MS Proposes Disclosing Windows Source To India 512
raghuram writes "Interesting news from Economic Times of India, I found an interesting story, Microsoft Planning to Share Code with India." He excerpts from that article: "Microsoft has already made a proposal to the ministry of information technology (of India) for sharing the Windows source code with one government body. The nature of the body has not been spelt out; it will presumably be worked out after discussions between the company and the government officials. Interestingly, the offer comes at a time when state governments are showing interest in rival Linux operating system as the latter's source code is free and downloadable from the internet."
Wild... (Score:2, Insightful)
One wonders if this is a precedent being set, or if this is just a bid to get into the good graces of what is arguably the current largest current producer of software developers (and cheap ones, too)?
Cynical, I know...
Re:Wild... (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Wild... (Score:3, Insightful)
Well, I reread the article, and it doesn't say whether they're thinking about opening the whole thing up to this agency or just select portions... they've given up parts of their code before to big corps and some educational institutions before, but I don't think they've ever given anyone the whole shebang.
Given how MS has protected its source in the past, I wouldn't count on any leaks, even if they do strike some kind of deal. I just don't see it happening.
Re:Wild... (Score:5, Funny)
I suppose there would be the humor factor of being able to point out the lines that say,
// Leave commented out until appeals are over.
// remove( "C:\Program Files\Netscape\Netscape.exe" );
Re:Wild... (Score:4, Funny)
grep -r
It would teach me tons about finding overflows, I'm sure....
Re:Wild... (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Wild... (Score:5, Insightful)
please, please, do NOT leak it.
The bugs could get corrected, which could lead to competition for Linux.
Re:Wild... (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Wild... (Score:5, Insightful)
In general, they're already paying for it (at least the goverments are, and I don't know how bad the piracy problem is in India...)
I think what's got Microsoft talking opening their source to the Indian government is that India and some other nations have been making noises about switching to open-source OSes. Maybe this is the first of several overtures to fractious governments.
Microsoft, after all, can offer some pretty tasty carrots with their sticks...
Re: Think about the precedent... (Score:3, Interesting)
Most people think that 'operating systems' are something that are confined to the workings of computers. History, however, would point out that the term 'computer' used to refer to a person, whose job was to compute (with an abacus or something). Similarly, an 'operating system' also affects how people perform their jobs... Have you ever had somebody tell you something like 'OK, so click Start, Programs, Office, Word' And without thinking, you go through a set of motions that are nearly instinctual? That's an example of how people use operating systems to communicate information and tasks to other people.
I digress a bit. The way I see it, the United States has sort of a 'protective ward' or 'shield' against this kind of stuff, because the USA has a 250+ year old operating system which the federal government uses. The code? Written down in the US Constitution.
Anyhow, the way I see it, you are right, sharing the source code of their OS with a government does seem like its setting a bit of an odd precedent. As far as I can tell, it's sort of like saying, 'OK, we'll organize your billion people just like we organize our files on a supercomputer.' And every person gets a profile, access, authority, and authentication to certain network resources (can you say access control lists (ACLS)?). Hmmm.
It seems to me that it's suggesting a rather Brave-New-World-esque operating system for India. Very, very weird precedent.
Re:Wild... (Score:5, Informative)
There's nothing new about this about this. Microsoft has made source available (under an NDA) for years, probably always. Presumably the fact that there are now competing operating systems and applications that offer complete and routine access to source may push them to offer source more liberally but there's nothing new here.
All that's new is that journalists and readers now know what the words "source code" mean.
Re:Wild... (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Wild... (Score:5, Insightful)
Want to know the punch line to all of this? Linux has reduced Microsoft into one of those little squeaky "Me too!"s that are little more than flame bait..
-----
QUICK! Reply to this email that you'll attach your OS sources and we'll send you all of the free image-upgrading pr0n you can handle!
-----
Re:Wild... (Score:3, Interesting)
Take that one step further and read Ken Thompson's masterpiece Reflections on Trusting Trust [bell-labs.com]
Re:Wild... (Score:5, Funny)
No, the precedent has already been set. . . (Score:5, Insightful)
The genie is out of the bottle. MS is the follower.
MS is running a slow retreat. It will do so as slowly as it can, as seldom as it can.
That is why it's offering the code to India but fought the DoJ tooth and nail. The *Indian* government's interest in Linux is one that MS believes is serious. It does not yet take the American govenments *use* of Linux seriously. When it does the American *government* will get code, but just exactly that least amount of code that will "seal the deal."
Rinse and repeat.
