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New Griefer Punishment - Crucification 119

garylian writes "I found this interesting little news snippet from the game Roma Victor. Apparently, the game designers have decided that since their game is going to be based on realistic events that happened in the Roman Empire in Europe, there is nothing wrong with handing out punishments that were handed out in that time. The game's site has a letter from the Publisher's CEO explaining about how crucification is an appropriate form of punishment for in-game behavior. There are also pictures of the avatar hanging from his week-long perch."
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New Griefer Punishment - Crucification

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  • by XanC ( 644172 )
    Good...
  • So pathetic (Score:1, Interesting)

    by Hubbell ( 850646 )
    He led a raid on a Dev Run city, took it over, and the Devs punished him by a 7day ban, ie, crucification ingame. They made the mistake of not putting an NPK timer after death, and thought that people wouldn't be spawncamped? I'm sorry, but that's just plain stupid.
    • He led a raid on a Dev Run city, took it over, and the Devs punished him by a 7day ban, ie, crucification ingame. They made the mistake of not putting an NPK timer after death, and thought that people wouldn't be spawncamped? I'm sorry, but that's just plain stupid.

      Maybe the Devs multispawned him after putting an EKG on a BBQ. Did what I just said mean anything?
      • I'm sorry, if you've ever played an MMORPG you would understand perfectly what I said.
        NPK - Non Player Killer. NPK Timer after death prevents spawn camping in PVP games that have it instead of a 'Ghost' after death.
        If you have respawning in a PVP MMORPG, you damn well better have an NPK time after death or you shouldn't be developing an MMORPG because you obviously can't even comprehend game mechanics at all. That's all I can say about the Roma Victor Devs.
        • If you have respawning in a PVP MMORPG, you damn well better have an NPK time after death or you shouldn't be developing an MMORPG because you obviously can't even comprehend game mechanics at all. That's all I can say about the Roma Victor Devs.

          That would explain the abject failure of World of Warcraft then. Now crucifixion of griefers I like, wonder if they could do it for real :)
          • WoW is not a PVP game, and the PVP in that game is horrid and pathetic.
    • Check your facts (Score:1, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward
      He led a raid on a Dev Run city, took it over, and the Devs punished him by a 7day ban, ie, crucification ingame. They made the mistake of not putting an NPK timer after death, and thought that people wouldn't be spawncamped? I'm sorry, but that's just plain stupid.

      None of what you said is actually true. I'm going AC because I'm a tester at Roma Victor and I was there. The game's still in development and the guy was exploting a spawn point on a test server while your "NPK" mechanics weren't working. T
  • by linzeal ( 197905 ) on Saturday March 25, 2006 @06:17PM (#14995093) Homepage Journal
    It would be neat to have trolls crucified somewhere with their accounts suspended.
    • Yeah, but there's a fine line between a troll on Slashdot and someone who just happens to hold a contrary opinion to the majority. By now, I'd probably have been banhammered to shit for my views on DRM and P2P if such a thing was in action (and it's a bit of a stupid idea on forums anyway).
  • by Sean0michael ( 923458 ) on Saturday March 25, 2006 @06:19PM (#14995103)
    As far as I know, it should be Crucifixion [reference.com]. And it's in the title even! We really need a -1 Spelling/Grammar mod.
  • Punishment (Score:3, Funny)

    by Detritus ( 11846 ) on Saturday March 25, 2006 @06:26PM (#14995135) Homepage
    Only a week? What a bunch of bleeding-heart liberals.

    In my day, we put their heads on a pike and fed their bodies to the dogs, and we liked it.

    Why not just strip them of their gear, and exile them from the city, never to return on penalty of death.

    • Old Jokes 101 (Score:4, Informative)

      by Valdrax ( 32670 ) on Saturday March 25, 2006 @10:30PM (#14996036)
      In my day, we put their heads on a pike and fed their bodies to the dogs, and we liked it.

      If you're going to use an old formula for a joke, get it right. The formula is:
      In my day, [we did something horrible and exaggerated to ourselves] and we liked it.

