Seriously doubt there is a "buyer". He has likely found a whole bunch of buyers who will form a group to privatize it. It was also reported somewhere that the Saudis were not interested in more than the stake they already purchased.
He's encouraged everyone with shares to keep their ownership once the company goes private, handled by a fund similar to as is done with SpaceX.
So for the purpose of easy understanding, I consider an extreme (and thus actually unrealistic - but bear with me) scenario:
: Almost everyone chooses to hold on to ownership rather than sell for $420/share. One guy chooses to sell a share. A major owner chooses to buy that share for $420 -- thus helping to somewhat virtually peg a value of $420/share in general (a
That's about how I understand it. I've seen estimates that around $20-30 billion will be needed to buy the shares of those that don't want to convert their shares to ownership in the new legal entity. It all depends on how many stay.
But, even that $20-30 billion or whatever the number turns out to be will likely come from a group of new investors, not a single investor. If there is a single investor, it could easily be one of the big tech companies that can throw that much around from cash that is doing nothing right now - Apple, Google, someone like that. I'd love to see a Waymo/Tesla combination but I think Waymo is trying to be the autopilot for many automakers, not to tie themselves to one.
The public market put down a $1000 deposit for a $35,000 car.
Yes, I know that you meant the stock market. Which translates: the business world in general. Who Musk thinks he is much smarter than. Was Tucker this arrogant in the 1950s?
its a stock price manipulation. instead of stock price reflecting company performance, it will now tend towards the price($420) musk said company would be purchased by the buyer, until the falseness of this is shown. if this was fully credible, the price would already be near 420. that it isn't, shows that most investors think this is a manipulation. already a sec investigation has started https://www.wsj.com/amp/articl... [wsj.com]
Yep. My grandpa knew in 1971 that Big Oil had bought the patent for the additive that will turn tap water into 97 octane fuel. Big Oil! What won't they do!?!
His products speak a truth loudly enough that unless he completely sells out to the Chinese - and we see suicide nets go up around his factories - or he crpples the development of unborn frogs by dumping thalidomide in their streams, he can have as many of my tax dollars as he needs (though more likely yours LOL) to continue shaking up the global launch, energy storage and transportation industries.
Well, from a German perspective the whole TESLA car company looks like a fraud. I have recently seen a TESLA on the streets next to my home, which has a sound like an electric wheelchair. Who would want to have it? Just around 300 are on German streets. That is near nothing compared to the daily 40 Elon Musk news reports and no, it is free trade across the Atlantic. If VW, Daimler, BMW etc. would order cars for tests they would have around 300 on the streets. No one made a convincing argument so far what th
The Saudis are very keen to move off of oil dependence. This is a hedge for them. The world would be a better place if all the oil companies started hedging in this manner.
The valuation of Tesla would barely be met by becoming the number one US car company. And the valuation increase that would come as Tesla reached even half that level would push the valuation to the point that being the world's number one car company would not meet it. For this reason alone, Tesla must go private. Otherwise, they can never succeed. The goal will always move.
But, I also believe the true goal is that high or higher. They don't want to lead the industry, they want to remake it under a completely new model - not a new energy model but a totally new relationship with customers that doesn't require designing cars to fail before 250K or even 500K miles to succeed and doesn't cause energy wars. To succeed in that, they need to be able to run without concern for profit for at least another decade with investors who have an extremely long-term outlook - like 30 years long.
Not only does he have an engineering degree, he even spends 80% of time doing actual engineering. People dealing with him are often amazed at the amount of detailed knowledge he has about the smallest technical details, which is highly unusual for a CEO. You can say a lot about his management and communication, but he really knows his stuff and is deeply involved in the actual design and execution processes.
I stand corrected, I got that information from another Slashdot post.
That doesn't mean he doesn't know anything about engineering, though. Plenty of people without degrees are experts in what they do, and he certainly seems to be one of them.
It also doesn't mean he knows jack shit about engineering.
