City Officials Almost Ban Foam Cups 1055
localhost00 writes "The city of Aliso Viejo, CA nearly banned foam cups when they learned they are produced from a substance known as 'dihydrogen monoxide.' A paralegal working for the city apparantly found a professionally designed web site put up to describe the dangerous properties of this chemical.
Apparantly, the report about Dihydrogen Monoxide was written by a then 14-year-old Nathan Zohner who was researching the gullibility of fifty ninth graders."
You know they forgot... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:You know they forgot... (Score:5, Funny)
It's sad what people will believe.
Re:You know they forgot... (Score:5, Funny)
Heh, semi-related true story.
Years back I was a starving student working at a paint store. We jugged our own 4L paint thinners from large holding tanks out back. Anyhow, I jugged a few 4L containers of tap water. Then I printed out some nice labels that said "LATEX PAINT THINNER" with the usual comments about adding slowly, stirring well, etc.
Priced them at $3.99/4L and people would actually bring the up to the cashier. We'd tell them there that it was a joke so there was no ripping off done.
Re:You know they forgot... (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:You know they forgot... (Score:5, Interesting)
Of course they're scams / humor sites, but they look really real!
I'm somewhat surprised by these, too. I believe they're encouraging people to commit a felony (identity theft), as well as fraud (not paying debts). I believe this may mean they are engaging in a criminal conspiracy, even if they don't know the other parties to the conspiracy. IANAL, someone please review and respond?
Here's some links:
Re:You know they forgot one more (Score:4, Funny)
Creationist Science Fair [jesussave.us]
Re:You know they forgot... (Score:5, Funny)
"Will all the single cell organisms in the room please raise their hands!"
I was amazed to find my self as one of three kids not to do so, the entire rest of the class had a hand in the air. And people wonder why teachers suffer under a constant nagging feeling that they are wasting their time.
Dihydrogen Monoxide *is* dangerous (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Dihydrogen Monoxide *is* dangerous (Score:5, Funny)
(That was a great episode of Penn & Teller's show,btw)
Re:Dihydrogen Monoxide *is* dangerous (Score:4, Interesting)
hyponatremia (Score:5, Informative)
Hyponatremia a Concern for Marathon Runners [coolrunning.com]
I know the Slashdot stereotype is that nobody *here* has to worry about such things, but actually, I bet there are people in the Slashdot community who run this far and this hard.
Re:hyponatremia (Score:4, Interesting)
Even for non-runners (Score:5, Informative)
The most common scenario where I've seen symptomatic hyponatremia in a non-athlete is in a syndrome called SIADH (AKA: Syndrome of Inappropriate Anti-Diuretic Hormone). I've rarely seen it in psychiatric patients who compulsively drink massive quantities of fluids as part of their psychosis... Believe it or not, it's actually possible to drink enough water that you dilute out your electrolytes.
Anti-Diuretic Hormone is what determines the final concentration of your urine (ie. how much free water your kidneys scavenge from the filtrate in your kidneys)... it works in the kidney's distal tubules. Interestingly, ADH is inhibited by ethanol. Ever wonder how beer seems to go through you so quickly? Well, the answer is that it really doesn't... part of that massive urination is from the alcohol inhibiting ADH secretion, your kidneys start dumping free water, and you start peeing like a racehorse. The result? You get dehydrated; one of the major contributors to the discomfort of hangovers. Heh... a bag or two of IV fluids does wonders for a hangover.
Dilutional Hyponatremia is relatively easy to fix (obviously depending on severity)... just restrict fluid intake. In the case of SIADH, you also have to hunt for the cause... some lung cancers are notorious for secreting excess Anti-Diuretic Hormone.
Note that severe hyponatremia is life-threatening... you can have refractory seizures, coma, and profound mental status changes. Fixing it too quickly is also dangerous, and can cause a nasty (and permanent) condition called Central Pontine Myelinolysis [emedicine.com]... definitely not on the top-ten-diseases-to-have list.
Re:Dihydrogen Monoxide *is* dangerous (Score:5, Interesting)
Legal ecstasy tablets probably would include an information sheet detailing safe usage practicesm and this would never have happened. However, the government, breweries and the tobacco companies all would prefer for you to believe that she was killed by a tab of ecstasy.
