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Windows XP Has Arrived 1218

ruszka writes "CNN has a good article on the release of Windows XP in London and NYC.. The BBC has their own article." I find it amusing that I didn't really even notice until I saw this submission. I know this affects a fair number of users but for the life of me I just don't know why ;)
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Windows XP Has Arrived

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  • Queuing... (Score:2, Funny)

    by swordboy ( 472941 )


  • by dmorin ( 25609 ) < minus bsd> on Thursday October 25, 2001 @09:39AM (#2476979) Homepage Journal
    Know what really, truly scares me about XP? This morning on the Howard Stern show he gave time to 3 callers (well, 2 actually because he got bored) to blatantly do a commercial. And when I changed the channel, another morning talk station was talking about it too! I mean, the hell?! Since when does the release of a new piece of software from the world's biggest software company suddenly mean everybody has to start plugging it?

    On a good note, the first guy was so boring (talking about why XP is cool because it's on a 32bit kernel, not a 16bit one on top of DOS like Win98/ME) that Howard and crew got very bored. So he gave the second guy a chance, who pointed out the bit about having to register every machine, etc... to which Howard summed up "So let's all get together and not buy this thing." And that was the end of that. Gotta wonder if that third guy was gonna be pro or against Microsoft.

    • Microsoft's revenue streams are in danger of drying up unless they can get a lock on people through MS-Passport. MS can leverage Hotmail and other online services by purchasing them and forcing migration to MS-Passport, but that can only happen on the desktop through upgrades to XP.

      XP has improvements, but there's no exciting reason to upgrade. Plus, with all of the security concerns finally ,the press release the other week coming down on publishing exploits is a tacit admisision that MS products can compete in a real world security environment.

      So they have to compete through saturation advertising. The Register [] has had a few articles over the last few weeks. Here's last weeks warning about the salvo we're experiencing : Microsoft will kick off a $200 million marketing campaign on Monday 15 October to create consumer awareness of upcoming Windows XP. [] They also explained how MS was able to insert a press release into Reuters [].

      • If the launch was/is held outdoors, it would be funny if there was a protest march against Bill gates.

        I mean. it isn't like he hasn't made enemies, or gotten people rather upset from time to time. Yers I know he is the most loved person on the planet.

        You know it would make the news.

        In fact, The protest marches would probably be the next big thing. I can see it now, the million geek march.

  • why it affects us (Score:2, Interesting)

    by gavlil ( 255585 )
    I know this affects a fair number of users but for the life of me I just don't know why ;)

    windows is a major part of computing and of history. many people who work it IT have to come in to contact with windows (like it or not).

    there are hundreds of reasons why it would affect us - even if its just because we have a new set of themes to d/l for X!

    dont be so ignorant to the world outside slashdot taco (yes one does exist!)
    • windows is a major part of computing and of history. many people who work it IT have to come in to contact with windows (like it or not).

      What? I haven't come in contact with Windows at all...

      An exception OE has occurred at 0028:C2A4785E in VxD tcpip(01) + 00001EBE.
      This was called from 0028:C001AE74 in VxD NDIS(01) + 0000378C. It may be possible to continue normally.
    • by micromoog ( 206608 ) on Thursday October 25, 2001 @10:22AM (#2477305)
      ...many people who work it IT have to come in to contact with windows...

      Except for those who work in the server room. Sunlight messes up the air-conditioning.

  • by opusbuddy ( 164089 ) on Thursday October 25, 2001 @09:40AM (#2476986) Homepage
    I dunnaknow. I've kind of gotten used to the blue screen of death. Tells me when it's time to go to the bathroom.

  • ...about things like digital rights. The CNN piece clearly states in the first paragraph:

    The system promises fewer computer crashes and will allow users to delete data from their hard drive.

    That's should satisfy everyone, right?

    • by Anonymous Coward
      That's why I hated Windows ME so much. It didn't have a delete function and I filled up my 40GB drive and then had to throw it away and buy another one. I'm glad to see that Microsoft finally implemented a delete feature.
  • Why? (Score:2, Redundant)

    by SaturnTim ( 445813 )
    Okay, I don't mean this as a troll or flaimbait, but I really don't know...

    What does XP offer me over and above my current win2k? I'm tired of updating to the latest and greatest just for the fun of it. My current os runs all of my applications without much trouble, so what do I get for my money?

    • Re:Why? (Score:3, Troll)

      by edremy ( 36408 )

      What does XP offer me over and above my current win2k? I'm tired of updating to the latest and greatest just for the fun of it. My current os runs all of my applications without much trouble, so what do I get for my money?

      Nothing whatsoever: you actually get less with XP.

      XP (Home at least) is not an upgrade to W2K users- it's W2K with a candy colored shell, some bundled software, no multiprocessor support and the ability to join domains removed. We're sticking with W2K here. (We're an almost all MS school, but I'm pushing OSX hard :^)

      OTOH, it's a massive upgrade to W95/8/ME users. Anything to finally put a stake through that miserable series of crapware is a good thing for the world.


