HBO Max Cranks Up the Widevine DRM, Leaves Linux Users in the Cold (arstechnica.com) 112
Jim Salter, reporting for ArsTechnica: A reader tipped us off today that HBO Max stopped working a couple of weeks ago for Linux users, under any Web browser. Any attempt to play back a video on the streaming service on a Linux system -- regardless of distribution or browser -- returns an error saying, "We're having trouble playing this video. Please try again later." Unfortunately, trying again later won't help -- the root cause of the problem is that the Widevine DRM attempting to protect HBO Max's content from pirates is refusing to recognize any Linux system as a known platform.
We saw the same thing happen in January, when CBS All Access suddenly stopped working on Linux in the same way. When we asked CBS executives if they had enabled the Verified Media Path (VMP) requirement on their Widevine server, they suddenly clammed up -- but later that day, the service miraculously worked for Linux users again. We did verify that HBO Max will not work on Linux browsers and that the problem is -- once again -- Widevine DRM refusing to issue a license. Although HBO Max has not returned requests for comment at press time, it seems very likely that the cause here is the same as it was for CBS All Access back in January. It seems like somebody enabled Verified Media Path on the Widevine server, and since the Linux kernel is not a verified media path, Linux users can't get a license and can't watch the content.
We saw the same thing happen in January, when CBS All Access suddenly stopped working on Linux in the same way. When we asked CBS executives if they had enabled the Verified Media Path (VMP) requirement on their Widevine server, they suddenly clammed up -- but later that day, the service miraculously worked for Linux users again. We did verify that HBO Max will not work on Linux browsers and that the problem is -- once again -- Widevine DRM refusing to issue a license. Although HBO Max has not returned requests for comment at press time, it seems very likely that the cause here is the same as it was for CBS All Access back in January. It seems like somebody enabled Verified Media Path on the Widevine server, and since the Linux kernel is not a verified media path, Linux users can't get a license and can't watch the content.
LOL @ Linux (Score:5, Informative)
Linux users left in cold
Linux users are usually power users, and many are developers. This is how you get people to break your DRM. I would say that most people on Linux have other methods of getting that media anyway...........
Re:LOL @ Linux (Score:5, Interesting)
Linux users are usually power users
This may have been the case 10-15 years ago, but from what I've seen it's not true today. During the past few years, we've gotten a fair bit of walk-in traffic from Linux-using students who don't seem to know any more about troubleshooting their OS than the average Windows or Mac user knows about those systems. They've got Ubuntu on their laptop, something or other isn't working, and they have no idea how to go about figuring the problem out.
Heck, a fair number of them aren't even particularly familiar with using bash. I'm not talking about sed or awk, I'm talking about stuff like ls.
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Power users not so much just hobbiests and developers. For better or worse nobody is funding the production of people who actually know anything anymore (aka admins).
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They've replaced you with a bunch of devs playing admin. Apparently you didn't get the memo yet.
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Sorry, that wasn't clear they've replaced admins with devs. The admins floating around are in legacy shops and jobs. There is no career to work toward as a *nix guy anymore so there aren't likely to be new *nix guys just developers who think they are *nix guys.
If sed, grep, awk, tr and perl aren't combined, at least 3 out of 4, together into a one liner most every day you probably aren't a *nix power user. If you install from source on a binary based package platform, you probably aren't a *nix power user.
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"I can't waste the time to argue about this more but it doesn't sound like you work in IT beyond a call center or something."
Son... I don't normally do this. In fact I don't know if I've ever done this. But you should probably at least glance at a UID before making a complete ass of yourself. There is a pretty fair chance I deployed Linux in massive global enterprise environments when you were in diapers.
I'm well aware of what lurks around most enterprise environments passing as 'knows linux' because I see
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Ahem... it is next to your name at the top of your post. User identification number. They are assigned sequentially. This forum were linux guys like Linus Torvalds and Alan Cox would participate. Alan's UID is 27532. Mine is from the late 90's when I'd chat with/debate/annoy those guys and a whole lot more from the linux crowd and many others here on Slashdot. Your UID is from MUCH MUCH later. I don't think they'd pop'd a million yet in 2010.
