School's Out Forever at SV High Tech High 190
theodp writes "Touted as a model of successful education by the likes of Bill Gates, Silicon Valley's High Tech High just held its first — and last — commencement ceremony, graduating only 21 students in its brief history. Despite the financial support of the world's richest man, the charter school cited money woes as it voted to shut its doors. Adding insult to the poor HTH kids' injury, the local public H.S. district plunked down $8.6M to snatch up their abandoned school and will turn it over to a brand new crop of kids in the fall."
Hmm.. (Score:5, Funny)
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No, that's not it, either. (Score:5, Insightful)
Nope, not true. (Score:5, Informative)
One of my children was a student at the school for three years, before leaving because it sucked big rocks.
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Insult? (Score:3, Insightful)
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Agreed. I would be adding insult in Apple bought the school.
-Grey [wellingtongrey.net]
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Which is quite amazing, given that they draw from a ton of very bright, motivated, and successful families. Portola Valley, Woodside, Atherton, Menlo Park, Redwood City... that's where
Not surprising (Score:5, Insightful)
Incidentially some of the "worlds richest men" are directly responsible for a slow computer revolution.
Re:Not surprising (Score:5, Interesting)
Agreed. I work as a teacher and for 99% of tasks, technology just gets in the way. I'm also horrified at the number of my fellow teachers who think the Internet is some magical panacea where they can just plop a class down in front of a computer, tell them 'research topic X' and the kids will actually learn something.
-Grey [wellingtongrey.net]
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Of course, they were homeschooled...
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Re:Not surprising (Score:4, Interesting)
Except that teachers are rewarded by brainless administrators for 'using ICT in their lessons' and they get no such reward for going to the library.
-Grey [wellingtongrey.net]
Re:Not surprising (Score:4, Insightful)
Primary education needs to be directed because kids need to develop a sense of the pattern of learning and obtain some background in various subjects to serve as a frame of reference for future learning which they might do on their own.
I had the luxory of getting a good deal of my early education before the public Internet and after that well lets face it is was not until the later 90's there was little content that anyone could sugest using in primary education out there.
I did go to one of those wealthy districts that had stuff though. We had this huge media-center. Loads of books on just about anyhting. We even had a Computer (IBM PC-AT) with an exteral cdrom driver and decades of various publications (in plain text IIRC) on CDs stacked next to it.
I also remember lots of teachers from grade one all the way to eight thinking that they could just march us all down there hand us some 3x5" cards tell us to research something and then expect us to learn from this.
Most of this media was books and periodicals, with the exception of the IBM PC-AT. That is media that has existed for centuries. I think it was for the most part as big a waste as all this Internet time for students is today. Kids need good teachers with materials to cover what is directly part of the curiculum, and a small library for some on their own but ASSIGNED research projects.
If a school is employing much of its budget to do anything other then hire the best most dedicated teachers in adequate numbers, and to provide them with the most basic facility and tools they require to do their jobs, that school is miss using its budget.
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When we have strong AI a hell of a lot more than just the teaching industry will be outdated. But until the singularity comes, we still have some issues to resolve.
-Grey [wellingtongrey.net]
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Ooo, wow, computers can "quiz" kids. Amazing! Now all our problems are solved! Oh wait, someone has to teach them the stuff they're being quized about in the first place... which is like 95% of the job.
Oh right, as if schools/teachers weren
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The experience I've had volunteering in my ex-girlfriend's class room is that about 80% of it is keeping the kids in their seats and not disrupting the other students. Another 10 to 15% is administrative tasks put on the teacher. The actual imparting of knowledge and a desire to learn is a much smaller percentage.
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It's a sad state of affairs and probably worthy of rigorous study. My posting was never intended to r
Re:Not surprising (Score:4, Insightful)
When we have strong AI, the students will be outdated too.
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AI and quizzing are just small parts of the value of computers in education.
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There is no easy way to apply corrections to pen and paper. And a blackboard is not able to retain information.
There are no easy ways to back up the data or duplicate it (of course xeroxing is an option for paper, but not for blackboards).
