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Some Back Compat Problems For PS3 138

Posted by Zonk from the going-back-in-time dept.
Via Opposable Thumbs at Ars Technica, the news at IGN that there are some annoying backwards compatibility issues with the PS3 and the PS2. Specifically, there are about 196 games that are experiencing issues. From the article: "In response to these issues, Sony's PR department pointed out that it, from the start, expected backwards compatibility to be less than 100%. It was also good enough to point out that some people can put up with playing games that lack sound. Regardless of this somewhat arrogant response, an official statement issued at the PlayStation.com site states that Sony will fix the problems with a future system update, and may even resort to individual patches for certain titles. When this will happen has yet to be specified." Qj.net has a list of some of the problem games, with their specific issues. It sounds bad, but to put this in perspective I believe there are still far more PS2 games playable on the PS3 than there are Xbox games playable on the 360.
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Some Back Compat Problems For PS3 More

Some Back Compat Problems For PS3

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  • i wonder (Score:2, Insightful)

    by thejrwr ( 1024073 )
    i wonder tho, why was the ps2 so good at playing ps1 games

    • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

      by Mursk ( 928595 )
      I'm sure someone with superior technical knowledge on this subject will correct me before long, but I believe it's because they were able to essentially include much of the original PS hardware on a single chip in the PS2. It's not quite at the point where they can emulate the PS2 the same way.

      • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

        by HappySqurriel ( 1010623 )
        IIRC the Playstation processor was included on the PS2 as the sound processor ...
        Currently the Emotion Engine has been included in the PS3 in a similar way ...

        Personally, I would suspect that much of the non-CPU related functionality of the PS2 is being emulated on the Cell processor but the emulation is incomplete
        • So, does this mean that the Ps3 can't play Ps1 games? If the ps3 struggles with the pas2 sound, then that it surely wouldn't play ps1 games which ran on the sound chip inside the ps3, right?

          • Re: (Score:3, Funny)

            by Hennell ( 1005107 )
            yeah, I'm sure people are really spending $600 to play upscaled PS1 games...

            • If I was dumb enough to spend $600 on the PS3, I would SURE AS FUCK expect it to play my PS1 games in addition to my PS2 games. I have a PS2, and PS2 games, and I still spend more time playing PS1 games on it. I have two PS1s (a PS1 and a PSOne - I have the PSOne because I got it when I didn't have my PSTwo (slim) yet, and I still have the PS1 because it supports the game shark) and I use the PS2 because I don't want them taking up space. I have a switchbox, but why have more hardware out there when the PS

            • ..except for the fact that the PS3 offers no enhancements for PS1 or PS2 games, at all.

            • Re: (Score:2)

              by ChibiLZ ( 697816 ) *
              No, they're paying $600 to play the newest next generation games. As a very nice bonus, it would hopefully play their old library of PS1 and PS2 titles. I like being able to just replace a piece of hardware in the entertainment cabinet, instead of having to add another.

              It's funny how backwards compatibility used to be such a bonus feature, now it's practically expected.
              • Exactly. I need to decide if I am buying a Wii, ps3, or xbox360. Well, I like something about each one of them....if the PS3 could play my older games, that would influence my decision.

                I think backwards a double-edged sword. If the makers add it, then they have a harder time selling ports of old games. If they don't, then they lose business on that.

                So, does this mean nobody knows if it will play Ps1 games? My favorite all time games are ps1 games.

                If the SuperNintendo and N64 and gamecube were

      • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

        by RzUpAnmsCwrds ( 262647 )

        I'm sure someone with superior technical knowledge on this subject will correct me before long, but I believe it's because they were able to essentially include much of the original PS hardware on a single chip in the PS2. It's not quite at the point where they can emulate the PS2 the same way.

        Actually, that's exactly what Sony did with the PS3 - the PS3 motherboard contains the same EE+GS chip that powers the slim PS2.

        You can see it on the left side of this photo [impress.co.jp].

    • Re: (Score:1, Insightful)

      by trcooper ( 18794 ) *
      The PS3 uses software emulation. The PS2's IO processor was basically a PSX as I remember, and they were able to leverage it to run old games.

      Since they're using software emulation now, they're in for the same issues that the 360 has. I don't think the issue to the consumers will be how many games work, but which games work. Few people will care if Madden '99 runs on the PS3, but they might be upset if their recently bought FF XII wouldn't.

      • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

        by bile ( 169020 )
        Actually they planed on software emulation but were unable to create the emulator in time so each PS3 actually contains an EE/GS chipset as used in the new PStwo's. At some point if/when the full software emulator is finished they will remove the EE/GS to save money.

      • Re:i wonder (Score:5, Informative)

        by Rufus211 ( 221883 ) <rufus-slashdot@@@hackish...org> on Monday November 13, 2006 @04:13PM (#16828852) Homepage
        Wrong.

        If you look at the pictures there are 4 chips. Cell (the main CPU), RSX (the GPU), EE/GS (the PS2), and an unmarked I/O chip.

        They plan on doing software emulation at some point in the future, and when they do they'll drop the PS2 chip and RAMs from the board. Untill then there's a full hardware PS2 in every PS3.

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by UbuntuDupe ( 970646 )
      All I know is, whenever I ask on a forum why emulation is so hard if you have the specs for the thing you're emulating, and designed the emulating system and thus can "translate" the new OS commands, I get a vague explanation from "experts" on the matter. Then when I ask clarifying questions about the explanations, they take it as rudeness and refuse to give any information that would reveal understanding of console architecture.

      • Simple answer is. (Score:5, Informative)

        by LWATCDR ( 28044 ) on Monday November 13, 2006 @04:51PM (#16829560) Homepage Journal
        If it was simple then they wouldn't be having all these problems.
        The hard answer is it depends.
        1. Did the program use some strange feature or bug that you are not emulating? This can cause problems even for hardware. You do a new rev of some chip and a program that uses some strange workaround fails. This was a major problem for Apple when they created the Apple IIc. It used the 65c02 which fixed a lot of bugs in the 6502 that some software depended on. It was also a problem for some Amiga users when they upgraded to the 68010 or higher.
        2. timing. This can be a real pain since on a modern CPUs you can not cycle count. On a modern CPU the amount of time an instruction takes is not fixed. Again did the software you are tying to emulate do something really odd with timing? Sound issues are often caused by this.
        3. Bugs. No program is perfect. Emulators tend to multiply bugs. One bug my effect a dozen games.
        4. Lack of documentation. Even if you have perfect documentation for the hardware specs that isn't enough. Some developer somewhere will go outside the specs and try something strange just to see if it will work. When it does they will leave it in. Unless you have the source for every program you intend to run on your emulator the odds are pretty good you will miss something. Even if you do it is unlikely you will go through every line of code.
        What developers like about consoles is that you can program right down on the hardware to get the maximum performance. You know that each and every console will have exactly the same hardware.
        What emulator writers hate about consoles is that console developers program right down on the hardware. If you make the smallest mistake it will come back and get you.
        Just a short list of reasons.
        • Another major factor is speed. You can do cycle-perfect emulation -- most SNES, NES, and similar emulators do this -- but at major cost to speed. Or you can translate functionality -- most PSX and PS2 emulators translate graphics into OpenGL or DirectX calls -- but at the cost of accuracy.
        • It was also a problem for some Amiga users when they upgraded to the 68010 or higher.

          68010 was not a big problem, it's so similar to a 68000. 68020+ is much more problematic, to the point where some emulators allow you to start up on the original CPU.

          timing and bugs in the other hardware are a much bigger deal, though of course I am not saying you are wrong.

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by LWATCDR ( 28044 )
            Actually the 68010 wasn't a big problem if you followed the rules. The problem was that some programs didn't. One of them was the calculator that came with Amiga OS. They later fixed it.
            A bigger problem was that the 2091 card would set address 0 to some random number. That caused more than one program to have issues. I wrote a tiny utility to rest that address.

            • Re: (Score:2)

              by LoadWB ( 592248 ) *
              The 68010 issue was due to an instruction (MOV EA?) being made a Supervisor instruction rather than User. There were at least a couple of programs which emulated this instruction on-the-fly by catching the trap.

              As stated, not following the rules broke MANY programs during the move from 68000 to 68020 and above as many programs used unused bits in the A-registers (24 bits used on 68000/68010 versus all 32 bits on later CPUs) to hold data. Bad idea.

              IIRC, Apple had a similar problem -- something about a "pur

              • Re: (Score:2)

                by LWATCDR ( 28044 )
                I think your right but it was a LONG time ago. Funny thing it that there where so few rules for programing the Amiga I am shocked that so many people broke them.

      • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

        by Aladrin ( 926209 )
        The answer is actually amazingly simple. Programmers. Damn their souls. They find ways to trick the hardware into performing better, or at least APPEARING to perform better, that wasn't designed by the original hardware engineers. They use little-explored functions for un-imagined uses. They generally just use the system hard until you have to emulate the original hardware bug-for-bug or SOME game will fail horribly. There will always be a crazy programmer that managed to make bug X actually be a usef

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by JordanL ( 886154 )
      I wonder why people are forgetting the graveyard of broken promises that the X360 has yet to fulfill...
      • Because they're plowing the ground for the graveyard of broken promises the PS3 will fail to fulfill.
        • By the end of September 2006, there were 8,181 PS2 titles released worldwide (4,554 in Asia, 1,319 in North America, and 2,308 in Europe),[7] accounting for cumulative production shipments of 1.127 billion units.

          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_2 [wikipedia.org]

          Having issues with 130 or so games is PRETTY GOOD as far as backwards compatibility goes. Compare this to the 'how many?' original xbox games that play on the 360 - even now. Not to mention the fact that Microsoft's version of backwards compatibility is a
          • I fail to see how backwards compatability should be the key selling point of a console, yet everyone trots that out like it's a holy grail of gaming.

            Isn't the point of buying a new console to play... new games? One doesn't buy a next gen console solely for the sake of playing old games. Granted that is a use and a selling point, but it's not the god damned WHOLE point!
          • I do agree that the list of working backwards compatible games this makes the Xbox360 look foolish, but I'd be like half-way to affording a PS3 if I got a nickel for every time a Sony fanboy told me that PS3 is "so totally awesome because it is guaranteed to play all my PS1/PS2 games!!!!" I thought one of the better points of the PS3 was guaranteed backwards compatibility by including the old hardware.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by tlhIngan ( 30335 )

      i wonder tho, why was the ps2 so good at playing ps1 games

      It's because the PS2 actually included PSX hardware in it. There's a adjunct chip addtached to the Emotion Engine called the IO Processor, which is used to handle all the I/O in the system (controllers, DVD-ROM, sound, etc), very DMA-ish. This I/O processor basically includes the central processing core of the PSX as well - in PSX mode, the Emotion Engine would basically end up (with the Graphics Synthesizer) acting as the graphics chip, while the I/

      • Unlike the Xbox360, which has NO adjunct x86 processor, and instead relies on the 3 PowerPC cores to emulate the x86 CPU and translate graphics calls to the ATI GPU. Hence why backwards compatitibility is awful on the 360.

        Kind of surprising, since they bought the company that made a really good x86 emulator for PowerPC. VirtualPC gave something like 25-50% native performance, and all the DirectX-related stuff should be handled outside the emulator.

  • so does that mean the other 800 or 900 work fine? i don't own a ps2 or ps3 - i own a gamecube, but when i go into a gamestop (or something similar) it feels like there are thousands of play station games out there, me i've just got to look for the little bitty gc section.
    • Yeah, there are 900 games you would never want to play.
    • Well according to Wikipedia, Playstation [wikipedia.org] has about 1400 games, while the GameCube [wikipedia.org] has about 700 games. So, there's plenty of games for both systems, although Playstation has twice as many games. The difference you see in stores is due to the fact that there's many more people with a PS2, so the decide to dedicate more space to PS2 games. However, Being a GameCube owner I find that GameCube probably has as many good games, if not more than Playstation. Remember it's not the number of games that matter,
      • I've read this tripe before. Lets pretend you like very game on the GameCube. There's still more games you'd like on the PS2 than for the GameCube. There are 16 thousand total games for the PlayStation2. So some of them suck. Some of the big names one suck. There are a lot of good games for the PS2 however.

        If you have a Gamecube and really enjoy it, good, keep enjoying it. Personally, my Gamecube owning friends are jealous of my huge collection of really good games for the PS2 and I don't own anywher
    • so does that mean the other 800 or 900 work fine? i don't own a ps2 or ps3 - i own a gamecube, but when i go into a gamestop (or something similar) it feels like there are thousands of play station games out there, me i've just got to look for the little bitty gc section.

      There are about 16'000 different PS1 and PS2 titles, counting all regions... source [scei.co.jp].

