Microsoft Freon 429
Veramocor writes "MSNBC.com has an article posted from the WSJ about MS's new plan for living room domination, codenamed Freon. Freon will be capable of 'playing games but also offering television capabilities, such as pausing live TV and recording shows onto a computer hard drive.' The article then goes on to explain future potential business plans for XBox incarnations. The system does seem to have some great advantages. I must question their naming question however, we all know what a disaster the actual chemical Freon was. Here's to hoping, Cheers!" We mentioned the Xbox's planned evolution the other day, too, but without the fancy codename.
Feature Creep (Score:3, Funny)
And I thought they were talking about Windows!
Re:Feature Creep (Score:2, Insightful)
Freon? (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Freon? (Score:3, Funny)
I draw the line at having them run my liquor cabinent, though. That's one thing I never want to lock up.
Re:Freon? (Score:4, Funny)
Don't you hate the EULA sticker saying "By opening this refrigerator door you
Re:Freon? (Score:2, Insightful)
Freon Banned [wtn.org]
Microsoft not just content with control they need to destroy the whole freezin planet as well.
Re:Freon? (Score:2)
GNU games console (Score:3, Insightful)
It wouldn't have to be very high-powered either, I would suggest an 68030 as the main CPU, with two 68000's one each as a sound and graphics processor - that's more processing power than is in a lot of the games in your local arcade, and perfectly adequate for the sort of games that most hackers like to play, (I.E. RPGs, beat-em-ups, shoot-em-ups, etc).
Just another of my excellent ideas
once again.... (Score:2, Troll)
Re:once again.... (Score:2)
Box for the cable/tivo. TV. Game Console. Computer. I like that they are seperate. I think the rest of the worl likes that they are seperate. Didn't they learn from their original webtv or what ever the heck it was called abortion?
I know, there is POTENTIALLY a huge market for an all inclusive product. Problem is, we don't want it. And those of us that do, well, they are a small minority I believe. Maybe in another generation or two, this would be feasible.
I can see it now, 50 years from now:
"Dude, what's that?"
"It's a Tivo. It only records and stores "live" *snicker* tv."
"Man, those poor bastards...good thing I have my Linux 5750 Access port."
"Yeah. Let's just hope the MAN doesn't get the free software Anti-DRM repealed."
"Word*."
*I am sure "word" will be replaced with something much cooler. Us old farts (well, by then anyway, won't know cool if it smackes us and takes our money.
We're not the target market (Score:2, Insightful)
Do you realize what a major pain in the ass it would be to hook up all those separate devices for your average person who can't even figure out how to program their VCR's clock? *THAT* will stop the masses from buying some (or all) of those components, not the cost. Read: loads of average people who WANT to spend their cash on these add-ons, but won't because the entry knowledge is simply too much for them to bother learning.
This is where the "do everything" boxes come in. All you have to do is plug in perhaps 4 wires, all color-coded, and *viola*! Instant home entertainment center with all the bells and whistles.
Now your average
For every
They can't dominate me (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:They can't dominate me (Score:4, Funny)
Then you can use it as a combination coffee table and space heater. Now that's utility!
Backwards compatability? (Score:2, Insightful)
Do they now have to cough up another $500 for a X-Tivo just so they can play any new games?
Releasing new box after new box, and cutting off your established user base isn't going to win this system any fans...
At least an old pc can still play new games, albeit at lower resolutions, will the old x-box play new games, or will they handicap the new games so they aren't as impressive on the new box?
Re:Backwards compatability? (Score:2, Interesting)
1. what you describe would be forward compatibility not backward (XBox playing XBox2 games which isn't going to happen)
2. one of my biggest peeves with windows is lack of compatibility for games across versions. my daughter has something like a hundred PC games (bought!) that were written for various versions of DX and windows and all of which show an amazing lack of compatibility with the newer versions of windows. Win2K,WinME don't work -most- of the time. WinXP is a bit better (in compatibility mode). so I have to basically maintain an extra machine to play (Win98) to play these games. let's not even go on to my pile of DOS games. the PC is no better.
3. sony has set a nice example with PS2 compatibility with PSX games. I would be surprised if the next version of XBox didn't do the same thing.
