this is riding my same old cheap bike up and down the hills around here, which costs me about $40 per year to maintain.
I keep the text file in version control (originally svn, now git), so if I start slacking, it goes down on my permanent record. While I'm sure that wouldn't work
Being part of a cult is better than a system! :) (Score:2)
Well, in my case I'm glad that I'm able to get motivated by a much cheaper system. I have a simple flat text file that I've been adding to for 20 years. Every day, I add a line indicating what fitness activities I did. Most often, this is riding my same old cheap bike up and down the hills around here, which costs me about $40 per year to maintain.
I had a system too. I biked every night while watching TV or playing XBox. It worked. I did it every night. My legs were slightly sore after an hour long show or game. I easily did this 5x a week for the last 5 years. Then my friends kept losing weight and I noticed how excited they were to squeeze in workouts here and there. I noticed their cult-like enthusiasm. I even mocked it at first. Then I realized that's what I want.
I want to be part of a cult and irrationally motivated to make better dec
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You could just have the tablet with the same instructors attached to a normal exercise bike... The Peleton could market themselves as "motivators with mini celebrities who yell at you 10% less than the guys at the gym do". Instead they want you to buy a stupidly expensive system, because they're marketin specifically to a particular upscale market. Likely also a market that *already* pays a lot of money for a gym. Part of the appeal seemed to be about being in the exclusive rich people's club. Probably
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I don't have mod points but 100% agree. I actually turned down a job offer from Peloton about 5 years ago, partly because I thought it was a fad. Wife was addicted to Soul Cycle, I went with her a few times and learned I HATE group fitness and vowed to never go back. She decides she wants a Peloton, she had been going to Soul for about 10 years regularly and it was starting to feel a bit stale. I roll my eyes, figure its going to be a dust collector but say whatever lets give it a go, this was a few months
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It's gamification of exercise. Working out to a video is not new - we've had it for decades now.
The problem is, well, without feedback it's rather boring. I mean, if it was so fun, then why do we bother with multiplayer?
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Depends on the person. I'll take a 2 star single player game over a 5 star multiplayer game any day of the week. I'm just not interested in competitive twitching against people 20 years younger than me. For the same reason, I'd rather have the solo session than a group workout class. The sole exception being if someone is there to teach me how to do something new.
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It's gamification of exercise. Working out to a video is not new - we've had it for decades now.
The problem is, well, without feedback it's rather boring. I mean, if it was so fun, then why do we bother with multiplayer? Just play Call of Duty by yourself, or Halo, or Quake or Doom. No, you play against other players because it's more organic and fun.
Well, if it's simply gamification that users want, then a calendar should do. I mean, the original RPGs were pen and paper things, not the point-and-click 3D monsters we have today. If a calendar is too boring, get a journal. Everybody should be familiar about this teenage Jewish girl who decided to "gamify" her horrible experience of war by writing a diary.
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The stereotypical slashdotter is a bit overweight, lives in a basement and eats junk food all day. Probably not the Peloton target market ;-)
My wife has a Peloton - the hardware is definitely over-priced for what it is. I was disappointed that (for example) the resistance adjuster wasn't controlled by the content - so if you do one of the "trail" rides, it doesn't get harder to go up hills. Other than that though, it seems pretty solid - it's been getting a lot of use over the last couple of years, but you
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I really can't understand the rage about all these fancy exercise regimes. I mean there are figuratively tons of aerobics and calisthenics videos on the internet. That is, if you're still or were paranoid about catching the virus. Otherwise, you can just walk or jog like in the pre-pandemic.
You're assuming that they bought it for exercise.
You can get far cheaper and more capable machines, but they don't get likes (even if they have inbuilt FB/Twitter/Instagram capabilities).
It seems eve with how easily a fool and their money are parted, Peloton still cant seem to make any money.
BTW, the fact more people are going to the gym is the main reason I cant stand it any more. I loved the pandemic where you could go to the shops and not be surrounded by a sea of slow moving morons. DYK, the av
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Motivation. It's easier to find the motivation when you have others encouraging you.
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Motivation. It's easier to find the motivation when you have others encouraging you.
