Comparison of Working at the 3 Big Search Giants

castironwok writes "Finally, everything you've ever wanted to know about being an employee at Google, Microsoft, and Yahoo. Tastyresearch describes his (or her) past few years interning and working at the three companies. Things I didn't know from before: Bill Gates wears old shoes, Google's internal security watches you like a hawk, the office styles of each company, and how to fill your suitcase with Google T-shirts. He calls the few select companies the 'prestigious internship circle', noting 'once you have worked at one, it's a lot easier to get into another'."

big three?

Microsoft? There are people who use MSN for searching? Name two.

Re:big three?

Remember that MSN.com is the second most visited website. This will draw some search traffic.

Here's the breakdown:

Google - 43.7%
Yahoo - 28.8%
MSN - 12.8%

http://seo.zunch.com/search_engine_usage_statistic s.htm [zunch.com]

While MSN trails Yahoo and Google, it's still in the top three. Other websites rank the engines in the same order, but the percentages slightly vary.

Re:big three?

While we're throwing out percentages, my biggest surprise reading the article was something I could have just looked up: the market cap of google is about 50% that of microsoft, and over 300% that of yahoo! It amazes me that within just a few years, an ad-sponsored website (yes, that's all google is) could reach half of Microsoft's size!

Re:big three?

Actually, Google isn't just one ad-sponsored website; it's a million ad-sponsored websites. Half the internet uses Adsense.

Re:big three?

Don't make the mistake of equating market capitalization to "size."

Google has $10 billion in assets, $6 billion in revenues and 10,000 employees. Yahoo! has $10 billion in assets, $5 billion in revenues and 11,000 employees. Microsoft, on the other hand, has $70 billion in assets, $44 billion in revenues, and 71,000 employees.

Google's market capitalization means that overall, the market has spent $144 billion in cash in order to own Google's $10 billion in assets. The market believes that somehow, it will make future profits with a current value over $134 billion.

To do this, Google would either have to start paying dividends within a few years, and pay out an amount well in excess of the company's total assets every year for 20+ years; or it would have to see revenue growth such that the company turns a profit 5 or 10 times better than the best Microsoft has ever done.

None of these scenarios are remotely plausible; the market has clearly overvalued Google. As such, the market cap figure is not very useful for valuation or market-strategic purposes.

-Graham

Re:big three?

There are people who use MSN for searching? Name two.

Lincoln 6 Echo and Jordan 2 Delta in the movie "The Island". Oh, you meant REAL people? Sorry...

Re:big three?

Guy at my $ORKPLACE has MSN set as his homepage. Whenever he needs to browse a website, he opens IE, types "google" into the MSN search box and hits ENTER. Once at Google, he searches for whatever it is he is looking for.

Re:big three?

Guy at my $ORKPLACE has MSN set as his homepage. Whenever he needs to browse a website, he opens IE, types "google" into the MSN search box and hits ENTER. Once at Google, he searches for whatever it is he is looking for.

This is exactly like sitting in a Yugo as it is dropped straight down into a Mustang convertable, and then busting out the windshield of the Yugo so you can shift.

Interesting random fact

Yahoo prefers one 24" monitor compared to the dual setup at Microsoft and Goolgle(19" and 20" respectively) Considering that most 24" LCDs cost at least as much if not more than a pair of smaller ones, I wonder why they opted for less screen real estate(also interesting to me since I am in the market to upgrade displays and am debating between the two setups as well)

Re:Interesting random fact

It needs less video card ram and power the drive one screen then it takes to drive 2 also SLI and cross fire only work with one.

Re:Interesting random fact

Considering that most 24" LCDs cost at least as much if not more than a pair of smaller ones, I wonder why they opted for less screen real estate

That is odd. At work we upgraded to dual 19" LCDs a few months ago and I can say there is a huge difference. I *feel* more productive because I spend less time bouncing between windows. I find it especially useful when coding, be it web or applications. You can have your code full on one screen, then the resulting webpage or documentation on the other. I think that a third monitor would be even better, having three full screens for different parts of a project. With one huge monitor you can't arrange windows as easily as you can with smaller monitors where you can just maximize the two or three windows you are working with. (An aside: if you have multiple monitors on Windows, you must try Ultramon [realtimesoft.com]. Worth every penny.)

I don't understand why anyone would want a 24" monitor for work. Watching movies maybe, but not the day-to-day stuff. Somebody who just started doing research at the university where I work got dual 24" LCDs with his new $8,000 workstation. For the cost of those two monitors he could have gotten three 20" LCDs, which would have given him more desktop space and (in my opinion) a much more useful setup. He just thought two 24" beasts sitting side by side would look frakking cool. He's right, but I still prefer multiple smaller monitors.

