AMD Slashing Prices Still Not Enough? 159
PeterN writes to tell us that after hearing the announcement that AMD was slashing prices on their processors by 47%, TG Daily looked a bit deeper and found that it still might not be enough. From the article: "For AMD's planned price drop for its dual-core processors to enable the company to regain its aggressive price/performance competitive position against Intel as it has promised, the company would have to reduce its existing Athlon 64 X2 and Athlon FX prices by between 38% and 56% for its various models, with cuts averaging about 51%. This estimate is based on a comprehensive price/performance review of Intel's soon-to-be-released Core 2 Extreme and Core 2 Duo processors, along with its existing Pentium D dual-core line, pitted against AMD's FX-62, FX-60, and Athlon 64 X2 processors in Tom's Hardware Guide tests."
gamers beware. (Score:3, Interesting)
Myself and several others have had problems with both Battlefield 2 and Source games (CS:S, day of defeat etc)
Very annoying.
Now i'll get lot's of replies from folks with this setup telling me otherwise....
Re:gamers beware. (Score:5, Informative)
Re:gamers beware. (Score:4, Informative)
(I've got an Athlon64 3500+; without CNQ it runs cooler and quieter than the Athlon XP it replaced, so I leave it turned off.)
Re:get a uid (Score:2)
Re:gamers beware. (Score:2)
do you have an nvidia Graphics card as well? i've an Asus board/64 X2 3800+/Nvidia 7600 card.
there are other people on the anandtech/steam/BF2 forums with the same problem.
Re:gamers beware. (Score:2)
Epox NF4+Ultra, NVidia 7800GT, AMD X2 3800+, 2 gb ram, Win XP sp2 + latest drivers
Re:gamers beware. (Score:2)
I have an NF2 with an AMD Athlon XP 2600+ and an nVidia 6200. It plays CS with no problems at all too. I just bought an AM2 and its having some strange timing issues with Linux. Not exactly sure what's causing it, but I think it might be a bug in KDE..
Re:gamers beware. (Score:2)
Seconded. I can't comment about the N4 chipset, but there certainly are issues with ming and the X2 line (I know that the X2s weren't 'meant' for gaming, but they do pretty well). The issues tend to fall into two categories: those that can't handle a 64-bit processo
Two things to try (Score:3, Informative)
The second (if that does not work) is to explicitly bind your game to a single core. Start the game and right away hit control-alt-delete. Select the game in the "processes" tab, right-click and select "set affinity" and check only 1 processor.
I too have an x2, nVidia video card and nVidia chipset. I had problems with Everquest2 until I installed the first, and regular Everquest until I did the second (every tim
Re:gamers beware. (Score:2)
I *believe* the Dual Core optimizer patch from AMD works the magic but I could be wrong. It's one of those things that plagued me and my friends for months, and once I found the right patch and everyone applied it, I forgot all about it. I do remember the problem was caused by faulty ACPI/timing issues.
Re:gamers beware. (Score:2)
Yes.
Battlefield 2 is well known for having a ton of bugs, don't know about CS:S though.
BTW, I have a 939 AMD64 X2 3800+ with a Nvidia Nforce4 motherboard that I bought 2 months ago and all my games run fine.
Games I play: UT2004, Warcraft3, Oblivion, Call of Duty 2, FarCry, San Andreas, Guild Wars, Doom 3, Half Life 2, SimCity 4, Civ 4....all work fine on my AMD64 X2, I don't play Battlefield 2 or CS:S so I can't tell
But its better with most... (Score:4, Insightful)
Anyway, I was looking at a 4800 X2, and it seems its still the best option to buy atm, cheaper then the Intel (?).
Still I think AMD has a group of active followers and Intel-haters, they won't stop buying those chips soon. And only in the very high end systems Intel is much cheaper, but thats not what most people will buy.
Re:But its better with most... (Score:2)
AMD always seems to edge out superior performance, and last just a little bit longer than it's Intel bretheren. Plus, the 64-bit support was there when I
Re:But its better with most... (Score:2)
Re:But its better with most... (Score:4, Informative)
Besides, even if one design adopted 64-bitness earlier in the process than the other, of what benefit is this? If this is advantageous, it should show up in improved performance on 64-bit benchmarks. Is this the case?
Re:But its better with most... (Score:2)
To say K8 is a totally new processor, as you alluded to, is inaccurate.
To say Core Duo 2 Two Deux is totally new is wrong too. It's similar to a wider PM with a huger cache [yes huger is a word!].
