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Does File-Sharing Really Hurt the Music Biz?

Posted by Zonk on Tue Sep 26, 2006 04:05 PM
from the methinks-they-doth-protest-too-much dept.
Phonographic Memory writes "A new study has come out that purports to show a link between file-sharing and decreased CD purchases. Covering the period of 1995-2003, the study looked for a link between owning a computer and decreased CD purchases. The researcher found that 'some US music consumers could have decreased their CD purchases (prior to 2004) by about 13 percent due to Internet file sharing.' In its coverage of the study, Ars Technica notes that the scholarly consensus on the possibility of a link between file sharing and music purchases is missing: 'the dominant impression gained from reading these studies is that finding accurate correlations between file-sharing and loss of revenue for the music industry is tremendously difficult.'"

Related Stories

[+] Your Rights Online: Music Companies Mull Ditching DRM 318 comments
PoliTech writes to mention an International Herald Tribue article that is reporting the unthinkable: Record companies are considering ditching DRM for their mp3 albums. For the first time, flagging sales of online music tracks are beginning to make the big recording companies consider the wisdom of selling music without 'rights management' technologies attached. The article notes that this is a step the recording industry vowed 'never to take'. From the article: "Most independent record labels already sell tracks digitally compressed in MP3 format, which can be downloaded, e-mailed or copied to computers, cellphones, portable music players and compact discs without limit. Partially, the independents see providing songs in MP3 as a way of generating publicity that could lead to future sales. Should one of the big four take that route, however, it would be a capitulation to the power of the Internet, which has destroyed their monopoly over the worldwide distribution of music in the past decade and allowed file-sharing to take its place."
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  • Ofcourse it does (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:07PM (#16205789)
    Ok RIAA, I said what you told me to. Will you now drop the case?
  • Does File-Sharing Really Hurt the Music Biz? by HTH NE1 (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:08PM
  • There has also been no new malls built since 2000 by Rooked_One (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:09PM
  • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:10PM (#16205831)
    1) I have never downloaded a song for which I don't own a CD already
    2) I have bought maybe 2 CDs in the last year, vs. 20 a year in the early 90's

    This is mainly due to the high level of suckage by today's "musicians". Has anyone done a study that includes that correlation? Also I've built my collection the point where I have almost everything I want already. How does that figure in?
  • Nonsense! by e2d2 (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:10PM
    • Re:Nonsense! by LiquidCoooled (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:21PM
    • Re:Nonsense! (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Frymaster (171343) on Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:22PM (#16206065)
      (http://frymaster.ca/ | Last Journal: Monday September 15 2003, @12:58AM)
      But seriously, does this shock anyone? If I'm getting the milk for free how is the cow gonna get paid?

      yeah! it's just like when the casette tape killed the recording industry and the video tape put all the movie theatres out of business and the radio wiped out record sales. we've know this connection for years! ever since the public library put all the publishers out of business.

      seriously. people buy cd's (and books and movies) as much for owning an artefact than for the actual content. people want to have personal libraries and large music collections and so they will buy books and movies. history proves it.

      [ Parent ]
      • Re:Nonsense! by powermung (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:51PM
        • Re:Nonsense! by TheSpoom (Score:3) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:58PM
          • Re:Nonsense! by Andr T. (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @07:00PM
          • Re:Nonsense! by dlim (Score:1) Wednesday September 27 2006, @01:05PM
            • Re:Nonsense! by TheSpoom (Score:2) Saturday September 30 2006, @05:26PM
        • Re:Nonsense! by tcc3 (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:10PM
        • Re:Nonsense! by EzInKy (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @10:36PM
      • Re:Nonsense! by HuDongQing (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @07:02PM
      • Re:Nonsense! by danpsmith (Score:2) Wednesday September 27 2006, @08:51AM
      • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
    • Re:Nonsense! by WilliamSChips (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:14PM
    • Poor stats and the missing middlemen by doppiodave (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @06:13PM
    • Re:Nonsense! by Benzido (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @08:06PM
    • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
  • Decreased CD purchases... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by merreborn (853723) on Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:10PM (#16205847)
    But of course, increased online digital music sales couldn't possibly have anything to do with *that* could they?

