University of Virginia Student Graduates in One Year

An anonymous reader writes "18-year-old David Banh of Annandale, VA recently graduated from the University of Virginia with a double major in Physics and Mathematics, and an education paid for almost entirely by scholarships. What's truly amazing is that he did it in one year, bringing in 72 Advanced Placement credits, then taking 23 credits his fall semester, 37 credits his spring semester and 3 credits in the summer. His brief undergraduate career didn't leave him much time to explore college, so he's now working on his master's degree. He says he may eventually pursue law school as a part-time student in hopes of becoming a patent lawyer."

Moo

Useless fact:

Meanwhile, he had mastered bridge -- yes, the card game -- competed in tournaments all over and ran the school club, which doubled in size.

What he did:

He was helped by the fact that U-Va., as a public school, costs a lot less than most private colleges. And that the university accepted many of his Advanced Placement credits from high school; many of the most selective private schools wouldn't. As it was, he doubled up on course credits and took more physics over the summer to finish his second major.

Where he going:

He expects to finish his master's degree this academic year

What he wants to do:

Where he wants to He wants to be a patent attorney.

===

Counterpoint:

Many professors would like students to explore and experiment in college rather than cram in as much as possible at top speed.

How he did it:

His college education, almost entirely covered by a patchwork of scholarships, cost him about $200. And he sold back textbooks for more than that. Now he's starting graduate study at U-Va. with a research grant.

===

Basically, it's a neat feat that took years to prepare for, like going through a process to be "pre-qualified", but he isn't quite Doogie.

Re:Moo

Meanwhile, he had mastered bridge -- yes, the card game -- competed in tournaments all over and ran the school club, which doubled in size.

Yeah, the other guy in the bridge club was excited to finally get someone to play with.

Re:Moo

What a waste of a genius. A lawyer.

Re:Moo

I have noticed that more and more bright kids want to be lawyers or MBA's.

Maybe because they're bright enough to notice that those are the people who make the most money, while incurring the least risk?

Re:Moo

He's not necessarily a genius because he graduated in one year. He simply found a system that allowed him to do such a thing and decided to take advantage of that system.

When I went to high school, it wasn't even possible to take 72 AP credits. Similarly, most colleges will not allow you to take more than 18-22 credits per semester without permission of the dean; 37 would be completely out of the question.

He blazed through college in a year, probably missing out on a lot of the transformative moments as a college student, not the least of which is the ability to get a feel for what mathematicians and physicists do. It's no surprise to me that he wants to become a lawyer.

He is considering a doctorate in math "if he wants to stay in college". That's the wrong attitude to go into a doctorate (speaking as a first-year CS doctoral student myself), because you will be miserable every second of the program if you go for that reason. It should have nothing to do with whether you want to stay in college and everything to do with whether you have a fascination with a narrow area of knowledge that can only be sated by deep study of that area.

Re:Moo

Meanwhile, in the time it took you to write all that (and me to read it!), David Banh completed dental school!

Re:Moo

Counterpoint:
Many professors would like students to explore and experiment in college rather than cram in as much as possible at top speed.

Also, the administrators would like you to take as long as possible to get your degree, to increase the revenue flow.

Re:Moo

I am surprised they all counted. You can take a ton of AP classes, but a lot of it will never help you to a degree. Any idiot can sign up and take the AP exam even if the AP class is not offered at a high school.

I recently had a student come in with 60, but 72 is amazing. I encouraged her to take more electives and get into undergraduate research.

The other thing, most places limit you to 23 hours per semester. He must have gotten a waiver for 30+. With night classes, you oculd easily do 37. I did 23 one quarter at GT, it wasn't that bad.

