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Dropbox is the Latest San Francisco Tech Company To Make Remote Work Permanent (cnbc.com) 52

Posted by msmash from the moving-forward dept.
San Francisco-based Dropbox announced this week that it will stop asking employees to come into its offices and instead make remote work the standard practice, even after the coronavirus pandemic ends. From a report: "Remote work (outside an office) will be the primary experience for all employees and the day-to-day default for individual work," the company said in a blog post. For employees who need to meet or work together in person, the company is setting up "Dropbox Studios" in San Francisco, Seattle, Austin and Dublin when it's safe to do so. The company extended its mandatory work-from-home policy through June 2021. "We'll have Studios in all locations we currently have offices -- whether they're dedicated spaces in places we currently have long-term leases and a high concentration of employees (San Francisco, Seattle, Austin, and Dublin to start) or on-demand spaces in other geographies," the company said. Dropbox had more than 2,800 employees as of Dec. 31, according to its latest 8K.
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Dropbox is the Latest San Francisco Tech Company To Make Remote Work Permanent More

Dropbox is the Latest San Francisco Tech Company To Make Remote Work Permanent

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  • Their landlord is shitting nickels about now... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by AmazingRuss ( 555076 ) on Wednesday October 14, 2020 @10:01AM (#60606490)
    ... there won't be a tenant to replace them.
    • I am really glad I am not invested in commercial real estate right now. With the physical distancing rules in place now we have half a floor, with a maximum occupancy of 12 people, and the most I have seen in the office at one time was about 6. We are growing, but I expect when our lease comes up we will be looking for a smaller space, with non-assigned desks, and a few group working spaces.
      I have not seen anyone entering or leaving the other businesses on the same floor, in months.
      • Pension funds are full of commercial real estate.  The govies are gonna get hammered.

      • In Vancouver, it looks like building owners are looking to convert at least some of the commercial space to residential use. They're spooked that even when the pandemic fades, it will have so altered the commercial real estate picture that they could literally own blocks of empty buildings. It might serve to bring residential prices down, but it depends on whether, with low commercial occupancy rates, why anyone would want to live in the city at all.

        • In Vancouver, it looks like building owners are looking to convert at least some of the commercial space to residential use. They're spooked that even when the pandemic fades, it will have so altered the commercial real estate picture that they could literally own blocks of empty buildings. It might serve to bring residential prices down, but it depends on whether, with low commercial occupancy rates, why anyone would want to live in the city at all.

          The landlords will have to do something, because otherwise they will be paying property tax and maintenance on empty buildings. It might also help the apartment rental market a bit.
          I have never understood why anyone would want to live in a city. I am an hour outside Vancouver and looking forward to moving further out.

          • that isn't hiking & camping. Sports games, bar hoping, movies besides the blockbusters, concerts, better schools and libraries, etc, etc. And if you're looking for a date.

            And of course there's jobs. Not everybody wants a 3 hr commute, and modern jobs come and go like the wind.

            Rural and small city living is great if you're like me and kinda anti-social or if you're retired.

          • Re: (Score:3)

            by tlhIngan ( 30335 )

            The landlords will have to do something, because otherwise they will be paying property tax and maintenance on empty buildings. It might also help the apartment rental market a bit.
            I have never understood why anyone would want to live in a city. I am an hour outside Vancouver and looking forward to moving further out.

            Well, convenience. Being able to walk/cycle to errands is actually quite nice, versus having to drive to the store, drive to the other store, and run around town in a car. Even in Vancouver sub

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by dasunt ( 249686 )

            I have never understood why anyone would want to live in a city.

            I can walk, bike or bus to work, to restaurants, and to bars.

            Plus there's such a great variety of things. I can shop at a variety of "ethnic" grocery stores, get most items I need the same day, and have a ton of activities I can do (museums, parks, events, etc).

            It's super convenient.

            I don't mind rural areas either. But I'm rather not fond of the suburbs, which seem to be the worst mix of both rural and urban. None of the convenience,

        • It's a huge capital spend to convert commercial space to residential, tons of rework and additions to plumbing and life safety standards up to residential.

          I know that a lot of housing development in urban areas has benefitted from both housing shortages and keeping people on a treadmill of moving up to the next grand new urban condo.

          But I wonder how well this works when trying to convince a population skeptical on living downtown anymore anyway, pinched for income, etc? I've seen two commercial-to-resident

          • Cities die because everyone moves to the suburbs. This is an ongoing and well documented problem. The problem is getting much worse because modern tech means you can get the benefits of living in a big city while actually living in rural locations or even wilderness. Labour Saving Device = Job Killer. A world without jobs is a world where money is worthless.

            • Cities die because everyone moves to the suburbs.

              Then why do their populations keep growing?

              Stop spreading obvious bullshit. Cities die because they are mismanaged leftist hellscapes where the rulers rip off the residents, and the residents rip off each other.

              • Plenty of cities have died throughout history, and has nothing to do with "Left" or "Right". They usually involve changes to resource availability, food production, or long-term economic decline due to failure of primary economic drivers.

    • because of this. There's literally trillions tied up in commercial real estate. Those people are very rich, and very powerful. They are not going to go quietly into that Good Night.