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by _Hiro_ ( 151911 )
      Funny, every time I walk into a gaming store I'm reminded of how many cool games are available for GCN and I have a PS2.

      That's why I'm getting a Wii. Now I can play PS1, PS2, GCN, and Wii games all with only two consoles. If only someone would work in Saturn / Dreamcast / Sega CD support, I could unhook all these other disc-based consoles I own...
      • Funny, I have a GameCube and a PS2 and every time I walk into a gaming store, I'm reminded of how many cool games are not available for the GameCube.

        Frankly, most of the GameCube games seem to be rubbish.
      • That's why I'm getting a Wii. Now I can play PS1, PS2, GCN, and Wii games all with only two consoles. If only someone would work in Saturn / Dreamcast / Sega CD support, I could unhook all these other disc-based consoles I own...


        It's why I've got a Linux PC: Now I can play PS1, N64, XBox, SNES, NES, DOS, Windows, 68k Mac, C64, etc. games all on one box.

  • no sound? (Score:5, Funny)

    by c0reboarder ( 885528 ) on Monday November 13, 2006 @03:38PM (#16828214) Homepage
    Who needs sound for guitar hero or DDR, seriously?
  • I remember reading recently that any PS2 hard drive based games like FFXI and some others will not run on the PS3 for now, but there is a future patch coming down.
  • "In response to these issues, Sony's PR department pointed out that it, from the start, expected backwards compatibility to be less than 100%"

    So Sony's PR department expected backwards compatibility to be less than 100% from the start.

    Did Sony's PR department point out that backwards compatibility would be less than 100% from the start?

    I'll admit I haven't read every PS3-related press release, but have they been informing customers from the beginning that they too should not expect 100% compatability? I do

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by ivan256 ( 17499 )
      I don't remember reading anything like that, and based on the good backwards compatability of PS1 games on PS2 I expected the situation to be the same.

      There was PS1 -> PS2 incompatibility as well to the tune of a couple percent of the overall title list. The compatible titles differed even from revision to revision of the PS2. It sounds like the situation is the same.

    • Obvious. (Score:3, Interesting)

      by MikeFM ( 12491 )
      Anyone who buys a first version of a product has to expect bugs. If they don't then they obviously don't understand technology and consumer products. It sounds like they plan to offer free fixes as they discover and fix these little bugs so what's the big deal? If you don't want to help debug the product you're buying then wait until the third major release. It'd be different if they weren't going to offer free fixes for the problems.
      • My dad always says the same about cars. Don't buy a new model the first year it comes out, or after they do a major overhaul. Buy a car where they haven't really changed anything in the last couple of years and you'll have a lot less problems.

    • Re: (Score:1, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward
      The IO processor was changed in a later revision of the PS2 (silver slim). Games which didn't follow the TRC requirements mis-used the old functionality and broke when new functionality was introduced. The situation is still far better than the 360, ~30 games broken out of 2000 versus 300 games working.
      • The IO processor was changed in a later revision of the PS2 (silver slim). Games which didn't follow the TRC requirements mis-used the old functionality and broke when new functionality was introduced. The situation is still far better than the 360, ~30 games broken out of 2000 versus 300 games working.

        So those games break on the later versions of the PS2 also? Interesting. You'd think Sony would do what all the x86 manufacturers have had to do: Make all future hardware bug-for-bug compatible with old ha

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by dknj ( 441802 )
          x86 is a horrible mismash of backwards compatibility. the day we have to wipe the slate and start over will be the day x86 stability improves 10fold.
          • x86 is a horrible mismash of backwards compatibility

            My only disagreement with this statement is that you didn't use enough superlatives and explitives.

            the day we have to wipe the slate and start over will be the day x86 stability improves 10fold.

            Are you talking about software stability? I highly doubt ISA backward compatability is a significant source of instability. Old software may be unstable, but it would be unstable on old hardware or new. Windows backward compatability causes instability because it

          • They tried that, it was called Itanium, and one of the main criticisims of it was....that it ran x86 code poorly.