    • One of the cool features that I've seen is that XP has the Go Back features of Millennium, where if you install something that hoses your OS you can boot into Safe Mode (hopefully) and select from a calendar what configuration was the last known good one for you.

      • woopie...and how many folks are gonna actualy take advantage of that? to most, it will just be anothe one of those litle pictures that you neve click on for fear of breaking tha computer
        • OEM tech support must love this, tho.

          Guy at work told me a story where his son had installed something on his new Dell and the thing would stall during boot and he would get as far as seeing the desktop wallpaper but no icons or taskbar.

          He called Dell, they had him boot with the rescue CD (still in the shrink-wrap, this guy is alright but he's not a PC expert). From there the tech had him go to the go-back menu and restore the reg from the day before his son installed the offending game. Saved his bacon with a minimum of intervention.

          Now, you can of course argue that the OS shouldn't have croaked like this in the first place, and I wouldn't argue at all - but this is a vast improvement over 'reinstall windows'.
    • What does XP offer me over and above my current win2k? I'm tired of updating to the latest and greatest just for the fun of it. My current os runs all of my applications without much trouble, so what do I get for my money?
      For the most part, not very much. Some of the bundled features, such as MP3 support, CD burning, etc., won't be new for most of us. And the interface certainly isn't worth the upgrade.

      But there are other things that will set itself apart from Win2k pretty well. Various hardware manufacturers were very slow with making drivers for Win2k, especially from those who make "consumer" hardware. Their argument was that Win2k is just a business OS, and that they didn't need to support it. Creative Labs was pretty slow in getting updated Live!Ware drivers out, and even the latest Live!Ware 3.0 drivers for Win2k are inferior to their Win9x counterparts (for one thing, it takes a lot longer to load up the speaker icon in the taskbar). Now that XP is out, I'm sure the driver support for Win2k can only go downhill.

      XP will have an advantage that Win2k didn't have. Since XP is now the combination of the 9x and NT line, only one set of drivers needs to be written, which will make it that much easier for hardware manufacturers to release the drivers. That to me is probably the biggest reason why I'll eventually switch from Win2k to XP (eventually, but not yet).

    • Like the posts above: To be able to change the colors of the screen of death! :)
    • Gosh, you've gotten 11 replies so far, and no one has mentioned the few things that I like about XP. There are a couple UI improvements that make my life *so* much better. First off, if you have a million windows open, it consolidates them on the taskbar into menus by application. If you have a cluttered task bar, this is great.

      Also, most common contextual menu options are visible as a sidebar in explorer windows. This can be handy.

      But best of all! You can switch users! It's excellent! I don't mean you can log out and log in as someone else, but rather you can log in a second time, and the first user's applications are still running in the background. I can't tell you how annoying it used to be to have to stop listening to music, log off of IM, and lose all my IE windows if I wanted to muck around as administrator. I realize, this feature could have/should have been here since NT4, but it wasn't.

      But I'm not going to kid you. I run it in "Windows Classic" mode 'cause the flat theme just isn't done right in all applications. Aside from these few things (and the driver rollback that I haven't used yet) there's not much improvement. It's definitely still the same OS. Do what you like.
  • by haplo21112 ( 184264 ) <[moc.anhtipe] [ta] [olpah]> on Thursday October 25, 2001 @09:41AM (#2476995) Homepage
    Well here we go, Microsoft, says give us more money, to upgrade your OS, cause we have 10,000 new features(that are really enhancements to old ones, aka fixes)...and of course if you don't we are gonna drop support for the old OS anyway so your gonna have to eventually...even now the manuals for supporting 98,ME,2000 are being destroyed at our support centers, why would anyone need those when we have this spiffy new thing.
    • I don't know if anybody here remembers it, but...

      When Windows for Workgroups came out (believe it was "Windows 3.11"), it was a bit ahead of its time. It had support for networking that most users - home and office - simply couldn't take advantage of, because networking hardware was still expensive.

      People in the press started calling it "Windows for Warehouses" because Bill & Co. were having such a hard time moving any copies of it.

      Bottom line is, people won't pay for new features they don't need, especially when many of us have *finally* stabalized our current Windows version. I predict this will be another "Windows for Warehouses".

    • Why spend the $$$ to get 'free applications' that I already have?
    • Now you need to replace your old dos and 9x apps...
    • You get IE 6, which is already free
    • You get 'reduced desktop clutter' -- as if you can't clear your desktop already?
    • 'bubbly buttons' - will that speed up my productivity?
    Though I know there are things that have been improved over 2K, etc, I'll still wait a while. Need to make let a couple service packs hit first...