Wait a minute (Score:5, Informative)
Ecstasy (MDMA) is chemically related to the amphetamine family, and has many of the same effects. One of the side-effects of Ecstasy is hyperthermia... an elevation of body temperature that can lead to rhabdomyolysis (mass breakdown of muscle tissue, often leading to kidney failure), brain damage, and death.
Ecstasy acts primarily on the serotonergic and dopaminergic neurons in the CNS, and appears to irreversably harm the former (documented pathologically in animal studies, and observationally in humans). Interestingly, Prozac and some of the SSRI drugs seem to partially antagonize the effects of Ecstasy (but if you're planning on stopping your anti-depressant so you can get a better buzz on the weekend, you need serious help).
There's another problem: you never know what you're getting when you buy street drugs. Unless you have a degree in organic chemistry and are making your own (which can be done), it pays to be cautious.
Maybe you've taken ecstasy hundreds of times and had no problem... good for you. But ecstasy is not harmless... I've seen it go wrong, and it's not pretty.
Re:Wait a minute (Score:5, Insightful)
Alcohol and many other legalized drugs have been around not just for decades but for centuries. We have a solid and firm knowledge of the health risks these drugs present and how to manage those health risks.
MDMA [Ecstasy] has been in common usage for only the past few decades at the outside. There have not yet been adequate tests preformed to gauge the effect MDMA will have on users over a long period of time, particularly recreational users as opposed to prescription users.
One strong argument against many kinds of drug legalization is that it is well and truly possible to kill yourself with an overdose without trying very hard. The only legal RECREATIONAL drug this is possible with at the moment is alcohol, which requires a fair bit of effort to actually induce alcohol poisoning.
Note -- I am aware that impaired judgment can kill and that Alcohol may cause judgment to be impaired. Of course, getting a blowjob can also cause judgment to be impaired. Neither is really safe while driving. Care should be exercised when under the influence of any mind altering susbstance (booze, pot, sorority chicks, Bawls, etc)
Re:Dihydrogen Monoxide *is* dangerous (Score:5, Funny)
1: More than 98 percent of convicted felons are bread eaters.
2: Fully HALF of all children who grow up in bread-consuming households score below average on standardized tests.
3: In the 18th century, when virtually all bread was baked in the home, the average life expectancy was less than 50 years; infant mortality rates were unacceptably high; many women died in childbirth; and diseases such as typhoid, yellow fever and influenza ravaged whole nations.
4: More than 90 percent of violent crimes are committed within 24 hours of eating bread.
5: Bread is made from a substance called "dough." It has been proven that as little as one pound of dough can be used to suffocate a mouse. The average American eats more bread than that in one month!
6: Primitive tribal societies that have no bread exhibit a low occurrence of cancer, Alzheimer's, Parkinson's disease and osteoporosis.
7: Bread has been proven to be addictive. Subjects deprived of bread and given only water to eat begged for bread after only two days.
8: Bread is often a "gateway" food item, leading the user to "harder" items such as butter, jelly, peanut butter and even cold cuts.
9: Bread has been proven to absorb water. Since the human body is more than 90 percent water, it follows that eating bread could lead to your body being taken over by this absorptive food product, turning you into a soggy, gooey bread-pudding person.
10: Newborn babies can choke on bread.
11: Bread is baked at temperatures as high as 400 degrees Fahrenheit! That kind of heat can kill an adult in less than one minute.
12: Most American bread eaters are utterly unable to distinguish between significant scientific fact and meaningless statistical babbling.
Wow (Score:4, Funny)
This stuff is nothing...l (Score:4, Funny)
Nah. The really deadly stuff (Score:4, Funny)
It makes dihydrogen monoxide look like water in comparison...
Re:Nah. The really deadly stuff (Score:4, Informative)
It MUST be true! (Score:5, Funny)
Re:It MUST be true! (Score:5, Insightful)
Its designed to catch people with knee jerk reactions that cant be bothered to do even a brief investigation of the facts. Its a way of showing the people that are always claiming the sky is falling for the fools that they are.
Re:It MUST be true! (Score:5, Informative)
I believe this is the original. The page slashdot linked to is just someone rehashing the idea and putting up a different take on it. The person running the link I provided claims to have had their page up for a decade and on gopher for several years before that. So yes, you could say fraud for the slashdot linked website, but the original is 100% factual, and I give them the credit.
