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Official WoW Expansion Talent Information 226

smartidiotaz writes "Blizzard has finally released more information about the talent trees after leaks broke out over the internet. " As typical, every class thinks every other class got a better deal, but the Pallies get to mean it ;)
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Official WoW Expansion Talent Information

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  • by __aaclcg7560 ( 824291 ) on Monday August 28, 2006 @05:53PM (#15996536)
    Slashdot finally releases guidelines for a proper summary length after an extra short summary left readers stratching their mousepads.
  • Well, since my main character in WoW is a Hunter, and my alternate character is a Druid... I'm somewhat underwhelmed by the "coming soon" notices contained in the link for those two classes.
    • Re: (Score:2, Funny)

      by Cybert4 ( 994278 ) *
      I wouldn't worry too much. I doubt they'll just leave them with nothing. Patience!
    • Im pretty sure they left out druids and priests becuase they know that the healer classes are completely screwed with all the other new talents and still ahve not figured out a gimmik to keep the healbots happy enough to not stop paying.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Monday August 28, 2006 @05:59PM (#15996562)
    Serious question, not a slam.

    I played through the 1-60 level grind on my free month, battlegrounds seemed a joke with the wait times, and WoW raiding doesn't seem very interesting(at least IMO compared to EQ raiding a few years ago).

    I know a lot of MMORPG players and not one of them are still playing WoW - which is strange because the sampling of the people I know has pretty well tracked player populations for every previous MMORPG over the past six to seven years I've been playing them.

    Where are all these WoW players and what are they doing while they are logged in all these months since the game went live?

    • Re: (Score:2, Funny)

      by Le Marteau ( 206396 )
      More importantly, where are all the eucher players? It used to be all the rage. I know a lot of card players, but not one of them are still playing eucher.
      • Re: (Score:3, Funny)

        I admit, things are a bit slow now, but when the "Cards of Fury" expansion comes out next month, with two new suits, I guarantee there's going to be tons of people coming back.
    • by Generalisimo Zang ( 805701 ) on Monday August 28, 2006 @06:12PM (#15996634)
      I stopped playing WoW for four months or so, but re-activated my account when I heard about the cross-server battlegrounds and the upcoming revamp of the Honor system.

      The wait times on Alterac Valley average about 2 minutes, across all hours of the day.

      For Warsong or Arathi Basin, you might have to wait up to 8 minutes in queue in the off-hours, but during peak hours the queues for AB and WSG are less than two minutes.

      Also, it looks like the upcoming changes to the honor system will eliminate DKs... so, more world PvP.
      • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

        A word of warning to add to this though: This is highly dependant on the realms your server is grouped with, and the faction you play. I know, on my old server, the Alliance are up in arms because their BG queues have skyrocketed, as they were grouped with a number of realms with tiny Horde populations. Conversely, on my present server, any time of the day or night, you can pick a battleground and get in instantly as a Horde character.
        • This is mostly due to the faction population imbalance present on most of the realms. This will be improved in the expansion by the addition of the blood elves to the horde faction. It turns out that people like to play good looking races and that the horde did not appeal to them.
      • by edremy ( 36408 )
        Another warning. I'm a noob player on a new server (Anvilmar) and there's been a lot of complaining from the PvP folks about the expansion. Since Anvilmar is a new server, there are very few 60s, which means there is very little twinking going on- there simply aren't enough high levels to give the killer loot to the 20s-40s. We go up against a more established realm in WSG30 for example and watch similar level characters on the other side doing vastly more damage.

        <grumpyoldman>Also, to all you fo

    • by Shivetya ( 243324 ) on Monday August 28, 2006 @06:19PM (#15996682) Homepage Journal
      You got it right, you did the grind.

      As such you would be clueless as to why people continue to play the game. See, they are playing a game. You were in a race, with what no one knows, but obviously you did not come to play. First and foremost, you cannot win at a MMORPG, so where is the rush?

      Apparently the MMORPG crowd you hang with is a minority. Then again people with your mindset normally are. Do you jump from game to game? If you only spent a month in WOW I can't see how you spend more in any other.

      Yeah this borders on bashing but if I had a PENNY for everyone who claims WOW is dieing or that everyone they know doesn't play it I would be so rich it would be silly.
      • by aafiske ( 243836 ) on Monday August 28, 2006 @07:34PM (#15997060)
        Mighty high flame setting on your stove there, boss.

