Where do you think the price bottom is for Bitcoin this cycle?
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Missing option: negative. (Score:5, Insightful)
Bitcoin is a crime against humanity, and the planet as a whole.
It's not the crypto aspect or the usage of bitcoin for speculation or purchasing illicit goods. It's the part where we intentionally waste resources and contribute to climate change on a massive scale, just to feed greed.
The real bottom should be negative, as in, pay up for your contribution to the damage done.
Re: (Score:1)
Such drama.
Re:Missing option: negative. (Score:4, Insightful)
Nope, Christmas lights make people happy. The cumulated happiness of Bitcoin investors will, at the end, be a net zero.
Re: (Score:2)
I should add that the cumulated happiness will, in fact, be negative: People tend to have uneven utility functions and value losses more strongly than gains.
Re: (Score:1)
Lots of us are happy watching the HODLers cry. That should count for something.
Re:NetZero (Score:2)
Huh. NetZero is apparently still in business.
Re: (Score:2)
This Whataboutism should not distract of the profound message of the parent poster: Trading with Bitcoins is wasting valuable energy and thus accelerating climate warming.
(Of course the Xmas lights are a waste too.)
Re: (Score:2)
Same with professional sports. People do a lot of stuff that is also a waste of resources.
Re: Missing option: negative. (Score:2)
WaterYourLawn coin is also such a waste. So many resources thrown away.
Re: (Score:2)
Then Christmas lights and the rest of the industry are also a crime against humanity. It's the part where we intentionally waste resources and contribute to climate change on a massive scale, just to feed greed and useless gift giving and wrapping.
Not so fast, Ebenezer. There is positive economic incentive to reduce the cost of any given form of Christmas celebration, such as by replacing incandescent tree lighting by LEDs. Crypto mining is an intentional waste of resources. Either it uses dirty forms of energy or it displaces better uses for clean technologies.
Re: Missing option: negative. (Score:2)
Christmas lights don't waste energy like BTC miners do. BTC estimates peg wasted energy on the scale of nations (or California). Christmas lights are becoming more efficient with LEDs, BTC is less efficient the more coins are mined. BTC is for moving money around, we could already do that with banks
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Then Christmas lights and the rest of the industry are also a crime against humanity.
Your terms are acceptable.
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
One way or the other, all participants in Bitcoin together do pay for the resources used. Whether that's via-via-via, exchanges with fiat currency involved or not, or people mining for themselves using hardware & power paid for with real $, €, etc. Whether those costs include all externalities, is the same question as for other human activities.
Which brings us to the next question. As another poster wrote:
The cumulated happiness of Bitcoin investors will, at the end, be a net zero.
People should judge for themselves what makes them happy, what is valuable, what they thi
Re: Missing option: negative. (Score:2)
Rolling coal.
Re: (Score:2)
Extremely nice FP. I was thinking zero, but you persuaded me that I was being too kind. (Perish the thought.)
You even limited the focus to Bitcoin, which takes into account that there are some non-terrible ideas within the various ideas of various cryptocurrencies. But that raises the question of what is so especially bad about Bitcoin. Basically the same energy-wasting problem, but as seen from a marketing perspective. The marketing for Bitcoin was an naked-greed-based appeal to the gold rush mentality, so
Re: (Score:2)
The worst part about the artificial scarcity is that it is combined with the artificially inflated difficulty. In a gold rush eventually there is no more land, and the gold on your land is what it is. With bitcoin, when someone else shows up to the party, suddenly your virtual land has less gold. So not only is the inflationary pressure coming from two directions, but it grows exponentially because land is infinite.
Of course, just like past gold rushes, the people selling shovels (ASICs) and meals (power co
Re: (Score:2)
ACK. Could be extended into why the scarcity is so artificial, but pretty sure we agree on that, too.
Re: Missing option: negative. (Score:2)
Mining ASICS are physical things that will have no value when Bitcoin drops to $0.
They will have to be disposed of in landfills.
Re: Missing option: negative. (Score:2)
For bitcoin itself it's zero, but if made illegal it could be infinite negative by capital punishment.