He's a Silicon Valley player. His starting money all comes from a little operation called PayPal where he was one of the bros. PayPal has never had much geek cred. It's certainly not an example of a success story based on engineering feats.
80% of his working time, obviously. The cameos, kid rescuing, family time etcetera are separate from that.
And when he's camping out on the assembly line, guess what he's doing there? Trying to make the assembly line work, coming up with technical solutions, what do you call that?
Let me introduce you to the real world: the best and brightest in virtually any career field will always make their peers look mediocre by comparison. Sure, your average engineer might have an IQ fifteen points higher than your average burger flipper... but that's still borderline-moronic to the truly bright. (Don't feel bad if you weren't aware of this; most aren't.)
Audis are on the road. Great cars. Great experience. Years and years of professional engineering.
Tesla however is production wise a dwarf. And regardless how broken the business concept, the quality, the production, the stock market announcements, Elon Musk is depicted as an equivalent figure of Stalin's person cult. The problem is, the figures show why he is bound to fail. You can foul capitalism but not the laws of physics and economics.
You have to be clear on what "number 1" means. If it means "sells most units", it's very unlikely. If it means "has highest profit margins" then that's the game Tesla is playing and they look like they're doing a fair job of getting there.
Even if that's the case, that's how 95% of business operates. Going with the status quo may make you a jerk, but then being a jerk is pretty meaningless in that case.
It's been 15 years and it's still cash negative, losing money with no end in sight.
Well, they did say they would be profitable from the next quarter onward. That should qualify as "in sight".
Also, how long did it take Amazon to become profitable? How long were they ridiculed for being an overpriced stock that was losing money with no end in sight?
Many companies begin their moral decline with an IPO. Exhibit A: Google, whose mantra of "Don't be evil" was replaced by "Please the shareholders". Tesla might be able to do better without having to live up to quarterly targets.
Also, am I a bad person for laughing at the jerks who shorted Tesla stock?
Also, am I a bad person for laughing at the jerks who shorted Tesla stock?
Yes, you are. The fact that they read the situation differently from you is how capitalism works. You each put money on it, and the correct person is rewarded.
Oh, bullshit. That's only happens in a fair and regulated market.
Apple used to be the most shorted stock, now it's Tesla.
It happens because the jerks who short the stock manipulate the market with rumours and crap.
We've all seen it happening with Apple for at least 15 years. Lead up to something happening at Apple, weird stock market movements, then the announcement and it's good news but the stock drops. There's some jerk who went on to get a show on tv about his "insight" into the stock market, and fam
I'm just interested to see how it goes because this is the first time (as far as I recall) that I've seen a company go private for the explicit reason of "Going public caused problems" (and not "Private equity wants to pay themselves with our debt and flip us back to the market in a couple of years").
Now, maybe the private-equity thing is actually what's going on here, and Musk is just either naive about it or putting a spin on it, but if it's actually what it's claiming to be--an attempt to fix the problem
Tesla might be able to do better without having to live up to quarterly targets.
This. Many theories, but the one that sticks out the most to me is that Elon no longer wants to be held to a quarterly target. It almost seems like a personal preference over a sounds business decision
It's become (Or maybe always has been but not as bad before) legalized gambling.
Look at the scandals large car companies survive, GM, Toyota, Honda. They are some of the least trustworthy companies in the world. But hey their stock's okay. We'd finally have some accountability if we were gutsy enough to actually let them fail.
I heard a cool explanation from Eric Ries (Lean Startup) on why Silicon Valley startups seem to be overvalued. I never understood it til I heard him explain it in a Q&A session at LSE.
Typical companies are worth what the fundamentals of their business suggest they are worth. Based on usual stuff like assets, customer base, supply and demand, sector growth, etc. Proctor & Gamble, Firestone Tire, Kraft Foods, etc., mainly valued in this conventional way.
I can't see Saudi Arabia wanting an electric vehicle company to succeed, not while they still have oil to sell to the United States, but I can see them 'investing' in Tesla for the sole purpose of destroying the company. Not sure what Elon Musk is thinking.