Tom
Re:But its better with most... (Score:3, Insightful)
As with all things of this type, it depends on the application and its data set. A straight port of a 32-bit app with a 32-bit data set to a 64-bit environment probably isn't going to gain you much. In fact, performance might even suffer, as 64-bit stuff tends to clog up the L2 cache more tha
Re:But its better with most... (Score:2)
Did you consider the Pentium !!! inferior because it was just a Pentium II with SSE added, rather than a CPU specifically designed for SSE?
Re:But its better with most... (Score:1)
Don't you mean a 486 DX2-66?
*ducks and hides*
Re:But its better with most... (Score:1)
Re:But its better with most... (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:But its better with most... (Score:2)
Opteron prices haven't changed (and weren't planned to change). At least not that I see in a quick check of the usual places. Where have you seen price drops? The Opteron 170 is still ~$400 (the only chip I know pricing for off-hand).
Re:But its better with most... (Score:2)
Uhm... still no word on the AMD buying ATI? (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Uhm... still no word on the AMD buying ATI? (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Uhm... still no word on the AMD buying ATI? (Score:1)
Re:Uhm... still no word on the AMD buying ATI? (Score:3, Insightful)
hate to break it to ya, bud... but... Methinks you spoke about three minutes too soon... [slashdot.org]
Re:Uhm... still no word on the AMD buying ATI? (Score:2)
Re:Uhm... still no word on the AMD buying ATI? (Score:2)
Re:Uhm... still no word on the AMD buying ATI? (Score:2)
That being said, ever seen what happens when you try to run an ATi card on an nForce chipset? Yeah, it sounds like a bad idea from the get-go, but I've seen people try it.
And fail. Spectacularly.
Re:Uhm... still no word on the AMD buying ATI? (Score:2)
So far, Biostar's nForce chipset series (their 6100 series) doesn't seem to like ATi cards made by MSI.
Just putting it out there.
Re:Uhm... still no word on the AMD buying ATI? (Score:1)
Re:Uhm... still no word on the AMD buying ATI? (Score:1)
Re:Uhm... still no word on the AMD buying ATI? (Score:2)
Re:Uhm... still no word on the AMD buying ATI? (Score:1)
it has been http://hardware.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/07/ 21/2147220 [slashdot.org]
when it is completely finished, it will be posted again ;-) (btw, you could make an entry of this yourself ;-) )
Re:Uhm... still no word on the AMD buying ATI? (Score:1)
4%? (Score:5, Insightful)
the company would have to reduce its existing Athlon 64 X2 and Athlon FX prices by between 38% and 56% for its various models, with cuts averaging about 51%
OK, so they're saying that AMD missed the mark by 4%? And that this is worthy of writing an entire article about (a very short article by the way. Your welcome for the additional ad revenue
Yeah. (Score:5, Funny)
I'd buy one if it was $213, but $225 is just too damn expensive!
Re:4%? (Score:2)
Re:4%? (Score:2)
OK, so they're saying that AMD missed the mark by 4%? And that this is worthy of writing an entire article about (a very short article by the way. Your welcome for the additional ad revenue
They havent met the 51% mark either. The 38% to 56% range is the price cuts that need to be made to different processors. Some processors have to be cut 38%, som
What about Opterons? (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:What about Opterons? (Score:2)
Not really, because the no1 PC server manufacturer (Dell) doesnt ship AMD. So we're stuck buy Intel crap... And I'm sure many many other companies have a "all PCs are Dell" policy..
Re:What about Opterons? (Score:2)
Re:What about Opterons? (Score:3, Interesting)
That's what I call bad timing. Three months with AMD, that means Intel is pissed off, and now they have the second fastest chips only. And while Apple has record margins because of "extremely favorable component prices", Dell issues a profit warning. Just wondering if these are related.
Re:What about Opterons? (Score:2)
Unlikely.
The Opterons don't compete with the Core line at all. Intel hasn't released any server class chips from the Core family yet. Apple still sells G5s in it's server and PowerMac line because of that. We are talking s
Re:What about Opterons? (Score:2)
The Opterons don't compete with the Core line at all. Intel hasn't released any server class chips from the Core family yet. Apple still sells G5s in it's server and PowerMac line because of that. We are talking servers not Desktops.
The server part of the new CPUs, Woodcrest, was released before the Core2 and is available in e.g. 1950 and 2950 from Dell. Dell stated they would use the Opteron for 4 way servers, which is what makes most sense.... with Intel's new chip, AMD seem to be behind on the CPUs
Re:What about Opterons? (Score:2)
Well, might that be because they "have not" started shipping them yet?
Read your own article please
"After all, it's the customers and not investors that will be buying Dell's new four-chip Opteron server at year's end."
There is plenty of time for Dell to scrap the entire idea.