    Lots of things have changed in the last 10 years. P2P fileswapping is one of them. iTunes is another.
  • The music sucks (Score:4, Insightful)

    by nsanders (208050) on Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:11PM (#16205855)
    (http://www.slashdot.org/)
    Said it before, say it again. It's not the Internet, it's the product. Music today sucks compared to years ago. I just have no desire to pay $18 for a CD when I could buy the DVD with full video for the same price.

    The same applies to movies. Torrents aren't killing your ticket sales.. Your crappy movies are killing ticket sales.

    "Honey, do these jeans make my butt look fat?"
    "No, your fat butt makes your butt look fat."

    See the concept?

    • Re:The music sucks (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Turn-X Alphonse (789240) on Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:16PM (#16205963)
      (Last Journal: Sunday September 19 2004, @10:03PM)
      Not to go against the Borg known as Slashdotters... but here you go..

      Music today is no better nor worse than yesterday. You remember the good stuff and forget the crap, the same way I remember the good 90s music and not the crap.. That is how things work. You remember the good and discard the crap.

      As you get older you learn about music and what's good and bad.. You learn yourself and your tastes, I'm sure you can understand that.. but when you're 15 you're still a young guy who will follow groups a bit more.. learn a bit more and such..

      Music didn't change my friend, YOU changed.
      [ Parent ]
      • Re:The music sucks by Volante3192 (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:25PM
      • Re:The music sucks by maxume (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:34PM
      • Re:The music sucks (Score:4, Insightful)

        by grumpyman (849537) on Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:41PM (#16206403)
        DITTO. Remember what our parents/adults said about the music we listened to back then.
        [ Parent ]
      • Re:The music sucks by Bull SR (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:47PM
      • Re:The music sucks (Score:5, Insightful)

        by div_2n (525075) on Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:53PM (#16206613)
        Music today is no better nor worse than yesterday.

        I think I'll be the one to decide that when it comes to spending my money since this is a highly subjective matter.

        I don't buy CDs nearly as much as I used to. Radio stations play the same music they've played for about 5 or 6 years now. I find myself turning the channel to talk radio more often than not because I'm tired of hearing the same music over and over and over again.

        Those are facts. We can argue the cause of the facts if you want.

        Not buying CDs

        1) I'll admit that music isn't as big in my life now as it was say in college. So perhaps age has something to do with it.

        2) I'm older and wiser and whenever I even think about buying a CD (which isn't often) I think of better ways to spend my money.

        3) Perhaps I'm falling out of touch with whatever is the fad of the day. (See #2)

        Same music over and over

        1) Perhaps there really aren't that many good new songs being released. (i.e. today's music really IS worse)

        2) Maybe whomever is in charge of the music at the stations in my area are lazy.

        3) What if (wait for it . . .) the music industry decision makers have lost touch with what's good and let great talent sit unnoticed?

        While I'm thinking about it (since #3 in the second group got me on this train of thought), I'll go ahead and say what I'll wager has crossed the mind of anyone who has more than three brain cells holding hands and singing "kum ba ya". File sharing kills off bands that suck. It just does. If you download and sample the other songs from a band besides the hit playing constantly on the radio and find out that they are a one hit wonder, are you going to fork out the full price of a CD for that one song? I wouldn't.

        Artists are (or should be) afraid of file sharing because it exposes their weakness at making a tight album. Music execs hate it because (among other things) it allows people to easily sample before they buy. I say easily because it seems to me that if someone takes the time to go to the music store, they would be more likely to buy something than if they didn't.

        In conclusion, I'll say that file sharing won't kill music or bankrupt talented artists. If the music industry is smart, it won't even hurt their bottom line that much. But I'll tell you what it will kill--the album as we know it.

        Don't get too upset about it. I suspect that the overall quality of the average song will actually improve since bands will quit messing around with songs that nobody likes.