A smartboard/interactive white/blackboard has replaced the ancient black/white board.
Even a tablet PC and beamer is more effective. Teachers can sit behind desk and use the tablet to show stuff on a
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You could:
A) cross out your mistake
B) use white out
C) write with erasable pens [howstuffworks.com]
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Re:Not surprising (Score:4, Insightful)
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In Soviet Russia, we use a pencil^W^W^W^W...errr...Pencil uses YOU!
Seriously, though, learning Calc in college, the biggest impediment was using programs to
"help" us learn, but if you did not know WTF you were doing, using Maple, mathcad or whatever
program just made the problem worse with learning how to program the damn thing.
If I were not the one that wen
Re:Not surprising (Score:5, Insightful)
There were 2 types of classes in college. Those that handed us out notes and went through a slide show and had us fill in some blanks and those that handed out nothing and wrote on the blackboard.
Guess which one I retained more information from? I've seen that people retain more information if they write it down than if they just see it.
There is an Excellent easy way to back up data on the blackboard, it's called notes. Some classes I didn't even have a notebook. Prior to the class I'd grab some sheets out of the recycle bin and write on the back side.
There's a very easy way to apply corrections, it's called crossing it out and rewriting it. You even retain th original information so you can sometimes see a progression of thought.
Notebooks, on sale, cost $.79 a piece.
Re:Not surprising (Score:5, Interesting)
- Ability to easily erase
- Ability to reposition text at will
- Ability to move on without erasing the board
- Ability to save the entire lecture as a PDF
In addition to that we have been experimenting with giving entire classes of students tablets. This then allows the instructor to ask students questions about the lecture (like "clickers"). However, by using open-ended questions where students respond in paragraph form, or by drawing out their answer, the professor can much more effectively gauge how students are learning.They're all crap (Score:2)
http://lowery.tamu.edu/Teaming/Morgan1/sld023.htm [tamu.edu]
You don't know how to use it. Re:They're all crap (Score:2)
Traditional lectures are abysmal teaching methods.
What a load. People have been teaching and learning forever. A good course will have a combination of all the things in the Pyramid you link to and any display technology will do. Let's review.
Method (average retention rate)
"Traditional:"
"Teaming:"
A reasonable course must have a combination of all of th
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I've also seen technology that allows those kind of presentations to be recorded as flash files. A professor of mine also used this to let kids get richer feedback on their submitted papers; he would load their papers up in the tablet PC app (electronic submission was required for other reasons) and record himself talking and circling, crossing out, etc parts of the papers.
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For that matter, what sort of university curriculum requires students to do busywork or writing (apart from Exams) during class?
You can also already do 3 of the 4 things you mentioned above with an overhead projector. A bottle of windex helps with t
Not everybody learns the same way (Score:2)
The fact that one guy didn't learn well by taking notes doesn't mean that taking notes is a universal hindrance for all. Likewise, transcribing things helps many people retain information.
Why the heck do so many people think one size must fit all?
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Another unusual thing in it was the weekly paper, which had to to 150 words or less. If it was 151 words, it was rejected. It really made you pare your arguments down to their essence.
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For example, I've taken a whole bunch of classes taught on the blackboard, and I've taken many taught by Powerpoint (with the blackboard occasionally used). Powerpoint kicks the blackboard's ass for sheer power of expressivity and content. There is a ton of things y
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No kidding! What was most annoying in college was teh 5 students who couldn't copy down the information fast enough and had to ask the instructor to stop while they wrote it down before movign on. How awkward. I just wanted to yell to to them, "Just pay attention and maybe take some abridged notes! You're holding up the class!" I don't m
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Well then you're not qualified to teach under natural conditions. That puts you out of a rewarding peace corps job.
There is nothing more effective than being in front of a student and engage in conversation about a new topic.
Teachers that sit behind desks aren't teaching.
Re:Not surprising (Score:5, Insightful)
A blackboard/whiteboard doesn't go wrong and it relies upon having a good tutor who knows what they are talking about. They can't just flick through a load of slides, they have to interact with the class.
