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Amazon Will Require Third-Party Sellers To Disclose Names, Addresses (geekwire.com) 77

Posted by BeauHD from the more-transparency-the-better dept.
Amazon announced a new policy Wednesday requiring third-party sellers in its marketplace to publicly display their names and addresses starting Sept. 1. Geekwire reports: The disclosure is already required in Europe, Japan, and Mexico. Amazon said it is updating its policy to "ensure there is a consistent baseline of seller information to help customers make informed shopping decisions" in a letter to sellers. Amazon has been working to crack down on knockoff sales on its marketplace for years, most recently forming an internal "Counterfeit Crimes Unit." Despite spending more than $500 million in 2019 to fight various forms of fraud, counterfeits and defective or unsafe products continue to be a challenge for the company.
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Amazon Will Require Third-Party Sellers To Disclose Names, Addresses More

Amazon Will Require Third-Party Sellers To Disclose Names, Addresses

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  • Like they will check ... (Score:4)

    by BAReFO0t ( 6240524 ) on Thursday July 09, 2020 @02:03AM (#60278096)

    ... some random Shenzen shop's real name and address... lol ...

    • You haven't read the OP right. This measure is meant for BUYERS to CHECK seller's address.

      So... yeah, if I live in Shenzen, I can check the shop and if I find it dubious, I can "report" it to Amazon.

      Basically: the end-user does the dirty job for Amazon for free.

      • Re: (Score:3)

        by ELCouz ( 1338259 )

        Basically: the end-user does the dirty job for Amazon for free.

        You mean like Slashdot too?

      • That only makes this even more of a joke.

        Like *I* am able to check some random Shenzen shop' s address... For one of its random sock puppet seller accounts du jour, which will be gone again soon.

    • Re:Like they will check ... (Score:5, Funny)

      by LenKagetsu ( 6196102 ) on Thursday July 09, 2020 @04:39AM (#60278296)

      Solution; your first paycheck from Amazon gets mailed to that address.

      • Workaround: US forwarding address using any of the mail forwarding companies. System gamed, not like China was worried about it to begin with. Just pay some guy $100 to forward the mail to China borrowing his address.
        • Paycheck has a giant DO NOT FORWARD label on the envelope. US Post Office respects that label and returns to sender.

          • Take it out and put it in a different envelope. You would have to restrict it to a specific bank.

            • Taking out of envelope and putting in new envelope still requires maintaining staff to check the address. That "local staff" requirement is the big defense this rule adds against fakes because it makes the cost of maintaining a fake location so much higher.

        • "So Mr. Smith of 123 West Street, Nashville, Tennessee, mind explaining why this check sent to your house was cashed by a bank in Wuhan, China?"

          Not to mention if you're paying the guy $100 to send a $5000 check to China very little stops him from saying "$4000 or I blow the whistle". I mean, what's Li Wei across the ocean in Wuhan going to do? Call the police?

    • 1060 west addison chicago illinois

    • Maybe not, but shoppers could check Google Maps and see if the place is really there, or call and see if they can talk to a real human being before buying. This data offers a way for someone other than Amazon to do the seller validation.

  • Easy Fix... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by ELCouz ( 1338259 ) on Thursday July 09, 2020 @02:09AM (#60278104)
    Just kick-out all third parties transaction. All handled/fulfilled by Amazon or sold by Amazon that source directly from the distribution channel.

    • Re:Easy Fix... (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 09, 2020 @02:49AM (#60278150)
      Given that third-party seller services earned $53 billion in net sales last year from third-party seller services (from their 2019 financial statement, page 68), compared to $141 billion for online stores, and the fact that Amazon doesn't have to actually handle any product at any point, I don't really see Amazon stopping. In fact, retailers generally really like it if all they have to do is put a listing up on their storefront, and it's up to the vendor to do the rest. There is a huge push from retailers generally to go in this direction.

      • Re:Easy Fix... (Score:5, Interesting)

        by AmiMoJo ( 196126 ) on Thursday July 09, 2020 @04:36AM (#60278294) Homepage Journal

        Also 3rd party sellers are Amazon's way of competing with eBay. If you find something on Amazon from a 3rd party seller you can usually find the same thing from the same person cheaper on eBay.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Luthair ( 847766 )
        I've probably said this before, but I think in the long run it harms Amazon (and Walmart, and Bestbuy, any site with "marketplace sellers") as a brand. They're effectively allowing third party sellers to trade on their own brand's equity, one doesn't need to look at too many product reviews to find people who aren't aware of the seller distinction, even for those of us who know each time a purchase goes poorly it removes some of Amazon's lustre. There is a reason ebay is commonly referred to as fleabay.