Why does this surprise me it is in California? (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Why does this surprise me it is in California? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Why does this surprise me it is in California? (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Why does this surprise me it is in California? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Why does this surprise me it is in California? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Why does this surprise me it is in California? (Score:5, Informative)
With a small amount of research I'm sure you can pull up stupid laws and occurences for just about every state in the union. You want to know why people love california? Let me list some reasons without trying to sound like a tourist commercial:
- Extremely varying climates all within a relatively small area (i.e. Desert, Beach, Mountains all within a hour or so of each other)
- Strong cultural heritage throughout the state
- Southern california has some of the best weather in the US, bar-none.
- Napa Valley, Big Bear, Hollywood, Alcatraz, Catalina Island, Sea World, just to name a few
If you're looking for real reasons not to move to California, I can give you those too:
- Everything is expensive
- California traffic has been compared to a day in hell
- major metropolitan areas are very crowded.
- no smoking in bars or restaurants (seriously)
Obviously they did zero research on this before they had their knee-jerk reaction
I think the irony in that statement has been accurately summed up =)
Just came in (Score:5, Funny)
Worker's Comp (Score:5, Funny)
Ah, the perils of lifeguarding.
DHM (Score:4, Funny)
Content on the Web (Score:5, Insightful)
but.... (Score:5, Insightful)
this isn't an Internet thing... get a grip.
Just like falling for stories at Slashdot (Score:5, Insightful)
Scientifically illiterate population (Score:4, Insightful)
pig ignorant of basic science that they'd fall for
this hoax. Didn't they listen AT ALL at school? But this seems to be a general problem in the population as a whole , even amongst suppposed intellectuals (read: arts & MBA
graduates) and yet amazingly they're not even usually embarrsed about it. The only reason they are in this story is because it was made public. If their ignorance was revealed in private
they probably wouldn't give a damn , yet if they'd found to be wanting in knowledge of business or the humanities they'd probably go red faced.
Re:Scientifically illiterate population (Score:5, Informative)
Jimmy Carter.
Mod Parent Up (Score:5, Informative)
Besides, the grandparent poster short-changes those of us who do have science/math backgrounds, who are passionate about politics, and who have considered getting more involved.
Google News to the rescue (Score:5, Informative)
--
Google News is fun [google.com]
Almost... (Score:5, Funny)
And this is almost news...
A poem. (Score:5, Funny)
Little Johnny was a chemist.
Little Johnny is no more.
'Cause what he thought was H2O.
Was really H2SO4
Honestly, though... (Score:4, Insightful)
So before you start lambasting Kawhlefornia (Terminator speak for California), remember these shows prove it happens everywhere.
Oh look a puppy!
A sad example of our times (Score:5, Insightful)
I think our approach to designing products aimed at the lowest common denominator might actually be responsible for all of this. Think about it the next time you pick up a cup of coffee with a warning on it stating that coffee is hot. If a paralegal (a "research expert" if you will) can be fooled by a smart 14-year old, what does that say about our society?
Our education is responsible for this, not designs (Score:4, Interesting)
This is a consequence, not the cause. The problem is our education system and the way it encourages stupidity. Read about that and the solution to it in th
Montessori Method. It's old and, sadly, is the sort of stuff nobody teaches children any more.
Re:A sad example of our times (Score:5, Interesting)
I'm not sure one can blame education or general intelligence for this -- at least not directly.
What we may have lost is the ability to detect bullshit. The tendency seems to be for adults to accept official looking information presented in an expected manner, or to believe statements from someone holding a microphone in front of a video camera.
I say "adults" only because I've seen a few "man on the street" spoofs where adults are caught up while their children look on in disbelief just before calling bullshit on the so-called interviewer. Some of Rick Mercer's [www.cbc.ca] "Talking to Americans" segments are particularly memorable examples.
Of course, this is completely anecdotal on my part. Not to mention some of the folks who got caught on this particular hoax were young adults. Adult enough, perhaps, to start believing what "experts" suggest to them without thinking critically about what is being presented to them.
The problem is a lack of critical thinking, I suggest, and not some arbitary level of intelligence (which is impossible to measure and compare, anyway).