People designed planes, nuclear bombs and all sorts of engineering/science marvels without computers. Computers are useful but not essential.
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In Japan, they still teach kids how to use an abacus. In fact, I think it's an advantage in the early years, because it gives a tactile meaning to what would otherwise be marks on paper.
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Use pencil instead?
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Well, for that I use /. IMHO.
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Idiots like you keep shouting "Technology is not a educational panacea!" Dude, everybody knows that.
Insult to injury? (Score:4, Insightful)
How on earth could this possibly be considered an insult? Because the public school district is so apparently awash in cash yet didn't subsidize their extremely specialized and (apparently) financially unsuccessful school, but instead let it flounder? Cry me a goddamned river.
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This was a charter school and not part of the regular public school system. So, it was actually a competitor to the district, similar to private schools.
Right, exactly, so the public school system couldn't and shouldn't care less about it.
Or is your point perhaps that the fact that competitor would up with the building is a blow? As if Apple were to get bought out by Microsoft, or something like that.
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sorry, "would" should be "wound".
This is what happens ... (Score:5, Funny)
alive and well (Score:5, Informative)
Their robotics team [techhigh.org] is very well respected and consistently performs well at national competitions. Their college placement rates are substantially higher than other local high schools. The failure of the SV HTH actually had more to do with administrative and personnel issues that were unique to the San Francisco campus. HTH continues to thrive and grow in California.
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If my high school had been like High Tech high... (Score:4, Insightful)
Unfortunately, K-12 education isn't exactly where the government's priorities are. Maybe one day.
Not entirely govs fault (Score:5, Insightful)
Our society looks down on education, to the point where we pass over well-educated, well-spoken presidential candidates for the apparent moron, the "regular joe guy I'd like to have a beer with." (Sorry, he doesn't drink any more, so you won't get that chance. But if you want to do some blow, he's the man.) Until we start respecting education as a society, our school system is doomed.
Not that we can't fix the government's problems with education, while we're waiting: stop funding schools based on property taxes, which slants education in favor of the rich, and punishes the poor. Stop pretending you can replace teachers with a computer, or some bloke off the street, and start paying them better. Repeal "No Child Left Behind."
Anyway. We've got a long way to go before we can fix our education system. But there's a lot more than the government at work here.
No Child Left Behind is achieved (Score:2)
No Child Left Behind is achieved by holding all the rest back.
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Re:Not entirely govs fault (Score:5, Funny)
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Actually, now that it's been in place long enough to have an impact, ABC News and others are reporting that it looks like No Child Left Behind actually works, after all [go.com].
(Note that I have no children, don't work for a school or school system, and in no way am involved in the American education cartel so I really don't care much one way or the other.)
Re:Not entirely govs fault (Score:4, Insightful)
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It's a strange relationship we have with education in the US. Most people want their kids to be educated. We're willing to throw money at the problem in the hopes that the next generation will all be able to do basic math. But at the same time, there are a large number of people who look down their noses at anyon
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charter schools done wrong (Score:2)
And now the school property is just going to expand the existing public indoctrination system. Very sad.
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About 2/3 actually. And thats of people who graduated high school.
As a software company, we don't hire based on education. We hire based on skill and experience.
As a software company, we hire codemonkeys based on skill and experience. If they have some college or even graduated, so much the better. Now if we want a software engineer, or team lead, then the person pretty much has to have a degree. We have found that most people who have done nose to the grindst
Stingy Welfare Program? (Score:2)
Maybe the fact that a sponsor with deep pockets was in the mix is also the reason the school failed. Just like a liberal welfare program, unless your own money is on the line, there's no incentive to do better.
Perhaps we can transmute the "learn by doing" into child labor. Why give culture and ideas to people when you could just teach them good slave labor skills? Exposing people to anything but broadcast media facts might make them uppity.