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by TGTilde ( 874930 )
      Actually they did state this. In fact they specifically stated that any game that didn't follow Sony's TRC (technical requirement chcklist) in creating PS2 games would NOT work on the PS3. They also said any game that needed a new peripheral, such as Guitar Hero, would NOT work. They didn't need to state specifically "We did not expect 100%" because the above infers this to be true. Source: http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/41353 [shacknews.com]
    • Sony made public statements earlier this year about how hard it was to support some PS2 games because the programmers hadn't followed the actual guidelines from Sony for programming the PS2, instead relying on undocumented behaviors. In those cases, I'm sure, it will turn out they will no longer be emulatable for the near future on the PS3.
  • I'm confused. If you need to play a PS2 game on the PS3, and it doesn't work well. WHY NOT PLUG IN YOUR PS2? I'm assuming you didn't purchase a bunch of PS2 games to sit on a shelf and collect dust. There must have been a PS2 in your greasy palms at some point.

    The PS3 is likely emulating a PS2 through a combination of hardware and software. Since 99.99% of the people buying a PS3 will want to play PS3 games on their PS3, this really isn't an earth shattering issue. For the small remaining crew, they have a

    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by PrescriptionWarning ( 932687 )
      the way I see it, is that people don't need several consoles hanging around the house, when instead they could have one or two that can play em all. If it were a perfect world, a PS3 could play any game ever made on CD or DVD, same with the xbox 360. That is, if they were more like PC's instead of proprietary pieces of hardware that they try to lock you in with the purchase of one over the other, or in the case where you're willing to blow more money, all of the above.

      too bad it ain't a perfect world. In
      • In a really weird world, though, the Xbox 360 would play PS2 games and the PS3 would play original Xbox games. :)

        My Nintendo Polyhedron that fell back in time, however, plays all games from all systems currently out and some that aren't out yet.

        The problem is it requires the user to smoke lots of Hash and drop some Acid before it becomes visible. Strange device, this future Nintendo machine.

        Oddly enough Windows games keep crashing on it.

        My huge and amazing library of linux games run flawlessly, though. Ma

    • Re:Why the bad press? (Score:5, Insightful)

      by fistfullast33l ( 819270 ) on Monday November 13, 2006 @03:56PM (#16828510) Homepage Journal

      Since 99.99% of the people buying a PS3 will want to play PS3 games on their PS3, this really isn't an earth shattering issue. For the small remaining crew, they have a PS2 they could hook up until the firmware updates roll out to correct it.

      While I agree with you that it's not earth-shattering, I'll also point out that there will be people who are trading in their PS2 to lower the price of their PS3, so it might not be a feasible option for everyone.

      • Not any more! They'll kept that sucker. Haha.

        How much do you honestly think you can get off a PS3 for a PS2, like 5 bucks? I'm seriously asking b/c I don't know if the value-proposition is worth it. If you can keep a working PS2 for a second TV or something, the tiny trade-in value might not be worth the loss of functionality.
        • How much do you honestly think you can get off a PS3 for a PS2, like 5 bucks? I'm seriously asking b/c I don't know if the value-proposition is worth it.

          No idea, but with the PS2-PS1 trade in, you could take $100 off the price of a PS2 by trading in your old system. I can't find anything official, but it looks like Gamestop will give you $60 for a PS2.

        • I work for a games chain in the UK and at the moment the trade on a PS2 is about £45. The PS3 will cost about £425 here at launch, so people would save around 10%.
      • There are also people in my category that don't own a PS2(PC and xbox gamer currently) but are concerned about the backwards compatibility simply so that we can also buy and play some of the hundreds of PS2 games when we buy a PS3. :)

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Chris Burke ( 6130 )
      I'm confused. If you need to play a PS2 game on the PS3, and it doesn't work well. WHY NOT PLUG IN YOUR PS2?

      Because your PS2 is broken, and instead of buying a new one you've been waiting for the PS3 to come out so you can play both next gen titles and your current library? All optical drives fail, original PS2s had many problems and even the slim ones seem to have (though mine is still running fine), so I'd wager there's actually more people in this category than you think. Sony must think so, because th
      • Yeah I see that point. My PS2 is certainly on it's way out.

        But I have to believe this is a matter of firmware updates and time-- not a permanent problem.
        • But I have to believe this is a matter of firmware updates and time-- not a permanent problem.