Examples about making change or spelling may be a bit misleading. I've never been strong with arithmetic (not mathematics) even though I worked for years in the service industry. I never learned the tricks and shortcuts people use to quickly calculate change or percentages. I'm not sure there is much my schooling could have provided to help this. After 35 years I just know I should use a calculator, and check my figures twice.
Many people find spelling problematic. Especially English spelling, which is hardly a normalized language; being a good English speller requires a fair amount of sheer memorization. In fact, new research suggests that some so-called learning disabilities have almost nothing to do with intelligence or ability to learn. Dyslexics have different brains that may actually be better at some tasks than non-dyslexic brains. Dyslexics can read and comprehend letters and words the same as everyone else, but the part of the brain the recognizes words shapes and establishes a lexicon "buffer" is the problem.
The fifty-ninth grade (Score:5, Funny)
You'd think when they'd been in school THAT long, they wouldn't be so gullible!
Old joke, maybe? (Score:5, Informative)
Styrofoam is easy to recycle (Score:5, Funny)
It is nasty stuff unless properly diluted (Score:5, Funny)
It is best to dilute it slightly with ethanol, as this kills the bugs.
Adding hops, barley, yeast, and letting it mix for a while is a very good way of adding the ethanol.
CA environmental stuff is wayyyy over the top (Score:4, Interesting)
Anyway the inspectors came around to check them out; and insisted on knowing what their cleanup method would be if they spilled the stuff.
"We don't need one."
At this point the inspector went into rant mode, threatening extensive punitive penalties if a cleanup methodology wasn't produced immediately.
(Indeed so effective was the desert at catalysing the peroxide, the team were jokingly considering abandoning their expensive silver catalysts, and using desert instead... but I digress.)
Wrong name.... (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Come on CA (Score:5, Insightful)
Nice, law making officials have been put on the same level of discerning information as a class of high school freshman. This gives me great confidence in our legaslative bodies.
Re:Come on CA (Score:5, Insightful)
Which is not a blank check to politicians, letting them go out and debug their way to a reasonable course of action.
Ultimately, if we're that pissed off about stuff, we have to get involved, whereupon we'll see some of the complexities involved.
Re:Come on CA (Score:5, Interesting)
I'm not worried about honest mistakes, but unhonest exploitation of the gullible does worry me. Legal professionals (the wealthy ones) understand all too well how to exaggerate the truth and worse, how to sugar-coat a lie.
Honest mistakes are forgivable. But, exaggeration on the other hand, well I'm not so sure about that.
Re:Come on CA (Score:5, Funny)
In fact, exaggeration is utterly unforgivable in all circumstances.
Re:Come on CA (Score:5, Funny)
Troc.
Re:Come on CA (Score:4, Funny)
It all makes sense now. All that stuff from Bush and co. about WMDs was really their contribution to the magical world of storytelling. Tuly a labor of love. The rest of the world should be so fortunate to have literary geniuses such as them in power.
Re:Come on CA (Score:4, Insightful)
And for the record, even though I did very well in high school and college chemistry, I missed the "dihydrogen monoxide" reference at first. However, I never presumed to be knowledgable enough to actually make a policy creating decision on the matter either...they did.
Re:Come on CA (Score:5, Insightful)
If people are writing code that has similar effects to laws, ie people go to jail or get executed, get money taken from them by force in the form of fines, or otherwise effect people's lives in a nonvoluntary way, then they better damn well get it right on first execution after its release.
Re:Come on CA (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Come on CA (Score:5, Insightful)
1. Just because it's on the Internet does not make it an authoritative source. I find the Internet to be a large shallow source, good for getting a direction and possible further sources for research, but not a replacement for libraries, technical journals/publications and a thousand other, more traditional, knowledge resources.
2. In the words of Mark Twain, "common sense isn't!"
3. Intelligence is not a prime prerequisite for paralegals or politicians.
Pretty easy to take potshots at elected officials...
Politicians make it soooo easy to take potshots at them! If they don't like being shot at, maybe they should quit painting targets on themselves. In other words, if they don't like being called stupid, they should stop doing stupid things!
Re:Come on CA (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Come on CA (Score:4, Insightful)
Exactly the reason why government should be kept as small as possible. Just as a reasonable operating system doesn't give every user super-user access, we shouldn't entrust the people's freedoms and rights to the government.