Re:Moo

UVA in fact only accepted 60 of his 72 credits. He also had to get dispensation to take as many credits as he did in a single term. The article in the local newspapers also mentioned that he did have two classes that met at the same time, and he was allowed to do that, too. http://www.dailyprogress.com/servlet/Satellite?pag ename=CDP/MGArticle/RTD_BasicArticle&c=MGArticle&c id=1149190702105 [dailyprogress.com]

Re:Moo

Having half of your credits come from freshman level courses doesn't seem the most appropriate method to getting an eduation.

Considering the pace and methodology, I'd say he wasn't interested in an education... he was there to get a degree.

And... it sounds like he will be the perfect lawyer.

Re:Moo

Patent lawyer, no less. The kind of person who makes sure to cram as many patents into the system as fast as possible, regardless of their worth.

Re:Moo

I'm an engineer, and I didn't think Economics was a "bullshit" course; I found it useful and interesting. It sure helps to have some grounding in the subject when discussing taxation, for example. Much of the misery we inflict on ourselves is a result of so many people having no understanding of economics whatsoever.

Re:Moo

I agree with the spirit of your post 100% (that your parent poster is an elitist jackass), but just wanted to add a counter point. The BS classes he's talking about are the freshman and maybe sophomore intro courses, which don't even sniff the topics you mentioned. He's talking about skipping a semester of picking out the intersection of supply/demand curves and memorizing the definitions of elasticity and complimentary goods, full of the typical Greek business majors on their way to a Management degree. At that level, I have no problem calling it a BS course if you can demonstrate a mastery of the content on an AP exam.

Re:Moo

enjoy your young years while you can. You have the rest of your life to be a grown-up ...

Or you could simply refuse to "grow up" and have fun your
entire life. The idea that you reach a certain age, or point in time and suddenly
have to start behaving differently is B.S. You can be young as long as you
choose to consider yourself young.

Now excuse me while I go put some Twisted Sister [darklyrics.com] on....

Get his Genetic Code

Hurry!

Re:Get his Genetic Code

Don't bother, he's already patented it.

Re:Get his Genetic Code

Impossible. He is the prime example of a nerd who'd never get laid.

Congratulations, Mr. Banh...

...you have completely missed the point.

Missed opportunities.

I was going to say the exact same thing.

Racing through college like that just seems like wasted opportunities galore. Not only for the social interaction, which he almost certainly didn't get, but to take all sorts of other classes.

There are whole fields of study that I never would have had any clue about, except that I saw them in a course catalog when I was an undergrad and thought "what the hell, I'll take it." Economics, for example, is now a big interest of mine, and there's no way I would have taken it, if I had been just trying to bang out the minimum graduation requirements.

I wish this guy the best, but I think he's driving too hard and too fast for specialization. Even for a patent attorney, having some concept for things outside your area of interest is a good idea. That doesn't mean you need to take twelve credits of Underwater Basketweaving, just that there are a lot of things that you can learn about (particularly a big school like UVA), and it's a shame to pass up those opportunities, as they're rather difficult to come by later.

Re:Missed opportunities.

Oh please. This kid just whizzed through college using precious little time and none of his own capital. I guarantee you that he understands more about economics than you do. Now this kid can pursue his own interests with his degree already in hand and the opportunities that come with a degree and a story that clearly manifests a strong work ethic.

While you (and I) are floating through life trying to figure out what it is that we want, this kid is setting goals and achieving them. Even if his master plan isn't 100% perfect he's gotten his degree in a fifth of the time that it takes most people. He could spend the next 3 years backpacking in Peru and still be ahead.

Good for him.

Re:Missed opportunities.

a strong work ethic

Yeah well, you know the old saying: "All work and no play makes Jack die frozen and alone in a giant hedge-maze."

-Eric

Re:Missed opportunities.

I saw an interview with him last night on the local news. One thing mentioned in the interview (that wasn't discussed in the article) is that a primary motivation for him to finish school so quickly was a desire not to burden his parents or himself with any debt. He has younger brothers (can't remember the exact number) and didn't want the cost of his education to negatively effect their ability to go later. I am sure he missed out on a lot of the "college experience" but with the cost of tuition nowadays, not sure I blame his desire to get it over with as quickly/cheaply as possible.