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Ummm... yes because it is a common thing to reference on Slashdot. I wasn't the one playing *nix expert on TV and calling people n00b like a 12 yr old. That was you remember? I was the one applying philosophical charity and assuming you were one of the existing admins who hadn't caught on to the removal of Unix expertise from the field.
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I'm talking about stuff like ls.
Putting these people on linux is doing them a disservice. Frankly, the desktop atmosphere on Linux will forever be a simple convenience for people who already know how to use the command line. Anyone who cant use the cli has no business using linux and will be MUCH HAPPIER using windows or mac.
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I don't think anyone "put these people on LInux" - they mostly seem to be doing it to themselves.
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I don't think anyone "put these people on LInux" - they mostly seem to be doing it to themselves.
Pffft, mortals. Your understanding of the world is so cute.
So, the reality is, all of them were put there by me or entities like me. We are they who shall not be named.
We put you on Linux too. You only thought it was your idea. We’re that good.
Re: LOL @ Linux (Score:1)
Anyone who cant use the cli has no business using linux and will be MUCH HAPPIER using windows or mac.
And that attitude, right there, folks, is precisely why it will never be the year of Linux on the Desktop.
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And that attitude, right there, folks, is precisely why it will never be the year of Linux on the Desktop.
Nope. Not even close.
The reason is because the average world IQ is 100, and the vast majority follow the path of least resistance, while being content with the status-quo, whatever that may be. If Linux came pre-installed on new PC’s, most people would use Linux.
Trying to convince a typical user to install a new OS over the one they already have is a Herculean task. Most will ask “What
Re: LOL @ Linux (Score:3)
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Since switching my mum to a Chromebook I've not had any tech support calls at all.
Re: LOL @ Linux (Score:5, Insightful)
For basic computing needs Linux does pretty much anything you want using a DE. Most people do not do much on their computer except browse the internet, write documents, and store their music collection. Most DEs have a graphical package manager like Snap or Gnome Software. Unless you are doing something related to development or server maintenance, there is no reason to open up a terminal app or run it headless.
Re:LOL @ Linux (Score:4, Funny)
Putting these people on linux is doing them a disservice. Frankly, the desktop atmosphere on Linux will forever be a simple convenience for people who already know how to use the command line. Anyone who cant use the cli has no business using linux and will be MUCH HAPPIER using windows or mac.
Especially Windows.
People tend to like having their files held for ransom and having to run anti-virus to visit a website. Many don’t even need to upload their own photos, someone else does it for them! Saaa-weeet!
But that’s not even the best part.
When surveyed, an overwhelming number of users reported that they “greatly enjoy” rebooting their computer, only to find that it WILL install updates for the next 20 minutes. When asked why they like this, the average user replied “more free time for me!”
I personally found it cool when I walked into the living room at 5am to find my daughter’s computer “in use” as if she was sitting in front of it. Apparently, some she installed some game mod that allowed someone else to control her machine. And it didn’t even require Admin privileges. It opened her computer up to the world, so that anyone could help her with technical support. Awesome!
Yes, put neophytes on Windows. It’ll do the a service and It’ll make the Internet, hell, it’s make the world a far better place.
When you’re right, you’re right.
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Linux users are usually power users, and many are developers. This is how you get people to break your DRM. I would say that most people on Linux have other methods of getting that media anyway...........
Yeah, and now they have a reason that many will empathize with.
After all, if they don’t even offer it to Linux users, how can they claim that they’re losing revenue?
“Gee, I was willing to pay for it, but you won’t let me, do ...”
I hear the crewcut crowd now, “but the laa
Android on KVM? (Score:1)
Besides, run Android in KVM and the problem does not exist. All done.
Re:Android on KVM? (Score:4, Funny)
First they came for the non-android linux distro users and I said nothing because I'm not a non-android linux distro user...