I've worked at all three... here's my take

When I worked at Yahoo, I had to say things like "Doinky doink" to my boss and paint my face green on one side and white on the other since I was the guy in charge of the Saskatchewan part of Yahoo...wherever the hell Saskatchewan is...anyway... the people in the cubes next to me where chimpanzees but they wore "Richard Nixon" halloween masks.
When I worked a Microsoft, I had to wear a suit, but the suit was in camoflage colours. My supervisor (I never did find out his name, I only knew him as "XZ95") was in charge of BTLIME.DLL, the subroutine that made sure that the system clock didn't accidentally exceed the number "6"...a big responsibility.
Finally, I got a job at Google... I don't know how it's going because I've spent all my time trying to win the "special day" competition to remake the "Google" web page logo on those "special days"

Thanks for listening

Maybe a tamed, blind hawk?

"Google's internal security watches you like a hawk"

Uhh...no. I walk around with my badge concealed, explicitly to see how much of a problem it causes, and I have been stopped less than a handful of times this year, and probably less than twenty last year. (Barring events that are explicitly high-security.)

Re:Maybe a tamed, blind hawk?

You're so badass.

Re:Maybe a tamed, blind hawk?

Or you could look at it from the point of view that "security" has become so pervasive and commonplace in your life that you no longer think it unusual to be stopped 20 times a year...

Re:Maybe a tamed, blind hawk?

How many times do you think you'd be stopped walking around NSA without a badge?

If they were any good, then just once.

Pretty good actually

Well that's pretty high security for most places. Where I work there's a badge-on-display policy but I have not worn my badge in the last ten years.

When I worked in the military everyone was supposed to have badge-on-display and everybody was supposed to look at badges all the time. The top security guy rigged a test: He had an arbitrary soldier replace his picture with one of a baboon. He walked past security points at least 6 times a day and was only discovered after 6 months when he dropped his card and people had a really close look at it.

Re:Pretty good actually

The top security guy rigged a test: He had an arbitrary soldier replace his picture with one of a baboon. He walked past security points at least 6 times a day and was only discovered after 6 months when he dropped his card and people had a really close look at it.

Similar story at Texas Instruments. To get into a TI building, you're supposed to have an electronic or visual inspection of your badge. Where we worked in Sugarland, TX, they used a visual inspection station (you put your badge over a video camera and the security guy in some security office remotely "verifies" your badge). But this happened so quickly, we knew they weren't doing anything more than glancing at the badge.

One of the interns (red badge, meant less than 5 years senority back in the 1990's) thought they probably weren't even doing that. So he taped the front of a small box of Sun-Maid [sun-maid.com] raisins over his badge. And used it like that for six months. Was only caught because we were laughing so hard about it at lunch one day while his boss was walking by, and the cat was out of the bag. The security office actually got in trouble, not the intern, and I don't think they use the visual inspection stations any more.

Regards,
Ross

Re:Pretty good actually

By "arbitrary solder" did you mean "the soldier who looked most like a baboon"?

Only for Interns

Finally, everything you've ever wanted to know about being an employee at Google, Microsoft, and Yahoo.

... based on a few weeks of experience of an intern.

This is intersting information for someone who is looking to be an intern, but that's about it.

all great places

Al have interesting work, good pay, interesting areas to live. "May you be cursed with job offers from all three" and have to decide :-)

Re:all great places

More than you would think. Most of the hiring managers I meet consider it very high prestige.

Virus Lookout Express?

The blogger's favorite Microsoft app is Outlook Express? Well, I guess given the choices...

I'll bet!

'once you have worked at one, it's a lot easier to get into another'

This doesn't surprise me at all -- I'm sure you're seen as not only good enough to have worked at the other ones, but as a possible wealth of information about the workings of the others. And you're cheaper and lower-profile than hiring away the competition's bigger fish.

Re:I'll bet!

I've only worked for two of the three (Yahoo to Google), but as far as I've seen _nobody_ wants you to disclose the inner workings of the others to them. This true on at least three levels that come to mind:

- The competitive advantage of knowing about other companies' proprietary information is dwarfed by the liability of acquiring that information. Especially given that you'd be acquiring them through someone who had proven they could not be trusted to keep a secret.

- At least Google has the (mostly deserved) hubris to assume that their own solutions to problems will tend to be as good as or better than other companies' solutions. So while other solutions may be academically interesting, they generally won't be useful.

- Lastly and most significantly, it's unethical. And yes, every person with whom I've worked at either company would find this alone to be reason enough to refrain, even if it did grant a competitive advantage.

Really, everyone would rather just hire competent, trustworthy people who will do their actual job well and with appropriate discretion. No one is looking for a stool pigeon.

MSN Search is terrible.

At my last contract job at MS, I really tried to use MSN search...

Sometimes the site wouldn't even load, sometimes clicking on search results would fail (because the click-tracking would fail), sometimes the main MSN site would show an server error. Each of these things were rare, but given how many things have to happen to complete a search task, overall I would estimate a 10% failure rate, to get any results at all.