"Releasing new box after new box, and cutting off your established user base isn't going to win this system any fans..."
uhh.. hello? this is the way the console market has -always- worked. and it -has- won them new fans, year after year. I don't hear much complaining that the gamecube doesn't play NES games.
Re:Backwards compatability? (Score:2)
Re:Backwards compatability? (Score:2)
They had to cough up another $100 for Win98, and then another for WinMe and then another for XP, so they can use new software.
They released OS after OS cutting off their user base for years, and now they're the biggest company in the world. We've heard this all before. And it worked beautifully the first time. But this time there is an alternative. [playstation.com]
I think that M$ has Missed the Point (Score:5, Interesting)
one: cheap
two: uniform hardware (or as close to it as possible)
three: a long upgrade cycle (about 5 years)
four: sell hardware at a loss or paper thin margins to make money back on software
My guess is that this will turn out to be the jack of all trades, but master of none. If they sell this thing cheap enough to be a successful console, then they'll lose money for every set top boxer. If they sell it at a respectable profit, it won't be a successful console. Granted, they could simply make it X-Box compatible, but then anyone willing to spring for a set top will probably buy them separately to get better features, or taylor their setup to their own needs. Not to mention the households like mine that have a dedicated gaming TV (nothing spectacular, really) so that other people can watch movies et al whilst the gamers game.
BlackGriffen
Re:I think that M$ has Missed the Point (Score:2, Insightful)
Nice try microsoft, but this is not going to work...
Re:I think that M$ has Missed the Point (Score:2)
Nice try microsoft, but this is not going to work...
Business 101: Corporations have two basic resources: capital, and management attention. Corporate strategy is the decision making process that allocates these in ways that fulfill the company's objectives (which may be as nebulously defined as "enhance shareholder value"). Anything a company wants or wants to do can usually be acquired or fulfilled using these two resources. It's wrong to assume that Microsoft not owning a fab right now will make much difference in the long term.
Also, there's something that savvy players in professional services (law, consulting, investment banking, etc) have known for a long time: unless you really want the brand, it's often not worth buying another company, since all the assets are intellectual. It's much cheaper to simply poach the key players and selectively encourage defections from their staff to yours. The same is true in high tech, witness Microsoft's strategy aagainst Borland. If Microsoft want to get people (all business is people, really) they can look to Sony or to Sony's rivals.
The future is still very much in play.
Re:I think that M$ has Missed the Point (Score:2)
Taiwan doesn't have slave labor camps. Taiwan is (compared to most Asian countries) free and democratic. If they want slave labor, they've got to get an agent in Hong Kong to contract to get the work done on the mainland.
Re:I think that M$ has Missed the Point (Score:2)
X-Box more costly cuz of Windows (RETCH) (Score:3, Interesting)
Oh cry me a river. Like Microsoft is losing money because of all the billions they're pouring into the miraculous X-Box Bastardized Windows Operating System. Sure, maybe the hard disk is a lotta coin, but the cost of putting Windows on a console? Catastrophic.
Re:X-Box more costly cuz of Windows (RETCH) (Score:2)
I find your remark very much to the point. I can't understand how Microsoft is loosing money on each console because of Windows... Surely this is a one off R&D cost. Unless Microsoft (the OS division) is charging the M$ fee for each console sold. That would really be a funny one, but I doubt it works like that...
Re:X-Box more costly cuz of Windows (RETCH) (Score:2)
Microsoft may not be actually writing itself a cheque, but this could be the start of some great 'creative' accounting, if put in the right (wrong) hands.
"But Judge, we're LOSING money. Protect us from those nasty competitors!!"
Re:X-Box more costly cuz of Windows (RETCH) (Score:2)
Ummm Maybe the cost is related to the fact that running Windows requires more memory and a hard drive which runs the costs up more than the competition.
Re:X-Box more costly cuz of Windows (RETCH) (Score:2)
I don't think the special version of Windows that comes with the XBox does necessarily, for example it doesn't have virtual memory support. It could probably be run from firmware like CE does. As far as I know, the OS actually comes on the game disk.
Patents (Score:2, Interesting)
Oh wait....thats right....
OurCourtSystem: Money=Influence Microsoft=Money, therefore Microsoft=Influence. Patents and other such laws no longer apply!