No, I don't believe in child labor and can make a case for re
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And what's wrong with child labor? Don't chain them to machines, that's what liberals always bring up whenever it's suggested that kids ought to learn some discipline and work skills. Nope, teach kids the meaning of honest work and the honest dollar. When else should people know about honesty? When they are older, they're going to have to know about dis
TCO (Score:4, Funny)
Despite the financial support.. (Score:4, Funny)
Bill always makes his money back. (Score:2)
It's not so much that he did not give enough, as it is that the community was not willing to fund his vision of a school. This is typical of charter schools and Bill's schools in particular. They provide a small portion of the money needed and expect the rest to be provided by the state, but it's all spent under Bill's rules. In charter schools and public libraries blessed by his patranage, the software must all be M$. You can see how this can be used to create a cash flow and charter schools stand accu
My daughter attends Summit Prep (Score:3, Interesting)
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And by the way, the quality of teaching is *amazing*. Really.
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San Mateo isn't in Silicon Valley (Score:2)
San Francisco isn't in Silicon Valley either, for the record.
Honestly, people should come up with another name for the high tech area because Palo Alto isn't in Silicon Valley either. As high tech as Palo Alto is, it was never really involved in silicon, just software.
Some information about the High Tech High network (Score:3, Informative)
As a former math teacher at another Bay Area high school associated with High Tech High, I can say that technology was (for the most part) integrated judiciously with the curriculum. I don't know if this was also the case at SVHTH, but based on my experience with other schools in the HTH network, I would suspect so.
Whenever I mention to people that I worked at an HTH, their first thought is often that the school is an IT vocational school, or a traditional school but with everything done on the computer. Both of these notions are incorrect.
The main emphasis of HTH's is project based learning. Rather than assigning loads of repetitive homework, teachers are encouraged to create challenging and relevant projects that motivate students to do their best. The project format was used for small, large, individual, and group efforts.
The "High Tech" name is used for two reasons:
1) When applicable, students use productivity software to do their work. This often comes in the form of collaborating with other students on projects using Lotus Notes and Microsoft Office. The idea here is that technology literacy will become increasingly important in the 21st century, and therefore should be integrated into the curriculum.
2) The schools are administrated electronically. Student tracking, facility scheduling, and parent/administration/teacher communications were mostly done through a centralized computer system provided by HTH. This was a great boon to the faculty of my school.
Another Great /. Spin (Score:2)
What the summary doesn't mention:
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Yes, poorly managed. I'll write more in a separate thread.
Some ideas on HTHB's failure, from a HTHB parent (Score:5, Informative)
So, the first year, the school had about 78 freshmen enrolled, which was shy of the promised minimum of 80 (and goal of 100). There was a lot of hassle about not quite having 80 students. The school was not well supported by the chartering school district. It was a lot like being at a startup -- we did without many things, everyone was very optimistic, people fullfilled multiple roles, etc. That first year, there were basically only 4-5 teachers total, and they were mostly pretty good. My son had a math teacher who was amazing, dedicated, intelligent, and very inspiring to her students. His physics teacher was also great -- really interested in the topic even though it wasn't what his grad work was in, great with the students. He was a little outspoken sometimes -- he and I got into it in email once over something really silly. My son's Spanish teacher was wonderful and devoted, had a student at the school. His humanities teacher was well, *okay* -- didn't seem on the same level with the other teachers, and sometimes basically taught wrong things. There were days when I thought, "I cannot believe I am trusting my son's future to a startup", but I dealt with it. That year, my son did independent study work to do two years of math in the same year -- he and a few other students were a year ahead of most of the student body. At that time, the school's model allowed for independent study, separate pacing, things like that.
The second year, the school was announced to be more closely affiliated with High Tech High in San Diego, but was not yet "a High Tech High school". The original principal had left the school and instead there was a guy who had been a middle school principal. My son and the other students a year ahead in math were initially independent study with assistance from the Really Great Math Teacher, but at some point, the administration decided that it was too much work for her, and instead put the new math teacher in charge of them. Well *that* guy wasn't a good teacher. In fact, he didn't help the students with their studies; it appeared he didn't have the math ability to understand what they were doing. He told them he couldn't give them tests because he wasn't able to grade them. He was A Bad Teacher, very erratic. Half way through the year, the school gave *that* up, too, and instead sent those advanced math students to take math at a local community college.