The Saudi's (and rest of the middle east) really wanna stick it to the US. One of the way's they try to do this is by investing in ways to out innovate the US in things like flying cars and crypto real estate. Moreover, for those holding dark $ investing in new tech start-ups offers a way for them to launder that money on a very large scale. Tesla is no different here, and does a great job of wiping a clean money that's been found in oil barrels.
Or maybe buying Tesla, a strong contender in the EV-market, solidifies their stronghold in the economy while their current love child slowly gets phased out by everyone else on the planet.
I think Elon probably screwed up by running his mouth about this via Twitter before taking a few precautionary steps he should have done first. And now, he'll get a big slap on the wrist by the SEC, if not worse.
But as for the question itself? Yes, Tesla is a company that's already clearly shown/proven it can build a product that people want to buy. It's also showing continuous improvement on that product, even if it's not at a pace that always keeps up with Elon's big promises. Unlike every other electric
A discussion about Tesla/Musk on reddit, one person pointed out Musk used to have a programmer nerd body and now he is totally ripped like he's being working out. This lead to maybe he has been taking testosterone boosters? One person who has studied many older people taking testosterone and estrogen boosters that it can result in emotional outbursts which suggest Musk going nutzoid? Some of his twitter posts have not been something of high caliber (reminds me someone else posted Twitter: the downfall of ti
It should not have been publicly listed - if I ever invent a better mouse trap you can bet the only time I would ever list the company is if I wanted to rake in millions and walk the fuck away. Being subject to the shareholders etc. is the reason why most companies are "evil", they have to be to keep the shareholders happy.
University of Central Florida professor Yanek Mieczkowski taught a class about some of the people who challenged the status quo of the U.S. auto industry from the post-World War II era to the present day. He discussed the successes and failures of people such as Harley Earl, Preston Tucker, John DeLorean and Elon Musk.
https://www.c-span.org/video/?... [c-span.org]
This is great (Score:5, Funny)
The saudis are polling slashdot to see if they should buy tesla O.o
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:1)
He's encouraged everyone with shares to keep their ownership once the company goes private, handled by a fund similar to as is done with SpaceX.
So for the purpose of easy understanding, I consider an extreme (and thus actually unrealistic - but bear with me) scenario:
: Almost everyone chooses to hold on to ownership rather than sell for $420/share. One guy chooses to sell a share. A major owner chooses to buy that share for $420 -- thus helping to somewhat virtually peg a value of $420/share in general (a
Re:This is great (Score:4, Interesting)
That's about how I understand it. I've seen estimates that around $20-30 billion will be needed to buy the shares of those that don't want to convert their shares to ownership in the new legal entity. It all depends on how many stay.
But, even that $20-30 billion or whatever the number turns out to be will likely come from a group of new investors, not a single investor. If there is a single investor, it could easily be one of the big tech companies that can throw that much around from cash that is doing nothing right now - Apple, Google, someone like that. I'd love to see a Waymo/Tesla combination but I think Waymo is trying to be the autopilot for many automakers, not to tie themselves to one.
Re: This is great (Score:1)
The public market put down a $1000 deposit for a $35,000 car.
Yes, I know that you meant the stock market. Which translates: the business world in general. Who Musk thinks he is much smarter than. Was Tucker this arrogant in the 1950s?
Re: Seems more like a Prank ? (Score:2)
Nah, Musk has addressed that (20 percent and round up = 420). Saudi is invested in green goods and luxury everything, it's a great match.
Re: (Score:3)
its a stock price manipulation.
instead of stock price reflecting company performance, it will now tend towards the price($420) musk said company would be purchased by the buyer, until the falseness of this is shown.
if this was fully credible, the price would already be near 420. that it isn't, shows that most investors think this is a manipulation.
already a sec investigation has started
https://www.wsj.com/amp/articl... [wsj.com]
Re: That's what it looks like. (Score:2)
Yep. My grandpa knew in 1971 that Big Oil had bought the patent for the additive that will turn tap water into 97 octane fuel. Big Oil! What won't they do!?!