        No, WoW isn't dying, but the grandparent had a point. You seriously run out of things to do in the game at a certain point. Maybe he races through things and reached it early.

        I played for about a year, took my time, levelled up a warrior and a priest (one horde, one alliance). And you know what? It got real tedious, real grindy, and real pointless. I sat and thought 'Why am I logging in? To grind to get a better item/new skill. So I can get better items/new skills more effectively. Huh. Waitaminnit.'

        WoW is not at all unique with regard to this problem, but it's not immune to it either.
        • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

          by snuf23 ( 182335 )
          Same here. Played for about 10 months. One level 60 character, a 43 and assorted alts in the 20s and 30s. I wasn't into high end raiding and PVP was time consuming. I got bored and the little irritating things started to bug me more and more. Needing to tweak my interface and macros for every patch, having to wait in a queue to login, having to wait in a queue to get in battlegrounds, having to wait an hour or more to get a raid group together.
          I really enjoyed the game but I didn't see any point in continui
          • "I wasn't into high end raiding and PVP was time consuming."

            i.e. you weren't into wow. That's fine, but wow is raiding and pvp. If you don't like those then you don't like wow. I'm a bit so so with raiding, but I love pvp especially world pvp.
            • by snuf23 ( 182335 )
              "wow is raiding and pvp"

              Actually, no. If you had said "the end game in wow is raiding and pvp" you would be correct.
              There are plenty of people that enjoy small party questing and 5 instances but don't care for 40 man raids. The best times I had in the game were 5 man groups in Dire Maul.
              I also did raid extensively. My raid tracker logged somewhere in the neighborhood of 75 raids run. The prospect of having to do the runs over and over for the 40 man runs just didn't seem fun. My old guild has gone on to do
              • i agree with you about the raids vs the 5 mans. I love 5 mans, 10 mans, and even the 20 mans, but i hate the 40 man raids. I personally love PVP and it's much better now with the BG queues. I haven't tried the world pvp enough to say much about it, but I actually like attacking towns :)

                "There was no way I could ever hit top of the ladder in PVP so there was very little point in doing it. I wouldn't be able to get the nice gear."

                I'll never hit the top of the ladder either, but the point for me isn't to
                • by snuf23 ( 182335 )
                  "I'll never hit the top of the ladder either, but the point for me isn't to hit the top of the ladder, It's to have fun! I have fun doing pvp. It's weird actually. When i get into the mode where i'm thinking "i gotta get xxx gear" then wow stops being fun."

                  Fair enough. I'm somewhere in the middle. I don't obsess on gear or xp but I like to feel progression of some sort. I think the issue I had with PVP was partially my class. As a lvl 60 Druid specc'd restoration (this was also before the talent revamp that
                  • I've played a druid more than any class, but i seem to play my lock more these days. I've had a druid since the old days and it's much much better now. All druids get innervate as a spell and it was replaced in the talent tree with an instant heal type thing. feral is much more fun these days.
        • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

          by mdarksbane ( 587589 )
          Yep. That's the theoretical beauty of the social game, though. I'm about as geared up as I care to be on both of my characters, but I still enjoy random instances with no loot for me left in them because I'm running it with guildmates.

          I think most good games like that go in stages - there's the point where you are wowed by the newness of it, the part where you're racing to get all the best stuff and become really powerful, and then the part where it's mostly a place to hang out with all the friends you met
    • by AstrumPreliator ( 708436 ) on Monday August 28, 2006 @06:22PM (#15996694)
      "Why Are People Still Playing WoW?"

      Maybe they're not still playing it so much as they just started playing it? I picked the game up in July as I had no interest in playing it before then (I'm not a large MMO fan). But a friend who recently bought a new computer that could run WoW bought it so I did.

      I'm sure there are still players that have been playing since the very beginning but I doubt they're the majority. I'm sure most of the people playing are either those who didn't buy the game until just recently or those who put it down for several months or longer and have decided to pick it back up again.
      • I joined November 2004 and still have an active account, although since I'm using gamecards there has been time where I have not been 'active'. The nice thing is since I buy them on amazon, I actually pay less than I would to have a recurring credit card subscripion, and I only pay when i want to play.