LXC. *maybe*. But probably not. (Score:4)
Android is a Linux distro...
But it's not a *GNU/Linux* distro. (Suddenly all the fuss by RMS bout the GNU/Linux moniker is entirely relevant in this specific case(.
It's a Linux kernel, but combined with Google very own "I can't believe it's not Java(tm)!" userland.
Of which only AOSP is the opensource part, but most app rely on the extra Google Play Service proprietary blob.
(though MicroG provide some replacement of the later)
And probably Widevine is using some more stuf that could even further break security infrastructure like SafetyNet and other anti-tampering crap.
unless it stopped working on Android, the title is wrong.
It's an abuse of language.
Most of the users usually don't necessarily care what kenel their system is running, but only what their system looks like.
Android looks entirely different and doesn't rely much on a POSIX core built out of GNU component.
Usually, people say "Linux" when they mean GNU/Linux and just use the kernel's name for the whole system.
And people say "Android" even if it also runs the same Kernel (but a completely different userspace).
Besides, run Android in KVM and the problem does not exist. All done.
Technically, you could use a container based-system like LXC and gain some performance by sharing the same kernel instead of running a whole extra VM layer.
- Anbbox is a very popular such solution
- Collabra have recently started SPURV as a similar tech.
(- And Jolla have AlienDalvik as their own solution for running Android apps on their own GNU/Linux OS - Sailfish OS )
But the problem is not just the ability to run apps.
The problem is having the DRM system to accept decoding the video. Whicih is an entirely different can of worm.
In my experience (AlienDalvik on Sailfish) running random simple android apps is trivial.
But having some special thing that requires some specific security bit to work - and DRM such as Widevine are of the typical problematic bits.
The worst part with Widevine is that it comes in different levels. Some modern apps like Netflix require some new levels that rely on a hardware solution that is outisde of the reach of the user who just want to run an Android LXC container.
It might be some special key that is saved on a special partition that Android self-destruct before you get to root your device (so you won't be able to copy the DRM keys from your Android smartphone into the Android LXC you try to run on your deksotp). It might be some special DRM chip that doesn't exist on your laptop.
Re: LXC. *maybe*. But probably not. (Score:2)
It's not super hard to get GNU tools on Android. They are simply of limited use due to the touch screen and sandboxes.
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Android isn't really Linux. It may be derived from Linux but I would say it is as much Linux as Linux is Unix (i.e. similar but not necessarily equal).
Re: Android on KVM? (Score:3)
Following your logic, it works on OS/X so it should also works on FreeBSD because OS/X is BSD? ;)
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I believe OSX is Darwin, and I would expect it to work but only if it’s POSIX compliant.
This is why DRM was needed as a web standard. (Score:5, Insightful)
So that something like this could never happen.
Oh wait.
They still use proprietary DRM, so it was an ideological loss for no practical gain!? THOSE MOTHERFUCKERS!!!
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What we needed was standard DRM as a web standard. People fought that too hard, so we didn't get it. Instead we got pluggable custom DRM as a web standard. Now we have nothing. Good work, protestors! Good fucking work.
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Re:This is why DRM was needed as a web standard. (Score:4, Informative)
Open standard DRM is impossible because it is reliant on closed binary blobs for trust. I mean HBO trusting it, not you.
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Yes, it was an onion of bad ideas, so many layers of wrongness to discuss.
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No but it's also fundamentally different. Web DRM ensures that, for example, the video stream is HDCP protected and not being captured on the device itself. That requires signed binary video drivers, for example.
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No, but bringing up WebAuthn in a discussion about video DRM is a red herring.
WebAuthn is a web API for authentication, used to prove who you are to a website. Then based on your identity, the website can perform authorization to tell whether you subscribe or not. Authentication and authorization are not the same thing. Furthermore, neither is related to Encrypted Media Extensions (EME), which is purportedly a way to display video through a subscriber's device while deterring the subscriber from tapping the
Re:This is why DRM was needed as a web standard. (Score:4, Insightful)
Well, the question ix - why are you wanting to watch in a web browser then?
