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Intel

How Long Will the Last Intel Macs Be Supported? macOS Sonoma Gives Us Some Hints 72

Posted by msmash from the closer-look dept.
An anonymous reader shares a report: A year ago, we compiled a model list of Macs spanning over two decades, complete with their launch dates, discontinuation dates, and all the available information about the macOS updates each model received. We were trying to answer two questions: How long can Mac owners reasonably expect to receive software updates when they buy a new computer? And were Intel Macs being dropped more aggressively now that the Apple Silicon transition was in full swing? The answer to the second question was a tentative "yes," and now that we know the official support list for macOS Sonoma, the trendline is clear.

Macs introduced between 2009 and 2015 could expect to receive seven or eight years of macOS updates -- that is, new major versions with new features, like Ventura or Sonoma -- plus another two years of security-only updates that fix vulnerabilities and keep Safari up to date. Macs released in 2016 and 2017 are only receiving about six years' worth of macOS updates, plus another two years of security updates. That's about a two-year drop, compared to most Macs released between 2009 and 2013. The last of the Intel Macs are still on track to be supported for longer than the last PowerPC Macs were in the mid-to-late 2000s, but they're getting fewer years of software update support than any other Macs released in the last 15 years.
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How Long Will the Last Intel Macs Be Supported? macOS Sonoma Gives Us Some Hints More

How Long Will the Last Intel Macs Be Supported? macOS Sonoma Gives Us Some Hints

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  • Apple, please end support for Intel!!! (Score:5, Funny)

    by ShanghaiBill ( 739463 ) on Monday July 17, 2023 @11:46AM (#63693296)

    I have an Intel MacBook and an Intel MacMini.

    They work fine, so my spouse won't let me buy M2 Apple silicon replacements, despite pleading, begging, and giving her daily foot massages.

    But if support ends, I'll finally have the excuse I need.

    • Re:Apple, please end support for Intel!!! (Score:5, Funny)

      by know-nothing cunt ( 6546228 ) on Monday July 17, 2023 @11:50AM (#63693322)

      despite pleading, begging, and giving her daily foot massages.

      Maybe you need to work a ways higher than her feet, bro.

    • Maybe it would help if I were the one giving her daily foot massages?

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by xeoron ( 639412 )
      One way to breath life into a Intel chip mac is convert it to chromeOS. The old 2016 imacs my work at that became way to slow and unsupported I converted to ChromeOS Flex this year and they went from slow machines that sucked to speed demons that all the staff love to use now when the big high-res screens for doing work on the web.

  • how long before Rosetta 2 is dropped? (Score:3)

    by Joe_Dragon ( 2206452 ) on Monday July 17, 2023 @11:52AM (#63693330)

    how long before Rosetta 2 is dropped?
    Will that be dropped at the about the same time Intel is dropped like how it happened with ppc?

    • how long before Rosetta 2 is dropped? Will that be dropped at the about the same time Intel is dropped like how it happened with ppc?

      The PPC saga is interesting. While the performance was good, IBM never got around to making the chips small enough. Mt old Mac Pro ( the one with the cool aricraft aluminum case) the PPC processors were huge - think the processor and cooling shroud was about the size of an entire Mac Mini. And since there were multiples, damn thing sounded like a turbojet when I was rendering 3D frames in lightwave.

      Hard to get a high performance laptop when the processor is 75 percent of the laptop size.

      Apple kinda h

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by drhamad ( 868567 )
        You're forgetting Motorola in that equation. The return of Steve Jobs to Apple really knocked Motorola out and that was the end of that. Motorola was more about the militarization than IBM.

  • Mac users had a long run of bragging how their computers would be useful for far longer than their PC/Windows counterparts. But that was always largely due to Apple moving more slowly with releases of new machines and OS/software updates.

    (If you don't have a lot of options out as upgrades for the system you're using, then obviously, you're going to feel like what you have is current and good enough, in most cases. And Mac users tended to ignore what the latest hardware was on competing platforms because the

    • I have a Dell laptop from 2012 that still runs a supported copy Windows 10 without issue.

      After upgrading it to an SSD, it actually works surprisingly well for an 11 year old device.

      It doesn't meet the hardware requirements for Windows 11, but I'll have security updates until at least 2025. I doubt that Apple will ever be that generous.

      • I have a Dell laptop from 2012 that still runs a supported copy Windows 10 without issue.

        After upgrading it to an SSD, it actually works surprisingly well for an 11 year old device.

        It doesn't meet the hardware requirements for Windows 11, but I'll have security updates until at least 2025. I doubt that Apple will ever be that generous.