It work both ways. Think of the religious or other cultural groups that ostracize members that have fallen from the path. What's worse than being a vegan? Being an ex-vegan.
WTF? (Score:2)
Did one of the Slashdot editors get burned by buying a Peloton and wake up to realize it was a waste of a lot of money? I mean why ELSE would we see so many highly critical articles about something that's irrelevant to Slashdot?
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Are YOU brain-dead, anon? The only people still on this site are the ones stupid enough to not realize they're being manipulated.
Obviously noting that *you're* still here ... :-)
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Old habits die hard, I guess.
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I don't know about a slashdot editor but I'd bet my first child that someone has a big short position on them and is feeding hit peaces on the company for a quit buck.
Not defending peloton here, any company that wants to lock down a hardware that someone already bought unless they pay a subscription can go f*ck themselves, but that there is a smear campaign is undeniable.
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You could always submit some better stories.
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The usual combination... (Score:3)
... of hubris and delusion that seems to be part of the mindset of a lot of unicorn startup CEOs. The best example being adam Neuman who tried to fool investors into thinking his old school office rental setup was some cutting edge tech titan. Yeah, right. At least Peloton do have some tech but at the end of the day its just an exercise bike with a cheap tablet nailed to the handlebars. Hardly cutting edge stuff.
Re: The usual combination... (Score:2)
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... of hubris and delusion that seems to be part of the mindset of a lot of unicorn startup CEOs. The best example being adam Neuman who tried to fool investors into thinking his old school office rental setup was some cutting edge tech titan. Yeah, right. At least Peloton do have some tech but at the end of the day its just an exercise bike with a cheap tablet nailed to the handlebars. Hardly cutting edge stuff.
Theranos was a pretty good example of what happens as well. A grifter who managed to fool a lot of people both with her unlikely product, with the added advantage that she was media worthy for some particular reason.
I only note that because the media's brethless reportage was more focused on Holmes being the first female self made billionaire than her scammy product that wasn't ever going to work.
Maybe Peloton CEO McCarthy could call her in as a consultant.
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The promise of Theranos would of been pretty awesome had it been able to work. That there was also an attractive woman at the helm of the company, even better.
Sadly, it was all a fraud.
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The promise of Theranos would of been pretty awesome had it been able to work. That there was also an attractive woman at the helm of the company, even better.
Sadly, it was all a fraud.
I suspect that at first, she might have believed she could do something good. But she seemed to want to emulate Steve Jobs in dress and actions, and fell for the old idea of "You can do anything you want to do, if you only try hard enough." maybe coupled with the strange thing I see a fair number of modern women do - this process of "manifestation". So she created a calculated persona. I knew there was something up when I heard her speak. It was obvious to me at least that she was talking an octave below he
like comparing Netflix to your local movie theater (Score:2)
At least Peloton do have some tech but at the end of the day its just an exercise bike with a cheap tablet nailed to the handlebars. Hardly cutting edge stuff.
Talk to people who are into it and you'll see it's a lot more than a cheap tablet "nailed" to the handlebars. It uses metrics, rankings, competitions, badges, and pseudo-celebrity trainers, among many things to make it an experience greater than the sum of its parts. It may not be your thing, but it has a huge following among people happy to buy an expensive device and an expensive monthly fee and who are very happy with it.
Unlike an exercise bike and an iPad, they've managed to build an experience th
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Still don't get it. The best experience is to ride a real bike and use it to discover the surroundings.
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"This is why it's more than a spin bike with an iPad"
Sure, whatever. Kid yourself all you want but its just a techy toy for people who arn't really into exercise so need some kind of gamification scenario to do it. I train in a gym 4 times a week and I don't even take my phone. If you're a serious trainer you don't need the BS tech.
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Fuck KnobGobbler69, she's not going to beat me!
Trust me, KnobGobbler69 is not a she.
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When I was a kid I browsed at +1 or +2. If I did that now there would only be a few comments to read and some of the insightfulness might very well be lost if I don't read all the comments leading up to it.
So now I just browser at -1 and use my mod points to reward post I think are making a good point or are informative or just downright funny.