Other parts of the year were more uneven, too. My son had a great humanities teacher, but his (new hire) chemistry teacher quit after a few weeks, and the replacement sucked. He taught students the wrong constant for Avagadro's number, things like that. Further, the school had no lab equipment, so they weren't doing any lab component. My understanding is that at some point, it became clear that the course would not be "state-certified" (which means it can be used towards getting into a UC-system university) unless it had a lab component. So the teacher did a basic measuring lab. And then he did it again. And for the rest of the year, every few days they would do pretty much THE SAME LAB, so that they could say that students had X number of lab hours per year. Nothing else. At the end of the year, the administration actually admitted that the students had not learned any chemistry, and that they felt bad, and would try to have a better teacher the next year. They told parents that yes, they had known that the teacher *and many others* had sucked early in the year, but they felt it was only fair to give them a semester to "settle in", and then once that was over, it seemed difficult to repla
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MOD PARENT UP (Score:2)
Quite sad to watch the whole thing happen, really. Especially during its final two years.
Schwab
Why is Summit succeeding when HTHB failed? (Score:4, Informative)
1. Summit has emphasized strong teacher over facilities.
I have two children at Summit. They each have 5 teachers and several student teaching interns. With the exception of maybe one so-so teacher, all of these instructors have been *amazingly* good. By that I mean that they're people who genuinely want to teach, who have depth and breadth of understanding in their subjects, who can manage and inspire students. At HTHB, my son had teachers who didn't know their subject well enough keep up with him. At Summit, if my son wants to go beyond the classroom discussion, his teachers are right there with him, able to guide him and offer more insights to deepen his understanding of a subject. Sure, there are a couple of student teachers who seem to be a bit awkward, but they're at the school in part to get guidance in improving on this.
2. Summit has *retained* its teaching staff, giving a sense of continuity and community.
Summit has teachers that it's had for all four years they've been open. As far as I can tell, all their hires have been "keepers". Part of the selling point of these small schools is the idea that students are known and do not fall through the cracks, that they don't become anonymous and "lost" like they might at 2000 student high schools. The thing is, that really needs a continuity in community to work fully, and at Summit, it does.
3. Summit has a "no student left behind" policy that makes the success of *all* students the responsiblity of every community member.
At some point, HTHB gave up on students. If you were failing, they would throw you out. And a lot of students failed out, because they didn't have good teaching, and were generally miserable. At Summit, the entire community -- students, teachers, parents -- are tasked with ensuring that *every* student succeeds. My son excelled at many of his classes; he put a lot of effort into tutoring, guiding, and helping classmates who were struggling, so that *they* could succeed, too. If students are failing a course, they have the support of the entire community to get them back on track. This works in big and small ways. My daughter is not a top student, but even she has days where she tells me about how she was working in a small group, a group member didn't understand something, and the group took responsibility for helping the lagging student. "No student left behind" *works* at Summit.
4. The Summit administration seems to have more emphasis on living the school values of integrity, compassion . . .
After having two years of a marketing guy with the whole "How can you tell I'm lying? My lips are moving." problem, it's *refreshing* to have Summit's administration. Sometimes, they don't know things -- and they say so. I like having honorable administrators, *good people*.
I could go on, but the bottom line is that it's like bad startup vs. good startup. Would you rather have great Aeron chairs and 21" monitors, or coworkers who were the best in the area and who were being paid and given benefits that would keep them *happy*, keep them coding? Summit is the success of people over facilities, of substance and skill over "concept".
Re:Man I wish I was young again (Score:4, Funny)
Yes, because this article is about the school remaining open.
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Charters are public. (Score:2)
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My son (who you probably know) was sad about not s
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Lets rephrase that..
They will help students with better grades and leave the class clowns and drop-outs out of the way of thosw who have ambition to succeed. I have been in too many classes where 50% of the class time was simply wasted dealing with class attention and control problems and not on learning. The best classes I have had were the classes without the disruptive zoo in attendance. What s