        Just $0.02.
        [ Parent ]
      • Re:Here is why you are wong. (Score:5, Insightful)

        by vertinox (846076) on Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:57PM (#16207599)
        (http://mp3bat.com/)
        Music today is no better nor worse than yesterday. You remember the good stuff and forget the crap, the same way I remember the good 90s music and not the crap.. That is how things work. You remember the good and discard the crap.

        Every generation has had its share of good and bad music and the manufactured pop idols, but one thing is different today than it was 5, 10, or 20 years ago.

        Clear Channel owns all the radios and MTV doesn't play music videos anymore.

        This means artists are chosen by the media cartels payola system rather than a voting system by the populace.

        As a kid I remember every year, there would a video that would play at midnight and then it would get popular and play at 10pm and then later it would be playing nonstop at primetime for an entire month.

        Now, a band is just manufactured and *BAM* they are on the prime time whether you like it or not.

        Mabye all those old bands were manufactured as well, but these days it isn't even remotley democratic.

        Do you remember the days when any local band had a chance of getting their demo played on the radio and then making it big?

        These days there is no such thing as a local radio station. They play the same lists on the East Coast as they do the West coast. Hell many of the shows are getting the same audio stream.

        So I wouldn't say the quality of music has gone down hill, but rather the industry itself and its promotions methods. RIAA and crew are no longer satisfied with taking chances with people possibly making it big. If they sign you then they force it down everyone's throats even if they aren't liked.

        Which is of course why we see more one hit wonders these days of people who real job was making jingles for commercials or have a pretty face.

        It isn't the internet or piracy nor iTunes killing the industry, but the industry itself.

        The only way to fix it would be to break up the RIAA monopoly and force Clear Channel to sell its stations.
        [ Parent ]
      • Re:The music sucks by noidentity (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @06:15PM
      • Re:The music sucks by vga_init (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @08:09PM
      • Re:The music sucks by 4D6963 (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @08:37PM
      • Re:The music sucks by banuk (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @10:33PM
      • Re:The music sucks by Technician (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @11:26PM
      • Well... by pyr0r0ck3r (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @11:42PM
      • Re:The music sucks by Henk Poley (Score:2) Wednesday September 27 2006, @06:05AM
      • Re:The music sucks by Stinky Cheese Man (Score:2) Wednesday September 27 2006, @01:46PM
      • 5 replies beneath your current threshold.
    • Re:The music sucks by kaufmanmoore (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:19PM
      • Re:The music sucks (Score:4, Insightful)

        by shark72 (702619) on Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:10PM (#16206907)

        "Amen, it looks like the top 2 albums this week will be Justin Timberlake's solo production and Clay Aiken...'nuff said"

        Here some of the top tracks of the year:

        • 1999: "Believe" by Cher
        • 1996: That fucking Macarena song
        • 1991: "Everything I Do, I Do For You" by Bryan Adams (Messrs. Bush and McCain are currently disputing whether this song is an acceptable means of torture.)
        • 1986: "That's What Friends are For" by Dionne Warwick
        • 1982: "Physical" by Olivia Newton-John (#2 was "Eye of the Tiger" by Survivor.)
        • 1979: "My Sharona" by The Knack
        • 1978: "Shadow Dancing" by Andy Gibb
        • 1973: "Tie A Yellow Ribbon 'Round The Old Oak Tree" by Tony Orlando and Dawn
        • 1966: "The Ballad of the Green Berets" by Staff Sargeant Barry Sadler (for those of you who remember this song: I am very, very sorry if this is stuck in your head for the rest of the day.)

        I hope this helps clear things up, and that you're a little closer to understanding why people chuckle when younger people think that "today's music sucks" is some sort of unique epiphany.