        I had some really old Dell Desktops that could still run W10 until we dot new ones last year. From a corporate point of view though, an old laptop or computer means nothing. No sales, and since I updated to W10 while the were doing it free on the old computers, Microsoft got nothing out of those deals.

        Okay for us - not a cent for the manufacturer.

    • If you don't have a lot of options out as upgrades for the system you're using, then obviously, you're going to feel like what you have is current and good enough, in most cases. And Mac users tended to ignore what the latest hardware was on competing platforms because there wasn't truly a direct correlation there anyway. EG. MacOS written specifically to work with the limited number of possible hardware configurations on the Macs produced won't necessarily need as many system resources as an OS designed for compatibility with millions of combinations of things put out by thousands of vendors.)

      I've never been much on buying a computer, then spending a lot more money trying to rev it up. I mean, that's great for a hobbyist, who's goal is getting something to work.

      But you are talking about a different crowd, a crowd who isn't concerned with getting the cheapest possible price and hand building a computer.

      I make money with my Macs, and if I need a faster one or it goes unsupported, I buy a new one. The cost of a new one is just background noise.

      Now I make money with my Windows machines as well

  • Offer a scrappage scheme and a legacy app migration scheme too. In the Windows world the backwards compatibility tangled web causes people to run old software for decades and find themselves in a knot when the hardware breaks down. The fact that so many people are stranded on Windows 7 is proof of this. The Applecare for the last Intel Macbook airs are starting to expire, so is a good time to start rounding them up. Intel Macs are a liability now, as Apple is not making them anymore, if they break you could
    • Applecare for the last Intel machines wont expire till summer 2026, Apple was still selling the 2019 Mac Pro new and eligible for Applecare in June

    • It's a computer version of a well-known tabletop game from before WWII. I'm using it because the "modern" versions of that game either cost too much, have ads, or "phone home."

      Archive.org is your friend.

      The pre-Windows-10 ".hlp"-based help system is obsolete, but Microsoft even provides a work-around for that [microsoft.com].

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by tzanger ( 1575 )

      I'm not "stranded" on Windows 7; I run Win7 VMs because they're smaller and lighter than Win10/11 ones and don't break down if they can't talk to the mothership. I'm quite sure there are ways to make Win10 do this, but it doesn't seem worth it for as long as the stuff I run runs fine in nicely snapshotted Win7 VMs.

  • It is a feature (Score:4, Funny)

    by jovius ( 974690 ) on Monday July 17, 2023 @12:09PM (#63693420)

    They finally came up with the ultimate way to force new sales: coming up with new chip architecture now and then

    • First the 68000, but you really needed to upgrade to the 68040 to get the MMU for virtual memory, and, of course, 32-bits at some point.

      The PPC 601, because why stick to an old architecture? Don't be like me and buy a 68030 when the 601 is available. Sexy RISC!

      When the G4 came along, you really did want Altivec.

      Hey, the Intel iMac! Finally, a Core that can run Windows natively without Connectix Virtual PC!

      Oh, damn. I got the Core too early. I really want a Core 2, so I can use 64 bits.

      I can get a $500 dev k

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Saffaya ( 702234 )

        "First the 68000, but you really needed to upgrade to the 68040 to get the MMU for virtual memory, and, of course, 32-bits at some point"
        Uh, excuse me?
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
        "The Motorola 68030 ("sixty-eight-oh-thirty") is a 32-bit microprocessor"
        "The 68030 is essentially a 68020 with a memory management unit (MMU)"

  • I think it's unfortunate... (Score:5, Interesting)

    by dark.nebulae ( 3950923 ) on Monday July 17, 2023 @12:20PM (#63693504)

    I bought one of the last 2020 Intel-based iMacs because I wanted the fastest system that was going to be possible under Intel and MacOS.

    I appreciate that they prefer their own chips, but damn it I appreciate being able to also run windows, linux, any VMs, docker containers, etc without having to worry if I need to find some specific version that supports Silicon or whether or not what I'm running will somehow have to be emulated as an x86.

    Will the end of Intel support force me to move to Silicon? No, probably not. It will likely have me not doing updates and hoping the software I use remains compatible, but otherwise I won't be changing until the bitter end...

    • I did the same thing, actually - bought an Intel MacBook Pro off the refurb store. And FWIW this was after my having used a work-provided M1 MacBook Air for over a year.

      The Apple Silicon Macs are nice, but in practice I don't notice any particular performance differences (and the M1 Air gets about as hot on my lap as the Intel Pro does). And I seem to have "lucked" into having some old Mac games that don't work under Rosetta 2 - the companies are out of business, so there's no chance of an update.