This is always the case when a business is based on "secret knowledge." Once someone else learns the knowledge they undercut the orginal seller. Once the knowledge is ubiquitous the knowledge has no commercial value per se and the "price" of the knowledge becomes the price of the labor to impliment it.
So it has been. So it is. So it shall be.
Eventually Windows and MS Office will sell, together, for about $40, about the price of a boxed Red Hat distro, and come with a certain amount of user readable and modifiable code.
It's where the market is already, it's just going to take a bit of time for it to overcome it's inertia and readjust to the current state of affairs.
With MS kicking and screaming all the way.
Because of this Linux *will never win.* At least in the sense of being the one true OS that dominates the world. It will eventually have too much competition *at it's own level.*
But that will be because its *principles* carried the day.
Somewhere in its heart MS realizes this. This is why it's so willing to aggresively seek various means of forcing Windows usage. It's the only tactic it has left.
Which is a clear indication that the game is already lost.
KFG
Re:No, the precedent has already been set. . . (Score:2)
I agree with everything except the above quote. I won't go so far as to say Microsoft doesn't have a heart (since we're anthromorphizing here, anyway), just that it keeps it in a freezer, since it never had any use for one - that would be bad for business :-)
Re:No, the precedent has already been set. . . (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:No, the precedent has already been set. . . (Score:4)
There are third alternatives: Mac OS X, AmigaOS, BSD, Hurd, Menuet [menuetos.org], Plan 9, Inferno, etc. There are hundreds of operating systems out there, many of which are very good for general-purpose computing.
By Microsoft's definition (world domination), Linux will most likely never win. But, neither will MS-Windows. The djinn is free, Pandora's box has been cracked.
And everyone but Microsoft will win, because Microsoft has made it a "Microsoft versus everyone else" fight.
Re:No, the precedent has already been set. . . (Score:5, Insightful)
(I guess I'm feeding the Troll, but...)
First off, the price of an OS + office suite is not zero. The price of a complicated, difficult to install, esoteric, very difficult to learn OS & office suite is zero. The price of an OS that works OUT OF THE BOX is several hundred dollars.I know you're trying to call Linux + OpenOffice complicated, difficult to install, etc. but what was the last Linux distro that you installed? I install Windows pretty regularly at work and I have installed my fair share of Linux as well. Some versions of Linux are easier to install than Windows. RedHat 8, Mandrake 9 and Knoppinx (to name a few) work out-of-the-box for me. Plus, they install (or run without even installing) OpenOffice along with the OS. Getting a full system up and running with apps is far easer and much faster with Linux.
If you were comparing apples and apples, then MS would already have stopped selling their software. But, they are not perfect substitutes, and most intelligent, rational people know that. They are not even close to perfect substitutes.If by "perfect substitutes" you meant "drop-in replacements", you're right. They are not drop-in replacements. No one ever said they were. Personally I don't want a drop-in replacement - I want an improvement. And while making it different doesn't always mean making it better, making it better ALWAYS means making it different.
People (like myself) would rather pay hundreds of dollars for Windows.[as opposed to $0 for Linux]This one diserves an <ul>
The encouraging thing (if you're one of us "OSS zealots") is that Linux use continues to grow, both in servers and on desktops. Application customers (especially big businesses) are encouraging their application suppliers to develop for Linux. Computer manufacturers are bundling StarOffice and OpenOffice on computers (and passing the savings on to the customer). "Grandma friendly" Linux distros like Lycoris and Lindows are gaining steam. All-in-all, things are going well for Open Source and Free Software.
* We all know that MS Windows is very not free.
Re:No, the precedent has already been set. . . (Score:3, Insightful)
As for paying a *nix expert to set things up. Your right, I can't speak for anyone else... but at my shop, we charge no more or less because your setting up *nix rather than windows, we charge the same either way and admittedly, initial setup sometimes takes a little longer for a *nix setup, but support after that is massively reduced. Usually it is most effective for a company to "switch" when they are about to spend money upgrading to a new version of windows anyway, this makes the additional labor for setup far cheaper than staying with windows.
If you rely that heavily on custom apps I pity, windows or linux, your either in a niche market where you have no choice or you've made very poor choices in the past. It's an extremely rare case where a custom app (especially one that can't be rewritten for another platform that has completely open api's in a couple hours) actually outweighs the benefit of a more popular package.