      Examples:
      - In my day, we walked ten miles to school in sleet and hail, uphill both ways, and we liked it.
      - In my day, we played computer games off of LP records. If you wanted to write your own, you'd have to get a needle and a magnifying glass, but we liked it that way.

      The whole joke is doing something ridiculous and unpleasant and liking it ('cause you weren't spoiled like rotten kids today). It's not really all that incongruous to say that you did horrible things to other people and liked it. That's just human history right there. What exactly implies that kids are spoiled today for not getting to put their enemies' heads up on pikes?
    • In my day, we put their heads on a pike and fed their bodies to the dogs, and we liked it.

      Oh yeah. I'm sure *you* liked it. But what about the punished? I'm sure they were terribly upset about all that!
  • Sounds pretty neat (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Opportunist ( 166417 ) on Saturday March 25, 2006 @06:28PM (#14995145)
    Pillories for griefers, cheaters and EBay money sellers!

    As much as I'm against it in RL, for the simple reason that a one-time criminal is going to be branded as a criminal forever, it's a bit different for games. You can, after all, toss your character and start another one.

    Is there a more literal way of "changing completely and becoming a very different person"?
    • You know in the US felons lose their right to vote, and must inform any employers that they are ex-convicts, right? There are no physical marks, but that doesn't change the fact they're 'branded.'
  • by isomeme ( 177414 ) <cdberry@gmail.com> on Saturday March 25, 2006 @06:36PM (#14995196) Homepage Journal
    That's "crucifixion", not "crucification", just for the record. As in "to be fixed to a cross (crucis)".

    Crucifixion [wikipedia.org] was in fact a fairly common form of punishment throughout much of the Roman Empire. It was both a particularly painful and notably humiliating way to die; victims often lingered in agony for days while being jeered at by passers-by. Few understand that Longinus [wikipedia.org] did Jesus a huge favor when he stabbed him in the side with his spear.

    It will be interesting to see how this punishment works out in Roma Victor. As the player will feel no pain, and loses only a week of game time while on the cross, the real punishment will come if others in the game take having been crucified as a mark of shame rather than a boastworthy accomplishment. Given typical online-game culture, I fear the latter is more likely.
    • According to the bible, Jesus was already dead when stabbed.
      John 19:32-34
      So the soldiers came, and broke the legs of the first man and of the other who was crucified with Him; but coming to Jesus, when they saw that He was already dead, they did not break His legs. But one of the soldiers pierced His side with a spear, and immediately blood and water came out.
      • That's often read as a gloss on the original text, written by someone who didn't understand the mechanics of crucifixion. Why stab someone who's already dead, especially if he's going to spray blood and water all over your nice clean tunic?
        • by JonathanBoyd ( 644397 ) on Saturday March 25, 2006 @07:43PM (#14995499) Homepage
          That's often read as a gloss on the original text, written by someone who didn't understand the mechanics of crucifixion. Why stab someone who's already dead, especially if he's going to spray blood and water all over your nice clean tunic?

          To check that he's dead. The fact that both red and clear liquids come out is the medical evidence that convinces doctors that he was in fact dead.

        • If he was dead, it wouldn't 'spray' out would it? It would leak out, but I thought the spray was caused by the beating heart.
          • pressure from gasses produced by bacterial action, there is a truely sickening image somewhere on rotten.com of a guy who died in a hot apartment in the summer, found days/weeks later when the smell started escaping the apartment.
        • > Why stab someone who's already dead,

          It wasn't good enough to _think_ he was dead. They had to _know_. There are several reasons for this, some more obvious than others, but the most obvious reason for those who were there at the time is that if he wasn't dead, they needed to break his legs so he'd die quickly, because they needed to get the dying men off the crosses before the holiday.

          So they stuck a spear in to see what came out. The blood had already separated, so blood and water came out separate
        • For the same reason that 'dead' gladiators would have hot iron brands applied to their feet; try to catch fakers. Longinus is usually regarded as having stabbed too hard; it's supposed to be a prick, basically, to the lower ribs that would cause in involuntary flinch. If Jesus wasn't already dead, he would be pretty quickly, from the stab wound.