        [ Parent ]
    • Re:The music sucks (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Kenja (541830) on Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:20PM (#16206037)
      If the music sucks. Why do you feel the need to download it without its creators permission?
      [ Parent ]
      • Re:The music sucks (Score:4, Insightful)

        by Firehed (942385) on Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:38PM (#16206349)
        (http://www.firehed.net/)
        We're not. They're just assuming we are when their sales suck. Sure, in some cases we download to sample it but wouldn't have bought the CD anyways (or decide we like it and actually DO buy the CD), but only those among us with the most bandwidth and the biggest hard drives download pure crap solely because it was available.
        [ Parent ]
      • Re:The music sucks by RsG (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:39PM
      • Re:The music sucks by mrchaotica (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:42PM
      • Re:The music sucks by zerosix (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:04PM
      • Re:The music sucks by Bull SR (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:08PM
    • Re:The music sucks (Score:5, Insightful)

      by shark72 (702619) on Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:33PM (#16206259)

      "Said it before, say it again. It's not the Internet, it's the product. Music today sucks compared to years ago."

      This is a constant. People approaching middle age in the 1950s claimed that modern music sucked compared to music of previous decades. As did people in the 1920s and 1870s.

      People who believe in the quality of music of past generations vs. today's music are often quite certain that they are correct in an objective sense, despite the overwhelming evidence to the contrary. Nonetheless, this phenomenon is so common that there is a word to describe it: nostalgia [wikipedia.org].

      I'm aware that this provides a quandary for P2P fans: if "today's music sucks" is a constant over T, then it's not a significant contributor to declining music sales. Another sticky issue is that the top pirated tracks [bigchampagne.com] match up with the top sold tracks pretty closely. "Today's music sucks" is not driving P2P fans to download old stuff in lieu of new stuff. The demand for the new stuff is strong; P2P simply provides another channel.

      [ Parent ]
    • Re:The music sucks by grumpyman (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:37PM
    • Re:The music sucks by jawtheshark (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:44PM
    • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
  • i think it helps cd sales (Score:4, Insightful)

    by brunascle (994197) on Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:11PM (#16205857)
    i wrote an albeit sloppy paper on this a few years ago. i found that there were several spikes in cd sales. one was during the heyday of napster. after napster was shut down, cd sales started to slow down. they picked up again as iTunes was gaining in popularity.

    personally, i know for a fact that i wouldnt have a huge chunk of my (legally puchased) music collection had it not been for file sharing, simply because i would have never heard the bands before.
  • WTF? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by khasim (1285) <brandioch.conner@gmail.com> on Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:11PM (#16205861)
    During 2002 computer owners' CD sales decreased by $4.79 a year, and by $5.55 in 2003. Those without computers only decreased by $0.80 and $0.22, respectively.

    And even an inexpensive CD (been out a few years, on a discount site, etc) is about $7.99 today.

    That's less than 1 cheap CD a year. That's barely 1 brand new ($15.99) CD every 3 years.

    WTF?

    And the 80 cent decrease? That's 1 less CD purchased every 10 years.
  • by LoadWB (592248) * on Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:11PM (#16205867)
    (http://df0.info/ | Last Journal: Saturday November 10, @02:11AM)
    Right. We download a song from an album that we *think* we want, then we say "Man, this sucks. I'm glad I didn't buy this shit."

    End of story. So, yes, you could answer that music downloads hurt music sales, but that only identifies the symptom and ignores the actual problem.
  • of course by stocke2 (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:12PM
    • Re:of course by Carlio (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:04PM
    • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
  • analogy by RM6f9 (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:12PM
    • Re:analogy by pscottdv (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:30PM
      • Re:analogy by Dargoth_Rejuv (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @06:29PM
        • Re:analogy by kimvette (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @10:08PM
    • Re:analogy by Foolicious (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:39PM
    • Re:analogy by pilgrim23 (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:56PM
    • Re:analogy by WilliamSChips (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:19PM
  • Not really. (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Turn-X Alphonse (789240) on Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:13PM (#16205889)
    (Last Journal: Sunday September 19 2004, @10:03PM)
    I don't think it does purely for the story I'm about to tell.