Re:Come on CA (Score:5, Insightful)
Otherwise you could just make a slick web page saying that Windows gives you cancer, and they'd ban it too!
Hey, wait a minute....
Re:Come on CA (Score:5, Funny)
"Oxygen is a very toxic gas and an extreme fire hazard. It is fatal in
concentrations of as little as 0.000001 p.p.m. Humans exposed to the
oxygen concentrations die within a few minutes. Symptoms resemble very
much those of cyanide poisoning (blue face, etc.). In higher
concentrations, e.g. 20%, the toxic effect is somewhat delayed and it
takes about 2.5 billion inhalations before death takes place. The reason
for the delay is the difference in the mechanism of the toxic effect of
oxygen in 20% concentration. It apparently contributes to a complex
process called aging, of which very little is known, except that it is
always fatal.
However, the main disadvantage of the 20% oxygen concentration is in the
fact it is habit forming. The first inhalation (occurring at birth) is
sufficient to make oxygen addiction permanent. After that, any
considerable decrease in the daily oxygen doses results in death with
symptoms resembling those of cyanide poisoning.
Oxygen is an extreme fire hazard. All of the fires that were reported in
the continental U.S. for the period of the past 25 years were found to be
due to the presence of this gas in the atmosphere surrounding the buildings
in question.
Oxygen is especially dangerous because it is odorless, colorless and
tasteless, so that its presence can not be readily detected until it is
too late.
-- Chemical & Engineering News February 6, 1956"
Re:Come on CA (Score:4, Insightful)
I guess they must have asked someone, since they figured out what dihydrogen monoxide is and the scheduled vote was removed from the agenda. I'd say whatever error-checking system they have in place worked pretty well. The issue never came to a vote.
Re:Come on CA (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Come on CA (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Come on CA (Score:4, Interesting)
You're assuming consumption is by inhalation; by ingestion, especially in concentrated form (hashish or THC tablets), it is surely possible.
Just as it is difficult to achieve alcohol poisoning when drinking normally because of the same self-limiting effects (although it is possible), it is also possible to chug a litre of pure ethanol and likely induce death.
Re:Come on CA (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Come on CA (Score:4, Interesting)
hahahaha, heehehehehehe, hahaha, there's a tree, hee hee hee, CRASH!
you get the idea.
Yes, I get the idea that you're probably one of the ones that shouldn't be smoking pot. You know, in about 18 years of smoking the stuff and being around people who do, I have never met ONE person that would behave like your described scenario. The dumb-ass giggly shtick, I always took that to be a hollywood fabrication. "Reefer Madness" and its influence springs to mind. But I guess some people just can't handle mind-altering substances.
I recall hearing about a study that tested (in simulators) driving abilities of straight, stoned, and drunk people. Guess what? The stoners tended to be the more careful, better drivers. Part of that I think is that when you're high, you know you're high, you know you need to compensate for attention-span etc. When your piss-drunk, you tend to forget that you're drunk, and figure being a complete idiot is just normal behavior.
I got 150 on an IQ test right after sucking down a huge bowl of weed. I would never have been able to do that while drunk.
Re:Come on CA (Score:5, Funny)
I, OTOH, had my faith (or lack thereof) in bureaucrats confirmed.
Re:Come on CA (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Come on CA (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Come on CA (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Come on CA (Score:4, Interesting)
Did you consider that the paralegal could've been the patsy [reference.com] to save face for the elected official ?
Re:Come on CA (Score:4, Funny)
I KNOW! Isn't it great!?! I never in my life expected them to be as on the ball as high school kids.
Scientific Illiteracy is tragic (Score:5, Insightful)
Unfortunately science education is not mandatory like english and basic math are. Nor is it taught in a manner that supports curiousity and interest.
Given that we live in an increasingly technical dependent society it's scary to find pseudoscience and scientific ignorance so rapidly on the rise. For those struggling to separate science and pseudoscience, a good book putting science's role into a clearer perspective is Carl Sagan's book: "The Demon Haunted World, Science as a Candle in the Dark." I have a few copies and lend it to people when they need it. (Note: there are other good books too this is just one that comes to mind).