Without it, it would be app only. Not a big loss - there are an alarmingly large number of streaming services that cannot be viewed in a web browser. Even more if you consider the app version often gets you enhanced quality - the web version might be 729o stereo, but if you use the app, you can get 4K with Dolby Atmos audio
I have seen many questions start with "I am getting rid of cable. I do not want to buy a Roku, I have a PC. Tell me how to get X" and it inevitably ends up as "Keep cable or buy a Roku or AppleTV because if you want X (say, Disney+), there is no web version. If you want 4K Netflix, you're limited to Windows 10 and the app, or the outdated version of the Edge browser".
I'm sure the people who really didn't want DRM didn't realize many services were already using it and would be more than happy to drop the online web version. I know the feeling was "if we don't give them DRM they'll just make the content free!" but the reality was they just won't provide it, unless you have an Android or iOS device (including things like AppleTV, Android TV, etc) or one of the few other devices like a Roku.
Honestly, speaking with many people ,it's only the really hardcore use the Web version - everyone else uses a streaming box on their TV (or game console), or their phones and tablets. Very few on laptops or desktops or HTPCs. Then again, without the DRM support, the services would just drop the web version.
Re:This is why DRM was needed as a web standard. (Score:5, Insightful)
I have seen many questions start with "I am getting rid of cable. I do not want to buy a Roku, I have a PC. Tell me how to get X" and it inevitably ends up as "Keep cable or buy a Roku or AppleTV because if you want X (say, Disney+), there is no web version. If you want 4K Netflix, you're limited to Windows 10 and the app, or the outdated version of the Edge browser".
Piracy is not rampant for no reason.
Yes, some portion would never pay anyway, but some would have but got tired of the customer-hostile bullshit.’’
The last time I paid for a song was about 15 years ago. I bought a CD, and tryst CD contained a root kit.
I never bought another one. Between that and DRM, they’ve disincentivized it to such a degree, that anyone with options will likely take them.
People will pay for convenience, and they will refuse to pay for inconvenience.
We’re all just trying to get through life with as many benefits and as little abuse as possible. Morals are things marketed to you by people who want to take advantage of said morals, or by people who desperately don’t want you to have more benefits than they do.
Make shit convenient or lose money.
I didn’t make the rules I just play the game.
Re: This is why DRM was needed as a web standard. (Score:2)
Why would you install the root kit?
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I am one of those people who only uses a browser. I don't understand why anyone does otherwise.
If you buy a streaming media box, you have to choose which one. One box supports services A, B, and C; another box supports services A, C, and D. If you want them all you have to buy 2 boxes, or hope that one of the boxes will add support later. A browser works with them all. Then in 6 months, service B changes and is no longer compatible. And new service E comes out that neither box supports so you have to
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An old laptop + any operating system + a web browser is superior in every way.
Other than that you have to buy multiple operating systems to run the streaming applications for services A, B, C, and D. And then the streaming application for service E runs only on one specific operating system that runs only on the brand of computer sold by the operator of service E (or on the same company's premium smartphone and streaming media box).
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I have never heard of the problems you list. What streaming service does not work in a web browser on Windows? The entire point is that by simply using a web browser completely eliminates the problems you mention. Why does anyone install a streaming application for a service? Just go to the web site. The only time I've had it not work is if I am using Android.
Quibi not on PCs; Windows CDMs not on X11/Linux (Score:2)
I have never heard of the problems you list. What streaming service does not work in a web browser on Windows?
I can think of Quibi. (source [quibi.com]) I suspected Apple TV+ was another but have since learned that Apple TV+ works in select web browsers on "a PC." (source [apple.com]) Without a subscription to Apple TV+, I cannot verify whether that means Windows and X11/Linux or just Windows.