    Three days ago I had no intrest in Pokemon Mysterious Dungeon, but a friend had the rom so I went "WTF, I'll give it a try".. I found out it played just like nethack, some minor changes, but in my head it became "Pokemon Nethack". I played it for a couple of hours and decided that this was a game I'd want to play on my DS rather than on the PC. So today I ordered the game and it should be here in a few days.

    Did I hurt the game industry by using a rom before I bought the full copy or buy a game I didn't have an intrest before I played it? Roms and P2P music has become the new demos, people will buy games they think are worth the money or they'll download games they didn't think were worth the money. You could even argument because of the rom I've now told Slashdot that they can get a Nethack like game on the DS now and may have even sold more GBA/DS consoles/games, but that maybe going too far.

    Quality will always sell.
  • Funny that by joshsnow (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:13PM
  • Aside from this being just a generally difficult type of study to execute, but what is their confidence level that a 13% drop is related to file-sharing?

    Though the methodology is complex, the results are straightforward: some US music consumers "could have decreased their CD purchases (prior to 2004) by about 13 percent due to Internet file sharing."
    Oh, there it is, the word 'could.' So on a level from one to a hundred, where does 'could' lie? I mean, if this was a rigorous statistical procedure -- no matter how complex, they should be able to give a percent confidence. You can measure deviation from your model and give it to me that way but I'm concerned that there might have been uncontrolled variables affecting the sale of CDs.

    And I believe that iTunes Music Service has been out since 2001, is that accounted for? It doesn't seem to be if you search the below linked document. I mean, I assume this study is targeting illegal downloads. iTunes is legal to my knowledge yet it would still decrease CD purchases.

    If you'd like to read the paper, it can be found here [bepress.com] (PDF alert).

    While this study does take into acocunt some variables, I'm just afraid there are too many for it to be conclusive. I would recommend that the article ignore Family Size and find out how many of their users used a legal music download service.

    Also, is 2,000 samples per year enough to be accurate? Possibly, but then again, they are talking about an economy of 250 million consumers.
  • Causation vs Coincidence by oakbox (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:15PM
  • What Music Biz? by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:15PM
  • owning a computer != internet file sharing by Trevin (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:16PM
  • Copyright, anyone? by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:18PM
  • Here's a few little goodies that the RIAA forgot to include with their pet study...

    1. Nicholls State University is in Thibodaux, Louisana which isn't exactly a hotbed of business research
    2. His study doesn't state where the funding to conduct the study was obtained from.
    3. The data came from the Consume Expenditure Survey, which is notoriously inaccurate
    4. RIAA has cut back on advertising and promotion for music across the board
    5. Their sales were actually better while Napster was in operation, without any additional expenditure on their part.

    Just my 2 cents,

    QueenB
  • Competition by bobintetley (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:21PM
  • Downloading isn't always illegal by Kope (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:22PM
  • Decreased by X% to ... what? by OWJones (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:22PM
  • People spend more money on culture today. by pipatron (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:24PM
  • What's the difference? by mi (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:24PM
  • Ah Ha! by ackthpt (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:26PM
  • Journal of Law & Economics by El Kevbo (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:30PM
  • Not worth buying by LuminaireX (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:31PM
  • by popo (107611) on Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:32PM (#16206243)

    Before we talk about filesharing, we should talk about the more basic issue: transmissable digital file formats vs. plastic media discs
    stored in poorly designed (easily breakable) jewel cases.

    Let's face it: CD's suck. And I'm not talking about the music. I'm talking about the medium.

    CD's have to be swapped out of the cd player. They hold too little music. They're easily damaged. And the jewel case is one of the worst atrocities
    of industrial design to be inflicted upon humanity in the last 20 years. (I'd say 30% of mine are broken).

    MP3's by comparison are instantly accessible, contain meta data, are sortable, and can be shuffled into infinite playlists. Not to mention, they're
    not breakable.

    When the recording industry pushes CD's, they are pushing a sub-par product on us.