The underlying skills of critical thought and a healthy dose of skepticism are the basis of good science. Even basic concepts like Occam's razor [vub.ac.be] are not widely understood or accepted. People need to be made to understand that science is not just ugly formulas in physics class, but that it forms the basis for all things that define our modern high standard of living.
If less than 1% of congress men ever elected have any scientific background how do you expect them to put forth a meaningful policy on scientific education or even understand basic issues.
Rather than sitting here in self congratulatory bliss about other people ignorance, we should take our responsibility as the scientifically literate (to some degree anyway) seriously and do what we can to educate people around us. Take an active role in science outreach programs, or at the very least lobby your elected representatives.
Yes, it is a slow difficult up hill battle, but 300 years ago 95% of the population was illiterate, today most can read and write. This is mostly due to a number of dedicated individuals that convinced their government of the need for literacy.
Ignorance is bliss... Unfortunately for me its to late...
Re:Come on CA (Score:4, Interesting)
They SHOULD ban styrofoam (Score:5, Informative)
Re:They SHOULD ban styrofoam (Score:5, Funny)
Yes, but it keeps my coffee so toasty warm!
Re:They SHOULD ban styrofoam (Score:5, Funny)
Re:They SHOULD ban styrofoam (Score:5, Interesting)
But on the bright side, you can dissolve styrofoam in gasoline (or other hydrocarbons). When you add enough, the solution becomes viscous and sticky (just like honey). If you love the smell of napalm in the morning, styrofoam is your friend. :)
Re:They SHOULD ban styrofoam (Score:5, Funny)
Re:They SHOULD ban styrofoam (Score:5, Interesting)
We used to do this in the boy scouts. We'd then pour/mold the mixture onto a newspaper, twist the newspaper around the stuff, and make a "starter log" for camping. Make 'em two or three inches thick, throw a couple into your fire pit, and you've got a great way to start a fire. Very good for drying out damp wood and getting a blaze going.
Re:They SHOULD ban styrofoam (Score:4, Informative)
Styrofoam is the polymer polystyrene in foam form, that is, with a lot of small gas bubbles. Google tells me that commonly used gases are ethylene, CFCs (not commonly anymore), and HCFCs. These gases are not particularly toxic to humans, but can be an environmental issue (i.e., the hole in the ozone layer), especially CFCs and HCFCs.
Re:They SHOULD ban styrofoam (Score:5, Funny)
I used to have this idiot friend Mike when I was a kid (14 or so). I was a freshman in high school, and he was a grade below me (in middle school).
One day I was showing him just that; taking styrofoam and disolving it in gasoline makes a pretty nice fire display. We had our fun in the backyard, and left the rest in a bucket outside.
A month goes by. Mike calls me up asking if he can have what's left in the bucket. I say sure, why not.
Now the styrofoam we used was the green stuff that veggies and meat are served in, so when we started it was a nice green slime. Now it had the consistency of Play-Doh.
I thought nothing of this, until the next day, @ lunch, when there was a schoolwide announcement: "WOULD ARTHUR PEALE PLEASE COME TO THE PRINCIPAL'S OFFICE IMMEDIATELY!" yes, those capital letters are there to display the fact that they were SHOUTING into the microphone, as well as having turned the volume almost all the way up on the PA system.
I head to the main office, and the secretary looks at me and says, "Oh, you're in trouble now, Arthur! Go see Mr. Perry, the Vice Principal."
I enter his office, and that's when I notice the two uniformed police officers standing there. They invite me to have a seat.
At this point I have no clue what's going on, until one officer says "Arthur, I'd like to see your license to make explosives, please."
I, of course, being 14, did not have one. I was clueless about what was going on, until they mentioned a green substance that a "Mike Parsons" had brought to school, and had been lighting out in the parking lot with some friends of his.
Aparently word got around to what he was doing, someone approached a teacher, the police and fire department were called, along with a bomb unit. The stuff looked so strange and alien they had no clue what kind of explosive it was. It was being treated very gingerly.
After I told the officers what it was, they told me that they weren't going to press charges. Mike got a week suspension, and I went back to class.
Re:They SHOULD ban styrofoam (Score:5, Informative)
Perhaps it can be recycled well in theory, but it is rare for it to be recycled, especially when used for fast food containers.