Re:Congratulations, Mr. Banh...

College is also about social interaction and trying new things.

Don't get me wrong - classes are important, but making new connections and the experiences you have are as important or, in some cases, even more so. A life where you do nothing but work is no life.

Re:Congratulations, Mr. Banh...

I powered through school in order to become a programmer, back in the day. 12 months a year, 23 credits a semester, one, two jobs at the same time. I thought I was in a hurry.

In my old age, I know realize that the facts I learned weren't the education. I missed an education. I never had time to make friends or go to a party or watch TV.

The education is being with people as smart as you, as young as you. It's watching Battlestar Galactica together and learning about how other people think about moral questions... it's about making friends with your professors and the TA's. College is where you start making the friends that will connect you with the world as you leave school, giving you access to jobs and communities and a life.

If I had a summary, it would be: goof off in college. Spend an extra year there. Talk to everyone. Take a difficult course twice. Don't be afraid to change concentrations. Go to parties. Get drunk. Meet the opposite sex, even the same sex if that floats your boat. Maybe even at the same time. Live. Learn everything. Cheat authority at every turn, 'cause that disrespect and ability to bypass idiot rules will give you real success at life -- conformity makes you a loser, no matter what toys they give you. There is no other time or place in your whole life that will let you be yourself again, so grab it while you can.

This kid has educated himself into mediocrity.

Re:Congratulations, Mr. Banh...

Funny how that works, isn't it? I occasionally hear people quoting Corinthians 13:11 when they deal with people they think need to "grow up" (it's one of the hazards of living in the bible belt)

"When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things."

I always want to add something to the end - "When I became wise, I leanred the value of childish things and turned to them once more"

Re:Congratulations, Mr. Banh...

I always want to add something to the end - "When I became wise, I leanred the value of childish things and turned to them once more"

Try instead quoting a portion of this, written by a very well-known author and Christian apologist:

"Critics who treat adult as a term of approval, instead of as a merely descriptive term, cannot be adult themselves. To be concerned about being grown up, to admire the grown up because it is grown up, to blush at the suspicion of being childish; these things are the marks of childhood and adolescence. And in childhood and adolescence they are, in moderation, healthy symptoms. Young things ought to want to grow. But to carry on into middle life or even into early manhood this concern about being adult is a mark of really arrested development. When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty I read them openly. When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up."
-- C. S. Lewis

Re:Congratulations, Mr. Banh...

College has been about both since around the time it started. There are old letters from European university students writing home to ask their parents for further funds. I read quite a few examples of such texts in medieval history classes that I took while at college.

One of them stuck in my mind because of a quote contained in it that basically said without Bacchus, Apollo grows cold.

Whether you like it or not, one of the really important parts of college are the experiences and bonding.

Re:Congratulations, Mr. Banh...

College should be about learning, not socializing

Learning how to socialize is the most important part of school. All the knowledge in the world is meaningless if you're incompetent at communication.

Re:Congratulations, Mr. Banh...

College should be about learning, not socializing, binge drinking, wanton promiscuity, or what have you.

I agree, college should be about learning. However, there's much more to learn that what's in the books you read or the notes you copy down for the chalk board. As you said, you don't need a prof up in front of the room to learn from a book. That said, there aren't many times, other than college, in your life where you are as free to experiment, try new things, and "open your wings". Learning about yourself and growing as a person (being social is a HUGE part of this) are the most important parts of college. Being successful (and happy) in life isn't always about what or how much you know. It is very often about how you present yourself (social skills) and who you know. College is a critical networking and personal growth opportunity.

Re:Congratulations, Mr. Banh...

I think what the parent meant is a large part of University is not just preparing for your job, but preparing through your life. A lot of the stuff you go through in Univeristy (partying,hangovers with an exam the next day, relationships succeeding, failing, and fucking your life over, prioritizing relationships vs. fun vs. school), prepare you for various aspects of your life as an adult.

