Making the Sounds of Vista

Bengt writes "The sounds of Vista took 18 months to get right for Microsoft. Artist Robert Fripp recorded hours of sound, and assisted Steven Ball in choosing between several different options. A clapping rhythm was rejected for 'sounding too human', and a techno beat was removed from considering because it was just the opposite." From the article: "If it seems like overkill to go to all that trouble for a few seconds of sound, consider this: Microsoft estimates that the clips such as the e-mail alert will be played trillions of times in years to come. That's a lot of opportunity to annoy, offend -- or, if the job is done right -- please or appease computer users the world over. One major concern was that the startup sound not grow grating after a time. You want a sound that people will love the first time they hear it, but it's a paradox to also say, 'Oh and by the way, we need people to love it the tenth, or the hundredth, or the thousandth time they hear it,' Ball said."

Yep, work on that startup sound

The poor saps are gonna be hearing that a lot... shortly after The BSOD Sound and the We Think You're a Damned Pirate sound.

Re:Yep, work on that startup sound

Actually, it's nice to know that MS is paying attention to the details.

Now, whether or not they've paid attention to the right details is another question entirely... and one which will be answered shortly.

Re:Yep, work on that startup sound

Actually, it's nice to know that MS is paying attention to the details.

That's a bit like a car manufacturer worrying about the color of the seats while the breaks are still leaking.

Re:Yep, work on that startup sound

Yes, I'm sure the car manufacturer would put all their fabric designers on the brake problem. That's a good use of their time.

Re:Car analogies

The car manufacturer could hire competent mechanical engineers and cut costs in the fabric design department instead.

Do you really think it's a lack of money to pay engineers that prevents a company like GM or Microsoft from creating bug-free products? That's amazingly clueless.

Don't you think that Microsoft wouldn't pay whatever it took to hire people to make Windows the best product they could? Yes, they would. The problem is not money. The problem is logistics and resources. There are a finite number of skilled developers, especially those with skills in a particular area. There are also a finite number of people that can work on the same project without stepping on each others toes.

You can't just throw more bodies at the problem. That just makes matters worse. So, no. It's highly unlikely that cutting the budget for fabric design would do anything to improve the engineering staff.

Re:Car analogies

then the jap's saved money by copying our engineering

Sorry to bust your bubble but the Jap's did something entirely different,
they looked at the British designs and execution thereof and knew what not to do.

Re:Car analogies

Lotus: cars that shake their suspensions apart in the early '80s. Absolutely horrid QC for a while.
Jaguar: Lucas Electric components leading to the "Off-dim-flicker" jokes even in Jaguar clubs and mailing lists.

What makes you think Japanese copied your engineering? Unlike British and American cars in the '80s when the Japanese began to dominate the auto market, Japanese cars actually WORKED. They didn't get where they did by copying your country or by copying America, but listening to engineering and manufacturing consultants whom no domestic manufacturers would listen to because improving processes is "too costly."

Re:OS X & Linux don't have "startup sounds"

So its OK for the Mac trumpet to sound, because its not the OS? Nevermind that it might as well be because you cant turn it off, its mandated by the same people who produce OSX, and its as annoying as anything an OS can produce? Stop putting artificial restrictions on arguements.

What was that?

I keep my speakers muted, you insensitive clods!

Re:What was that?

Don't tell Microsoft that, you might convince them to create visual effects to match each of their startup sounds!

NPR ran a story on the sounds yesterday.

Go to it, boys and girls! http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?story Id=6466901 [npr.org]

Re:Sounds?

No offence, but your post (and it's upward moderation) underscores a lot of what is wrong with a lot of open source software to my mind. The little bits of polish really do matter to most people; they may not notice it when it's there, but they sure as hell notice when it's missing.

You do realise that MS employs both programmers and sound engineers, right? And that devoting some time for a sound engineer to try to make sure the sound scheme is as good as possible does not detract one iota from the amount of effort that the programmers can put in to their parts of the project, right?

On a project of this size, aesthetics and engineering considerations are not mutually exclusive, you can have both. The problems only come when you have too few people, the wrong mix of skills, or too little time/money. None of these are problems for Vista.

Re:Sounds?

The problems only come when you have too few people, the wrong mix of skills, or too little time/money. None of these are problems for Vista.

or if you're in denial and believe in your own superiority over everyone, like how some open source people have become. Note the replies that came after your post.

Let me quote:

There is a big difference between polish and flashiness, the former applies to functionality as much as anything else while the later does not.

and

Your post underscores a lot of what is wrong with this M$/propietary software movement, that is, you keep stating the obvious, changing aesthetics and pretending its some new 'kewl' hip new thing, and over all, trying to be elitest bastards.