I don't really see why anyone cares so much about what someone else thinks about them on the Internet. I sure as hell am not going to waste time making extra accounts
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Its all left and right and nothing in the middle? Just like between your ears, a left ear and a right ear with nothing in between.
they are shit (Score:2)
Overpriced and very limited shit. You're better off buying a trainer that costs much less, bolts to your existing bike and can be plugged into your computer for data logging or virtual racing games. They are much more capable than a peloton in every way.
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You're better off buying a trainer that costs much less, bolts to your existing bike and can be plugged into your computer for data logging or virtual racing games.
I have a magnetic resistance one that's pretty good, especially in the winter months when only the really crazy people ride outside. :-) No electronics though, just pedal, pedal, pedal to the TV ...
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I've been tempted to do this but just don't have the space to leave my bike setup with the trainer. If I had to get my bike out, get the trainer out, set it all up and then start my ride...Yeah I would never do it.
Part of me does want to kick the wife's car out of the garage and turn that space into a permanent setup but you already see the problem with that idea, I'm sure.
Luckily I live in San Diego so most of the year is good for riding. For me, it's more about finding the motivation then it is about the
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Part of me does want to kick the wife's car out of the garage and turn that space into a permanent setup but you already see the problem with that idea, I'm sure.
Luckily I live in San Diego so most of the year is good for riding.
Do you have off street parking other than the garage? If so, a garage sounds like a colossal waste of incredibly valuable space. I can see if you lived somewhere colder then yeah, scraping off snow in the ass-biting cold is really tedious, but San Diego?
I say that but quite a few pe
It is crazy (Score:2)
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So many people are too stupid to just move their muscles where they would actually do something useful...
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Subscription, subscriptions, subscriptions (Score:3)
No thanks. While I can see how some people might need the motivation of a subscription, all you need is to buy a machine and just use it. Develop a routine and save thousands on a shitty Peleton.
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Feel the burn (Score:1)
The cash burn, that is. Peloton has secured prime retail space around Sydney, and every time I've walked past a boutique it's been empty.
PRO-TIP: You are not HAMSTERS (Score:2)
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GO OUTSIDE
Some of us live in places where there is sufficient ice and cold to make running / cycling impossible. Others live in places where they want to get wet due to sweating not due being caught in a storm.
If you don't have means to exercise at home then you are simply not actually serious about getting exercise and we can safely discount anything you say on the matter. You could do us all a favour and go outside instead of posting shit on slashdot.
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Why? Do you think your personal attack on me somehow invalidates the argument that cold places exist and people don't like exercising in the rain while wearing thick jackets?
You really need to exercise more Rick Schumann. It's good for the brain, and may help you function enough to make a coherent post.
In the mean time fucking yourself is also good exercise, I suggest you do that before your buy yourself something more advanced.
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Oh and by the way if you own a Peloton you're a hamster and none of your shrill posts can change that.
Just run up the stairs (slowly) for like 50-100 fl (Score:2)
Just run up the stairs (slowly) for like 50-100 floors every alternate day.
Pushups/Pullups other days.
Now get off my staitcase
Strava pollution (Score:2)
I just wish Strava would allow filtering of Peloton (and Zwift, and any other virtual activities) from the activity feed. Some folks will have a 5 minute warm-up, activity, 5 minute cool down, and maybe stretching. Each activity with a Peloton instructor hamming it up for a photo or some "virtual" Zwift action shot.
I understand people want to do and track these activities and that is great for them. I have no interest in seeing them though. I assume Strava gets paid for the integration and they consider it
Don't try to be something you're not (Score:2)
Sorry but every time I hear someone talk about a spin "class" or being a spin "instructor", I throw up a little in my mouth. These people aren't teaching you anything. They aren't really being a coach either. These people are trying to elevate their social status and some people are enabling them. Don't fall for it.
Patent bastards (Score:2)
Peloton managed to get patents covering the incredibly obvious "watching a video while exercising" that should never have been granted. Peloton used that patent to sue a number of competitors to oblivion over the last couple years. Now, finally, after a couple years of legal crap, two of the main patents have been voided / invalidated as of a couple months ago.
https://www.pelobuddy.com/two-... [pelobuddy.com]
I understand the need for patents, and the very specific usefulness of them. But when you have these corporations m