Anyways...seriously...does TiVo (or someone) have this patented?
Re:Patents (Score:2)
Microsoft has already have a TiVo like system, it's called the Ultimate TV [ultimatetv.com].
So until next time, please don't start the trolling and stupid MS bashing until you get all the facts straight
Possible MS Project Names (Score:3, Funny)
Microsoft is running out of destructive chemicals/materials to use as product codenames.
Here are some suggestions so they can continue to innovate:
Plutonium - the "most powerful" platform
Asbestos - Microsoft's new embedded platform
Acrylamide - for next generation restaurant machinery
Lead Paint Chips - top-secret, pervasive computing initiative
Another idea (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Possible MS Project Names (Score:2)
How about Ununoctium? Which probably is chemically inert.
Microsoft strong point: STABILITY (Score:2)
(Hassium has a 2.0ms half-life).
Re:Possible MS Project Names - bad chemicals (Score:3, Funny)
This remote agent is downloaded into your computer overnight by Microsoft. It works behind the scenes in your computer to help keep it secure. (against you, the enemy) While you're using your computer, Agent Orange is hard at work maintaining the integrity and security of your system.
Microsoft Agent Orange can also notify you of special offers that you might be interested in. Such as how to increase the length of your... oh wait.
Lies, all lies (Score:2)
funny names (Score:5, Insightful)
I think that some of the marketing/PR people of MS have been sick / on holidays / away these times.
Palladium : was originally the name of the statue of Pallas-Athenas, which was supposed to protect the city of Troie. Which was later invaded by greeks which used a subterfuge which will be known for centuries as trojan horses.
Freon : according to this web page [about.com], apart from evident utility in refigerators, "Only decades later did people realize that such chlorofluorocarbons endangered the ozone layer of the entire planet." and, even worse for MS : "The trade name Freon® is a registered trademark belonging to E.I. du Pont de Nemours & Company (DuPont)."
Re:funny names (Score:5, Interesting)
I definitely think that it's a subtle jab at clueless leaders, that the marketing types are playing jokes on the computer geeks that supposedly run the place.
They were probably having trouble keeping a straight face as they suggested Freon. "Oh yeah, it'll connotate 'Free' and 'on'! (snicker) Um, I gotta go to another meeting! (burst of laughter as the door closes)"
Re:funny names (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:funny names (Score:4, Funny)
Re:funny names (Score:2)
Together it made Windows CE ME NT, or Windows CEMENT.
Marketing sabotage? (Score:2)
OTOH, maybe MS has a large secret slushfund to hire people to post utterly over-the-top pro-Linux messages and make the real Linuxers look like idiots. And to write Linux how-to's that take you through a dozen typed commands when most distros have a simple GUI program to do the same thing in 3 mouse clicks.
Re:funny names (Score:2)
The OfficeXP commercial featured the start of the song "Lunatic Fringe" by Red Rider. I guess they were attempting to directly address their customers who are willing to buy the same product over again.
Re: funny names (Score:3, Insightful)
> Palladium : was originally the name of the statue of Pallas-Athenas, which was supposed to protect the city of Troie. Which was later invaded by greeks which used a subterfuge which will be known for centuries as trojan horses.
Funnier yet when you find out that some people think the Palladium was actually a gigantic dildo.
No, stop, don't mod this up as 'funny' - I'm serious.
Re:funny names (Score:2)
This just in... (Score:2, Insightful)
Word on the street - Nike to make new shoe; increases running speed!
Kodak to make picutes more sentimental! Kodak moments to increase!
Lexus is rumored to make an expensive-looking car, and charge a lot of money for it!
What Linux (as a community) REALLY needs to do is create a sexy commercial featuring a scantily-clad Britney Spears doing an 'apt-get install' with wild camera angles and dance music. I'm thinking directed by Hype Williams, fish-eyed lens and all. Because we all know that advertising is the only REAL way to increase market share...or something.
Oh shit! The commercial will also have to feature this guy:
http://www.thelinuxpimp.com/
Trust me, no matter how monopolistic M$ will try to be (or is), teenagers will flock to a sexy OS.