    • If you saw the screenshots and read the dialogs in them, "no throwing dung, it's too expensive. Throw apples, they are cheap" "Awww, missed!"
    • Not being able to play is actually a fairly effective punishment. We used to use that back on the MUD I worked on. We would "hell" players. You just issued a command in the form of hell . They would then be sent to hell, which was a location where they couldn't do anything. They could still talk to people, they just couldn't play the game. In more severe cases, we'd ban them from connecting, but hell provided a good intermediary. It also had the deterrant effect in that they'd sit and whine to all their fr
      • On one mud I created a bot that went around stealing as much as possible from other charaters, selling it, and turning the genrated gold over to my main character. Some wizards eventually deduced what I was up to, and teleported both my characters into torture chambers.

        They demanded that I admit that both characters were played by me, but of course I played them as if they did not know each other. These wizards then proceeded to torture my characters ingame for over an hour before finally banning them.

        To
    • I seem to remember that modern experiments, first by the Nazis on prisoners and later by professors on grad students, showed that if you were crucified as shown in the screen shots you'd probably exhaust yourself then die of asphyxiation within six hours.

      It they REALLY didn't like you they'd give you a little seat to sit on. Then you could last until you died of dehydration (a couple days) or I guess of starvation if they really, really didn't like you.
    • You mean people can't be crucificated?
  • by EddieBurkett ( 614927 ) on Saturday March 25, 2006 @06:36PM (#14995197)
    Interesting how this hubbub and article come out shortly before the game is scheduled to go live. Pre-order today!

    Regardless, only a 7-day suspension? If they really wanted to punish the guy they'd change it so that on his next logon the offender was stuck playing an SOE game.
    • they should brand them on the forehead as well and forbid them ever wearing anything to hide the brand...
    • Make it mandatory that part of the time must be spent with the person ON LINE! Don't just have it so that the person just doesn't log on for a week, and then comes back and his griefer is ready to roll. Make it so that he has to spend time on line, and BE ACTIVE, otherwise he gets auto-logged out. Now that would be a more suitable punishment.
      • Now, come on. How active can you be if you're NAILED TO A TREE? Do you have to hang there all day tapping your toes and singing "Always look on the bright side of life"? Or maybe scream out "I'm Spartacus!" at any passer-by?
        • Sounds good. ;)

          I guess they could let them down to break rocks, but that's not nearly as entertaining.

          Hey, it was the Roman empire, just revoke their citizenship and make them slaves for a while.
          • I guess they could let them down to break rocks, but that's not nearly as entertaining.

            Hey, that's a great idea.

            Rather than ban the player for seven days, send them to a prison where they're released once they perform boring, repetitive tasks until they earn their freedom.

            Hmm, actually, I guess that basically describes most of the MMORPG experience, so nevermind.
            • Rather than ban the player for seven days, send them to a prison where they're released once they perform boring, repetitive tasks until they earn their freedom.

              Hey, sounds just like the jail in Nexus. [nexustk.com]

              Hmm, actually, I guess that basically describes most of the MMORPG experience, so nevermind.

              No, that describes the RPG experience.

              Some people will never actually get the MMO part of it. There are communities, they are persistent, and they always have the game world and gameplay as a metaphor and reference poi
    • "If they really wanted to punish the guy they'd change it so that on his next logon the offender was stuck playing an SOE game."

      Now now, I dislike griefers as much as the next guy, but forcing them to play a SOE MMO is just cruel and might leave permanent damage. We're no longer in the middle ages, you know. Regardless of what evil deeds someone did, you can't just strap someone to a chair and subject them to chinese water torture [wikipedia.org] or a modern day SOE equivaletnt until their sanity crumbles.

      Joke aside... act
      • > A company may put in its EULA that it owns the data in your account, characters included,
        > and may do whatever it pleases with it, including deleting it and display it on a cross
        > on Golgotha. But that ownership may extend only to the bytes and bytes in that data, not
        > to the player who "created" that data.