    The music industry was slow to adopt a commercial alternative, and when they did they gave us DRM infected, vastly overpriced, low bitrate shite because they were
    still convinced that if given no other alternative we would continue to buy the sub par plastic discs.

    But there was an alternative: An infinitely better, cheaper, higher quality and more accessible alternative. The recording industry attmpted to
    control the market at the expense of the consumer. They gambled and they lost.

    When businesses offer subpar products they fail.

    The message to the recording industry is simple: Sell me non-DRM infected tracks at .12 each and I'm interested. That's the same amount of money you're getting from your CD's anyway. Push for more, and give me less? You lose.

  • I sure hope so! by myowntrueself (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:34PM
  • No dice, Monkey Boys. by mnagy (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:34PM
  • hooiee by billsoxs (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:37PM
  • Not really surprising, but not really important by localman (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:37PM
  • My sig... by night_flyer (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:37PM
  • I sense... by d_54321 (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:38PM
  • truer words were never spoken by PMuse (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:39PM
  • You only get half the annecdotes you need by cliffski (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:39PM
  • I've got news for the RIAA... by rnturn (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:40PM
  • When I was younger I would buy a cd every couple weeks, in the past year I have purchased two. I have a huge cd collection but it stopped growing, there just isnt enough compelling music out there. In the past year I picked up a Santana cd and The Wreckers debut album. I havent gone on strike against the record labels, though I do not buy on impulse anymore, and wont just buy a disk for one or two songs. My tastes havent really changed, I just have lost interest. I have a few independant disks that I picked up at shows and have purchased a couple dozen tunes on itunes. My wife has picked up a few disks, but to me most of the bands she is into sound the same. Maybe im just old and cranky but it just seems like the stuff being pushed these days is just so formula that owning one of the bands songs is like owning them all.
  • The problem with these studies by dtfinch (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:45PM
  • And in related news... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by laughingcoyote (762272) <barghesthowl@NOsPAm.excite.com> on Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:45PM (#16206501)
    (Last Journal: Sunday December 03 2006, @11:20PM)

    'some US music consumers could have decreased their CD purchases (prior to 2004) by about 13 percent due to Internet file sharing.'

    In related news, some Congressman might now be accepting 80% more bribes, 50% of people might be below average, and 100% of statistics prefaced with "some" and "could have" are sensational bullshit. If you've got real statistics, you don't say "some might have."

  • my cd purchases have decreased by orson_of_fort_worth (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:45PM
  • The music industry hurts the music industry... by Sodade (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:46PM
  • Until the RIAA dies, I won't listen to music. by acherusia (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:47PM
  • Is file sharing the problem in 2006? by PCeye (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:48PM
  • False Correlation by Analogy Man (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:49PM
  • One personal experience... by Pocaille (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:51PM
  • In other news... by mutube (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:56PM
    • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
  • Olde Fashioned Sand Bagging by ElitistWhiner (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:56PM
  • Lies, damned lies, and statistics by TheWoozle (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:57PM
  • Too many variables by Srsen (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:00PM
  • ill start buying CD's When... by Nocturnal Deviant (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:12PM
  • Link? Absolutely by ShimmyShimmy (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:13PM
  • Simple cause and effect, and the RIAA report card by hAckz0r (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:21PM
  • My purchaces by Sirusjr (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:21PM
  • They are Some Idiots! even the study...... by A Wise Guy (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:22PM
  • RTFA, the summary is laughably bad. by kinglink (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:31PM
  • Disposable Income... by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:32PM
  • Just because you own a computer... by Shacky (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:35PM
  • Sure there's a link... by hendersj (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:47PM
  • filesharing hurts sales? by steampoweredlawngnom (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:48PM
  • Less CD Sales!+Less music sales by Monsuco (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:49PM
  • Rock vs Pop (Score:3, Interesting)