Hmmm...so this is a bit off-topic. The point is, new M$ products don't excite me or qualify as news. Unlike a sexy linux/tux commercial. Did I say sexy? 'Cause I meant sexy. As in sex. Sexy.
"Uh, how about no, ok Scott?" -Dr. Evil
Re:This just in... (Score:2)
it not free-on at all (Score:3, Funny)
Some marketing genius says: well lets attack the negative and code name it Freon.
another marketing genius says: but isn't freon an unpopular gas?
the first marketing genius: But people will think that it is FREE ON, did you see what I did there? Did you see that?
second genius:Hey, the number one marketing word is FREE. You are a genius.
first genius (smug mode on): Hey, I'm living proof that Micro$oft recruit from the top.
toxicology (Score:2)
Step carefully... (Score:5, Insightful)
It wasn't until the NES rose out of the console market's ashes did things kick back in gear. One thing that was great about the NES was it was stable and long lived. The same goes for the next market leader, Playstation.
Microsoft could very well risk killing the entire console market if it introduces too much confusion and churn into it. If they make consoles as complicated as PCs, a lot of buyers may just be turned off. Think of all the people, right down to the poorest you know, that have a console but no computer in their house.
Re:Step carefully... (Score:2)
Damn the English language at times...
By stable, I meant, consistent and long lived. The Atari 2600 came out in 1976 and was king for several years. The NES was the #1 console for ages as well. Having an unfragmented console market back then meant that all of your friends had the same system and you could haul your carts around, share, play together, etc...
I just don't think the market can support too many consoles. My closet is full of short-lived failed consoles, like my 3DO, Dreamcast, and N64.
Looks to me like PS2 is the winner this round. Just ask any kid who is current-generation consoleless what console they want.
Compatibility advantage... PS2??? (Score:2)
PS2 - Need I say more?
The Future, Near and Far (Score:2)
I think the idea of replacing the TV with the X-Box is a really good one for a lot of obvious reasons, but unless they provide a CD or DVD burner, there's no way I'd toss my VCR. You simply want to archive stuff (favorite episodes and such), and if you've got an X-Box hard drive full of MP3's or whatever, you're not going to want to go around deleting things prematurely. If they make it in to a full TiVO-like service and provide a really huge hard drive (and a burner too!) they would have a potentially killer product on their hands.
I think what'll be really interesting is to see whose online gaming model will play out better. Sony's model is more anarchic, while Microsoft's is better planned and more centralized. Kind of like the difference between Id and Blizzard. In my experience, the random Quake server is a hell of a lot better than a Battle.net game of Starcraft, but we'll see if this will extend to console-based online gaming.
I'm betting that the online gaming thing won't become critical at least until the PS3 hits. It's pretty much a fringe thing right now, but I have no doubt that it'll become much more important once the console makers really get their acts together. Still, I always think of console gaming as being a lot more social than computer gaming, with a bunch of people clustered around the TV playing Smash Bros or Goldeneye to be more likely than a bunch of people clustered around a hub playing Quake on their own monitors. Because of this, I'm betting less people will feel the need to hit the network to play games when they can just call a few friends to come over and play.
Munching tacos and swilling soda while beating your friends to pulp is a lot more fun when they're right there next to you doing it too.
we all know what a disaster Freon was... try again (Score:5, Interesting)
I remember an anecdote about a du Pont employee demonstrating the safety of the chemical by inhaling a good breath of Freon and blowing it out to extinguish a candle, demonstrating that it was both non-toxic and not explosive. Try that with ammonia!
Even if it may have had an impact on the ozone layer, there's more than just the safety component of the refrigerant chemical to consider. Where would food safety and preservation be without refrigeration? Without refrigeration, say hello to E. Coli and friends. Get used to salt-curing, preservatives, and freeze drying (yum). And then say goodbye to fresh seafood, out-of-season produce, frozen pizza, and a lot of the food that we eat.
Here's an article about the history of Freon [about.com] and another about the history of the refrigerator [about.com]. (Oops, it wasn't just a du Pont employee who did the demo, it was the actual inventor... sounds like a lot of technology demos.)