Re:What about Opterons? (Score:2)
Before and after (Score:5, Informative)
After the cuts [amd.com]
Re:Before and after (Score:2)
That's the exact same document, with the exact same date (July 24, 2006), just linked to from different sections of AMD's site, so the URL isn't exactly the same.
Re:Before and after (Score:2)
Because AMD has apparently been making changes to their website, and that document has been changed several times since the link was first posted...
It is now correct, but when I posted that comment, they were exactly the same document.
So...This Is Being Spun In A Bad Way??? (Score:1, Insightful)
When AMD slashes prices it's....bad???
Sure it's tinfoil hat material, but I am starting to think this past year Intel didn't do the usual passing around of marketing money but have flooded the Net with cash to generate positive PR.
And to think I use to be sickened by simple things like Intel's bogus marketing compiler generated SPEC scores...
Re:So...This Is Being Spun In A Bad Way??? (Score:3, Insightful)
The release of the Core 2 caught AMD in the same way that the Opteron caught Intel; they didn't have a competitive product. Their only optio
Off Topic: AMD PR Numbers (Score:4, Interesting)
The current crop of AMD parts are marketed with a similar scheme showing the speed of an equivalent Pentium 4. Intel have pretty much discontinued the P4 now, and an Athlon 4200 is definitely not twice the speed of a 2.1 GHz Core 2. Are these performance rating numbers going to make AMD look silly?
They are not "PR" numbers, they are model numbers. (Score:4, Insightful)
Do you get the point?
Clockspeed is so yesterday. Just forget it.
Its just a nametag. Live with it.
Re:They are not "PR" numbers, they are model numbe (Score:2)
In a world where you were running true CISC chips and every instruction took at least one clock cycle, and most took several, clock speed was everything. Now you have superscalar instructions, dual cores, special optimizations for multimedia, 3D graphics, etc., and well, clock speed doesn't seem to mean much anymore
Re:Off Topic: AMD PR Numbers (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Off Topic: AMD PR Numbers (Score:2)
Re:Off Topic: AMD PR Numbers (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Off Topic: AMD PR Numbers (Score:2)
AMD CPU prices are not the whole story (Score:5, Informative)
They are around 200 euros. You can get a pretty good NForce4 board for 939 X2 for under 100 euros, and even AM2 boards are in 100-140 euro range.
So total price, board+cpu, AMD still wins by a clear margin (price/performance), because intel chipsets are as overpriced as ever...
Re:AMD CPU prices are not the whole story (Score:2)
Re:AMD CPU prices are not the whole story (Score:2)
However, Intel will milk the mobo makers as long as 975X and P965 or whatever the new one was are the only chipsets validated for Core 2 Duo. Considering how late nVidia chipsets are, I expect personally to see high end boards go for 200-250e all the way until the new year, and that's the main reason why I personally can't recommend Core 2 Duo, unless your goal is to build the ultimate killer system ignoring the cost. You will be paying 50-100 euros premium for i
agreed... (Score:2)
But Intel hasn't even truly introed Core 2 Duo yet. When the chip is announced and available, prices will drop.
Right now, these mobos are all in short support, so of course the prices are high.
This point, although true, will be moot in under 6 weeks.
Also, I wouldn't buy a 939 mobo right now. AMD is killing off 939 rapidly. AM2 is a smarter idea. You can buy a 939 mobo on fire sale, but better get it quick or you might find yourself unable to ge
Re:agreed... (Score:2)
Depends on your planned usage pattern. If you don't plan on upgrading the CPU down the road (merely adding memory), then a 939 board is fine (just get PCIe).
Over the last 10 years, I think I've only ever upgraded a single CPU... maybe. That's out of a few dozen systems that I've built.
well, for two reasons... (Score:2)
Re:well, for two reasons... (Score:2)
Aye, I can understand that.
Personally, I've become quite fond of motherboard bundles where the store puts together the CPU / RAM / MB for me for a few bucks, then fires it up to test it prior to shipping it. Less worries about finding a chip to go with a particular MB, I don't have to stay (as) cu
Re:well, for two reasons... (Score:2)
Maybe I will go ahead and switch to the AM2 boards after all. At least for the X2 systems with 2GB of RAM (~$400). The 939 Athlon64s with only 1GB cost the same either way (~$250).
Re:agreed... (Score:2)
Err... the chip *is* announced, and will apparently be available as of the day after tomorrow.
AND (Score:2)
If it becomes available in two days, then it isn't really announced and available, is it?
Re:AND (Score:2)
Small earthquake, not many dead (Score:2)
Too much is never enough (Score:2)
Re:Too much is never enough (Score:3, Insightful)
Well, I dunno.