    • Re:Easy Fix... (Score:5, Informative)

      by DrXym ( 126579 ) on Thursday July 09, 2020 @06:09AM (#60278394)
      Fulfilled by Amazon is just a ruse by them to absolve themselves the obligation of handling refunds, warranties etc. and still charge the 3rd party money for using their infrastructure. But even so, it's still better than 3rd party vendors. Trying to search certain items on Amazon can be a waste of time because the filters are useless. It's not possible to see what things Amazon sells vs fulfilled vs 3rd party. The best thing to hope for is by searching on "eligible for Amazon Prime" or "free delivery" that you can whittle it down.

      And these days if I want to use 3rd party sellers I may as well cut Amazon out entirely and go to Aliexpress where at least I know I'm buying cheap Chinese crap.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

        Did you notice that this is already the practice in places like Europe and Japan because that's the law there? I can't speak for Japan but in Europe all the normal consumer laws apply to 3rd party sellers, including free returns if the product is faulty or fake.

        Consumer laws are the solution to this problem, not hoping that Amazon does the right thing.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by EvilSS ( 557649 )

        It's not possible to see what things Amazon sells vs fulfilled vs 3rd party.

        Yes it is. Once you add a category filter, you can select the seller filter, and Amazon.com is always the top one if they sell it at all.

    • These third party sellers via Amazon is the big reason why so many small businesses are so up an arms against them.

      Small businesses profit with Amazon as they use it to sell their goods threw them. Heck my Mother In Laws give my wife a bunch of books, which she then sells on Amazon. It isn't a lot of money, but it creates some spending cash.

      • Mother In Laws

        Mothers in law. Assuming you're talking the plural of "mother in law".

        Oh, and you misspelled "through" - "threw" is what the catcher did to the baseball. Why is it that well-educated people can't spell?

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by cusco ( 717999 )

          Not-so-smart phones with auto-correct. I loathe browsing on my phone, but an inexplicable percentage of people seem to actually prefer it.

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by tsqr ( 808554 )

          Why is it that well-educated people can't spell?

          Those who cannot spell common words are not well educated; they are just escapees from the school system.

    • Amazon has lots of fraudulent items in their warehouses. Fraud is not only from 3rd party sellers. Not only that but Amazon keeps fraudulent products in their warehouses even after they are informed. I get the feeling Amazon really does not care if they sell fraudulent items to customers, their actions are merely theater to keep the government away. At least that's my take. Nothing to see here move along now...
    • Says the person who never sold on Amazon. Any idea how much money you hand over to sell FBA? The only person making money on Amazon is Jeffy B.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by tsqr ( 808554 )

        Says the person who never sold on Amazon. Any idea how much money you hand over to sell FBA? The only person making money on Amazon is Jeffy B.

        Really? So all those third-party sellers are just there to provide a public service?

        • No, they are selling that way because they make more money. Of course Amazon would like to convert 3rd part to FBA.

  • Not enough (Score:5, Interesting)

    by rossz ( 67331 ) <ogre@@@geekbiker...net> on Thursday July 09, 2020 @02:21AM (#60278116) Journal

    It's easy enough to get a post box in whatever location you want. So some counterfeit knockoff business can have an address in some random state. I'd like to see strict rules requiring full disclosure of where items are made so I can avoid purchasing from certain countries (fuck you, China). That won't stop the scams and junk makers, but it would make it easier to shut them down when they are caught lying.

    • If Donald Trump ever wants to do something useful (a guy can dream, can't he?) he should discontinue the USPS' ePacket progam. It's really fucked that an item can be shipped from China to my door for wayyyyyy cheaper that it costs to ship the same item across town. He bitches about Amazon getting sweetheart rates from the USPS, but least those are the front door rates and the USPS makes money on those, unlike ePacket where the USPS loses money on every package AND gives Chinese sellers an unfair advantage

      • Re: Not enough (Score:5, Insightful)

        by guruevi ( 827432 ) on Thursday July 09, 2020 @09:26AM (#60278894)

        ePacket is fulfilled to follow the UN rules on postage and international postal systems.