        I like running around the world, and I have almost all the gryph points in the Eastern Kingdoms (I am level 43 on that character). It's an adventure getting there, and with so many ways you can get to level
    • Well, my son played the beta, but found it too boring, and everything I've seen severely underwowed this Starcraft and Diablo II and Warcraft I/II player.

      He's mostly playing flash anime games, I'm mostly doing the Sims until the Wii comes out with Spore and Animal Crossing and hopefully a Diablo spinoff.
    • Re: (Score:2, Funny)

      by 0xdeadbeef ( 28836 )
      The smug sense of superiority it affords us over people who play Everquest, Guild Wars, and EVE.
    • Re: (Score:3, Funny)

      by mordors9 ( 665662 )
      Funny. I don't remember any of the things you mention in Wizard of Wor. I will have to get out my Atari 800XL and play it again.
    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by chreekat ( 467943 )
      Jesus Christ dude, one month? No wonder you got sick of it. If I got to level 60 in one month, not only would I not want to play WoW anymore, I would also want to kill myself.


    • by alexgieg ( 948359 ) <> on Monday August 28, 2006 @07:00PM (#15996916) Homepage
      You shouldn't have rushed to get to level 60. I played for 4 hours a day at a slow pace, enjoying the storyline, getting to know the game world, learning (and changing!) professions, participating in roleplay events and PvP, helping other players inside and outside my guild, doing lots of non-experience rewarding quests (the gray ones) etc., and by doing so I reached level 60 after eight (yes, eight) months. It was much, much more enjoyable than going the "power leveling" path.

      And since I reached 60 I'm still playing the same character, slowly acquiring gold to purchase my epic mount, trying to get some end game gear but not being obsessed with it, going in some raids with my guild, fine-tuning my addon collection, and so on and so forth.

      So, I'd say that WoW is kinda like a Mac: an integral experience. If you focus on a single aspect of the game it gets boring pretty fast. If you try to do all it allows you to do, then there's almost no limit to what you get from it. I am very far from getting bored, that's for sure. :)
      • I've noticed that the people who generally have a better experience in MMOs are those in guilds, especially those who have real life friends playing with them. Contrary to what people claim it is extremely difficult to find a good guild, especially if you only play casually. Inevitably, if you're not playing enough for their tastes you're marginalized.

        And that leads me to another problem. MMO players seem to have a skewed sense of what casual gaming is. Compared to the ones who play all night I suppose 4 ho
    • by Floody ( 153869 ) on Monday August 28, 2006 @07:23PM (#15997010)
      Serious question, not a slam.

      I played through the 1-60 level grind on my free month, battlegrounds seemed a joke with the wait times, and WoW raiding doesn't seem very interesting(at least IMO compared to EQ raiding a few years ago).

      I know a lot of MMORPG players and not one of them are still playing WoW - which is strange because the sampling of the people I know has pretty well tracked player populations for every previous MMORPG over the past six to seven years I've been playing them.

      Where are all these WoW players and what are they doing while they are logged in all these months since the game went live?

      Many of us are still there. Not necessarily with our original characters, but still ....

      Myself, I played from beta onwards. Not continously, I've taken multi-month breaks. Early on I spent most of my time exploring the 1-60 content, most of which is soloable or doable in five-man groups. Then I spent much time exploring the pvp aspects. Most recently, I've taken to the end-game (i.e. "raid") content, which is more challanging, but only by virtue of there being little room for error (and learning techniques for getting 40 people to deal w/ some rather intricate encounter mechanics).

      Why do I continue with a game that is considered rather pedestrian by the hard-core mmorpg crowd? Mostly, I suppose, because I don't like mmorpgs, and wow doesn't "feel" like one (in the traditional sense). It's fast paced, you kill quickly and you likewise can die quickly. But more than that, buried behind the accessibility of the game that has made it so popular is a rich and sophisticated set of mechanics. These mechanics were originally designed to create as much diversity as possible between the different classes (although I fear those responsible for this design are long gone, as the trend has definitely been towards homogenization). Each class has a significantly different feel to it and requires a different playstyle in order to excel, while simultaneously retaining class-specific complexities. These traits don't usually become fully apparent until one has reached the higher levels with a given class.