          Hopefully. It may end up like the 360 where you need to download a per-game patch, but hopefully a system-wide patch will fix the problem. I think this will mostly just ruffle the feathers of those who bought into Sony PR. Yes, that is foolish, but I don't think that means we should let the PR firm off the hook for being misleading either. If they jump on fixing the problem (instead of making dismissive stateme

    • because (Score:3, Insightful)

      by everphilski ( 877346 )
      ... you sold your PS2 and gave blood plasma for the past 6 months to finance your PS3 :)

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by whoop ( 194 )
      As someone who hasn't gotten around to getting a PS2 or GameCube, I'm still interested in the Wii/PS3 compatibility. There are huge libraries there for the picking, much cheaper than the new games. If you've never played the games, they're as good as "new."

      I'm more likely to get a Wii (price, looks a lot more fun). I can pick up Zelda, maybe one other Wii game, then hit the used stores and buy a buttload of $5-15 Gamecube games.

      Hmm, I suppose it's asking too much if the PS3 emulates PS1 games too?
    • When I get a PS3 (not this year, probably next) it will replace my PS2 because I have a lot of devices vying for video connections - even with a switchbox in place. Not to mention space devoted to various consoles, which females in the household seek to minimize.

      My PS2 still works just fine but it does have some problems with a few newer games that use blue discs, in particular Lego Star Wars. So I would love to have a PS3 that could also play a few current games I couldn't get to work on my existing box

  • More GH problems (Score:3, Insightful)

    by chrismcdirty ( 677039 ) on Monday November 13, 2006 @03:51PM (#16828412) Homepage
    I read on another site (possibly Destructoid) that Guitar Hero was having problems, due to the fact that you needed to hit a specific button (let's say 'X') that doesn't exist on a GH control. Then if you try to hotswap controls, you're told to turn on analog control, another feature which the GH control doesn't have.

  • Too many words... (Score:4, Funny)

    by ivan256 ( 17499 ) on Monday November 13, 2006 @03:54PM (#16828470)
    Really, what Zonk meant to say was:

    It sounds bad, but to put this in perspective I believe there are still far more PS2 games playable on the PS3 than there are Xbox games.

    All kidding aside, though... That list makes it look like the problems are minor... Basically HDD games aren't supported (They aren't supported on the actual PS2 anymore either) and some cut scenes have audio problems. Oh well.
    • There are only a handful of games that use the hDD, but already Sony has announced future support for Final Fantasy VII (or whichever one it was that ran on the PS2 HD). No way they could let that market drop!

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by paitre ( 32242 )
        FFXI, I believe, and Square-Enix made it quite clear that THEY weren't going to support the PS3, since porting would require a straight rewrite, and they weren't willing to to that for an MMORPG that's now 5 years old, and showing it's age. /shrug.
  • I think I recognized 5-10 of the games in that list. Given, I'm not a "hardcore" gamer by any definition... but are most of these games in Japan or something and the info is from that release and the trouble Japanese people are having? I didn't really notice if TFA said or not, so someone correct me if it didn't.

    Basically though, how many people in the US will this really impact? I'm certain that most of the other PS2 gamers out there have heard of and/or played more of those games than I've heard of... but

    • I was working on the PS3 earlier this year as part of small contract employment with Sony's U.S. R&D. I don't speak for Sony and don't know much definitively related to emulation (as I was mostly working on building PSGL and COLLADA code and samples for the CEB and DEH SDKs).

      While there, I was under the impression that the backwards-compatibility (i.e., PS2 emulation) software (including the small wrapper around the embedded PStwo chips that are planned to be phased out as soft-emu improves) has been

  • OMG PONIES (Score:2, Funny)

    by wampus ( 1932 )
    Can I still play Barbie's Horse Adventure?
  • Wait, didn't Sony include the PS2 hardware into the first gen PS3s percisely so this wouldn't happen?

    How can they not get 100% backwards compatibility when PS2 games run on the PS2 hardware?

  • The solution (Score:5, Funny)

    by InfinityWpi ( 175421 ) on Monday November 13, 2006 @04:04PM (#16828680)
    Sony needs to hire those guys from Bleem! to finish their emulation software! It's perfect for them!

    (This post has been modded -1: Way Too Dated A Reference)

    • Re: (Score:1, Funny)

      by Anonymous Coward
      You're dating yourself. But at least you're dating someone.

    • If mentioning bleem! is dating yourself, is mentioning that bleem! is an upside down acronym for 'pentium 133, windows' marrying yourself and setting down with a two door garage, 2.3 kids and a dog?