In any case, you have to buy a Windows license for your PC in order to use EME CDMs made for Windows. When I bought the used ThinkPad on which I'm typing this comment, its Windows license was a volume license, it couldn't reach the LAN to which the v
Yup... (Score:2)
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They care nothing about your complaints so long as you still pay them.
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The move to HBO Max definitely dropped our experience with HBO streaming down a few pegs. Thanks, HBO, for losing all those things we had saved in our watch list with no possibility of reviewing, backing up, or recovering them. Thanks also for making the home screen more of a cluttered mess. Oh, and also thanks for breaking your app every week or two when you randomly change something in the background forcing us to run a full update mid-show just to keep watching.
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Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)
Read those specs again (Score:4, Informative)
Actually if you go look at their Supported Devices and Features it lists under computer:
Windows 7 or later
macOS X 10.10 (Yosemite) or later
Google OS
Linux is not listed.
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I simply won't use their service. It's as simple as that. The more restrictive these services get, the more of a nuisance it becomes that even the general public gets annoyed to hell with it, not just niche power linux users.
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Sidenote Bravo to the marketing short bus at Microsoft for slowly convincing the world that PC = Windows.
I agree with most of your post, but I feel like this was more due to Apple and their "I'm a Mac, I'm a PC" ad campaign.
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Earlier this year we had similar for TV. (Score:4, Informative)
But earlier this year the majority of programs were no longer available due to a Widevine 'update'. Linux users of the upstream provider KPN experienced the same.
The helpdesk did not know of a solution , eventually they gave me a free month of internet and TV.
Luckily the problem was a couple of weeks later fixed with a new version of Widevine, I have never heard what the underlying cause was, could be similar to what the HBO users are seeing.
Yeah this sucks.
Verified? (Score:3)
Does "Verified" mean some sort of kickback?
Because the NT kernel has more new holes every week than a NJ side street, so it's not clear what they're protecting. Do they think that in-memory keys are secure on Windows?
Re:Verified? (Score:5, Interesting)
So "verified" in this context means either the hardware platform or the software viewer was approved by Hollywood. Desktop Linux would've fallen under the first category (I assume running in a browser). But someone flipped a bit or dropped the ball and suddenly Linux browsers are no longer verified for the movie stream.
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Full hardware decoding is available with the right DRM modules and hardware. Microsoft offers its PlayReady [microsoft.com] DRM for precisely this scenario, giving media applications a secure end-to-end pipeline for the decryption, decoding, and display of media.
Though the degree of DRM requi
Considering it doesn't work on Amazon and Roku (Score:2)
https://www.indiewire.com/2020... [indiewire.com]
I'm not terribly surprised that it isn't working on linux...
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The more they fracture the whole streaming service industry, the more I want nothing to do with them. I'm not going to pay $15 to each one every month.
So you're a pirate, then. (Doesn't matter if you're not--that's how they'll justify to investors for missing projections and to legislatures for more draconian laws.)
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The more they fracture the whole streaming service industry, the more I want nothing to do with them. I'm not going to pay $15 to each one every month.
So you're a pirate, then. (Doesn't matter if you're not--that's how they'll justify to investors for missing projections and to legislatures for more draconian laws.)
There are plenty of low cost/free streaming services. With more content than you'll ever begin to scratch the surface of in your lifetime. (Insert blatent plug for the Internet Archive here)
HBO Max doesn't really have that much content. You could probably sign up for it and stream everything you wanted to watch in the "free" month you get when you sign up. Unless you have kids, and they watch Frozen every day, all day.
Re:Considering it doesn't work on Amazon and Roku, (Score:2)
So you're a pirate, then. (Doesn't matter if you're not--that's how they'll justify to investors for missing projections and to legislatures for more draconian laws.)
They write the laws, yes, but who writes the code?
That’s right, you and I do, and half of the rest of Slashdot. (I’m assuming)
Unless lawmakers learn to program, they can make all the laws they want, you and I will always know a way to get around them. (Generic you, not specific you ,,, you’re a milkman for all I know)
Sure, t
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So pirate it. The files still work just fine. (Score:2)
Isn't it kind of a given, that whenever you see DRM, you're seeing fraud? It's more than a mere coincidence that no legitimate company happens to have ever used DRM.