That's probably true for the hobbyist market, but I'd guess the vast majority of processors go into machines that are never upgraded; therefore the concerns of the manufacturers are probably paramount.
I have a friend in the auto industry who claims that engineers will sell their soul to save a nickel on a 30K$ automobile. Multiply that out by a lot of cars and it adds up. I imagine that it's t
Re:Too much is never enough (Score:2)
I'm pretty sure she was full of shit. When you look at the difference between American and Japanese cars, the Japanese cars are often built of chintzier parts. However, the overall system design is superior, so the cars are still superior.
As a slight deviation, the Europeans took the view that a car made of great parts would be a great car. That was true, but
Re:Too much is never enough (Score:3, Interesting)
Agreed - I just thank Zeus that we finally have a good ol' fashioned price war again - Both Intel and AMD have, for a year or two, just kept pushing prices up as though not in competition (which I suppose partially holds true - Intel didn't need to fight for business market share, and AMD didn't need to fight for the DIY'ers).
However, although Core II Duo (stupid name aside) looks rather impressive, keep
Re:Too much is never enough (Score:2)
Re:Too much is never enough (Score:2)
Re:Too much is never enough (Score:2)
I remember the good old days when the fastest damn CPU you could buy could not run latest flight simulators and the like decently.
These days the CPU speed is fairly irrelevant. I went
Re:Too much is never enough (Score:2)
How did Intel manage to stay in business the past couple years by selling more expensive, slower, hotter, power hungry CPUs?
not the issue for many of us (Score:5, Insightful)
That's the real news, not AMD missing the pricemark by 4%.
Tom Caudron
http://tom.digitalelite.com/ [digitalelite.com]
Re:not the issue for many of us --I agree, but... (Score:2)
Re:not the issue for many of us --I agree, but... (Score:2)
Re:not the issue for many of us --I agree, but... (Score:2)
The local chinese shop where I go has updated the price on one of their x2's. http://www.cty.ca/details.asp?pid=1560 [www.cty.ca]
Only on the AM2 X2 3800+ it seems ATM. Not the old 939 X2 3800+ http://www.cty.ca/details.asp?pid=231 [www.cty.ca]
$185 Canadian for the AM2 X2 3800+ is pretty good (considering I paid $350 for t
Re:not the issue for many of us --I agree, but... (Score:2)
No reason to buy ANY new processors. (Score:3, Insightful)
There is no reason at all to buy a new generation processor outside of extreme gaming or science. Hell I still edit video on a 3 year old 2.8 P4 and it works great.
The processor industry is suffering from stagnation. the new stuff is not fast enough to entice someone to throw away their current PC and buy the new performance stuff. and 64 bit has ZERO attraction to consumers and most people as there is no benefit or erason to switch to the 64 bit processors (unless you rtun linux and are a tinkerer.)
Re:No reason to buy ANY new processors. (Score:2)
Nevertheless, the processor industry is absolutely not stagnating - it's just that you aren't interested in what they're developing because you haven't gotten hooked by any killer app that requires high performance yet.
Re:No reason to buy ANY new processors. (Score:2)
Gee, why am I not amazed that cheap computer hardware is adequate for playing back century-old low-resolution television, using decades-old ineffecient lossy video codecs?
Switch to HDTV, though, and you need a top-of-the-line CPU and fairly new GPU just to play H.264 encoded 1080 video. Editing and re-encoding is another matter all-together, taking many hours on
Re:No reason to buy ANY new processors. (Score:2)
Except these 4 words: Processor support for virtualization.
Entirely depends (Score:2)
AMD cannot compete with Conroe in pure performance and yeah, the price cuts aren't enough to make the purchase of a high-end AMD CPU a good deal.
But, the price cuts have made the 3800+ and 4200+ really great options for those with slightly older CPUs looking for a cheap upgrade path. The low-end AMD X2 CPUS will provide a great deal of horsepower for a much lower cost than the Intel E6300.
It's like a Cyrix that doesn't suck.
The E6300 will still be faster, but I th
Re:Entirely depends (Score:2)
In other words (Score:2)
It's all a bit of history repeating (Score:3, Insightful)
Marketing (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Marketing (Score:2)
Re:Marketing (Score:2)
pricewatch (Score:2)
BTW. The grammar natzi that thinks I'm an illiterate AMD fanboy is right. I AM illiterate. Ignorance is bliss.
Re:Ugh. (Score:2)
I am glad my AMD 1400 Thunderbird and Duron 1000 (both with 768 Meg of 168 Pinn simms) running my Linux servers for the past 4+ years is still worth something
Re:Forget this article... (Score:2)
Re:Does Palladium makes any difference? (Score:2)