  • List not that bad (Score:4, Informative)

    by SuperKendall ( 25149 ) on Monday November 13, 2006 @04:18PM (#16828946)
    I have about 20 PS2 titles, and only one is on that list (Devil May Cry, attract mode sometimes freezes) - IGN has a better version [ign.com] of the list listing the games most people would care about, and also with more generic issues (like some USB device support in PS2 games being flaky, like microphones).

    As least you don't have older versions of popular games not being supported in order to push newer titles (Ridge Racer was not on that list).

    Also noted is that the PS3 does not support the multitap - but it does support multiple controllers directly in PS2 games (since the PS3 can support up to seven wireless controllers at a time).
  • Never buy a sony console at launch, there are always bugs. I had to replace both my original playstation one and two. However, this really isnt that big a deal, 196 games out of a library of three thousand or more games isnt so bad, and I bet sony will eventually fix most of these issues in an update , or it will be fixed in a later revision of the hardware unfortunately for early adopters (like the ability to read cd-r and dvd-r disks and adding progressive scan was in the playstation 2).
    • Never buy a sony console at launch, there are always bugs. I had to replace both my original playstation one and two. However, this really isnt that big a deal, 196 games out of a library of three thousand or more games isnt so bad, and I bet sony will eventually fix most of these issues in an update , or it will be fixed in a later revision of the hardware unfortunately for early adopters (like the ability to read cd-r and dvd-r disks and adding progressive scan was in the playstation 2).

      expand this to inc
  • Sony brags "our PS3 will be 100 percent backwards compatible because we are including a PS2 emotion chip in there". Oops. guess not.

    Sony brags "we'll have more than enough systems at launch". HA! if you believed that one I got a bridge to sell.

    Sony brags "Our system is best" are we going to listen?

    The problem with Sony is no one would care if you only could player 1200 out of 1400 games. However Sony can't stop hyping their system to the point where they promise so much that of course they are going to s
    • wheting our appetites at E3

      Huh? I dunno what E3 you could have gone to, but everyone was over at the Nintendo booth. The most people near the Sony booth was the massive line that went next to the Sony booth to the other side of the hall for the Nintendo booth. Sony's showing at E3 was abysmal. Both with their "Riiiddddggggggggeeeee Raaaacccccccceerrrrrr" & "Flip the gian crab over for massive damage" demos and the games in general at E3. All Sony has had going for them since E3 is their hype machine.
      • My point was that they should have tempted us then, and then been quiet. Same with the E3 before it.

        Both E3s showed that people didn't care about the PS3, and were interested in the Wii (why do you think we got motion control?) so they got paranoid and just started over hyping the system.
  • My copy of "Daito Giken Premium PACHISURO Collection Yoshimune" won't work on my new PS3. I am pissed. Um, could anyone tell me what "Daito Giken Premium PACHISURO Collection Yoshimune" translates to in English? Thanks.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by patio11 ( 857072 )
      Daito Giken is the name of a particular manufacturer of gambling machines (you can see which at www.daitogiken.com). Pachisuro is short for Pachinko/Slot. Yoshimune is another name. So, basically, a forgettable bargain basement gambling game.

    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by DubbaJ ( 691044 )
      Daito Giken Premium PACHISURO Collection Yoshimune loosly translated is "Duke Nukem Forever" in Engrish.
  • Unlike Microsoft who SAID they would improve backwards compatability and then abandoned it after a few more 360 titles were released....
  • Ok, some PS2 games don't work well on the PS3, but what about PS1 compatibility?
  • I'm actually pretty impressed with the backwards compatibility as reported so far. At least it seems that most games will work without problem.

    This is in contrast with the Xbox 360 backwards compatibilty which is such a total joke that I can't believe anyone even bothers to mention it as a feature. On the 360 there isn't any way to move an old save from an Xbox, huge numbers of games don't work at all, and those that do are not guaranteed to behave the same way.

    I'm not complaining about the 360; it's a

  • I believe there are still far more PS2 games playable on the PS3 than there are Xbox games playable on the 360.

    There are also a lot more ps2 games than original Xbox games. It would be interesting to see a % comparison.

    I think its just different views of the companies that drove their backcompat efforts. Microsoft with only their second console wants to make sure that every game they port works, while Sony knows economically thats not possible with the large title library, so they say 'here ya go, if it

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