Re: This is great (Score:2)
You mean you hate finance?
So you short--fucks are as dumb as you are dishonest; he said he hates you, Unimpressive One.
Re: This is great (Score:2)
Re: This is great (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Well, from a German perspective the whole TESLA car company looks like a fraud. I have recently seen a TESLA on the streets next to my home, which has a sound like an electric wheelchair. Who would want to have it? Just around 300 are on German streets. That is near nothing compared to the daily 40 Elon Musk news reports and no, it is free trade across the Atlantic. If VW, Daimler, BMW etc. would order cars for tests they would have around 300 on the streets. No one made a convincing argument so far what th
Re: This is great (Score:2)
The Saudis are very keen to move off of oil dependence. This is a hedge for them. The world would be a better place if all the oil companies started hedging in this manner.
It seems the only way (Score:5, Interesting)
The valuation of Tesla would barely be met by becoming the number one US car company. And the valuation increase that would come as Tesla reached even half that level would push the valuation to the point that being the world's number one car company would not meet it. For this reason alone, Tesla must go private. Otherwise, they can never succeed. The goal will always move.
But, I also believe the true goal is that high or higher. They don't want to lead the industry, they want to remake it under a completely new model - not a new energy model but a totally new relationship with customers that doesn't require designing cars to fail before 250K or even 500K miles to succeed and doesn't cause energy wars. To succeed in that, they need to be able to run without concern for profit for at least another decade with investors who have an extremely long-term outlook - like 30 years long.
Private is the only way.
Re: (Score:1)
Not only does he have an engineering degree, he even spends 80% of time doing actual engineering. People dealing with him are often amazed at the amount of detailed knowledge he has about the smallest technical details, which is highly unusual for a CEO. You can say a lot about his management and communication, but he really knows his stuff and is deeply involved in the actual design and execution processes.
Re: (Score:1)
I stand corrected, I got that information from another Slashdot post.
That doesn't mean he doesn't know anything about engineering, though. Plenty of people without degrees are experts in what they do, and he certainly seems to be one of them.
Re: It seems the only way (Score:1)
It also doesn't mean he knows jack shit about engineering.
He's a Silicon Valley player. His starting money all comes from a little operation called PayPal where he was one of the bros. PayPal has never had much geek cred. It's certainly not an example of a success story based on engineering feats.
Re: (Score:1)
80% of his working time, obviously. The cameos, kid rescuing, family time etcetera are separate from that.
And when he's camping out on the assembly line, guess what he's doing there? Trying to make the assembly line work, coming up with technical solutions, what do you call that?
Re: (Score:2)
Congratulations, you just failed mathematics.
Re: Liar, Liar, Pants on Fire. (Score:3)
Re: Liar, Liar, Pants on Fire. (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
audis and lamborghinis are also glued together.
Re: (Score:2)
Audis are on the road. Great cars. Great experience. Years and years of professional engineering.
Tesla however is production wise a dwarf. And regardless how broken the business concept, the quality, the production, the stock market announcements, Elon Musk is depicted as an equivalent figure of Stalin's person cult. The problem is, the figures show why he is bound to fail. You can foul capitalism but not the laws of physics and economics.
Re: It seems the only way (Score:2)
You have to be clear on what "number 1" means. If it means "sells most units", it's very unlikely. If it means "has highest profit margins" then that's the game Tesla is playing and they look like they're doing a fair job of getting there.
Sure, why not? (Score:1)
Re: (Score:1)
Public or private, Musk is still a jerk. A rich jerk, but a jerk nonetheless.
Re: Sure, why not? (Score:2)
Even if that's the case, that's how 95% of business operates. Going with the status quo may make you a jerk, but then being a jerk is pretty meaningless in that case.
Re: (Score:2)
And a pedo. We went to Thailand with a giant metal dildo with the expressed intent to get some underage boys.
Re: (Score:1)
It's been 15 years and it's still cash negative, losing money with no end in sight.