Re: Missing option: negative. (Score:2)
In what country? China? (On again, off again, illegal there. Likely for a select few to enrich themselves.) Make it illegal in one country and the largest hodlers just flock to a different country.
Re: Missing option: negative. (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3)
>Finance people were also like that before they learnt how to make money on it.
Finance people are cunts.
And part of the reason "crypto"-"currencies" are hated is because they're the kind of scam that would appeal to finance-industry cunts.
Re: Missing option: negative. (Score:2)
If countries were smart, they'd ban PoW coins, while simultaneously supporting PoS coins. (Maybe a tax break/advantage, or some kind of public nod.)
Re: (Score:1)
Re: Missing option: negative. (Score:2)
there's a difference in scale between using a personal computing device to post a short bit of text on the internet and encouraging people to build masssive mining farms.
There is real value you are missing (Score:1)
it's the part where we intentionally waste resources and contribute to climate change on a massive scale, just to feed greed.
It's not about greed. It's about having a currency that is generally free of government control and oversight.
That has real value, unless you desire all of humanity to be under the thumb of giant global banking cartels until the end of time.
Yes greedy people use crypto but that's true of anything.
Mind you I am out of crypto, and I'd stay out until the greedy people all leave for a bit
Re: (Score:1)
Re: Missing option: negative. (Score:2)
Is the risk of having a water leak kill your ASICs worth the small advantage of some savings on heating?
Re: (Score:2)
End of Bitcoin predicted, news at 11 after the game
Gap (Score:2)
I'm not going to guess, just pointing out the gap in answers.
Re: (Score:2)
Took me a while to figure out your comment, but they must be taking 5% as "normal" variation? Assumption hidden in the poll question?
200 WMA is the bottom (Score:2)
https://www.lookintobitcoin.co... [lookintobitcoin.com]
Re: 200 WMA is the bottom (Score:1)
The scam is dying. Good riddance. (Score:1)
Bitcoin is a scam on many levels which has gone on far too long. It affects even those who do not take part in the scam because of its wasteful nature, burning energy for no purpose whatsoever
Re:The scam is dying. Good riddance. (Score:5, Insightful)
A friend asked me what I thought of Bitcoin a few days ago, she's the classic "Grandmother investor" type with an income to match (low). I have not asked her how she came across it but if she's thinking about "investing" there, the end is nigh.
Warren Buffett has made categorically clear he is not going there, Warren Buffett does do the research, that is good enough for me.
Re: The scam is dying. Good riddance. (Score:1)
You might have noticed WB isn't a huge fan of holding cash. He likes to own businesses which create wealth. Cash doesn't create wealth, it is used to transfer it. That's what Bitcoin should also be treated like. Anyone buying Bitcoin as an investment doesn't understand what currency is. Otherwise, they're using the word investment when they really mean speculation.
Re: The scam is dying. Good riddance. (Score:2)
FinEx has always been a thing...
Re: (Score:3)
on slashdot, a place that is notoriously full of bitcoin haters,
Also a place that plasters the front page with cryptocurrency stories (while refusing to offer any filter), as they obviously have a vested interest [slashdot.org] in the whole thing.
A conversation in the future (Score:4, Interesting)
Bitcoin is going to be so useful after all the national currencies fail. Here's a conversation in the near future, after the fall of modern society:
Crypto bro: "Can I have some food? I can pay for it with bitcoin."
Farmer: "I have no use for bitcoin. The internet's not even working anymore. I need fertilizer. Go crap on the manure pile and I'll give you half a potato."
Re:A conversation in the future (Score:5, Funny)
Go crap on the manure pile and I'll give you half a potato."
Which leads to the classical Irishman's dilemma. Do I eat the potato now, or let it ferment it so I can drink it later?
Re: (Score:2)
I don't think that's a dilemma for any true Irishman, obviously you let it ferment. But here in the states, we'd be trying to figure out whether to mash it, bake it, fry it or shoot it out of a gun. That's a classic dilemma.
Re: A conversation in the future (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
ROFL!
Re: A conversation in the future (Score:2)
California would have to stop exporting most of its food to the rest of the United States.