      While these sophistications certainly exist in WoW, the other edge of the sword is that, quite obviously, mass accessibility was a primary design concern; meaning that while you can become very good at the intricacies of a particular class and playstyle, it's not exactly required in order to experience all the content. The fallout from this is that the majority of the (very large) playerbase isn't terribly good at playing the game (and there exists little incentive for them to improve). Similarly, with a small group of proficient players who have mastered these intricacies, one can easily move through late/end-game content that most players would consider very difficult (without high-end "raiding" gear itemization).

    • by Bob9113 ( 14996 ) on Monday August 28, 2006 @07:37PM (#15997076) Homepage
      I know a lot of MMORPG players and not one of them are still playing WoW - which is strange because the sampling of the people I know has pretty well tracked player populations for every previous MMORPG over the past six to seven years I've been playing them.

      Where are all these WoW players and what are they doing while they are logged in all these months since the game went live?

      I play WoW in a decent sized guild. A solid 50% of them are not gamers. My brother is the perfect example. He plays two games on the computer - WoW, and a poker tutorial game.

      Which may suggest the answer to your question: You know a lot of hard-core gamers, to whom WoW may not be attractive. It is EQ easy-mode, after all. But, to a great many people like my brother who grew up with video games but were never hard-core about it, WoW is a pleasant distraction for an hour or three a week.

      I was once a hard-core gamer, but I got distracted by other shiny things along the way. Now I play WoW a bit, and it's fun. Hard-core me probably wouldn't have liked it much - there is too much chance, not enough reward for mad skillz. Casual me finds it to be just about right.
    • 1. WoW is still the #1 selling PC game every single month. So while you may be done with the "grind" there is tons of new players just begining. 2. Some people don't play on l33t mode like yourself. I was hardcore once upon a time in my MMORPG career, but I've learned that a truly good game is better enjoyed casually. You wouldn't understand what "fun" is if it bit you in the ass. 3. I know a lot of MMORPG players that got tired of WoW also. Good luck and have fun on the next game. Guess what in the
    • WoW is the only MMO that I can play on my Apple and I'm not buying 2 PCs (one for me, one for the wife) just so that we can move to another MMO
  • Can someone please explain the logic in that? I'm trying to remedy the thought of a Paladin and an undead questing side-by-side.
    • Re:Horde Paladin? (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Kesch ( 943326 ) on Monday August 28, 2006 @06:15PM (#15996651)
      It's ver simple really. The Blood Elves are a kickass race. When a kickass race wants divine power, they don't ask for it; they just take it. In the Blood Elves' case, they made a Naru(being of light) into their bitch and their paladins tap into divine energy siphoned from it.

      So blood elf paladins' holy power does not come with any EULA saying they have to have a +5 stick of morality up their ass.
      • by Gropo ( 445879 )
        So blood elf paladins' holy power does not come with any EULA saying they have to have a +5 stick of morality up their ass.
        Sorry, I don't think that's what Blizzard has in mind for "socketable items" ;D
    • Re:Horde Paladin? (Score:4, Interesting)

      by thesandtiger ( 819476 ) on Monday August 28, 2006 @06:37PM (#15996784)
      Aside from the "lore" explanations given by the other poster, putting paladin-like (they're "Blood Knights" dontcha know!) characters on the Horde side and shaman characters on the Alliance side is supposedly allowing the designers to make MUCH more interesting instance encounters. Since they no longer have to worry about factional differences, they can implement ideas they had that would require certain classes etc.
    • by brkello ( 642429 )
      The Horde is not evil, it is just different. Paladins are merely holy warriors with the ability to heal. Both sides have faith, they just view things differently. In WoW, there is good and evil. There are evil humans, undead, orcs, night elves, etc. etc. So apparantly there are some good undead...or more accurately, some undead that you will put up with so that you can achieve a similar goal.
      • Re:Horde Paladin? (Score:4, Interesting)

        by alexgieg ( 948359 ) <> on Monday August 28, 2006 @08:49PM (#15997346) Homepage
        I beg to differ. While the Horde isn't clearly Evil, it's nonetheless slightly "more evil" than the Alliance.