    by static0verdrive (776495) on Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:52PM (#16207537)
    (http://montrealbands.net/schooner/ | Last Journal: Wednesday March 09 2005, @01:02PM)
    As a musician, let me explain something. In the rock or underground world, you get paid next to nothing for your CD sales. The record company knows bands are hit-or-miss, so keep all the dough to themselves, letting the band make their money from live shows *if they are widely accepted. This is in contrast to the pop industry, who knows that the pop groups are close to one-hit-wonders, and the "artist" gets paid for their CD and tour as a lump sum. The record company rakes in the profits from the CDs and shows. In most cases, the pop groups are built by the industry for this very rea$on, vs rock groups who create themselves.
  • Oh no! by shack420 (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @06:16PM
  • well now by crashelite (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @06:17PM
  • What about married gen Xers? by zenasprime (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @06:19PM
  • OH whatever. by Overfiend1976 (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @06:35PM
  • by RexRhino (769423) on Tuesday September 26 2006, @06:36PM (#16208101)
    File sharing DOES hurt the current model of the music biz... one that is based on the disposable mega-pop-star. It is hard to sell 10 million albums for a musician with one hit song when someone can just download the single they like so easily. For a pop-phenomena, it is very easy to hit the critical mass of people online to share something.

    On the other hand, there is a lot of music that is very hard to find on file sharing networks. Whole genres of music are pretty much unaccounted for on file sharing networks. If you can't listen to it on an FM radio station, good luck finding it. There might be a successful business model in selling fewer records of more artists, than selling more records of a handful of artists.

    Regardless, it is not the role of the government to be propping up outdated business models. I think it is pretty clear that the automobile was pretty disastrous to the blacksmithing and livery industries... but it created even more profitable industries in the long run. Think of the mess we would be in if we tried to save the blacksmithing and livery industries as large scale parts of our economy. True, file-sharing IS stealing and immoral, I don't deny that: but so is taking my tax money against my will, in order to fund a government agency to preemptively go after file sharing, or to legally harass potentially innocent people, or to legally restrict new technologies because they *MAY* potentially be used for file sharing. The immorality of file-sharing (extremely minor evil, if it is evil at all) is far outweighed by the immorality of the draconian methods required for enforcement.

    And specific to the music industry... WE WILL NEVER HAVE A SHORTAGE OF MUSIC!!! Music is one of those things people enjoy doing without payment... and one of those things that garners a lot of non-financial rewards (attention, respect, adoration). Look at all the garage bands, amateur musicians, people making demo CDs, people posting their music free on websites, and tell me that we would not have lots and lots of music, even if the entire industry collapsed. Making music is not like building airplanes, in that it takes vast amounts of capital and can be dangerous if done by people who don't know what they are doing.
  • Experience from the Trenches of the Music Biz by termite12 (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @06:37PM
  • Who Doesn't own a computer? by Alchemar (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @06:48PM
  • Too bad there's no metric for shitty music by initialE (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @06:52PM
  • I wanna talk about me, I wanna talk about I by CarnivoreMan (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @06:53PM
  • I think there was an error in the quote used by Tinman_au (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @07:01PM
  • The first step is to admit you have a problem by Windows Breaker G4 (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @07:04PM
  • Can't pinpoint the problem by Opportunist (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @07:13PM
  • If it were discovered that... by exp(pi*sqrt(163)) (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @07:46PM
  • Other Pasttimes... by plonk420 (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @07:50PM
  • The music biz by Benzido (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @08:00PM
  • Lets see... by tubapro12 (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @08:54PM
  • Increased downloading == increased buying by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @09:05PM
  • Correlation != Causation by Fonkey (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @09:08PM
  • News: Does Global Warming Hurt the Music Biz? by uv_light (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @09:16PM
  • Real World example.. (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Technician (215283) on Tuesday September 26 2006, @09:32PM (#16209785)
    Before i graduated high school, I bought very little music. I was a full time student and a single record was a little more than my weekly allowance.