Meanwhile, Google ALWAYS works. I have never once seen Google fail to load, or produce proper results. If Google doesn't load, I know it's my local network that's the problem.

Maybe it's the Parallel nature of Google's configuration vs. the apperently Serial setup of MSN. If a machine at Google fails, it dosn't affect much else, while one failure at MSN breaks the chain.

how fast things change

2000 is a distant memory. In 2000, VA Linux and Redhat were the it companies. Work at one and you could work at the other and the world would kill tthemselves for your autograph. Now no-one even knows what VA Linux was and Redhat is a troll. Hard to believe in 4 years we'll probably forget what Google was.

Worst Typo Ever

The guy wrote "horderves" to mean "hors d'uvres".

So

Now we know that he values perks and the showy stuff. Good luck chatting, networking and backstabbing your way up the 9 levels of management at Yahoo. Where I work there are no super stars, no free anything but I can come and go whenever I want (9 to 5 is no problem, too), get a really good reliable paycheck and most importantly the work is interesting and unpretentious. No need to sacrifice my private life for an endless string of office parties and chic gossip.

Security IDs are pathetic

I think that IDs give a false sense of security: here is why...

I did a little experiment at my old job that required an ID be displayed...I just wore it backwards...all that was on the back was a company logo and RFID chip to open the main door and the data center: never once did security ask to see the picture and credentials that I was concealing...

Our High school (2000-2004) made us wear IDs, the kids from the catholic school down the street would use IDs from the previous year or IDs that others had "lost" to sneak in and at lunch with their friends at our local public school...almost never getting busted. even by random ID checks that the lunch cashiers did.

The place I work now doesn't have IDs, just a magnetic card that you swipe to get in the secure doors after hours...there is not a security problem because everyone knows enough other people that if you cant answer a few questions in a casual conversation, you will be busted in 10 minutes...questions like "new here? welcome aboard, what position are you filling?" and "oh, who manages that dept?"...that is the place where I have felt the SAFEST...

Sounds Terrible

These places sound great in theory but the more you think about it, the more phony and limiting they become.

Consider that they provide all of these resources to keep you on their campus as long as possible. Their entire goal is to squeeze as much work out of you they can while prolonging the time it will take you to burn out. They create their own small community you're expected to be a part of at almost all times.

Maybe I'm in the minority but my work isn't my life. I enjoy what I do but I don't stay at the office any long than I have to. I have friends to see, places to go and personal endeavors to get to that don't involve my company. I don't want my recreational activities to be sponsored by or provided by my company. I'm not sure I want to work in a place that "optionally" provides these facilities as they become expectations of the employees and those that shun them become outcast by their coworkers.

It's like if you don't participate in as many work related activities as possible, you'll alienate yourself and not be part of the brainwashed masses at your company of choice.

Maybe I'm old fashioned but I get to the office, I do my job and after about 8 hours or so I go on my way and do whatever I want to do. I get lunch with some friends at places of our choice. I'll even participate in work related and non-work related recreational activities with people. But it's not a way of life.

I don't know, something about working for a company that has created facilities and devices to keep you occupied under their roof for as long as possible seems a little fishy. I don't trust companies like this. They don't have your best interest's in mind, like most companies, but try and create diversions from this. Many young geeks end up wasting their youth in this corporate socialism.

I'm in the elitist outer ring

Since you've worked no where, no one will hire you for lack of experience. I laugh at jokes even when they're at my expense.

Google research lab

In his table, under "Research Lab", Google gets a "Not really". This guy has absolutely no idea about what he's talking about. Google has some of the most cutting-edge research in the industry. They almost always have research papers published at the conferences that I attend (so does MS, but Yahoo rarely does). Here [usenix.org] are [usenix.org] some [usenix.org] examples [rochester.edu].

internet bubble again?

fuck working at a web company i'd much much rather work at MS. look at the perks and the pay its way over what the other give you? i'd kiss bill gates ass at every oppertunity

Dumb Question

How do guys like this afford to do these internships? Are they paid? Does the bank of mommy and daddy pay the way?

Seriously. I've got no bank of mom and dad, work and go to school. How do I do it when I'm the one who feeds/clothes myself?

Re:xbox?

Ok ya got me. How did you figure this out? After going back to the site, there is little identifying information about "tastyresearch".

Re:Security

They're watching for tailgaters. The Mountain View complex is entirely open, and there have been big problems in the past with employees of other companies wandering over to use the free canteens - not to mention trying to get into TGIF. If it was like most office buildings where there was one main entrance it wouldn't be necessary, and indeed in the Zurich office there are no guards.

Re:Research In Motion....

Start your own company. It doesn't take much in this industry and the rewards are much greater.