      When the O

      • Re: (Score:1)

        by r0nc0 ( 566295 )
        Interesting. I have a 2016 Intel MBP, a 2020 Intel MBP and a 2022 M1 MBP the latter of which replaced the first as my primary work machine. It easily beats out the 2016 MBP when building and running a complex docker-compose stack; the 2016 MBP has odd docker errors and can't quite run the full stack while the M1 doesn't have an issue even though it's fully running all cores a good bit of the time. Obviously anecdotal; I don't use the 2020 Intel MBP for development so I can't compare - I use it for music stu

    • I bought the first M1 Mac mini as Iâ(TM)m a developer and wanted to try it out. Back then, it was pretty tough but at least as smooth as the shift from PPC to Intel was back in the day. The major difference was the temps, my Intel Mac mini routinely runs at 80+C and the M1 runs at 35 under the same loads. Iâ(TM)ve now got an M1Pro MacBook Pro which slaughters the old Intel MacBook Pro I used.

      I do all the same stuff I did on the Intel Macs, including virtualisation with UTM which being based on Qem

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by slazzy ( 864185 )
      This is why I switched to Mac in the first place too, Intel-based Macs allowed me to run all OS that I wanted on one machine

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by antdude ( 79039 )

      Ditto. I hope by the time ARM Mac is needed, it can easily do free VMs, other OSes (e.g., Linux), etc. Hopefully, Apple will bring back its BootCamp too.

  • I would really like to get six years out of it.

    Though I usually update macOS only every two years, so I don't have to spend too much on VmWare Fusion

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by tzanger ( 1575 )

      I do about the same; my 2011 11" Air lasted seven years of hard, daily use and is still running 24/7 as my home security camera system (SecuritySpy). When I got it, I got the fastest i7 and maxxed out the RAM (8GB). When I finally retired it and got the 2020 13" pro I did something similar (i7, 32GB RAM, 2TB SSD). While I hope I will get 7 years out of it I'm a little skeptical, but it's been awesome so far. I limit the OS updates just because I hate change for the sake of change, and VMWare Fusion works ve

      • I spent over 2500 CHF (incl. taxes) on the i7 Mini (32G/1T). That was about two weeks before they dropped the price a bit...

        That said, a 32G/1T Mini with the highest-specced CPU/GPU/NE is about the same today. But I could upgrade this Mini to 64G, if I wanted to spend the additional 500 CHF or so that it costs to have done at an authorized service partner.
        For a bit more, there's already the Mac Studio...it's a rabbit hole.

  • Updates doesn't mean new OS availability. For instance I have a 2012 mac mini out in the garage, it does fine for what I ask of it but the newest Mac OS it can run is 10.15 but it does get updates
    Not "new major versions with new features, like Ventura or Sonoma" hell it wont even install Big Sur and that's 3 versions old

    • Re: (Score:3)

      by mysidia ( 191772 )

      the newest Mac OS it can run is 10.15 but it does get updates

      This is not true... You can only get the existing historical updates they released up to 2022. Once you applied 10.15.7; that's the very last update for MacOS 10 that exists and is expected to be the last version of MacOS 10 to ever exist.

      MacOS 10 is what is called "End of Life". It's not supported anymore, so Apple has not been and is Not expected to release any further update to 10.15. There are plenty of new security issues discover

    • For quite a while now, security updates are only available for the two most recent non-current major versions. So once Ventura came out, that was the end for 10.15 and when Sonomo comes out, Big Sur gets dropped.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Osgeld ( 1900440 )

        yea that's on me, once Ventura came out I downloaded the drivers for wifi and bluetooh (maybe some others) and have been running windows 10 native boot for close to 4 or years

        Mac OS irritates the shit out of me TBH, and we were a Mac OS family since the SE came out.

    • Updates doesn't mean new OS availability.

      It didn't pretend it does. In fact TFS and TFA literally talk about OS updates and security updates separately. Without looking it up, can you tell me how many paragraphs in TFS? I'm going to guess you'll say 1.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Osgeld ( 1900440 )

        it plainly states Macs introduced between 2009 and 2015 could expect to receive seven or eight years of macOS updates -- that is, new major versions with new features, like Ventura or Sonoma in the summary

        I don't give a single fuck about Macintosh life, just commenting on what was quoted you hateful useless prick

  • I was issued an M1 Mac a year ago, and the software I needed to develop was in a framework that was only available for Intel. After scrabbling around for a good long while, I told my boss I couldn't do my job on the hardware they had given me and contacted my recruiter to put me back out on the market. At the time I really had no other choice.