  • by ergo98 ( 9391 )

    Finally it's bringing the masses to a reliable operating system, and truly this is closing the window for Linux. There are lots of people who truly and rightfully got thoroughly upset when Windows 95/98/98SE/ME took a dump because they opened explorer before the soundblaster drivers had settled in, or because they made the mistake of alt-tabbing between apps a few too many times, and these were the people who were ripe for picking for conversion to the Linux camp. However how many people do you hear complaing regarding the quality of Windows 2000 (on which XP is based)? I have 2000 and I have never, since I first installed one of the RCs many moons back, got a BSOD. Ever. There are nuisances such as the fact that explorer.exe locks directories forcing you to wait several hours to delete them if you made the mistake of navigating into them, and that it itself occasionally dies, but they are trivial in the grand scheme of things.

    Anyways I'll probably keep going with Windows 2000 as there is no redeeming factor for me to upgrade to XP from this, but for everyone using one of the 16/32 OS', it can't said with enough emphasis that you really don't realize how much shit that you're unnecessarily putting up with.

  • I'm running 98 on my Windows machine at home, and quite frankly, I'm going to stick with software that was created *before* the "software-as-a-service" craze that's taken over MS.
  • It's in the EULA. Anyone who has ever used a micro$oft product has to care about any new release. Else all those records that micro$oft keeps will be released to our employers/family/public. Think of all that pr0n!
  • by nachoworld ( 232276 ) on Thursday October 25, 2001 @09:45AM (#2477026) Homepage
    If people were really excited about getting Windows XP (there are quite a few of them), then they would have got their hands on it earlier. eBay had some up for sale. My brother got a copy of XP a little less than a month ago and offered it to me, but I told him to just get the money he could make from an eBay sell (it was about $350 back then).

    I think release dates are getting less and less important now in the days of advanced comunication and distribution. Remember those days when people would line up for hundreds of feet Tuesday at midnight for the release of a CD? Those days have been dwindling, and the lines are getting smaller. If one really wants that CD he'll download it before the release date and then take his time getting the CD after it's released. Tower record parties on Newbury Street in Boston are nonexistent anymore. Just 3-4 years ago they were incredible with radio staion vans parked everywhere and hundreds of people croweded around.
  • by Masem ( 1171 ) on Thursday October 25, 2001 @09:45AM (#2477027)
    Sure, I'm going out tonight to buy XP, but only because my gaming machine is 98, and I'd like a bit more stability in it.

    But I've been listening to reports and reading articles, and while the industry seems hyped up about it, most pundents (that are not typical MS fanboys) appear to be believe that for most businesses, already in the Win2000 migration, XP is not a good choice, and for those on home machines, you have to have some oomph in your box to be able to take advantage of it.

    Most of these critics think that the stability is a great point, but other aspects, including look, integration of WMP and other programs, and the *amount* of blatent advertizing for MS on the default install is put-offs for them. They definitely feel that the engine behind XP is worthwhile being built on 2000, but they could do without all the glitz.

    And many people expect very slow sales of XP. There's no lines-around-the-corner as with 95, but they do expect a modest amount of sales today. But they don't believe that XP is going to be a big economic burst into the market as Microsoft tried to make it out as; again, since most seats of the OS are sold to business, and most appear to be sticking to 2000 until necessary, there's going to be very few sales from that market.

    The short story from what I've read: it's great that MS finally has a NT-based, stable OS for the home user, as it's been 5 years that it's been needed, but it appears to carry a lot of extra weight that is unnecessary and possible questionable in light of several legal cases.

      • I'm going out tonight to buy XP, but only because my gaming machine is 98, and I'd like a bit more stability in it

      Why not buy Win2K? I know for a fact that some games now run slightly faster on Win2K than Win98SE, due to a switch in emphasis by driver developers. I've been developing and playing DirectX and OpenGL based games on Win2K for a year or so, and am generally happy with its stability and speed.

      So really, why buy WinXP? It's just Win2K with phone home and some more GUI knobs and whistles that slow it down (that you'll immediately turn off if you're bothered about performance).

    • Sure, I'm going out tonight to buy XP, but only because my gaming machine is 98, and I'd like a bit more stability in it.

      I hope for your sake you have a lot a horsepower and that your games will run on the XP box. A lot of games don't seem to run on Windows 2000 for some reason, and XP is based on 2000.
      • Actually, it was 9x/2000 combined. And I have not had a problem with any of the games I've tried yet. The ONLY issue any of my friends have had were between nVidia's newest Detonator XP drivers and WinXP in Dark Ages of Camelot, and they had that same problem under Win9X. Quake3, Wolfenstein, Black & White, Sims, Everquest, Unreal Tourney, Diablo2 all have worked, and the list goes on.
        • Shit, forgot to add that nearly every one of these run faster, smoother and look MUCH better under XP on my TNT than they did under 98, 98SE, ME (God was that ever a mistake) or 2000.

          along with that, the genearl windows display, interface, fonts, graphics, etc. are much cleaner, better looking (even without the toy GUI).
          • Do you have any benchmarks to prove this.