    Fast forward a few years. I'm in the Navy and just bought a killer sound system. I live in the housing with no expenses. I find music I like down the hall. I buy a few LP's. I get a car. I get an LP badly scratched so it skips. I buy a case of good Maxell tapes. Make a set of tapes for the car (Can't play LP's in the car) and another set to play to preserve the original LP quality. I get a few tapes tangled in a friends car tape player. No problem, recreated a replacement. Also traded a few tapes (before lawsuits start, the Statute of Limitations ended about 25 years ago) so yes I pirated music in my youth. It also happened to be my peak music buying years. For the music that I really liked, it was worth buying a pristine copy. I bought the Mobile Sound Fidelity Labs copy of Pink Floyd's Dark Side of the Moon at a premimum price. It has been played less than 15 times in the years I have owned it. Each time was to cut a tape from it to preserve the original.

    If I didn't have a tape deck and a good way to expand my library by sharing, I would probably have just stuck with radio and not have ever heard of Pink Floyd. File sharing is a marketing tool. Learn to embrace it.
  • Does file sharing hurt the music biz? by sudden.zero (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @10:15PM
  • Who Cares? by xQx (Score:2) Tuesday September 26 2006, @10:30PM
  • Norbert Michel would take a beating... by cursorx (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @10:56PM
  • No, it doesn't by small_white_fox (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @11:51PM
  • spurious by flar2 (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @11:54PM
  • I stopped buying CDs pretty much by suitepotato (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @11:58PM
  • Could it possibly be... by binarysins (Score:1) Wednesday September 27 2006, @12:28AM
  • Correlation by SEWilco (Score:2) Wednesday September 27 2006, @01:14AM
  • Global warming & Pirates!!!1!one1eleven by Spliffster (Score:1) Wednesday September 27 2006, @03:24AM
  • Why I no longer buy CDs by endemoniada (Score:1) Wednesday September 27 2006, @03:39AM
  • The argument that annoys me.... well kinda by dmjones500 (Score:1) Wednesday September 27 2006, @04:15AM
  • I've bought many more by yusing (Score:1) Wednesday September 27 2006, @04:27AM
  • You can read more about it by shaharsol (Score:1) Wednesday September 27 2006, @06:58AM
  • And the economy in those years? by whitroth (Score:2) Wednesday September 27 2006, @07:22AM
  • The artists by s31523 (Score:2) Wednesday September 27 2006, @08:00AM
  • Baby Boomers by Ginnungagap42 (Score:1) Wednesday September 27 2006, @08:29AM
  • seems appropriate by ClassicComposer (Score:1) Wednesday September 27 2006, @09:03AM
  • Isolation of factors like used CDs and remasters? by scottsk (Score:1) Wednesday September 27 2006, @09:04AM
  • What about library statistics? by dlm85 (Score:1) Wednesday September 27 2006, @09:08AM
  • File sharing didn't hurt the RIAA because of me... by Sierpinski (Score:2) Wednesday September 27 2006, @10:06AM
  • the music business hurts the music business by Hohlraum (Score:1) Wednesday September 27 2006, @10:28AM
  • previous papers from Dr. Michel ... by sun5diver (Score:2) Wednesday September 27 2006, @10:39AM
  • I trade cassettes... by thinkzinc (Score:1) Wednesday September 27 2006, @10:39AM
  • Another reason for decreased CD sales by atomic_toaster (Score:2) Wednesday September 27 2006, @11:11AM
  • Huh? by Grand V'izer (Score:1) Wednesday September 27 2006, @12:05PM
  • Repeat after me... by SnowDog74 (Score:2) Wednesday September 27 2006, @01:57PM
  • Correlation... by SnowDog74 (Score:2) Wednesday September 27 2006, @02:00PM
  • Inconclusive by djcondor (Score:1) Wednesday September 27 2006, @02:20PM
  • Legal Music Variety by The Raven (Score:2) Wednesday September 27 2006, @07:38PM
  • Re:Not really by marct22 (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @04:34PM
    • Re:Not really by CDTrave (Score:1) Tuesday September 26 2006, @05:03PM
  • Re:The other way around... by endemoniada (Score:1) Wednesday September 27 2006, @03:58AM
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