But when it comes down to it, yes, we agree, linux (or insert another OS here) is not always going to be a perfect solution when you've already sunk your hook in another platform. With any computer solution, it starts with the software and computer setup revolving around how the rest of your buisness is run, later the buisness is revamped around the ways the computers run to gain the most benefit. At this point it becomes very difficult to switch period, extremely difficult with a proprietary solution. Because you don't want to restructure your buisness around the way the new software works, you want it to "do all things your old software did" aka acomplish your needs in the same manner your old software did, not in the manner the new software does. Sometimes small case scenerios are no big deal, it's a much bigger issue when talking about an entirely new OS and all new applications. Your "functionality" isn't a task list being present in your email client that is shared via a server. Your real functionality is effective time management, a more specific look than this is micromanaging your solution and is where you'll have problems "switching" where you would have had none if you'd built using a different solution from the get.
The same problem exists with most of those who go out into the world and setup linux solutions, most of them are converts who switched from windows... the problem with them (regardless of how much they "know") is when they are determining a solution, first they think of how they'd do this in windows, then they think of a linux solution to "provide the same functionality" they are using linux to replace a windows system that doesn't even exist yet!
On another note with your custom apps... think how much you could save in the future if you insist on custom apps by open sourcing those apps after they are built and essentially letting the world upgrade your custom apps and provide more functionality... sometimes things you yourself would have ended up paying developers to add... and next time you switched to "a better way" your app might have already been ported. If you have custom apps because they are cost effective when your in the buisness of making custom apps, begone you nasty beast
*ps - for labor costs in general, it's not hard to evaluate, is it cheaper to pay me for an hour extra during an install, or 5 extra hours for each time I have to come out and fix windows?*
Re:Wild... (Score:2)
Kudos Microsoft!
HHAA (Score:2, Funny)
Wow, try telling RMS that.
Simple != Obvious (Score:3, Insightful)
Wow, try telling RMS that.
The idea behind open source is simple. It just isn't terribly intuitive to most folks in the business world.
It just doesn't add up. (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:It just doesn't add up. (Score:3, Funny)
Because the American government wasn't considering using a rival OS.
TheMole
Re:It just doesn't add up. (Score:5, Interesting)
Security is very important to foreign countries... and having the source would help them be less concerned about backdoors.
This is a way to take one of the arguments for Linux off the table. They will only use this trick in places that are actively try to switch away.
Easy... (Score:3)
Instead, DOJ already is a Microsoft customer, and one of the biggest, to the tune of many thousands of machines.
Sweet... (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Sweet... (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Sweet... (Score:5, Funny)
Actually it was Linux with a Windows logo set as the wallpaper.
Sweet... 'n Sour (Score:4, Interesting)
Sour: If Windows source is already available to selected developers right here at home, why hasn't someone leaked it?
My understanding of "Shared Source" was that Microsoft shows you theirs if you promise not to tell what it looks like. I naturally assumed that with the code being such a closely held secret, that it would be on the newsgroups before you could say groups-dot-google-dot-com.
But then, it may just be my ignorance showing... I'm just a VB coder staying away from the bleeding edge -- in order to provide my clients with code that works the same way each time.
Re:Sweet... 'n Sour (Score:5, Insightful)
Looking into the source code might require signing a NDA (Non-Disclosure Agreement) that states that all financial damages which occur due to leaking the source can be reclaimed on the person who signed the NDA. It can't be that hard to hide some obscure hex value in a constant in some unimportant part of windows which can be traced to people who have access to the sources. Also, do you think MS would give it's source code to companies that are against MS?
Re:Sweet... (Score:5, Interesting)
True? Nah, likely not. Would it work? Just possibly. We've all heard about Samba developers who treat MS code like a toddler running around with ebola milkshakes (cover eyes and run).
Re:Sweet... (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Sweet... (Score:3, Informative)
It's not like the Windows code is some uber secret that noone outside MS has ever seen, it is just controled. What MS objects to is having to give their source code to their competitors or to the public at large, not to certian groups of their choosing.
Re:You'd like that (Score:4, Interesting)
The real reason is to make sure that developers who see their source code can't later work on open-source projects without "polluting" the open-source project. I will never look at M$ source code, for that, among other, reasons.
But could you imagine the damage if M$ was successful in claiming that their code ended up in a linux kernel? Or apache? or php? or perl? or gcc?
Wow, reminds me of childhood (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Wow, reminds me of childhood (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Wow, reminds me of childhood (Score:2)
Running scared (Score:5, Interesting)
It sounds like Microsoft is running scared now. They realise that India is a powerhose because it has way more people (population) than the United States.
India seems to be tilted toward linux right now and if the linux movement there gets into full swing, the momentum will be very, very hard for Microsoft to stop.