            I have a hard time believing there would actually be an improvement over 98. Windows98 is rather unstable, but that lack of stability comes from the shortcuts they made to increase performance. (ie, run on crap hardware). In the end, the footprint is a great deal smaller then that of the newer OS's.

            Often when we think something will perform better, our perceptions are a bit tainted.

            I've done this before, its a rather common reaction.
            • I understand what you mean, but no, I've never benchmarked anything. I am going purely by perception, but I do know wolfenstein ran like crap under 2k, quake ran like crap under 2k, chess master 6000 didn't even run under 2k. Granted, with the first two I got decent performance with lower graphic settings and 800x600, but with XP I've been running with medium graphic settings across the board at 1024x768. Bear in mind, XP was installed along with the latest version of DirectX and the DetonatorXP's. As far as stability goes, I saw one BSOD in over a year of using 2k beta3 and on, and have not seen one in XP [yet].

              Don't get me wrong, XP is not the eighth wonder of the world, but I am happy with it. A coworker dropped it on his laptop at work the other day, was up and running an hour after putting the CD in, with access to the novell network and everything. So as far as I can tell, it's glitzier 2k with gaming support =) but not much wrong with that.

              Unfortunately all the hard-core/Linux geeks spaz when they see something like this, with a Fisher-Price® GUI and "useless" fading menu effects, etc, but this is the garbage Linux will need to become a wide-spread home operating system.
    • I've not yet had any problems with XP Pro (been running it for two weeks or so) other than explorer crashing once or twice on my pIII-450, but that has subsided since I went to a normal interface, rather than the Fisher-Price® default. You will definitely need a machine with a bit of oomph to run comfortably, but there are a lot of graphical things you can disable to increase performance on a box.

      The WMP integration thing kinda blows, but I've never used it to begin with, no reason to start now. The first CD I popped in, I was prompted for what action to take (i.e. open in WMP, open in Winamp (already installed), open in Windows CD Player, do nothing), so you are not locked in and it appears to be easy enough to use another program. The CD burning seems to be overhyped though; WinXP only does DirectCD-style burning (ie. mount CD-R/W as read/write, and drag 'n drop files) so I had to pull Nero down again, but it works great. Nero with the built-in DirectCD style stuff should complement the other quite nicely. Be warned, I was not able to read a CD burned with DirectCD in XP, and roxio does not have an updated UDF/DirectCD reader for XP.

      My DVD drive was another story altogether. I had WinDVD 2.x installed as a trial version; when I installed XP, it notified me that those drivers were not compatible (didn't yet mention I did an upgrade from 2k pro) so it downloaded new DVD drivers and the newest version of WinDVD, registered and all. Nice accidental addition. Overall, I like XP after the gooey gui is gone.
    • And many people expect very slow sales of XP. There's no lines-around-the-corner as with 95, but they do expect a modest amount of sales today. But they don't believe that XP is going to be a big economic burst into the market as Microsoft tried to make it out as; again, since most seats of the OS are sold to business, and most appear to be sticking to 2000 until necessary, there's going to be very few sales from that market.
      From what I've observed, from smaller companies or state/government agencies, there are a lot of machines still running NT 4.0, who have been holding off on the Win2k migration. Granted, I haven't been in any big dot-com campus, but I do think we'll see XP sales exceeding Windows 98SE, ME, and Win2k combined, at least within the next 6 months. There'll be businesses with NT 4.0 who will soon be ready to migrate to XP and skip Win2k altogether, and there will be consumers who will actually upgrade their home OS; Win98SE and ME, for the most part, have been OEM-only updates. Win98 was the last real upgrade the people actually bought to upgrade their 95 machines. Since both the business and consumer markets are involved with this product launch (like Win95 was, before NT 4.0 came out), I'm pretty sure we'll see pretty big sales figures.
      • Heh, my employer still runs a host of Win95 boxes. They were considering migrating to 2k in January, but they may retool that to move over to XP. The remote desktop feature, remote assistance and the ability for a WinCE device to VPN to the desktop without setting up Terminal Server or anything are big selling points for them.
    • Sure, I'm going out tonight to buy XP

      Just make sure that you get a *real* copy of it. Microsoft, as of late, doesn't seem to allow the vendors to sell anything other than a restore CD. The vendors then put the license info and hologram directly on the PC. This means that, unless you can get the license off of the PC, that you will lose permission to use XP when you get rid of the PC in question. Not only that, but you still have to source a real CD that you can install from (not just a PC specific restore number).

      When people say that MS is not a monopoly, I point them to these things... Most users simply don't know any better...
  • XP's kernel is based off of Windows 2000, so it's stable. And it's compatible with many more programs (read: games), ala Win98.