Re:we all know what a disaster Freon was... try ag (Score:4, Interesting)
It definitely does matter. Freon isn't just a gas in a refrigerator; it liquefies when it is compressed and gives up heat to the outside air, then evaporates _quickly_ when the pressure is released in the cooling coils. This takes the right variation of the boiling point with pressure. To get just the right physical characteristics in Freon, they tried substituting various numbers of flourine and chlorine atoms for hydrogen atoms in hydrocarbons. And as a bonus, it turns out that Freon is non-poisonous, non-corrosive, and coexists quite well with compressor lubricants.
Nothing else works quite as well. Water and alcohol have too high boiling points (and might be bad for the pipes and bearings too). CO2 requires a quite high pressure to liquefy. Ammonia is as toxic as cyanide. R134a (similar to Freon but with only carbon, hydrogen, and flourine atoms) is not quite as good at lubricating or at refrigerating.
By the way, refrigeration was responsible for only a tiny percentage of the chloroflourocarbons released into the environment. Refrigerators that leak coolant are defective! Spray cans were another tiny percentage. Most of the release was industrial cleaning systems - Freon and similar substances being great solvents that dry quickly, and pose no danger to the workers as long as there's enough ventilation to keep oxygen in the room. Generally these systems would try to recycle the Freon, but it kept leaking out around both ends of the conveyor belt.
Re:we all know what a disaster Freon was... try ag (Score:3, Informative)
Re:we all know what a disaster Freon was... try ag (Score:2, Interesting)
I heard a story on Freon in that if you check it out. The patent is expiring, or has expired. The company owning the patent (Dupont?) for fear of losing liscensing revenue has invented a new refrigerant and lobbied alongside the Greenie Weenies to outlaw Freon.
Follow the $'s dummy.
Not totally... (Score:2)
Solution 1: Get a new condenser from a newer car. Best if done at the same time as the retrofit. They run $150-200.
Solution 2: The cheap one, and one I plan on implementing soon. (My A/C is borderline - It cools, but it sometimes takes a while, as opposed to my heat which comes up within a minute or two) Solution 2 is to install an auxiliary fan in front of the condenser that is hooked to the A/C clutch circuit. This will provide additional cooling capacity. Some cars need it more than others - I know of a guy with a Toyota minivan - It wouldn't cool down at all until it was moving 50+ until the owner installed a fan. My Dodge Spirit is borderline, but cools whether standing or moving - Because the main radiator fan is already set to turn on full-time whenever the A/C is turned on. (As opposed to only under certain speed/temp conditions)
It would be great if.......... (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:It would be great if.......... (Score:2)
xbox as VCR (Score:2, Funny)
Dad: boy don't touch my little Freon tonite
Son: (WTF...)
Dad: I've scheduled recording of Britney show
Son:
Will it be still sold at loss? (Score:3, Interesting)
needs a different name. (Score:2)
How about:
CFC
Ozone destroyer
Aerosol
cancer box?
Defender of capitalism against the demon hordes of cancerous GPL software?
F-box
money-pit
DRM testbed
We Control Your TV Set
Tivo+
What were we making again?
I'm sure someone will be able to come up with more names.
Are they nuts?! (Score:5, Insightful)
Why in the world would anyone buy an xbox now? We now know it's going to be replaced with "something much much better" in a little while.
Now instead of making money selling xbox's and xbox games, everyone will just hold on to their cash and wait for Freon(tm).
In the meantime xbox-exclusive game makers will bleed red, and drop support for the xbox.. when Freon actually makes it out the door, it'll have no games because the game makers aren't going to invest the time and money on a product that already burned them once.
Freon will kill all of MS's hopes in the console market. And you can bookmark me on that.
Re:Are they nuts?! (Score:2)
Re:Are they nuts?! (Score:2)
Re:Are they nuts?! (Score:2)
In any event, the point is that an old console is still selling well despite their being better consoles out there, which is the point I was trying to make.
Re:Are they nuts?! (Score:2)
Re:Are they nuts?! (Score:2)
Go Microsoft !
X-Box and Freon will run the same games! (Score:2)
I doubt it they will make a $500 console and expect people to make games only for that console. This is never going to work!!!