Just say no. Never pay for that shit. It's always a scam. You're feeling the incentive anyway, so just give in and pirate. You shouldn't have signed up in the first place. If it had been an honest business, they would have advertised that it doesn't have any DRM.
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Isn't it kind of a given, that whenever you see DRM, you're seeing fraud? It's more than a mere coincidence that no legitimate company happens to have ever used DRM.
I'm not sure how valid the highlighted statement is.
Apple used DRM when they began selling music via iTunes (although they no longer do). Netflix and Amazon also use DRM for their video streaming services. I think you would be hard pressed to say that Apple, Netflix or Amazon are "no legitimate compan(ies)".
Re:So pirate it. The files still work just fine. (Score:5, Insightful)
A judge would rightly call this stealing.
Right, but only if you do it. If a big company deliberately overcharges $10 million people, a judge would call it "a civil matter", and no one would ever risk seeing jail. If you steal a $1.00 pack of gum from Walmart, you sir, are tried under criminal law. Walmart doesn't need to hire it's own lawyers, the state will take care of prosecution.
You?
Pfffft ... better have deep pockets if you want your $39.99 back. The lawyer is on your nickel.
The courts don't work for you and me, they never did, so if you find yourself making arguments in front of a judge, you've already lost.
A judge also said the government can take your home, pay what they think is right, and then give it to a rich guy if he'll generate more tax revenue. A bunch of judges said that slavery was constitutional.
Unless you're one of those that actually thinks that corrupt politicians and lobbyists determine what's right and what's wrong.
And if they disappear, they'll disappear. I guess it's a self-punishing paradigm. But remember, artists put on plays and entertained long before they started getting paid to do it. It's not like true artists will simply give up and become accountants.
A new way of compensating them will spring up. One that doesn't involve the indentured servitude that all but the most popular artists find themselves in.
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Thank you for reminding me why I stopped reading Slashdot forums. Your opinion will change when it suits your interests, in that miraculous postmodern way. No point in arguing for either of us. Arguing is for people who exercise reason, and that's so far from a majority even here on slashdot, there is no chance for comment moderation to work. Web 2.0 has been the death of reason, and democratized moderation has been the death of unpopular truth. Someone is going to respond with something about "whose t
As usual (Score:3, Insightful)
Can't just be the User-Agent string, can it? (Score:2)
How are they determining the OS? Can't just be the user-agent string. Does something else in Javascript reveal that info?
They're also breaking TiVo (Score:5, Interesting)
On the email address I have registered with a "lifetime subscription" TiVO box, I got this message today:
Dear TiVo Customer,
As of August 31, 2020, the HBO app will no longer be available on TiVo DVRs.
You may be able to continue to enjoy HBO programming on HBO Max, which is available on your computer, mobile device, and select streaming devices, including TiVo Stream 4K. Please note a separate subscription to HBO Max may be required.
To see a full list of HBO Max supported devices, please see HBO Max Supported Devices.
Sincerely,
TiVo
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I've been a TiVo owner for a lot of years, but I have to say - their support of streaming media has always been half-assed at best, even on the boxes which were marketed as "all in one" media solutions.
I've got a Tivo Bolt with lifetime under my TV, but it's basically just been gathering dust now that my wife isn't watching any network shows. For the commercial streaming services, as well as streaming your own home media, there are much better options.
Cancelled my HBO in response to this mess. (Score:3)
I've been a HBO subscriber for 20+ years. Yesterday I cancelled my subscription. This is the last straw.
I still don't understand the difference between HBO Go, HBO Max, HBO Now, etc... I don't think they could make their network's viewing options any more annoying and complicated. Now there's too much better content out there. Bye Bye HBO. I won't be back.