    So really, it's nothing new, it's just a combination of previous products.

  • This explains why /. is *so* quiet today. Everyone is waiting in line at their local computer store for a copy. ;-)
  • I heard a rumor that Linus was waiting til the release of WinXP to fork the 2.5 kernel. Anyone have info on that? Maybe it was just a rumor.

    Everything I've heard on XP is that it's stable. Nobody I know has said anything else about it.

    Micro$oft:This will change your computing experience.
    Me:Yup, I can get work done now instead of staring at a BSOD.
  • I'm sure this discussion will be incredibly insightful.
  • I used XP on my desktop for about a week and if you want windows, don't need to boot a non-MS OS then it is the way to go... if you're used to NT/2k. I noticed that setting permissions for multiple users is actually significantly harder to figure how to do than it is in 2k. In 2k you just right click on something and click properties. In XP you have to first enable some obscure option to be able to do that and of course there is nothing in the helpfile to tell you what to do, you have to figure it out on your own
  • My First Impressions (Score:5, Informative)

    by Enonu ( 129798 ) on Thursday October 25, 2001 @09:52AM (#2477086)
    The new look of Windows XP to me could be described as bubbly. With the default theme, it's Ficher Price and bubbly. I know that perhaps it's because I'm used to the old L&F that I don't like the new L&F, but it seems like a fair amount of people I've shown XP to can only ahhh and ooooh as well as say "I want that on my system." Just goes to show how right Steve Jobs was when the iMac and AQUA L&F came out.

    XP handles crashses better on my system. It's like they didn't happen. However, they occur more often than in Windows 2000. So even though my system doesn't become any bit more unstable after a crash, I get to see that error report dialog box a bunch. This is really a pain for apps that don't seem to like XP entirely. For example, Real Player 8 gets a bit upset from time to time. My system shouldn't crash at all. I have brand name components (ASUS, Hercules, CAS2 Corsair, etc.) and Windows 2000 rarely if ever crashed.

    The boot time for XP is freaking amazing. I think it's faster than ME even. I have a sub 10 second boot from pushing the power button. Another nice thing is that hibernation is transparent since there is only the option for Standby, Shutdown, and Restart when you go to Start/Turn off Computer. The only weird part is that it takes longer to turn off my system than it does to turn it on. I think it's because of the nVidia drivers I have installed, but I can't confirm that.

    I like to have multiple folders open on my Desktop at the same time when doing file management. When there are > 5 or open, at a resolution of 1600 x 1200, the taskbar will group all these folders together in one button so that the taskbar doesn't get overly crouded. You can then close all these folders as a group, etc. This is one of my favorite features.

    There's loads more to talk about, but it all boils down to one thing. My productivity has not increased one iota. If you have 2000, it's not worth upgrading to because of this. It's not like the upgrade I did from 98 SE to 2000 I did a while back, where all the sudden everything ran flawlessly.
    • To manually hibernane, hold down shift at the shutdown screen and "Suspend" switches to "Hibernate."

      Also, look for the (beta) Powertoys. Some of these little things are VERY nifty (Virtual Desktop for Windows, new TweakUI, etc.)
  • but "XP" sounds like a story tag[0] for extreme watersports. Given the amount that Microsoft products usually piss me off, that's probably not a wholly inaccurate interpretation of the acronym.

    [0] Story tags are those little letter codes in the subject line that the author uses (ideally) to indicate what sort of things the story contains, like "mffg bdsm nc" might mean a guy, two girls, a goat and nonconsensual bondage & pain infliction. Wheee!
  • ...has to be the following quote:

    Gates told the Associated Press: "It's a value for consumers. Why are there headlights in cars? Why don't they make you go and buy those things separately?

    "If you look at the value of the stuff that's in Windows XP, compared to the stand-alone packages you'd have to buy for the equivalent, that's many hundreds of dollars," Gates said.

    "And all you have to do is understand that to understand why consumers like it and why a competitor would say, 'Hey, it's too good a deal, you know, why are they offering people such a good deal?"'

    Why does a car come with headlights? Well, does GM manufacture its own headlights? Nope. It "bundles" headlights from "GM-certified" suppliers, so those suppliers are still getting their money in the deal. If MS were bundling Norton Ghost or EasyCD Creator or RealPlayer or BlackIce Firewall with XP, then maybe the analogy might hold.

    The thing is, most J6P's will look at Gates' statement and say "Yeah! I agree with that!" without even giving it any thought.

    In order for his statement to work, GM cars would have to: 1) come with GM headlights 2) use non-standard eletrical connections for said lights so that if you decided to replace them with a competitor's superior lights, they would either break or function in a reduced capacity 3) disable the starter if you changed your lights, floormats, muffler and tires at the same time, forcing you to call GM's hotline in order to have a new set of keys sent out to you.