Well, they did say they would be profitable from the next quarter onward. That should qualify as "in sight".
Also, how long did it take Amazon to become profitable? How long were they ridiculed for being an overpriced stock that was losing money with no end in sight?
Re: (Score:2)
Amazon was profitable 6.5 years from launch, and 4.5 years from when he went public. Bezos had promised "in 4-5 years", so he was dead on.
Are they going to buy... (Score:1)
Bitch Please! (Score:4, Interesting)
I hope that Tesla going private would mean that we would not have to hear Elon Musk in the news so much ...
Yes, for two main reasons (Score:5, Insightful)
Many companies begin their moral decline with an IPO. Exhibit A: Google, whose mantra of "Don't be evil" was replaced by "Please the shareholders".
Tesla might be able to do better without having to live up to quarterly targets.
Also, am I a bad person for laughing at the jerks who shorted Tesla stock?
Re: (Score:3)
Yes, you are. The fact that they read the situation differently from you is how capitalism works. You each put money on it, and the correct person is rewarded.
Re: (Score:1)
Oh, bullshit. That's only happens in a fair and regulated market.
Apple used to be the most shorted stock, now it's Tesla.
It happens because the jerks who short the stock manipulate the market with rumours and crap.
We've all seen it happening with Apple for at least 15 years. Lead up to something happening at Apple, weird stock market movements, then the announcement and it's good news but the stock drops. There's some jerk who went on to get a show on tv about his "insight" into the stock market, and fam
Re: (Score:2, Informative)
Just remembered the jerks name. Jim Cramer, Mad Money.
Re: (Score:2)
I'm just interested to see how it goes because this is the first time (as far as I recall) that I've seen a company go private for the explicit reason of "Going public caused problems" (and not "Private equity wants to pay themselves with our debt and flip us back to the market in a couple of years").
Now, maybe the private-equity thing is actually what's going on here, and Musk is just either naive about it or putting a spin on it, but if it's actually what it's claiming to be--an attempt to fix the problem
Re: (Score:2)
Tesla might be able to do better without having to live up to quarterly targets.
This. Many theories, but the one that sticks out the most to me is that Elon no longer wants to be held to a quarterly target. It almost seems like a personal preference over a sounds business decision
I'd personally never put my company in the market (Score:4, Insightful)
It's become (Or maybe always has been but not as bad before) legalized gambling.
Look at the scandals large car companies survive, GM, Toyota, Honda. They are some of the least trustworthy companies in the world. But hey their stock's okay. We'd finally have some accountability if we were gutsy enough to actually let them fail.
Re: (Score:2)
Try telling that to someone who owned GM stock in early 2009.
Tesla and other startup over(?)-valuation (Score:2)
Typical companies are worth what the fundamentals of their business suggest they are worth. Based on usual stuff like assets, customer base, supply and demand, sector growth, etc. Proctor & Gamble, Firestone Tire, Kraft Foods, etc., mainly valued in this conventional way.
But startups have a second component of v
Yes (Score:2)
Saudi Arabia = petroleum (Score:3)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Or maybe buying Tesla, a strong contender in the EV-market, solidifies their stronghold in the economy while their current love child slowly gets phased out by everyone else on the planet.
As a Tesla owner? Yes, go private.... (Score:2)
I think Elon probably screwed up by running his mouth about this via Twitter before taking a few precautionary steps he should have done first. And now, he'll get a big slap on the wrist by the SEC, if not worse.
But as for the question itself? Yes, Tesla is a company that's already clearly shown/proven it can build a product that people want to buy. It's also showing continuous improvement on that product, even if it's not at a pace that always keeps up with Elon's big promises. Unlike every other electric
Re: (Score:2)
Good (Score:2)
kiralik bahis sitesi (Score:1)
Auto industry mavericks all failed, Musk is next? (Score:2)
Re: (Score:1)
If people chose "don't care", why did they vote?
We don't care about Tesla being private or public, we do care about /. polls.
Would have voted for the Cowboy Neal option if there was one.