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HBO Go: Internet VOD service bundled with subscription to linear HBO through a traditional multichannel video provider
HBO Now: Stand-alone Internet VOD service with substantially the same library as HBO Go
HBO Max: New name for HBO Now with expanded library, introduced soon after AT&T takeover of WarnerMedia
DRM working as intended (Score:4, Insightful)
DRM sucks.
Meh. (Score:2)
I'll just wait until someone with an 'approved' OS rips a copy and uploads it to Pirate Bay.
ok then Directv needs all MAX ONLY to HBO VOD (Score:2)
ok then Directv needs all MAX ONLY to HBO VOD so if have Directv + HBO then you can get it all on the Directv box.
Which Linux? Linux95? LinuxMe? LinuxNT? (Score:1)
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How do you run GNU and Android userlands on the same Linux device?
So what? (Score:2)
Our eyes don't have DRM chips built in yet. So it's literally impossible to work.
I bet running a minimalist, stripped, skinned and organ-harvested Windows with a fake GPU and fake hardware IDs would make mincemeat of this bullshit.
Incorrect (Score:2)
It works fine on my Linux phone.
It's about piracy, stupid (Score:4, Interesting)
HBO MAX blocking Linux isn't about them not wanting to deal with a support burden. Unless it gets blocked by a DRM choice, it just works in Firefox and any Chromium-based browser; no burden there. People using Linux are rarely a support burden anyway; they're experienced computer users. That is, until you go and deliberately break things for them; then the Linux users start cluttering your support channels with requests to make it work again, probably in numbers out of proportion to their inconvenience because they want the Evil Big Corporation to pay for its error.
It's not about HBO hating Linux. Corporations aren't like that, with the possible exception of companies that create and maintain competing operating systems. Operating systems are tools for them, nothing more.
It's not about Linux users not being willing to pay. The people who are complaining already have paid for subscriptions.
It's not about a concern about Linux users stealing passwords. Keyboard loggers are available for every kind of system, and it's usually a whole lot easier to just ask your friends for passwords.
What it IS about is Hollywood paranoia that people will steal their precious content and make it available as downloads or torrents. It's true that since Linux is an open source operating system, it would be easier to insert taps in the video rendering process to pirate what goes on the screen than it would be on Windows or macOS. But all of that is unnecessary because another key piece of DRM has already been broken: the HDCP standard that protects the pixels that are on their way to your monitor. Plug an HDCP stripper into your computer, feed the result to an HDMI capture card, and you've got their content. There is nothing that Hollywood can do about it because HDCP is a frozen standard that is in a huge number of devices, and changing it would break too many things.
Presumably when 8K media or streaming become real, there will be another new form of encryption to go with it, along with another update of HDCP to protect the data link. And it will also get broken because the pirates have a fundamental advantage; they can keep updating their software and devices, but the content creators are bound by standards. And to top it all off, there will be disgruntled early buyers of 8K TVs because their displays will not be compatible with the new DRM, so they will be unable to use their displays to watch the new content. It has already happened to early buyers of 1080p and 2160p ("4K") TVs in the past, and there is every reason to believe that bit of history will repeat itself.
Re:So what? (Score:5, Informative)
Everyone with HBO Max is paying the same.
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Everyone with HBO Max is paying the same.
Ummmm not sure why this is modded up when the issue is the Linux audience not being big enough for Netflix to pursue.
Linux is a niche OS, aren't you guys used to popular products not being available to you yet? I'm a Mac guy, it's not that often I get to chance to criticize you lot for being whiney.
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Oooh, congratulations. You’re in the 98% majority. The one with an average IQ of 98. No, no, you should be proud, way to tell those two percenters (if that) how great life is for mainstream consumers like yourself. Some people just aren’t satisfied with the status-quo, but not you. You like what they give you and you want the world to know.
And so you have. Frankly, I’m happy for you. It must be bliss.
That said, the 98 is showing because you clearly misread the comment. Linux users still
Re: (Score:2)
That said, the 98 is showing because you clearly misread the comment. Linux users still had to subscribe to watch, and they pay the same rate as you chosen folks.