And many more to come.

I'm almost certainly will be modded as troll, but I don't really care. This is exactly the reason why open source will never rule the world, the mentality of "we are superior" and "strike down those that say otherwise". Or even "silence those that criticize the obvious flaw in our thinking". Oh, and the lemmings mentality that praise everything Apple.

Instead of discussing WHY MS put so much effort in this area, it is instantly scoffed at and judged without the slightest clue. Scoff all you want, people. These guys are making millions of dollars each year, while most of you DO NOT. There must be something they're doing right, so if you want OSS to succeed, steal some of it instead of dismissing it like 5 year olds. Nevermind their monopoly tactics, their product DOES have some merit of its own, which are left as exercise for the readers.

The response of slashdot to criticism is very predictable. Watch how my comment is modded down to oblivion.

Re:Sounds?

The response of slashdot to criticism is very predictable. Watch how my comment is modded down to oblivion.

You forgot about the part where if you say "go ahead and mod me down" or "I'll probably get modded down for this," you in fact get modded up. It's one of those Slashdot peculiarities.

Re:Sounds?

> This seems to underscore Microsoft's focus on flashiness over function, to me.
> I would hope that far more development would go into security, efficiency, and reliability.

I think you have a misunderstanding of how software development works. It's not as if Microsoft Executives said "Stop working on the security, boys, and start frettin' those guitars!" They're independent teams - working on Windows sounds isn't going to pull resources off the programming teams.

> Adding new and exciting sounds is pretty far down the list of what would make me want to run out and buy a new OS.

No, but it's going to contribute to your sense of comfort with that OS; and if that doesn't apply to you specifically, it WILL apply to most Windows users. What's going to make people feel like they're using a well-designed OS? I can guarantee that for the vast majority of people, it's not going to be clever kernel I/O scheduling algorithms or an efficient garbage-collection subroutine. It will be the look and feel of what they see (and hear) every day when they turn on their PC.

> Especially since we've had the ability customize the sound scheme since what, Windows 3.0?

Accounting for statistical outliers, approximately.... nobody does that. So, the default sounds had better be pretty good.

Ball said

"Oh and by the way, we need people to love it the tenth, or the hundredth, or the thousandth time they hear it."

I'll settle for "just not annoy me." If I'm supposed to love it, that sounds like too much distraction already.

Re:Ball said

I think I love some sounds just because of what they imply. Like one of Pavlov's dogs, I get a little happier when I hear the "Your Friend Just Logged Into IM!" sound.

Most obnoxious startup sound

Just don't make it like this guy's startup sound: http://youtube.com/watch?v=Mt1bgsvsWms [youtube.com]

Let's Ask Clippy

I see you're trying to perform Frippitronics! Would you like to:

• Feed guitar notes into delay, reverb and replay tape-loop system?
• Hire Brian Eno to help you?
• Reform King Crimson yet again?
• Sell out to Microsoft?

Personally, I'm going to wait until the remixed, remasterd versions of the Vista sounds come out with additional material in a special boxed set available only from Discipline Global Mobile...

Re:Let's Ask Clippy

I see you're trying to perform Frippitronics! Would you like to:

Well, you've been modded up, so someone out there gets the joke.

For everyone else, here's some Who The Heck is Robert Fripp [wikipedia.org] information.

Pah...

If they're so anal about getting the sound "just right", why wouldn't the last step of the install process just ask you to pick a sound scheme out of a set of 10 or so different styles.

Hell they could even be the SAME notes, but with different instruments to suit the user's taste.

Can Frippertronics save Vista?

While I'm most likely never buying this OS, I've been a big fan of Robert "Bob" Fripp for quite some time. For those who don't know who he is, He founded one of the premier "intelligent rock" bands, "King Crimson." He also worked heavily with Brian Eno and Peter Gabriel in the 1970's, creating some of the more brilliant music of the time. His solo work (and duo) relies on something he and Eno invented called "Frippertronics" which later evolved into "Soundscapes" in the 90's. I really can't wait to hear what he's come up with on this project, creating very short sound pieces seems a bit harder than the much longer pieces he normally plays.

The title of this post is a bit of a Lark, of course it can.

My choice for the startup sound of course would be the opening section of the song "Discipline" from the "Three of a Perfect Pair" album. And perhaps a good error noise would be Belew singing, "I repeat myself when under stress I repeat myself when under stress I repeat!"

But enough of this banter.

Re:Can Frippertronics save Vista?