        I think altering the gameplay experience for the player falls under the category of owning the game, not owning the player. I don't think the other poster intended to indicate that the play
  • Obligatory (Score:2, Funny)

    by 91degrees ( 207121 )
    I'm Spartacus!
  • by advocate_one ( 662832 ) on Saturday March 25, 2006 @07:03PM (#14995315)
    A line of prisoners files past a jailer.
    Coordinator: Crucifixion?
    Stan: Yes.
    Next prisoner.
    Stan: Er, no, freedom actually.
    Coordinator: What?
    Stan: Yeah, they said I hadn't done anything and I could go and live on an island somewhere.
    Coordinator: Oh I say, that's very nice. Well, off you go then.
    Stan: No, I'm just pulling your leg, it's crucifixion really.
    laughing
    Stan: Yes I know, out of the door, one cross each, line on the left.
    • You know the penalty laid down by Roman law for harboring a known criminal?
      MATTHIAS: No.
      CENTURION: Crucifixion.
      MATTHIAS (uninterested): Oh.
      CENTURION: Nasty, eh?
      MATTHIAS: Hm. Could be worse.
      CENTURION: What do you mean 'could be worse'?
      MATTHIAS: Well, you could be stabbed.
      CENTURION: Stabbed? Takes a second. Crucifixion lasts hours. It's a slow, 'orrible death!
      MATTHIAS: Well, at lest it gets you out in the open air.
      CENTURION: You're weird.
  • i didn't see any blood in the screenshots
    • If you understood crucifixion, perhaps you'd know why.
      • iirc they were nailed to the cross weren't they? i'd imagine you'd see at least some red patches arround the nails......
        • usually they were just tied with ropes around their wrists.

          Jesus, i believe, was tied and nailed. (If he existed, etc..)

          If you've ever tried nailing someone suspended to something with nails through their palms, it doesn't work. The hand just splits down the middle under their own weight.
          • Which is why they nailed people through the wrist, where it would hold them. They would tie and nail them, and depending on how well they nailed they'd take the ties off if possible.
    • IIRC, crucifixion only sheds small amounts of blood, mainly from the tears in the skin from stretching under the body's weight and under the ropes which were rough and applied very tightly. Occasionally a victim was nailed (most famously Jesus) but this was rare since the eventual anemia and shock would cause faster death, which was never the Romans' intention, in these cases victims would be tied with ropes as well since the nail wounds would simply tear under the victim's weight. Later derivations of this
  • Good! (Score:1, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward
    Nail 'em up, I say! Nail some sense into 'em!
  • Old News (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Lord_Dweomer ( 648696 ) on Saturday March 25, 2006 @08:05PM (#14995585) Homepage
    This is old news, see my coverage of the event at The Halting Point [blogspot.com].

  • by rlp ( 11898 ) on Sunday March 26, 2006 @10:10AM (#14997715)
    Cynewulf, (in real life a 27 year-old electrical engineer from Flint, Michigan, USA)

    Some would say that having to live in Michigan was punishment enough.
  • They oughta implement a more durable punishment, like cutting off a leg or something. Make the character hobble around begging for the rest of their short life. Or put out an eye and make half the screen fuzzy or cut off an ear and attenuate the sound on one channel. That'd serve as a persistent reminder, both to the player and to others who interact with them.
  • I'm guessing that there's many reasons people become griefers, but you'd have to think that one of them would be to gain notoriety. i.e. thinking its cool to have people recognise you in the (virtual) street & turn to each other & say in hushed whispers... "there goes teh_griefer". Surely crucifixion would just be giving them more of the infamy they're after?
  • seems to me you will only be giving these guys a messianic complex. matrydom the sign of a true PKer, blah, blah, etc...
  • In addition to the public humiliation of your character for a week, it would seem to make sense to handicap them in other ways for a limited time which would increase in severity for each 'conviction'. Off the top of my head, here are a couple of things I could think of. For 1 month after the crucifixion:

    - Add a surcharge of 25% for any financial transaction. The recipient of the transaction would still only get the requested amount, but the payor would pay the requested amount + 25% tax to the game.

Of course there's no reason for it, it's just our policy.

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