A lot of people just throw it wherever, and once out in nature it lasts virtually forever, unlike products made from alternative materials like paper and starch.
tree huggin' (Score:5, Insightful)
I don't mean to be pedantic, but your point does expose a rift between different sorts of environmentalists. A true "tree hugger" would far prefer the use of styrofoam to that of paper which comes from - dare I say - trees!
Another great battle is over wind power. You'd think all the environmentalists would be on top of that one. Not so - it disrupts migratory patterns and splatters a lot of birds, so many conservationists are against it. Same with things like tidal power (similar effect on fish).
Again, pedanticism aside, the environmental "faction" is far more fractured than you might think. Frequently the anti-global-warming, conservation, and wilderness camps take diametrically opposing views.
Re:They SHOULD ban styrofoam (Score:5, Insightful)
Cardboard soaked with organic grease burns fairly cleanly, especially if it isn't the only thing drawing the fire. It's made from plants, so it's not going to add any more CO2 to the atmosphere. It reduces the amount of fossil fuels used for cooking. It reduces the need to transport used containers to recycling plants {which often uses as much or more energy than initial manufacture}.
Burning food packaging in the stoves used to cook the food seems to make perfect sense
Re:Come on CA (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Come on CA (Score:4, Funny)
My new career: Supermodel (Score:5, Funny)
I learned a lot from the recent election in California. I learned that you can get a job even when you have no qualifications. So, I've decided to be a supermodel.
Re:Please allow me (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:The funny thing is, DHMO isn't even the right n (Score:4, Insightful)
Since when have hoaxes needed accurate info?
Only geeks or
Re:The funny thing is, DHMO isn't even the right n (Score:5, Informative)
No, it is actually technically correct. (The best kind of correct!) [geocities.com] In chemistry naming conventions you usually use this sort of naming convention for binary nonmetal-nonmetal chemicals.
For example:
NO2 - nitrogen dioxide
N2O - dinitrogen monoxide
N2O5 - dinitrogen pentoxide
CO2 - carbon dioxide
So it does make sense to say:
H2O - dihydrogen monoxide
However the name hydrogen hydroxide is incorrect since that would indicate that the OH part of HOH (H2O ) is an ion and that the extra hydrogen is ionically bonded to it. This is not the case, in H2O both hydrogens are covalently bonded to the central oxygen atom.
You can see more about chemical naming conventions here. [widener.edu]
You have you facts confused (Score:5, Insightful)
You really should check your electronegativies before saying bonds are covalent. This is pretty basic chemistry and explains amongst other things why water is liquid at livable temperatures for we humans and many other phenomenon.
You can find more about naming of chemical structures via IUPAC [iupac.org] the International Union of Pure and Applied Chemists
Re:You have you facts confused (Score:4, Informative)
Just because a molecule can dissociate that does not mean that it is bonded ionically. Each hydrogen in H2O is bonded equally to the oxygen atom in what is called a sp^3 hybrid orbital, where the 2s orbital of the oxygen atom combines with the three 2p orbitals of the same atom in order to form four sp^3 hybrid orbitals. Two of those orbitals are taken up with unbonded electron pairs and each of the other two orbitals are covalently bonded to a hydrogen atom. You can see more about this on this web site. [boisestate.edu]
Electronegativity really does not enter the picture here. Yes, oxygen is highly electronegative and it will tend to "pull" the electrons toward itself but that only means that the water molecule will be highly polar (and only because the charge separation is not symmetrical about all of the axis of the molecule). It is true that more highly electronegative atoms tend to form more ionic compounds than less highly electronegative atoms, but there are other factors at work here. For example, if you look at this web page [wikipedia.org] you will see that the difference between the Pauling elecronegativities of hydrogen and oxygen is 3.5 - 2.1 = 1.4. By most definitions an ionic compound should have a difference in elecronegativity of at least 2.0. So water is a covalent molecule even by that definition.
By the way, IAAC (I Am A Chemist)
Re:The funny thing is, DHMO isn't even the right n (Score:4, Informative)
The correct name is "dihydrogen oxide". Theres no need to put the "mono" on the oxygen. If you dont believe me, you can look at NIST's chemistry webbook...
http://webbook.nist.gov/cgi/cbook.cgi?Name=Dihydr