      If you want to keep working from home you're going to have to pass laws over the objections of the real estate owners & brokers.
    • If you can do the job from home then so can someone in India making 10% your wages.

      • 1) Language barriers
        2) Cultural differences
        3) Time Zone differences
        4) Poor network infrastructure in many emerging economies
        5) Data privacy laws. For many industries (banking and insurance for example) employees, and company data, are not allowed to be offshore.
        6) The same reasons that the "Offshoring" model is false economics

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by Junta ( 36770 )

          Not to mention a difference in the extent that remote worker is invested in the success.

          I've seen this time and time again:
          -We offshore to what is billed as a 'low-cost' geography
          -The recruiters in that geo don't give a crap about anything but getting their cut, and dig up the dregs of the local job market
          -On top of probably not qualified, they also like the recruiter, simply don't care
          -If against the odds you find a decent offshore employee, they will be gone within 3 months, as they have skills, commitmen

  • Comment removed based on user account deletion

  • Working from home is fine (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Viol8 ( 599362 ) on Wednesday October 14, 2020 @10:19AM (#60606548) Homepage

    If you're not new to the company and don't need to be mentored and you're not particularly sociable and are quite happy in your own company 24/7 or just your near family.

    Most of us arn't like that however and as someone who started at a new company during all this I can say from first thand experience that a steep learning curve becomes almost vertical when the only way you can communicate with the rest of the team is through fucking Slack and email.

    • I can say from first thand experience that a steep learning curve becomes almost vertical when the only way you can communicate with the rest of the team is through fucking Slack and email.

      You need to add a video conferencing tool (Zoom/Google Meet/ETC.) I have onboarded quite a few new staff during Covid, and video meetings has been absolutely essential. Hint: Use one that allows you to remote control the other person's computer.

    • That is my biggest trepidation as well— the sit-around-the-conference table brainstorming sessions don’t go over nearly as well with zoom, and the impromptu huddles are even less effective. Purely functional activities seem to be fine (if not better), but strategic and soft activities and deliverables are harder to make work. Marketing is one of those, and while functional “doer-seller” roles work short-term, adapting a marketing plan for the changing environment is much harder.

      I

    • If you're not new to the company and don't need to be mentored and you're not particularly sociable and are quite happy in your own company 24/7 or just your near family.

      Most of us arn't like that however and as someone who started at a new company during all this I can say from first thand experience that a steep learning curve becomes almost vertical when the only way you can communicate with the rest of the team is through fucking Slack and email.

      Today we have the ability to give remote control to the educator/supervisor to walk a student/new employee through any process, step by step, literally moving the mouse for them,...across an HD video stream with surround-sound audio.

      ALL that technology, still isn't enough?

      I find it hard to believe that a mature professional in a work environment in the 21st Century, simply cannot effectively communicate and work with other mature professionals using digital mediums.

      Or perhaps the real problem, is your lack

  • Maybe DropBox will stop rolling out new features that no one ever asked for or wanted. Perhaps they should focus on doing one thing really well.

    Even better, on my 1 year old top of the line Win 10, T-Series laptop with a large DropBox folder, maybe they can improve performance so that is doesn't take me 5 seconds to open a folder. God help you if you are in explorer and have to name a file or folder.

  • Work from home favors the the better off (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Hydrian ( 183536 ) on Wednesday October 14, 2020 @10:26AM (#60606580) Homepage
    Work from home favors the better off. The poor don't necessarily have a good/dedicated space to do work. They also may not be able to get reliable/fast enough internet/utility connections. Also, the minor day to day issues at home are harder to ignore and deal with when you get home when your child/significant other is right next to you or talking through the door to your home office.

    • Work from home favors the better off.

      No kidding and that's why we hear of software and other office jobs doing this. My company announced a permanent WFH option a few months ago. We're not required to take it, not yet, but it's encouraged.

  • "Permanent", in some cases, means "until we change our minds after the pandemic is brought under control. How any situation benefits them on the bottom line will determine future courses of action.

    • I imagine that Dropbox is thinking that we're still a year out from a generally available vaccine, and probably six months to a year after that before things begin to return to normal. That's basically two to two and a half years of people working from home. Their employees' lives will have been rebuilt around work from home, they'll be in competition with other tech companies in the same boat. In other words, they see a tipping point, and feel that it's wiser to be at the forefront, rather than trying to r

      • Funny how Hindsight, still chastises those with 20/20 vision.

        It's as if Stupidity and Ignorance, still ruled the world.

        Nah, couldn't still be true now, right?

        Right?

  • Dropbox (Score:3)

    by JasterBobaMereel ( 1102861 ) on Wednesday October 14, 2020 @10:52AM (#60606640)

    ... A company with only a cloud based service, who does not have their own servers, has little need for an office

    Now tell us about a company that produces a physical product and needs infrastructure to do it

    • ... A company with only a cloud based service, who does not have their own servers, has little need for an office

      Now tell us about a company that produces a physical product and needs infrastructure to do it

      Now convince me remote work is still justified, by presenting me an impossible environment to support remotely.

      See, I told you I was right.