This guy skipped all that, obsessed with the scholoarly aspect 24/7. He will probably do the same with his job, become quite wealthy, but ultimately very depressed. I wouldn't be surprised to see this guy on a suicide watch by the time he is 25 if he is not careful.

Is that the punchline?

.. he rushed through the technical stuff, and wants to jump into patent law.. sounds like a dig at the USPTO :) .. "I want to rush through stuff JUST LIKE THEM!".

There is A LOT more to college than the degree, hell - for most people thats an afterthought.

3 Credit Summer?

What a slacker! But before I get modded troll, let me just say that I think more students could be graduating a lot sooner if useful classes were offered during the summer. A lot of summer semesters get wasted when out of state kids can't afford to go home for the summer and don't have any classes worth taking either.

Many schools no longer accept AP credits

Many IV league schools no longer accept AP credits. They want you to get an education from THEIR institution. If you enroll into a school with 72 credits, about half of your university education doesn't even come from the university you attended. This is why many schools are following the examples of the IV league institutions.

Re:Many schools no longer accept AP credits

...IV league...

Wow, they now have a whole new class of schools just for people taking performance enhancing drugs? Do you have to take them via IV, or are other ways acceptable too?

Seems to have missed the point.

Part of the point of an undergraduate education is to be exposed to new ideas and concepts while you're establishing yourself in an environment separate from your parents and the babysitting culture of most secondary schools.

Somehow, I don't think he got very much exposure to new ideas and concepts. He sounds like someone who's decided that whatever makes the most money is the best thing to do with your life.

Regards,
Ross

What a shame

It seems to me that this guys has missed the point of university. Yes, his feat is just short of miraculous and he is clearly a smart guys, but it sounds like he was there merely for the credential. Simply to get the degree. University is supposed to give someone a chance to explore the universes, or the parts that seem interesting. To experiment and experience things. Not to simply vacuum up credits. In a way, I am sorry for him.

What he missed

Okay. 37 credits your spring semester. That's pretty much 9 AM to 5 PM in class, five days a week. Add in study time and prep time plus time to do assignemnts, and (judging by what I did carrying 15 credits at Penn State) he was working an additional 6+ hours a night, seven nights a week, for his classes. That's it. That was his life for a year.

See, to me, college was about learning first and foremost, about obtaining a well-rounded academic education. The key here is "well-rounded." If you're literally spending 13-14 hours a day on class, what else are you doing? Nothing. That's not well-rounded. This kid missed out on everything that makes college, college. Friends, relaxing...hell, dorm floor-wide LAN matches in CS and UT99 (as in my case). Oh, and football. Sweet, sweet football. On the other hand, I can guarantee you that he did nothing but eat, sleep, work, and study.

I'll take a party here and there and some video games, please. I would not do what this kid did, nor would I consider it, or consider letting my children (someday) do it. It's just flat out not worth it.

Re:What he missed

I'm pissed that there's so much animosity towards people who choose to spend most of their studying. I admit, I know some self-hating schoolaholics (those who study all day just because they can't think of anything better to do). However, a lot of the people who "waste their lives" studying most of the day end up being people who submit dozens of patents every year, publish influential papers, and greatly expand the sphere of human knowledge and understanding.

I don't think it's fair to say "it's not worth it," because to a lot of people, contributing something meaningful to society is far more important than self-gratification. Just because 95% of the people going to college think it is for their personal benefit does not mean the remaining 5% should share the same view.

And hey, for the most part, I'm in your boat. I waste a lot of time playing video games, watching TV, and hanging out with friends. But I greatly admire those who choose to sacrifice all of that to come up with all of the innovations that allow us to live such a life of leisure. Those people deserve our respect, not our pity.

Point of college...