        Typically each member will exchange money based on the amount of mail they receive and send and some rate the member sets for handling that parcel within their country.

        If all play fair then you basically pay equitable amounts of money within the UN, net exporters like China and US would pay poor countries like Nigeria in Africa that receive more than they send. What is happening is that China simply lies, they set their rates for incoming packages exorbitantly high because they claim, big country, lots of cost to distribute, but then they set the rates for outgoing packages to like a few dollars per ton meaning they basically get paid to distribute their exports.

        If you ever get China direct packages, look at the postage, they pay 100 yuan (~$1.50) for exports to the US but if you send it back, I've gotten quotes for nearly $300 from their customs to handle the return on the same package.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by EvilSS ( 557649 )
        He actually did to an extent. He threatened to withdraw from the postal treaty, which forced a re-negotiation.

        The deal struck on Wednesday will allow the United States to start setting its own postal fees in July and allow other countries that receive more than 75,000 metric tons of mail a year to start phasing in higher rates in January 2021.

        The agreement is less disruptive than what the United States had pressed for, which would have created a pricing free-for-all. This new system sets a volume threshold for countries that can self-declare rates and a number of other controls on the process.

        Delegates from about 140 countries stood to applaud as Bishar Hussein, the head of the Universal Postal Union, said the new formula had passed. Only a day earlier, he had warned that a United States withdrawal could lead to chaos in international mail service.

        https://www.nytimes.com/2019/0... [nytimes.com]

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by rossz ( 67331 )

          I'm surprised the New York Times did a straight report of the facts for a change. I would have expected them to scream "Trump Disrupts International Mail" in their headlines.

  • Hey Amazon, free tip for you - 100% of your lithium ion batteries from recognizable name brands are fake.

    • Re:Free Tip (Score:4, Informative)

      by serviscope_minor ( 664417 ) on Thursday July 09, 2020 @03:10AM (#60278178) Journal

      Hey Amazon, free tip for you - 100% of your lithium ion batteries from recognizable name brands are fake.

      I don't know what you're talking about. That 40,000mAh 18650 I bought is completely legit. Hang on a mo, some alarm has gone off, brb.

      Seriously though, I avoid amazon in general where possible and avoid them like the plague for anything electrical. They're full of blatantly unsafe crap and they simply don't care because they're making a ton of money on it. They're starting to care not because the shit is unsafe but because people have started filing lawsuits.

  • I bought a pair of runners through Amazon from a store in Spain. I was told to be patient when the tracking code didn't work. Eventually after about a month some runners arrived in a plastic bag from China. They weren't what I asked for & they were counterfeit so I returned them for a refund to the address in Spain. The shoes were received but I got no refund and the store went dead. This sham ran for 6 to 8 weeks before it shut down so I assume many people were duped and they purposefully string people
    • Actually they make A-z claiming very easy and obvious. Not sure what website you were looking at.

      Also, by Amazon's rules your seller was required to provide a domestic return address, pay the shipping for the return to another country themselves, or just refund you without return.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by DrXym ( 126579 )
        This was on Amazon.co.uk so YMMV but there were no links associated with the sale where it was made clear how I could open a dispute or claim the money back from Amazon rather than the vendor. So when the vendor didn't refund me I basically had to go out to Google to come back in and find the thing that would help me get a refund. I strongly believe this is one of these services that Amazon has a legal or reputational obligation to provide but would rather you didn't know about for obvious reasons.

        And per

        • 5th hit when I search "problem with seller" in Amazon's help is "Request an A-to-z Guarantee Refund". And most if not all of their help pages regarding dealing with sellers also mention it.
        • From the Amazon.co.uk help:

          International Return Policy
          If you order from a Marketplace seller who dispatches from a location outside the UK, Amazon’s return policy requires that international Marketplace sellers must provide one of the following:

          A return address within the UK
          A prepaid return label
          A full refund without requesting the item is returned
          If a seller doesn't offer these methods to return your items, you may file an A-to-z Guarantee claim to seek help with your return.
  • Like that idea. That way I know if it will take 1-2 days or months to receive an item. Ordered an item in late May --- due to arrive July 22 -Aug 15, 3 months or more, literally on sloooooow boat from China !!!