Re:Are they nuts?! (Score:2, Interesting)
I've got a PS2 and I think its the better machine, but admittedly I am partial to Sony products, I know they have a larger market share on game titles, and also I haven't been exposed to playing the Xbox. I'm not an MS junkie and Kudos to anyone who can do anything better... but really, whats the point in always expecting or wanting them to fail. I for one would rather see them produce better products
Re:Are they nuts?! (Score:2)
This is no different than buying hardware: There will always be something better. Why do people buy the latest and greatest hardware when they will surely be able to get better hardware for the same price (or a substantial price reduction on the same hardware) a few months?
Logic, anyone?
Seems obvious to me (Score:2, Insightful)
Well, simply put, they have to. Microsoft is a huge company, used to churning out huge profits. That was all fine and dandy as long as they could continue to create (or copy, incoporate, etc) new operating systems and software packages that people would continually purchase on a somewhat regular basis (every software/hardware cycle). The problem that they seem to be facing over the past few years is that NO ONE wants to upgrade their systems anymore. Their software, a huge part of their profits, has reached a point where users are quite happy (i know, how sad to be happy with their products) with them. SO, no matter how many rebates or promotions they offer, there are still a lot of computers out their running windows 2000 and even 98 and NT4. Why? Cause the new features that office XP has are worthless to many people.
So, how does this all tie in? Microsoft needs to find a new way to generate continual profits. It can't push people into buying software upgrades as they could in years past. The only way they will be able to sustain this money influx is to expand to new markets (video games, TV, various website services) as well as try and charge monthly costs for their OS (i believe that they are still trying to do so).
So, stop being suprised about all of this. It's gonna happen. And if you don't like it, don't buy their products/services. They currently don't have dominance in these other markets, and they won't as long as people don't buy all of their crap.
Recorded BSOD (Score:3, Funny)
Does this mean that I will get three hours of recorded Blue screen of Death on my hard disk?
The ironic thing about Freon (Score:2, Informative)
See, the patents that DuPont held to the Freon compound expired in 1992... the same year the UN adopted a treaty banning the use of CFC-based refrigerants [greencity.com] with support from DuPont and a lot of enviro-hype. The approved refrigerant, HFC-134a, is less efficient, highly toxic, and protected by exclusive patents owned by DuPont.
It's a bit like if Microsoft somehow got a law passed declaring Windows 98 illegal, and requiring all users to upgrade to Windows XP, replete with customs agents stopping smugglers of legitimate, but now contraband, Windows 98 copies at the border.
Believe me guys, MS is just small-time evil. Quasi-evil. Not evil enough.
Re:The best part... (Score:2)
It's a very real threat, ask the people down under.
weak name (Score:2, Funny)
Freon seems much more passive than the sgi names. but it is for couch-potatoes after all..
One interesting point from the article.. (Score:2)
Anyway, the article is quite a good overview of the current console scene. I can't help but wonder, however, if Microsoft's "go it alone" strategy is the best choice, or whether they'd be better off licensing gaming technology [eetimes.com] to other manufacturers as they are planning for WMV (see link). It would reduce financial risk to them, mirrors their current strategy for OS dominance in the personal computer industry, and Nintendo has started to do this with its GameCube (Panasonic DVD/Gamecube combo). Or would this wind up suffering the same fate as the Nuon chipset [everything2.com]?
MS launching probing attacks into a new sector (Score:2, Interesting)
It seems clear that there is a huge marketplace in the home entertainment / home management space. The traditional PC / laptop and Office type apps aren't going to take this area by storm so some new thinking is needed.
First off it isn't clear what will turn out to be the paradigm shifter. New ways to run e-mail? Video interaction with chat groups over broadband? New games? Management of CD music centre? TiVo style access to TV content? Automating household security and energy management?
Any or all of these could be the key, but maybe something not on this list at all. The big thing for MS is to leverage current strengths to absolutely dominate the space they target.
From this point of view they need to establish a new common platform for H/W, S/W and comms under MS control.