      - Micromanagement

  • We're going to see a bit hit (even more than we already are) to downtown real-estate across the country. Many businesses aren't going to return. They'll save a ton of money on rent, insurance, utilities, and more. In return they also get people that are more productive and work longer hours on average. Restaurants and other businesses that serve the typical downtown businesses are going to close up shop for lack of business sadly. Some suggest turning office buildings into apartments but the problem with th

    • Re:Downtown Real-estate (Score:4, Interesting)

      by aaarrrgggh ( 9205 ) on Wednesday October 14, 2020 @11:14AM (#60606714)
      I would look at the long game here and see if your theory still holds. Why do people like working downtown? Generally a big part of it is to actually be around other people, both at work and after work.

      I think it will take time for downtown business districts to recover, but don’t count them out. City people still tend to be city people. Not everybody is cut out for the roosters’ morning routine.
      • Back when I lived in Manhattan, I would do something every week - see a show, go to a museum, try a new restaurant. Maybe instead of places where drones shlep to the office, big cities become centers of culture and playgrounds for the idle rich.
        • When I think of my time after graduating college and starting my first real job, the idea of living in a place where a car did not dictate my every decision was a huge factor. Now my home does have roosters starting at 3AM. I have more money now, and while the food trucks as the primary alternative to cooking at home does have some limitations compared to San Francisco back in the day. But, if I was younger and single I can’t see why the suburbs and beyond would be more compelling than city life an
          • Really? I think downtown luxury residential properties will be fine for the same reason luxury everything is always OK - rich people have $$$. My wife and I, comfortably in the top 10%, but not rich rich, are thinking if properties drop any more in Boston's Back Bay we may buy an apartment down there for weekends.
            • People over-extended on rent. In Los Angeles, people making under $100k were spending $3k/month on rent for a 1BR/1BA, 600SF apartment. The same buildings might have ultra-lux 3BR/3BA, 2,500SF units for $20k/month; there are a lot more units like that than families making $600k/year. The condos were in a similar position, but with very high HOA fees. I might be a spendthrift, but the idea of spending more than 1/3 of your income on housing as an economically stable adult seems unsustainable. (I get it
              • Your point on rental property is a good one. Why would I pay $3k a month rent to be in commuting distance (for pretty expansive interpretations of commuting distance) of Google when they don't make me commute? I was talking about purchasing property. I have no idea what the thousands of rental units will do. Perhaps they'll all become condos, but I doubt the market has room for that. That end of the market will take a beating.

      • I will also add that supply and demand will follow the hordes wherever they go. Folks trying to escape cities to the burbs may very well find them much more expensive than they were led to believe as the people who got their first bid up prices. Generally Californians get the blame for this, but that's likely just because California is so much bigger than other states, with a population almost equal to the bottom half of the rest of the country (23 smallest states) .

        There's also the idea of salary. Peop

  • Well lookie here... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by erp_consultant ( 2614861 ) on Wednesday October 14, 2020 @11:50AM (#60606816)

    I have a feeling this is the beginning of a mass exodus of big companies from big cities. If most or all of your employees are working from home then why maintain very expensive urban office buildings? Just recently Boeing announced they are leaving their Seattle site for South Carolina. Amazon announced they are not renewing a lease on a large office building in downtown Seattle. I read the other day where the last remaining grocery store in downtown Seattle (an IGA I believe) is shutting down too. What is the point of living downtown if you can no longer to walk to your favorite store?

    Same thing is happening in New York and Los Angeles. People, and companies, are leaving in droves. And with them the tax revenues that the big cities rely upon for public services. Small businesses that relied on the foot traffic of the big downtown office buildings are seeing a dramatic slowdown in their own businesses, as well as increased crime looting and vandalism.

    Now obviously these cities are not going to shrivel and die overnight but there is an unmistakable trend going on. Commercial real estate is about to suffer a massive correction.

    • I have a feeling this is the beginning of a mass exodus of big companies from big cities. If most or all of your employees are working from home then why maintain very expensive urban office buildings? Just recently Boeing announced they are leaving their Seattle site for South Carolina. Amazon announced they are not renewing a lease on a large office building in downtown Seattle. I read the other day where the last remaining grocery store in downtown Seattle (an IGA I believe) is shutting down too. What is the point of living downtown if you can no longer to walk to your favorite store?

      Same thing is happening in New York and Los Angeles. People, and companies, are leaving in droves.

      Yes, and that would have likely continued to happen even without a global pandemic. Shit didn't exactly start smelling up San Francisco streets yesterday. Neither did the idiotic immature mentalities that turned downtown Seattle into a place no one wants to be.

      Of course, if you ask any of these city leaders why people are leaving in droves, they'll use the convenient excuse of COVID to mask years of placating to stupidity.

      • I have visited San Francisco literally hundreds of times over the years for business. Then I went back in 2016 for an Oracle conference and that is when I really started to notice the downturn. The rise in the number of homeless people and just the general filth was really shocking to me. SF had always been one of my favorite places to visit. It was such a beautiful city in so many ways - the view of the bay from Coit tower, the sounds and street artists along fishermans warf, the great restaurants in China

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