    Sheez, I hope no automakers are reading this...
  • The BBC is one of the few (or perhaps the only?) news organisations in the world with a legal obligation to be unbiased.

    However, is it just me or is there a touch of sarcasm in the way the following sentence has been composed:

    "I understand that, certainly, in tough economic times it is not the best time to introduce any new piece of work," he said, though he insisted that the software was very "exciting".

    So Steve insisted it was very "exciting". Funny.
  • All of the news about XP over the last few months describing all of the ways Microsoft is continuing to be a software bully and stifling competition, resulting in me, the end user, getting less "cool stuff" for my windows PC has resulted in this: XP is the last straw. I am switching over to Linux as my primary platform and using Windows 2000 as a backup on a small partition. I've worked with Unix before and my roomate is an expert on Linux so I think I'll be able to pick it up and become a power user in no time. Given the small amount of time I actually use my computer at home and the amount of work it will take to get all of my devices working under Linux I didn't want to make that sort of investment in learning a new, more powerful OS that requires me to manually configure everything, but I am so disgusted with Microsoft that I am now willing to do so. If you don't really care what OS I use, fine, sorry to waste your time, but for those of you Linux lovers out there I thought you would be happy to know that Microsoft is actually driving people away, and making Linux stronger, just by being the evil company they are.
  • It's nifty and all, but I just can't see businesses using software that has the potential to shut itself down(intentionally, anyway).

    I'm starting to see more and more "normal" people like my parents and grandparents become aware of Microsoft's bullying business tactics. They couple what they've heard about Microsoft will the fact that Microsoft will force them to register their software online and are saying "no, thanks".

    As is obvious to most of us, Microsoft needs some real competition. Its only occurred to me recently that the average Joe on the street is starting to realize they need real competition to stop them from bullying everyone from their suppliers to their customers.

    Unfortunately, I can't yet recommend my grandma, who has trouble enough figuring out the intricacies of the mouse, that she go to something like linux. A Mac might be nice, however it would likely cost double what her PC cost.

    The demand is definitely there for Microsoft to have some real competition, because nobody likes to be bullied. I wonder who will finally give it to them?

  • I think it is a pretty good OS, far better than 9x based systems. The UI is interesting, though I'm not sure it's worth the performance hit. At least they offer the old interface. No point of upgrading from W2k unless you either really like the new UI, or need multimedia support... As for the UI, has some interesting ways of refreshing that old win98 look, with Windowblinds and DesktopX.
    What really puts me off is the licensing. I do relatively frequent changes to my hardware. I don't feel like frequently requesting activation code and therefore be flagged as suspicious. If it would truly be a one time thing to me, I wouldn't care so much, but asking Microsoft before I can actually use any upgrades I buy would suck.
    For now, I'll stick with W2k for when I *absolutely* need Windows, and Linux for everyday purposes.
    (BTW, my evaluation of Windows XP is based on a nice official beta I installed for a while before zapping it with W2k again)
  • by ( 216696 ) <mgofwd+Slashdot @ g m a i l .com> on Thursday October 25, 2001 @09:57AM (#2477122) Homepage Journal
    Ok let's go.

    1. XP is for eXPensive
    Never in the history of the PC has the part of the operating system been so pricey.

    2. XP is for eXPires
    Microsoft has invented the software that eXPires as the customer can only install the software a certain number of times. If you have a virus, need to upgrade your hard drive, want to clean up your HD, add another component, change PC or any other reason to install, your software gets closed to death.

    3. XP is for eXPloit
    Knowing the care microsoft gives to security, this meaning is close to become reality.

    4. XP is for eXPlosion
    eXPlosion of Denial of Service (DoS) attacks as windows XP gives raw socket acces to the mass of home users. (read and

    5. XP is for eXPected
    It took 10 years to microsoft to deliver a operating system that doesn't crash or need a reboot multiple times a day. At last !

    6. XP is for linuXPreferred
    For all the above reasons.

    Any other ideas ?
  • Absolutely mahvalous!!

    Actually I'm dying to ditch WinME/9x but they're going to be out there for a long time yet, untill the ROI is paid off. Sorry, that's the way most industry works. Once a business sinks so much capital into IT infrastructure they just keep using it untill depreciated (5 years I think) or it has paid for itself. Not every company can afford to buy all new systems every two or three years.

  • I really don't like Madonna's songs, so here goes:

    Alternate XP Theme Songs from Madonna

    Dress You Up (but you're still dodgy)
    Burning Up (my bank account)
    Deeper & Deeper (into MS's pocket)
    Borderline (antitrust violation)
    Material Girl (looking pretty but costing heaps)

    shut up man
  • I'm sure I'm not the only one who's noticed this, but a heads-up to everyone else: there is indeed a way to get "hacked" copies of XP, without the activation. The key was to take a combination of the corporate edition (which doesn't have activation), coupled with a corporate key. The original copies circulating around the web required massive hacks to defeat activation (in the final releases of the "normal" Pro code) and the timebomb (in the RC releases).