Xbox offers
* A foothold in the livingroom via a games console, with a cashflow attached
* Testing out of the control technologies that will be needed to enforce a monopoly:
* Xbox architecture for coupling the OS and hardware so that only controlled, approved apps can run
* The chance to test out DRM and distribution apps (at least in the next Xbox release)
* MS mediation of interactive services, e-mail home shopping etc that are currently set top box based
* A viable platform for whatever does turn out to be the killer app/service in the home
A lot of people would love to see these kind of services up and running, but lack the muscle to do it on their own. If MS can ship enough Xbox class machines they should be able to attract third parties to deliver whats necessary (within MS rules of course)
Whatever happens I'm sure that Xbox and derivatives will not be money down the drain for MS
x-box tv advertising? (Score:2)
What I don't understand is - Microsoft say they are investing a few billion on the X-Box over the next few years - but where are the ads? Maybe it's different in the USA, but in the parts of Europe I frequent I've seen hardly any X-Box advertising recently. There was a burst of TV ads at the launch, but now virtually nothing.
I'll admit to not being as brilliant a businessman as Bill Gates, but I can't help thinking that spending a bit more on regular and compelling TV advertising might be a better idea than adding more functionality to the X-Box hardware.
What's happening with console advertising in other parts of the world?
DRM? (Score:2)
Sure... but only if the production company says you can.
Given their plans for "Palladium" and the EULA for the WMP service pack, does anyone think this thing isn't gonna be chock full o' DRM?
MS-NBC's Impartial Reporting (Score:2, Interesting)
combo-x-box? (Score:2, Insightful)
Probably not.
Pointless.
Where have I heard this before? (Score:4, Insightful)
So much for other companies trying to raise funding to develop products in this market.
Oft-observed MS behavior:
Ooooooh, I just can't wait... (Score:2, Troll)
Disaster (Score:4, Insightful)
Big assumption there cuz I don't know about any disaster. I do know that Freon had some very important uses in refrigeration and electronics which saved lives and improved the quality of life for millions.
How about just reporting the news without the emotional enviromental bullshit panic phrases. Thanks.
Re:Disaster (Score:2, Interesting)
So what does dupont do? Simple, tell everyone that Freon will destroy the world, get it banned and introduce a replacement. Voila, they have a safe monopoly again.
Re:Disaster (Score:2)
..and all along it was Dupont marketing protecting their monopoly... I feel so foolish. Thank you for letting me see the light.
If it did Quicken and a handful of other apps ... (Score:2)
Then Microsoft would have a seller! I've written on this before. [matrixlist.com]
I don't know why Microsoft doesn't take advantage of its PC dependence and use that to keep them on the Windows platform. I mean, if you've got the capabilities in the unit, why not exploit them as much as you can? Especially in a set top unit that would be easier to maintain than a PC, but will do everything that 50% of what homes need?
Sure, there are issues with the screen display, but when it comes to balancing your checkbook, checking your on-line porforlio, writing simple letters, and a few other details that a good 50% of homes use, it's sufficient. Most of us /.'ers will still have a PC, but most home users aren't as savvy. A set-top box would be much better, since the PC is far too much more them. They just want gaming, TV recording, Internet browsing, checkbook balancing, investment tracking and writing letters -- nothing more. Heck, if it ran Quicken, I'd probably buy it (a 100% Linux user, both at work and home, for the last 4 years!).
I don't know why I'm the only one that seems to see this? I also don't know why Nokia or some other company in the TV Linux Alliance [tvlinuxalliance.org] hasn't been able to team up with AT&T, the regional Bells, etc... to offer such a Linux-based "set-top box" for their cable (or, limitedly, DSL) subscribers yet. I've heard rumors, but nothing solid yet. If Microsoft wants to "take over," it should make a move on this. But, instead, it looks like they'll keep doing the "minimum required" combined with "dumping" [matrixlist.com] and losing to other vendors again and again and again at a huge loss. And they probably won't wake up until someone else has a 50% marketshare with one of these devices either.
WebTV rebates? (Score:2)
Is it upgrade-able? (Score:2)
It would be cool to offer a way to carry your movies(and games) to friend's house and play them.
FYI: Xbox uses a modified USB port for all external devices. Thus a USB device could be used as a travel device.
Sounds like DaveDina (Score:2)
Is this the "plan of the week" (Score:2)
quality of this discussion (Score:2)
Um, what about patents? (Score:3, Interesting)
I think its appropriate. (Score:3, Funny)
Once you have Freon, it costs a lot of money to dispose of it.