You left out his work with David Bowie on the Heroes album, which is undoubtedly Fripps most listened-to work. There was an issue of Guitar Player magazine back in the mid 1980s which had details on exactly how he got that delay thing working, and had a floppy record of some astounding solo work. Listen to the David Bowie track "Moss Garden" to hear Frippertronics at full steam.

A good sign

It is this attention to detail that differentiates a quality product and something just chucked out the door. We see it on many types of products. For example, the miata has a tuned exhaust note. It cost a bunch of money, money that could have been used for executive bonuses, but Mazda instead invested it in the car.

We see this often with computer and programs. Thinking about how long it take a computer to boot up or wake. Thinking of how many key clicks it takes to get from one place to another. Thinking of the opportunity costs of forcing users to enter 30 character validation keys at every turn.

As long they have funded the sound as additional work, and not just redirected the effort from another project, I see this as a good sign. It could mean that MS Windows will be a tool that people like to use, and not just one they have to use.

Are startup sounds really necessary?

"One major concern was that the startup sound not grow grating after a time."

How about getting rid of the sound? What else does a startup sound inspire other than the sour feeling of having to restart the PC all the time?

Good god

Hire a decent musician, spend 18 months and millions of dollars futzing with stuff he recorded and RELEASE A TURD anyway. That's the unique Microsoft development process (tm).

About that Windows 95 sound...

This link has popped up a few places today, but just in case you missed it: the SF Chronicle did an interview with Fripp [sfgate.com] back in 1996, in which he talked about developing the startup sound to Windows 95.

I'm kind of a Fripp fan, so I got a kick out of reading this:

Q: How did you come to compose ``The Microsoft Sound''?

A: The idea came up at the time when I was completely bereft of ideas. I'd been working on my own music for a while and was quite lost, actually. And I really appreciated someone coming along and saying, ``Here's a specific problem -- solve it.''

The thing from the agency said, ``We want a piece of music that is inspiring, universal, blah- blah, da-da-da, optimistic, futuristic, sentimental, emotional,'' this whole list of adjectives, and then at the bottom it said ``and it must be 3 1/4 seconds long.''

I thought this was so funny and an amazing thought to actually try to make a little piece of music. It's like making a tiny little jewel.

Re:About that Windows 95 sound...

Brain Eno not Fripp designed the Windows 95 sound...

They are correct

I know that the current startup sounds make me want to puke, and im sure that i am not alone.

Dont want your customers throwing up everytime they use your product.

Let me guess...

Let me guess... the BSOD sound is going to be "One More Red Nightmare"? :)

Preview of Vista sounds

Comparison with Windows XP [istartedsomething.com]. I do actually find applications making various sounds useful, because it means I don't have to keep checking or stare at them to check for significant events. There are a lot of sounds in Vista that, by comparison, seem like they're trying to "hide" from the user. Some of them are much less noticeable. In particular, I noticed that the "battery low" and "battery critical" sounds were pretty generic and surprisingly upbeat.

No thanks.

I've been a musician for about 13 years now, a composer for 6, and a music snob for many years beyond that, and I can safely say that I think they have succeeded at failing to create a lasting startup sound.

For the era, The windows 95 startup sound was good - especially in stereo. While it was somewhat obtrusive, I think it was the best out of all the startup sounds MS has bundled with a Windows OS.

The 4 note progression, if trying to follow the syllables of "Win-dows Vis-ta", should (disclaimer: in my opinion, mind you), be quite different. The ascension progression should (disclaimer: more opinion) hang on the last note (Think "I want my M-T-Veeeeeeeeeeeeee"). Just dropping the progression and sinking into the background chords in the manner they have chosen rubs me the wrong way.

Now, if they had chosen a progression that doesn't continue to ascend, such as the tradmark NBC sound, I think they would have it. When that "C" is struck, it creates a musical sense of relief and completion (disclaimer: my brain says so).

The ascension feels like it is choking, to me. Almost like the way a person would ask a short question - "Windows Vista?"

Oh well. I disable all startup sounds on computers anyway, as they take up RAM, and tend to not blend with whatever music I'm listening to at the time. :)

Startup sounds I want

(mainly for computers for which I'm not the only user)

- Earth-shattering kaboom
- Beethoven's 9th (yes, all of it)

Re:18 months....

Well in fact this is the reason of all the delays! The other problems etc, they were just to give the composer a bit more time. As you can hear, it really was worth the effort!

cellular automata based composition

By Wolfram Research, makers of Mathematica. Surprisingly addictive. [wolframtones.com]

(Some compositions [wolfram.com] I made.)

Re:If they wanted a have a sound I like...

... why not let me use my own sound clips?
Why am I stuck with the musty-sounding Vista start-up sound clip that Microsoft thinks I will like?

That's been a function since at least Win95, maybe before.