  • As a means of helping the purchaser make an informed shipping decision, this was an easy first step for Amazon. Not much effort, and put the onus on the third-party seller. The much better option would be to change the ads. Instead of showing an estimated "5 to 7 days" delivery date, the ads should show: ships from "city and country" Anther change: add a notation to all items showing ""sold by "whomever" and fulfilled by Amazon"" to include both the current inventory in the local warehouse, and the count

    • Instead of showing an estimated "5 to 7 days" delivery date, the ads should show: ships from "city and country"

      I believe that's how eBay does. You can even filter search results to show only shipped from US Only and/or Worldwide. Then again, some Chinese companies have "store fronts" with California shipping addresses, so I'm not sure that would help much.

  • Having a case to interact with Amazon a year ago on a likely-gray-market/counterfeit $1500 Microsoft Surface product, I can attest that the Counterfeit Crimes Unit at Amazon is a joke. I worked with multiple Executive Team resolution folks, and THEY couldnâ(TM)t get the Counterfeit Crimes Unit people to even get back to them! Same with the Marketplace Sellers Fraud Unit. It was kaska-esque. And Iâ(TM)m the good, patient, âoedone this beforeâ expert they could only dream of for partnering

  • A "where made" prominently displayed in the items description might help. Although, if the seller is willing to offer counterfeit merchandise a little more fraud is not going bother them. Complaining to large companies is usually like complaining about the weather. But, every now and then, someone with the ability to make a difference, will.

  • Just so there's no confusion, let me post my address here as well, in case anyone needs to get in touch with me:

    1060 W ADDISON ST STE 1
    CHICAGO IL 60613-4397

  • Sounds like a legal solution is needed (Score:3)

    by LostMyAccount ( 5587552 ) on Thursday July 09, 2020 @07:44AM (#60278586)

    Just make Amazon financially responsible for any product purchased off their web site and require them to accept returns and issue refunds.

    The net result is Amazon embargoing payments to third party sellers for the duration of the mandated return window so they don't get burned on the refunds. This will discourage small-timers without the cash to deal with a delay in receivables but will also make fraud difficult since Amazon can always return funds without any cost to them. Prices will also be higher and people will complain about this, too.

    I'd guess the reason we don't have this is that the market more or less accurately represents people's willingness to accept the risks of fraud in exchange for a bargain.

  • Amazon needs.... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Rick Zeman ( 15628 ) on Thursday July 09, 2020 @08:11AM (#60278672)

    ...what eBay already has, which is a filter so you can specify the geographic region a seller is in. "US Only" would win big with me, and would filter out the bulk of the Chinese shit purveyors. I imagine the sellers would have to provide some sort of a business license as proof of location, but that's their problem.

    • Check the prime shipping box and stuff has a one month delivery date. Yeah prime shipping my ass.

    • eBay also has one of my favorite killer features, sort by price+shipping.

      I usually search Amazon and eBay at the same time. The price is usually lower on eBay, but sometimes it is a few dollars more. I usually choose to pay it.

      I search for items in the US only, sort by price+shipping, and filter out all but buy it now in almost all cases as I rarely want to wait long enough to screw with bidding on anything.

  • I rarely buy any name brand goods on Amazon anymore, as it's 50/50 these days you'll get the actual product and not some Chinese knockoff, even when fulfilled by Amazon. Stories abound of people getting counterfeit goods, pieces of wood, bricks, etc. Amazon seems to think returns is the way to go, but they could save us all the hassle by actually policing their marketplace sellers.

  • Those button CR2032 batteries, bought a 10-pack, every single one of them read "LOW" on the thermometer I had bought them for.

    More recently, bought a 12V 20AH battery for a garden pump, and it came from eBay in a loose bag, no shrink wrap, definitely used.

    This is good but seems a little late.

  • Give them 30 days. If they can't prove who they are and provide a reasonably believable identity, boot them off the platform.

  • Don't buy Zero Water replacement filters on Amazon... ...They did a bait & switch on us, our order arrived from a third party seller when initially it didn't show this seller. This seller sent out HUNDREDS of counterfeit filters. The water came out of them dirtier than it went in! This also contaminated our pitcher. It took me a MONTH to get refunded by Amazon!

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