Not to troll, but I found that throughout my college career, not only did I get an education, but being in a constant social/acedemic environment for four years helped me develop as a person (I think the same is true for many folks). Finishing college in one year seems to really get the acedemic part, but it must limit how much you are able to grow as a social being.

Although, he double majored in physics and math....probable not much of a need to be a social being (and this is coming from an EE with a minor in Mathematics.... :)

Wow, he did the exact opposite with his AP credits

as I did with mine. I intentionally stayed in college 6 years*(1.5 of those were spent doing internships) because I wanted to explore everything there was. My AP credits allowed me to get a lot of stuff out of the way so I could explore. I took an internship at a steel mill and worked at an R&D Lab in Japan. I majored in computer engineering and minored in math and Japanese, and actually took a lot of other classes that I didn't have to take because I thought they were interesting. I have something like 32 credits that don't really "count" as it were, for my degree. I am sure as hell glad I took them though because I will probably never get another chance to take a class in world music or Japanese literature.

Those sure as hell don't help me on my job or in grad school next year, but I really felt like they helped me grow as a human being.

135?

christ, i graduated with a single major (computer engineering) and i had to take 140 credits. all he had to take was 135 for two.

where's my second degree? :(

Extracurricular

Apparently he didn't have enough time for a minor in female anatomy.

The light that burns twice as bright...

...burns half as long? I worry about people who are so task oriented. I bet the guy gets anxious when he isn't working towards a deadline and has some free time.

You're all wrong.

This guy hasn't missed the point of going to college. He got it right. He's taking advantage of the TIME VALUE OF MONEY. Facing the extreme price increases in tuition why not take as many transferable AP classes as you can. Then if you get someone else to pay for your collage that's even better. And instead of wasting 4 years of valuable time (where you could be making money instead of forking it over the university, landlords, beer vendors, or pot dealers you can get on with life and start doing what you want. The more you earn/invest today, the better off you will be tomorrow. The less debt you have today, the more you will have tomorrow.

Universities have become a money making shell game...they require you to take a load of irrelevant course work (to broaden your horizons) at over $300/credit then they offer limited sections of these classes which delays your graduation a semester or two. Yeah, the university has your educational interests at heart.

Thomas Jefferson H.S.

I knew, the second I saw the headline, that it was a TJ [tjhsst.edu] grad. I could have easily spent another year at TJ after my senior year, and learned a hell of a lot more than I did during my first year (or two) of college. In fact, in my time at TJ (where I specialized in Physics), I learned more about computer science in passing than I have at the two universities I've attended for most of the past ten years (including a CS degree).

I'll be the first one to admit that chances are he missed out on a lot of fun college life, but sometimes you just have to do something "because you can". He's smart, and I'm sure he'll spend the next three or four years in grad school and law school, and he'll find time to have a little bit of fun while he's at it.

Congratulations to him, and remember, just because he's smarter than you (academically) is no reason to try and take away from his accomplishments just to make you feel better about yourself.

--brian, TJ '96

An ideal candiate...

Just imagine how fast this guy will blow through the McDonald's training materials! He's got Assistant night shift supervisor written all over him...

Re:The punchline

A patent attorney.

In a Swiss Patent Office, perhaps? I think I heard of that one before...

Re:The punchline

I would think that's a good thing. We want good people who can genuinely understand the patents in the system.

Re:The punchline

He should be pretty happy as a patent attorney. My brother-in-law does that, and the job doesn't leave a lot of time for a social life... which this kid obviously doesn't have, and certainly didn't learn anything about in his year at college.

Re:Stupid

I mean, a true genius would be eager to use his cognitive abilities for the advancement of mankind.

Right. Because [wikipedia.org] no [wikipedia.org] lawyer [wikipedia.org] has [wikipedia.org] ever [wikipedia.org] done [wikipedia.org] anything [wikipedia.org] to [wikipedia.org] advance [wikipedia.org] mankind [wikipedia.org].