I hope the Indians look to the long terms effects of the windows and linux paths, as opposed to short terms benefits.
spank me (Score:2)
Re:Running scared (Score:2)
Last time I was in India (~2,3 years ago) there were by far more signs up in Bombay about C# courses than anything else.
Re:Running scared (Score:3)
and you, my highly-learned friend, are WAY off base. The education system in India is VERY good, it's just that it is skewered in favor of the middle-class--those who are poor can find it difficult to complete education. IMHO most people over here are doubtful of the benefits of education and hence do not complete it, even though banks are willing to give educational loans. Even the people who do complete higher education are disenchanted with it and just do it for the "degree".
Some places such as Bihar and Orissa have literacy rates around 30% and you think some memo about linux in schools is gonna make a difference?
Let me see, 30% of 1billion+ is 300million. Yup, that's NOT gonna make a difference worldwide, right?
bad idea microsoft (Score:2, Troll)
I feel MS should be more careful with their products, free software would deffinately be more appropriate for piracy-rampant asia. go linux!
If you *really* want the windows source, you can.. (Score:2)
There are also other people with the source. If a company really needs to see the windows sorce, they could probably place a corporate spy into M$ to get it.
Re:bad idea microsoft (Score:2)
Re:bad idea microsoft (Score:2)
P.S.:I don't count anything written in VB as "real work", and I'm sure I'm not the only one who feels this way.
If you haven't had any problems, you haven't been trying hard enough, I guess /-)
Re:bad idea microsoft (Score:2)
Here's the diff: Having to reinstall Windows 'cause it's [broke | corrupted | virused | bsod] as opposed to install a new version of linux because you want to see what's new.
So, to get back on topic, I wouldn't want to see their source code anyway. If I want to see examples of bad code, I just have to look at the stuff I wrote 2 decades ago.
Why do people think this is some miraculous thing? (Score:4, Informative)
It's not like you can go download it or Joe Schmoe can get it for any old reason, but it is (and has been) available under special circumstances.
This is not new, or news.
Re:Why do people think this is some miraculous thi (Score:2)
"Much" is worth absolutely nothing from a security perspective. You must have all of it, including the compiler, then compile the compiler with an independent "trusted" compiler (e.g. gcc). Then you recompile all the system software and apps and make sure they match, bit for bit, the shipped product. That's the only way you can verify that they've actually given you the real source.
Hopefully India will insist on at least this, otherwise it's worthless.
Agreed (Score:2, Interesting)
One thing to remember about MS source code is that it's not necessarily all in C/C++ or some other such language which one expects to 'compile.' Much of it is in Microsoft speak, as it were. Think of it as a meta language, which operates at a social organization level... which is basically what an operating system is, and is what they sell. If you havn't seen Microsoft code, alot of it is written in 'English' in a similar way to how Cobol is writtin in 'English'.
I digress (and run the risk of upsetting somebody) so I'll get back to the issue at hand. Yes, Universities and other entities get Windows source code.
The indiatimes.com server is iffy at best (Score:3, Informative)
MS to share Windows code with India
PRAGATI VERMA
TIMES NEWS NETWORK[ FRIDAY, DECEMBER 13, 2002 02:31:31 AM ]
Microsoft is virtually doing the unthinkable in India -- it is planning to share the Windows source code. Not with one and all, as Linux does, but with a specific government body which, in turn, will share it with others for the purposes of e-governance and education.
Microsoft has already made a proposal to the ministry of information technology for sharing the Windows source code with one government body. The nature of the body has not been spelt out; it will presumably be worked out after discussions between the company and the government officials. Interestingly, the offer comes at a time when state governments are showing interest in rival Linux operating system as the latter's source code is free and downloadable from the internet.
When contacted by ET, Microsoft India president Rajiv Nair was somewhat cagey. Although he didn't deny the move, he merely said, "We are evaluating the idea (of sharing the source code)." However, sources in the company said that MS is already in talks with the government to work out the modalities of sharing the source code. It's learnt that MS worldwide program manager for shared source program, Jason Matusow, was recently in India to work out the modalities.
Microsoft is exceedingly secretive about its Windows source code -- the company has so far shared it with only a few big clients and developers. In Asia. MS has shared the Windows source code with select clients in Japan, Korea and Singapore. What appears to have persuaded it to extend the same privilege to the Indian government is the growing attraction here for the Linux OS, which is seen by some state governments as a cheaper alternative to Windows.