        Take the Orcs, for example: they allowed themselves to be near completely corrupted by demonic powers. They are now free from this corruption, sure, but in the end they lose in comparison to the Alliance, for the member races of the Alliance did not become corrupt, they fought against the Burning Legion's corruption so fiercely that they managed to avoid the corruption.

        Now, look at the Undead (Forsaken): they, like the Orcs, managed to become free from the corruption. But a lot of the evil influence from the Burning Legion remains, just look at the biological experiments they do.

        The new Blood Elves are addicted to magic, and their culture revolves around the idea that totaliarianism is A Good ThingTM. For instance, see how did they manage to get Paladins: they captured and enslaved a holy entity that would have given holy powers to them had they simply asked! But no, Blood Elves don't ask, Blood Elves take!

        And the Trolls were cannibals that only gave up on cannibalism because the Orcs told them that they wouldn't be allowed to join the Horde if they kept doing that.

        From the entire Horde, the only race that is clearly and plainly good are the Tauren. They're with the Horde due to their sense of duty, because the Orcs for having saved them, but that's it.

        Now, let's look at the Alliance:

        The villest thing the Night Elves did was to go around in a killing spree against Furbolgs, thinking all of them were corrupted and thus killing the minority that wasn't. They also built a new giant tree when their gods told them "no" (the shock! the horror!).

        The Gnomes messed up badly and ended poisoning their own capital after being invaded by trolls. Now they have to live with the Dwarves.

        The Dwarves dig big holes, what the Night Elves think violates "Mother Azeroth" (or something like that).

        The Draenei had bad luck and ended in a forced landing in Azeroth while fighting the Burning Legion.

        And the Humans, ah, the Humans! The most horrendous thing they did was not to pay the masons that rebuilt their capital, these masons now being pretty revolted with the nobles...

        So, all things considered, I don't think both are equal in the moral level. The Horde is clearly, at least, a "bad neighbour". Were not for the existence of the much more evil Burning Legion, in comparison to which the Horde is made of saints, and the moral difference between the Alliance and the Horde would be really undisputable.
        • Re: (Score:3, Funny)

          by ameoba ( 173803 )
          You're just saying that because you're Human.
        • by sadr ( 88903 )
          Except the masons are humans and conspiring to destroy humanity.

          The Scarlet Crusade is human, and they're evil.

          Most of the pirates (nice folks there) are humans.

          Oh yeah, the Barov family are great examples of human kind.

          Stratholm is a human city, right?

          Let's see, what else have I missed...
          • Well, the leader of the scourge is a human ex-paladin, that would be prince Arthen, who killed his own father. The necromancers that propped up the scourge were humans. The scarlet crusade willfully work for the burning legion just because they hate the undead.

            I also don't understand the knock against the orcs. They were dominated by a far superior enemy and used as pawns in the outlands. Finally thanks to Thrall they broke free and the PCs that you make in WoW are part of those "good" orcs. Yeah so the Dar
    • You should bear in mind the morality of Warcraft - the Horde aren't bad guys, the blood elves joined the Horde simply because Alliance paladins deemed them to be "tainted" and attempted to wipe them out in the good old ethnic cleansing genocide style. They only narrowly escaped to the Outlands. The Night Elves themselves just flipped a coin to decide whether to go with the Orcs or the Humans, but really they just wanted to kill everyone invading their territory.

      The "forsaken" are the victims of the scourg
    • I played a paladin as a tank for the first year+ of release. I quit after Blizzard came out and said "paladins should only tank in some 5-man content when the group can't find a warrior or a druid."

      Now it seems they've reneged on that promise and made some changes to boost tanking. Any paladins out there see improvements that would make it worth coming back? I'm looking for a role as a 5-10-man main tank and a raid off tank, with healing as a backup when off tanking isn't necessary.
  • Leaks (Score:5, Funny)

    by rackhamh ( 217889 ) on Monday August 28, 2006 @06:00PM (#15996566)
    leaks broke out over the internet

    Well, that explains it. I *thought* the Internet was running a bit slow today...
    • Re:Leaks (Score:5, Funny)

      by gsn ( 989808 ) on Monday August 28, 2006 @06:06PM (#15996607)
      Well you know the internet is not a dump truck. Its a series of tubes. And if you put an enormous amount of material... an enormous of material those tubes will be blocked up and if my staff send me an internet yesterday it'll get stuck in the tubes. But its much worse if the tubes are leaky. Your internet may never get to you if you have leaky tubes. If your tubes leak get them tied up.