    Our company purchased an "Open License" for XP for about 200 users, so naturally I put one on my mobile laptop. The OS is actually suprising in some areas, irritating in others. The compatibility is a nice touch for those who have been running W2K (and couldn't get all their games to work); and the Start menu is more functional now than it was before. The Control Panel has become less intuitive, though.

    Back to what I was saying: all you need is a copy of the corporate edition (which never asks for activation) and a corporate key. I have my machine booting corporate edition XP and Mandrake 8.1. I couldn't be happier.

  • We have a nice oppurtunity to influence all VB scripters and turn them away from M$! It's easy, you can help too. If you see a clueless person in the bookstore, looking for "Programming XP in 24 hours", step up to them, smile and show them the shelf with eXtreme Programming.

  • Futureshop add (Score:2, Flamebait)

    by Nos. ( 179609 )
    Saw an add last night from Futureshop []. Along with your purchase of Windows XP, they're offering 128MB Ram, and McAfee Virus Scan. You can see the promotion on their website. I find this quite funny. If you're going to run XP, you need more memory and a virus scanner!
  • Gates told the Associated Press: "It's a value for consumers. Why are there headlights in cars? Why don't they make you go and buy those things separately?

    Because people don't buy cars the way they buy computers. When you go to an auto dealership, they sell you the car more or less exactly as it came from the factory. If headlights were sold seperately, the auto dealer would have to have a manufacturing plant on the premises.

    But when you buy a computer, and call up Dell, they DO buy all the seperate parts and put it all together. Including the software. It would be trivial for them to install, say, Bob's Media Player instead of WMA.

    Additionally, there's nothing stopping an auto dealer from pulling out the headlights the cars come with and putting in new ones. Dell is legally and technologically barred from doing that with XP's bundled software.

    Okay, now go ahead and post the "if cars were OSes" joke.
  • GOOD news!!! (Score:3, Interesting)

    by the_2nd_coming ( 444906 ) on Thursday October 25, 2001 @10:06AM (#2477192) Homepage
    Howard Stern was talking about Win XP and he decided that there was no compeling reason for him to buy it, then when a caller told him about how you could only put it on one computer per copy, he said "well screw that!!" I was excited, do you know howmany not computer literate people listen to him and take his opinion to heart? not to mention that XP just got some negitive press in popular media....

    I am so happy.... :-)
  • I find it amusing that I didn't really even notice until I saw this submission.

    Yeah, yeah, we get it: Slashdot==Linux.

    But really, there is something disturbingly naive about whistling down the street not giving Microsoft a second thought; all the while they're plotting some serious hardship for your baby (Linux).

    Just because you don't think about Microsoft doesn't mean they don't think about you.

  • I don't know what kind of coverage they were hoping for with this article, but I'd have to say that the first paragraph made me think that there wasn't much to the new release:

    The system promises fewer computer crashes and will allow users to delete data from their hard drive.

    struck me as funny. My first thought was that I could delete files perfectly well at the moment...
  • by zummit ( 448138 ) on Thursday October 25, 2001 @10:15AM (#2477261)
    Yesterday morning, Bill Gates was on the Regis show and I would like to share a direct quote which he said in reference to the idea that WinXP doesn't crash as much as other windoze OS's.

    "The average user will save about a week a year."

    [When I shared this with a friend, he replied, "Someone should file a lawsuit alleging that Windows was defective and that the licensing was an ineffective waiver of rights because of M$'s monopoly and their collusion with hardware manufacturers to force their product on consumers. I figure that since 1996, Biull G. & Co. have waster about $8,000 of my time."]

  • Time to upgrade the hardware, I mean...

    Seriously, I have almost always bought a new computer based on a new operating system. I think this is a common experience. I've never upgraded a Windows operating system, except for my first college computer, when Win95 came out a few months after I purchased it - and Gateway gave me a free upgrade coupon for that one.

    Why? Well, like most home PC users, I don't upgrade the hardware much. I buy a system that's more than I need at the time, and when I start feeling the pinch, there's no clear upgrade path to the next system. For instance, I could use a GeForce2/3, a video card with DVD-out (and a DVD player that supports that), Firewire, a 3x to 5x processor increase (350 Mhz to somewhere in the high 1000's), and maybe get the memory up to half a gig. But there's no good upgrade path - that's a motherboard change (to one w/ AGP and that supports a faster processor), and it means discarding my current DVD drive, and possible other hard drives. I might as well buy a new, integrated system. And while I'm at it, I might as well get the latest operating system. I wanted to buy a new PC around the time Black and White came out, but I decided to wait and see if XP would be worth the wait.