Freon: How appropriate... (Score:3, Interesting)
...to code name this project. It'll have the same chilling effect that all of Microsoft's other product plan announcements tend to have on competitors. Who's going to get VC funding for a living room computing product now? Funny, though, with all of Microsoft's talk about digital ecosystems that they'd name a project after a chemical that's done a good job of destroying part of the most important ecosystem.
Even though it'll probably be a piece of crap, it'll have no competition. No doubt that it'll have more features than any family will ever use, cost too much, and be more complex than anything else people have ever put in their living room. (I'm reminded of that old Apple commercial with the two office managers tinkering with the PC to make it easier to use. ``Honey, you done fiddling with that thing yet? I wanna watch my soaps.'') But... I'm betting that the clock function won't flash ``12:00'' and, as a result of that, Bill Gates will be hailed as a genius.
Is Freon going to improve the quality of what I watch on my TV? Hmm? Ah... didn't think so.
Microsoft and the media conglomerates (Score:3, Insightful)
Microsoft has always come down heavily in favor of aggressively protecting copyrighted material. They support the media giants in their efforts to make copy-proof one-time use media. They are talking about integrating code checking (intellectual property validation by another name) into future OS releases.
They've always taken this stance because first and foremost, they're a software company. But now they're moving into hardware. Companies like Dell and Apple, which have been up in arms about the media conglomerates' strong-arm tactics, have a vested interest in standing up for fair-use rights as computers become more tightly integrated with media creation and playback.
So far Microsoft has skirted the issue with ReplayTV, but if they try to take TV integration to the next level, they'll run smack-dab into the media giants.
Of course, based on their history, MS is likely to make deals with the media giants that restrict fair use by creating micropayment schemes or some other method of tracking and billing users for the wonderful things they're doing with the TV/game box.
This would alienate users in droves, especially when there are plenty of other competitors out there who aren't primarily software companies. Of course, MS could just wait for the hardware companies to do all the hard work of fighting the intellectual property battles with the media industry. Then they could step in after the dust clears, and reap the benefits without exposing themselves.
Whatever happens, Microsoft is literally getting so big and diversified that some of its products are bound to compete with each other in significant ways. I wonder, can Bill, as clever as he is, continue to advance Microsoft on all fronts without at some point having to scale back his ambitions?
Re:what about the environment? (Score:4, Funny)
It'll contain CRC's and eat up your freedom to choose?
.haeger
Re:Has it occured to anyone.... (Score:2)
I read it as them implying that the product is cool.
Cheers,
Ian
Re:Wont work, here's why. (Score:4, Insightful)
I wouldn't think this is a huge obstacle. Really. If the thing has a hard drive then updating is a issue unless it were something major. Um, I use my XBox (cue flaming) as my primary (read: only) DVD player and i have to ask why is it hype? Kind of a logical step if you ask me. Your console plays DVD games, why not movies in the same format. Damn useful if you ask me. Which you didn't. But if you did...
"So what happens if just one of the 3 components breaks?"
First, what 3 components are you talking about? The DVD, HD and..? Motherboard? But even without knowing what those components are, the answer is simple- Fix/buy a new one or do without. The more capabilities a unit has, the easier it is to stop up the plumbing, naturally. It goes with the territory of any technology and it's something you have to live with. Other technologies have this inherent problem yet they thrive. Go figure.
"Microsofts track record for defects with the XBox"
Huh. Source please. Link it. The only ones I know of was a small batch of the consoles were scratching disks in Japan and I had my friend mention one overheating as a display model, but that's all I've heard, and since I own one, I like to think I listen for that sort of news. And as much as I love the PS1 I have to mention that it had it's share of issues depite it's popularity, namely the laser assembly burning out or jamming prematurally (discounting hot-swapping of import CDs). I know
"because they didn't want a hunk of plastic that didn't work after 2 years"
If it's anything close to an Xbox, the damn thing is as close to a computer as it'll get. And unlike a computer, it doesn't nessisarily need to be at the cutting edge of technology. I don't see us moving away from DVDs anytime soon. Will TV be changing that rapidly to make this obsolete in 2 years? What, exactly, will make this hardware obsolete? I agree that ll technology has a finite shelf life, but PVR? As long as you can update the software, technology like this will have a long lifespan.
Maybe it won't work, but your "why" needs a few less holes.