Re: A conversation in the future (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
the Internet renders many things obsolete, including national currencies.
Except it hasn't so far, and it shows no signs of doing so soon.
Re: A conversation in the future (Score:1)
In Zimbabwe cows are the new currency (Score:3)
At least for saving for pensions, as reported in the Economist this week given the high and rising inflation there:
'Mr Chamunorwa, an actuary trained in Britain, started a company, Nhaka Life Assurance, to sell inflation-proof pensions to Zimbabweans. The pensions are not denominated in Zimbabwe dollars, since they quickly evaporate, nor in American dollars, since many Zimbabweans are struggling to obtain any.
Instead, they are denominated in cows, which the government can’t print. Savers, typically wa
Re: (Score:2)
This kind of creativity shows that Zimbabwe is set for a rebound (finally).
If you can keep optimism and find growth when the economy is so bad, then you can thrive.
Re: In Zimbabwe cows are the new currency (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
There's always someone more pessimistic than me...
Re: (Score:2)
Until Covid-20 ravages cattle populations worldwide.
Thus the aforementioned livestock insurance:
Zimbabweans have long seen cattle as a store of wealth. Mr Chamunorwa jokes that he has merely updated an old idea and added livestock insurance.
(emphasis mine).
Re: In Zimbabwe cows are the new currency (Score:2)
Cows are "printed" when they reproduce. This will end the same way as tulips, because you can print an infinite number of cows/tulips.
The real missing option (Score:1)
0, obviously (Score:4, Insightful)
Price bottom for a non-asset, whose valuation is based entirely on unspoken mutual agreement is always 0.
Re: 0, obviously (Score:1)
Re: 0, obviously (Score:2)
How is that different than buying a stock that has 0 dividends like most
Gold? (Score:2)
The number of actual uses for gold are not sufficient to use up the annual production; despite that it has largely remained in fashion as a store of value, and has reemerged successfully as such over recent years after going into eclipse for a period. The apparent death of bitcoin may well make it even more attractive...
Re: Gold? (Score:1)
Invalid premise (Score:2)
Wow (Score:1)
Re: Wow (Score:1)
Missing the obvious answer (Score:2)
CowboyNeal, obviously.
Suckers are a non-renewable resource (Score:5, Insightful)
What do you mean by the bottom in "this cycle" ?
-- Prof. Nicholas Weaver, UC Berkeley, in an interview [currentaffairs.org].
Re: (Score:2)
There are always more suckers, but it's easy to see there could be another "bubble" if inflation continues on its current track.
It's just not a big enough player anymore (Score:1)
Bitcoin is just like any other crypto coin. And as long as new coins are being created everyday the capital that flows into them slows/negates any possible gains of bitcoin.
Basically I am saying in the bigger picture all crypto coins are fungible. So the process of creating new coins is basically creating inflation of the entire crypto coin market.
Re: It's just not a big enough player anymore (Score:1)
There is only one decentralized, nation state proof, hard money. Bitcoin.
The sooner you realize that, the better.
Cheers!
Re: It's just not a big enough player anymore (Score:1)
Re: It's just not a big enough player anymore (Score:2)
If you copy/paste, you'll get double spends. Bitcoin's massive resource usage also secures it. (Unless you can get someone else to spend a larger amount on power.)
So salty in here (Score:1)
Remember kids, itâ(TM)s still very early.
Bitcoin has two end points - a low nominal value or the global reserve currency. Every day the former does not happen, the latter is more likely.
Consider putting a small amount in to benefit from that asymmetric bet. Bitcoin value is not in the token, it is the network, in the same way tcpip packets are not valuable without a computer to send them.
Cheers!
Re: (Score:2)
Bitcoin has two end points - a low nominal value or the global reserve currency. Every day the former does not happen, the latter is more likely.
It is logically possible that bitcoin maintains a high nominal value and never becomes the global reserve currency.
Additionally, would you apply the same argument above to all other currencies, inclusive of digital, physical, centralized, and decentralized?
Already dipped to $26K range (Score:3)
This is the bottom ($28,000)
It already hit below that on May 12.
5 figures, 4 ... 3 ... 2, 1 (Score:2)