    Which puts me in a bind. Like others say, there's not much differance between XP and 2000, except for some (downloadable) bells and whistles, and that AWFUL authentication scheme. I'll wait until the verdict to see if I should go XP, 2000, or ME. Unlike some ZDNet columnists, I'm pretty happy with Win98SE...

    If it wasn't for the funky licsensing, I'd jump right on, and have my PC delivered tommorrow. I'm afraid a million others are making the same choice, and we might see a boom in PC sales by Christmas, maybe not.

  • ...I've read a whole truckload of posts from peopl claiming that gamers should go to win2k. Crap. Heaps of games don't run on win2k, and there's no sound at all in dos games. (I know about vdmsound, but that crashes a lot of games eg worms). WinXP runs more games than win2k in my experience, and it runs every dos game I've thrown at it, although only a dozen or so, but it runs some that 98 would not, and all with sound. It runs max payne bloody well, and the only game i've had problems with is Warlords 3, but it runs warlords 2 great, with full sound, midi and voice.

    There are some things that are done wrong, there's too much MS advertising, and good luck to MS re charging for more themes, but apart from these (relatively minor) gripes, I love XP, and I'm hoping that the oracle guys port soon so I can loose 2k for good.

    Also, anybody know a place to download themes for the built-in theming engine? Much appreciated if you do, all I can find on google is wallpaper+sounds+icon packages :-(
  • With all its faults, XP and .NET will soon dominate the IT landscape. And although the DOJ suit is not completely resolved, the possibility of a breakup is greatly diminished with an ally like Bush in the White House.

    "No One's Gonna Break Us Up! On one!" ay=20010907 []

  • I was surprised that NPR was giving XP a positive review of XP. They had a person on there from some large compute chain (like CompUSA, but I don't remember which), sayig that is is definitely easier to use, and it looks better. He then went on to say some odd things like "it will be able to copy pictures off your digital camera without you having to install any software" and a bunch of other things. When asked about the fact that you have to buy one copy for your laptop and one for your desktop, the guy said "this has always been the case" and just now they have the product activation. This morning, they were talking it up again, although they had one analyst say that which it is a great operating system, it isn't going to cause a resurgence in computer hardware sales, and the amount of money Microsoft has slated for advertising is indicative of the fact that while it is better, it's only marginally better. The only bad thing I have read so far is that you may not be able to play the Snow White DVD [], but there will be a patch soon.

    One thing I noticed that was lacking was any statement like "your license will expire in 2 years". Is this still on for the retail/OEM version? I remember that they pushed it back for businesses because of the budgetary planning issues, but how about the retail. Anyone have any links?

    Incidentally, yes, it is possible that NPR is giving such a review because it is in fact better. I just don't like the form they are giving it in. They are having a guy, who obviously stands to gain if people go any buy XP at his chain, make extremely broad statements that in some cases don't make sense (how can it know all future digital cameras. Does it really even know all current ones? Even ones that have been off the market for 3 years, like my QV-11). I listen to NPR to get away from commerical radio.
  • Because now when I get a "tech support" call from a friend, I'll be troubleshooting a (in essence)W2k machine, not a WinDOS machine.

    C-X C-S
    Unfortunately, helping chicks with their computer problems does not appear to help you get into their pants. :(
  • Ah, Windows. Be it a backdoor in Outlook or a macro in Office, virus writers cannot get enough of Windows.

    Idea: Purchase a brand new computer to support a buggy OS so that you can run all those fancy new viruses.

    [true story]
    I know of a guy who updated his ActiveX in order to view an attachment that later turned out to be a particularly nasty virus.
    [/true story]

    Dangerous New Virus Called "WindowsXP" Poised To Cripple Users ay=20010827 []
  • by eddy ( 18759 ) on Thursday October 25, 2001 @01:24PM (#2478527) Homepage Journal

    I guess Microsoft is showing its commitment to security, because we already have the first critical update for WinXP out.

    Citing HardOCP []:

    Windows XP Update Package, October 25, 2001- Download size: 1.9 MB - This update resolves all critical issues that were found in Windows XP between August 2001 and October 2001, and is discussed in Microsoft Knowledge Base (KB)
    Article Q309521 []. Among the updates included in this package are several that eliminate security vulnerabilities. Download now to ensure that you have all the latest critical updates for Windows XP.

    You'd think they'd at least hold onto the last release-candidate for a month or so to make sure no critical issues come up, before making it a master and sending it off to be pressed, no?

  • by kindbud ( 90044 ) on Thursday October 25, 2001 @02:35PM (#2478891) Homepage unlocks the full power of the PC and enables them to enjoy the best of what the digital world has to offer.

    Didn't they say the same thing about Win9x?

    When will my PC's potential be fully unlocked?

Stinginess with privileges is kindness in disguise. -- Guide to VAX/VMS Security, Sep. 1984