Thus being the case, your comment made no sense.
My comment makes plenty of sense, provided you read all the words in it without your feelings getting hurt. ;)
Linux users paying the same as everyone else has no relevance here when there aren't enough of them to pay the developers needed to support it.
Iâ(TM)m afraid you squandered your chance, though.
You're right, I really regret not dumbing down such an elementary point enough for you the first time.
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Dude... they checked a box on their DRM platform and broke all the Linux users. What developers? They just have to uncheck the box?
At no point has HBO made any indication there aren't enough linux users to pay developers or support them, only trolls here have indicated that. As for niche, it is almost guaranteed the entire HBO MAX service is built on Linux.
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Dude... they checked a box on their DRM platform and broke all the Linux users. What developers? They just have to uncheck the box?
And maintain it. Money.
Oh and the opposite of your point works, too: You decided to watch Netflix primarily on a really niche platform when you've got a bazillion inexpensive, and better, ways to watch it. You're like $20 away from easily fixing this problem on your end.
At no point has HBO made any indication there aren't enough linux users to pay developers or support them...
And they wouldn't willfully turn down profit. So either it's too expensive or they really hate Linux. Maybe they all eat boogers, too.
As for niche, it is almost guaranteed the entire HBO MAX service is built on Linux.
Serving file streams. Okay.
Look, I understand being mad about it, wasn't my point to suggest you shou
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"And maintain it. Money.
Oh and the opposite of your point works, too: You decided to watch Netflix primarily on a really niche platform when you've got a bazillion inexpensive, and better, ways to watch it. You're like $20 away from easily fixing this problem on your end."
Actually the opposite doesn't work. I'm paying them the money they would use whereas they aren't paying me anything.
Companies are beholden to consumers, not the other way around.
"It's not worth it for them."
If it wasn't worth it for them (
Re: So what? (Score:2)
Okie, I'll concede that the servers providing video streams and the clients viewing them are exactly the same thing and completely interchangeable.
Netflix is dropping millions of customers over this, so you'll either get your service back or they'll go out of business and you'll have your revenge. :)
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Yes, but if they choose not to support Linux that is their call. If Linux users don't like it, they can stop paying. That isn't to say that Linux users shouldn't fight back and try to get support back, assuming this was intentional on HBO's part. But, ultimately, it's HBO's call to make.
I never understood these posts. It’s like, someone wakes up Captain Obvious every so often and says, “Quick, a thread is three comments long and no one has stated the obvious yet!”
So, everything you
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As to the relevancy of my comment, their comment was that everyone is paying the same. What people pay is irrelevant when discussing what systems are supported, unless there is a tier of service that adds that support or something along those lines. That was the point of my comment. It doesn't matter that Linux u
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Someone indicated Linux users don't like to pay, implying they were freeloading and somehow less worthy of support than other users. Pointing out that they pay as much as the users of any other platform for their subscription to THIS service and therefore that argument and the sentiment it propagates is invalid isn't pointless.
Pointing out that HBO can do what they want is pointless. What "they" want as a for profit venture piece of paper is to make money.
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Re:So what? (Score:4, Insightful)
HBO doesn't owe them shit.
It goes both ways; users of quality software don't owe anything to HBO either.
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The secure path has been there since 1991. It works like this: don't give anyone else your password, set your video files' permissions right, and then other people won't have access to your files.
It's DRM that we don't want. Those DRM people think that a computer's "security" is for them, not the owner. That's ridiculous. The owner is who matters, when it comes to security.
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It seems like if Linux users want to watch DRM video (funny, it seems they wouldn't want to) then the Linux community needs to step up and create a secure video path for Linux. Linux users are always touting the security benefits of Linux. Finish that and put in a secure video path and then you can watch DRM video. Seems fairly simple.
Agreed, most thing you say seem fairly simple.
I used to write free software. Hundreds of thousands of lines of code, maybe millions. I stopped, though.
Why?
Because I realized