    My boss talked me out of leaving and the company found an Intel mac to issue me. I've been using it successfully ever since.

    Now, I've heard that Intel emulation on

  • I had a 2018 top-of-the-line i7 iMac that became so slow by 2021 with OS updates that I gave up on it as a daily machine. I still have several older MacBook Air's that are functional, but too slow as daily machines. One Air still has the free app-version of Sketchup so it gets pulled out once in a while when I need that... but it is painful.

    Ultimately that is what pushed me to just switch to Linux Mint for my desktop. The i3 NUC is a little light for my use, but it does the job. 80% of my needs are stil

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by lyran74 ( 685550 )
      I'm sorry, but there is no way a properly functioning 2018 i7 Mac was too slow with OS updates by 2021.

      It either needs a reinstall, thermal paste reapplied to the heatsink on the CPU, or possibly something else.

      It's just not the OS.

      • If "top of the line" then it probably means more storage than available with flash, so it's probably a fusion drive setup and the mechanical drive portion is failing. Apple picked some really bad hard drives over the last 10 years compared to others, quite a bit worse than industry average. And of course the 2018 would be a pain to upgrade because you have to cut the adhesive on the screen to get in.

        • Re: (Score:1)

          by lyran74 ( 685550 )
          I almost forgot about spinning platters and fusion drives. And yes, the iMacs are a pain to upgrade internally. Most straightforward option is just to boot off an external Thunderbolt SSD.

        • Yeah, that is likely my root cause. Hadn't thought to try an external SSD to compensate.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by cstacy ( 534252 )

      I had a 2018 top-of-the-line i7 iMac that became so slow by 2021 with OS updates that I gave up on it as a daily machine.

      My daily machine is a 2014 Mini (running Monterey) and it's perfectly fine. I sometimes use my 2009 Mini, but that one is a little sluggish.

      My tasks are: text editing, browsing, email, Zoom, etc etc, audio editing, and some video editing and production, watch videos of course

      Development (mostly Lisp and Python, and I compile open source stuff with the GCC suite. I get a lot of stuff from the "brew" repo.

      When security updates stop, I'll just keep using the machine, as long as Firefox (or something) can be cu

      • Well. there is one Apple thing that is very convenient that I use. Time Machine.

        A little bit of bash scripting with rsync and using hard links and you can come very close to Time Machine on Linux without a lot of effort.

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by cstacy ( 534252 )

          Well. there is one Apple thing that is very convenient that I use. Time Machine.

          A little bit of bash scripting with rsync and using hard links and you can come very close to Time Machine on Linux without a lot of effort.

          Time machine runs continuously in the background, atomically and safely backing up all the system files in addition to the user files. It works by means of support in the file system, which notifies the daemon whenever any file in the system changes. Does Linux have that? And of course it does truly incremental backups, with the oldest versions of the files automatically getting pruned. It has a cool UI for retrieving files. And it's all fully automagical; no user intervention needed. And it never gets in t

          • I love Time Machine. That's why I replicated the layout of its backup folders for Linux backups. No, I don't have the speedups of file tracking, so rsync has to go file by file looking for changes before creating a hard link to the unchanged previous copy of the file in the new backup folder. And no, it doesn't migrate anything.

            But no - Time Machine does not run continuously in the background. It runs hourly. APFS snapshots handle file changes continuously and Time Machine can tap into that.

            Technically

            • Re: (Score:2)

              by cstacy ( 534252 )

              To do this with Linux, you'd just have to restore the whole disk and then upgrade.

              Yeah that's not the task, though.

              • Technically it is just a longer method to complete the same task because that installer is where the only migration tools are. Though it's a bit off topic for Time Machine, being a function of Migration Assistant.

  • I'm typing this on an M2 Mac Mini that I bought earlier this year, replacing an Intel Mac mini, that replaced an earlier Intel iMac, and so on.

    None of these upgrades were motivated by support; my 1st generation 2014-vintage iPad Air still works beautifully, though I can't install much new software on it and many websites tell me my browser is no longer supported. So be it. I still use a 4th generation iPad mini for flight planning. It works fine but is on its last iOS and ForeFlight updates. After this ma

  • I have a couple Intel Mac Mini's that run ESXi. Works great, I have multiple older OSX guests running (from time to time) as well as windows and linux (time server, dns, etc)

    Amazing stuff. I have a M1 laptop but for a server I don't see moving to a M1 mini unless some magic Intel virtualization comes around and that is sounding like a dream.

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