      • If your tubes leak get them tied up.

        But what if you're a Catholic? Is there a rhythm method for leaking internet tubes?
  • Hasn't WoW been posting the new talent trees since a month or two ago? Well, I can't get to the page at work, so I don't know if they changed them. But I know I'd been looking forward to redoing my rogues talents because they were nerfing one of them. Points more valuable elsewhere.
    • Re:News (Score:4, Informative)

      by lewp ( 95638 ) on Monday August 28, 2006 @06:37PM (#15996783) Journal
      They've been systematically reviewing each class almost since the game came out. Most of the changes have been in the talent trees. Rogues had their review in the 1.12 patch, and their talents were changed.

      This is different. This is the addition of new, higher tier (up to 41 point required) talents to coincide with the release of the expansion and the increasing of the level cap to 70.
  • Is it just me (I have never played WoW), but are all those Icons for Mage talents stolen from WC3? I can recognize dozens of them from previous games.
    • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

      by moo083 ( 716213 )
      They are probably the same skills. I am a hunter in the game, and have a skill called True Shot Aura. I believe that skill does roughly the same thing and has the same icon. Its not like it was stolen anyways. Its the same company and the same universe and it came out about a year afterwards. Not a huge surprise and I don't see anything wrong with it.
    • Technically, not "stolen", since Blizz owns both.

      But yes, lots of the iconography is WC3 recycled. Unsurpisingly, since WoW is the sequel (in storyline, if not spirit) to WC3.

      Look close enough, and you'll find WC2 and even original Warcraft: Orcs and Humans graphics (or at least icons inspired by those from that game).

      Reuse at its finest. (Whether I am being ironic or sincere is left as an exercise for the reader.)

    • by racas ( 633636 )
      "ZOMG Blizzard made another game with Orcs in it!" World. Of. WARCRAFT. WTB [Clue] PST.
    • by GNUguy ( 55665 )
      "but are all those Icons for Mage talents stolen from WC3?"

      Uh, it is (W)orld (O) (W)arcraft, since it's part of the same game series, I don't think it is considered stealing.

    • are all those Icons for Mage talents stolen from WC3?

      I know for a fact WoW has been using WC3 icons since early beta.

      I'm sure it's been the same since day 1.
  • Why Slashdot...why? Blizzards servers can barely handle a normal days worth of traffic. But to post an article covering expansion information here of all places...that's just cruel.
  • Shamans have two different elementals to choose from while mage has to go DEEP into frost to get theirs. Sucks for fire mages, but Invis is a nice addition :). Warriors get a move to block the next attack of another party member... Genious! And yes, pallies spells are kinda lacking :/. Overall, it's pretty mediocer, but I'm sure Blizz will get the unbalancedness out before the final product (hopefully).
  • by shigelojoe ( 590080 ) on Monday August 28, 2006 @06:38PM (#15996785)
    From the Paladin talent calculator:

    "Avenger's Shield
    Hurls a Holy Shield at the enemy, dealing 270 to 330 Holy damage, dazing them then jumping to nearby enemies. Affects three targets."

    Why not just change the class name to Captain America while you're at it?
    • Beacuse some people appreciate the sublety of the joke, and don't
      need to have the joke hurled at them and two of their friends in
      order to get it.

      Wait. nevermind.
  • As typical, every class thinks every other class got a better deal, but the Pallies get to mean it ;)

    While that was said in jest, I would actually say that Paladin's didn't get a raw deal this time. Not only can we be viable tanks, but also a lot of the improvments focus on Paldins being in the thick of things, going melee on mobs, instead of standing in the back and healing. That's a definite improvement in my book.
  • It's Tuesday. What a day to pick to run a WoW story with a link to the website. It always gets slammed by players on Tuesday as it is, looking for the updated PvP rankings and generally satisfying their addiction on the forums during the weekly downtime. On top of that, a slashdotting. Better hope Nef doesn't pay you a visit.

This process can check if this value is zero, and if it is, it does something child-like. -- Forbes Burkowski, CS 454, University of Washington