Microsoft officials are, of course, playing down the Linux threat. They insisted that Linux wasn't a big issue while selling to the governments in India. Says Peter Hayes, industry vice-president, Microsoft Government: "OS software is merely 1-3% of the total cost of an IT project, and studies have shown that total cost can be lower with Microsoft technologies compared to Linux." The open source software has been grabbing headlines recently as the debate on open versus proprietary software has gained momentum in government circles here.
Says MS boss for shared source program, Jason Matusow, "There has been a lot of hype about open source code in the software industry as well as in the media. Linux might grab headlines, but being able to look at source code doesn't bring any benefits to an average end-user, though it might increase the trust level."
The basic idea behind open source is very simple. When programmers can read, redistribute, and modify the source code for a piece of software, the software evolves. People improve it, people adapt it, people fix bugs. While open source community believes that this process produces better software than the traditional closed model, proponents of proprietary software argue that this model can't work in the commercial world.
Microsoft should (Score:3, Insightful)
How about sharing that source code with the US federal government and all the other state governments it has pending cases with.
Either way, a loss IMHO... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Either way, a loss IMHO... (Score:2)
All too true probably. However, I was thinking about the hundreds of worms and DOS attacks that will happen within days, probably clogging the internet to a standstill. Thanks Microsoft...
Re:Either way, a loss IMHO... (Score:5, Funny)
Remember, if you keep all of your data in portable formats, Windows costs half as much.
Comment removed (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:scared.. (Score:3, Informative)
http://research.microsoft.com/collaboration/uni
This may be the first time they've done this with a government, but it isn't the first time they've liscenced out their source.
India: don't fall for it (Score:5, Insightful)
Even if they do give India the source, it'll only be temporary -- for now, to prevent them from switching to Linux. Once India is dependant on MS, it'll be no more source and no more cheap-deals for them.
Re:India: don't fall for it (Score:3, Funny)
-India
That's EXACTLY why (Score:2, Interesting)
They don't specify the version... (Score:5, Funny)
Interestingly enough... (Score:2, Insightful)
I would not be surprised one bit if M$ follows this tactic with India and any other large industrialized nation seeking a computer implementation that isn't already under their control. It makes those countries think that they are being helped by a corporation that is only doing it to gain marketshare.
Tainted code (Score:5, Insightful)
So, Microsoft is offering show the Windows source to India, potentially tainting a 15% of the world's population with their intellectual property?
I can't think of a better way to manufacture thousands of Windows developers while at the same time denying Open Source access to a billion people.
Well, they do share code with the US govnt (Score:2, Redundant)
I'm sure if you put enough money on the table M$ would let you look at the code. And I'm sure M$ sees a lot of money in getting it's hooks in india's growing IT world.
let me ge this straight ... (Score:5, Interesting)
and so now it's friday the 13th per GMT. maybe this is a fitting time to run the story
I just wonder... (Score:4, Insightful)
I mean, if the atom bomb got out, which has only a fraction of the destructive power of Windows (just kidding), then why not Windows?
Has it been:
- People are too scared of Microsoft to do it, even with anonymizing technology?
- Microsoft's security is just that good?
- ???
Re:I just wonder... (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:I just wonder... (Score:5, Interesting)
I'll give you some answers. I won't go into details of me personally, which you hopefully understand after reading this but here's the few personal things I _will_ say:
- I worked for M$
- I was not a developer
- I had full access to the source of a Windows version (it was not an NT/2K/XP variant, the source was available to everyone on the M$ network who knew where to find it)
- this was several years ago, things have changed, no doubt
Now, back to answering your question. First of all, some common sense answers:
- because it would be illegal?
- because they are not anti-M$?
- because it doesn't occur to them that it would be a 'good thing' to do?
I'll take your suggestions backwards:
Microsoft's security is just that good?
Obviously not.
People are too scared of Microsoft to do it, even with anonymizing technology?
Exactly, I think your question answered that already quite nicely when you said "arguably the most valuable piece of source code in history"
with all that in mind someone would consider:
- who would want to risk a reasonable career, for exactly what?
- who knows if my access to the source is watermarked?
- as someone suggested with the analogy of the Coke formula: is it really that unique that it's worth risking anything for? (believe me, it's not. In fact you CAN look at large pieces of M$ source, just go download a DDK)
Now, from what I have seen, there _is_ some evidence that could have helped the DOJ case regarding the non-competitive stuff with DR-DOS which can be found in the source.
This may have been a valid reason for someone to leak it, but the question is, would you trust the government or anyone enough to protect you so that you can continue the live that you want to have, after you did?
Or even more importantly, should the government be able to get and find this information by it's own, legal, resources?
I think it's a tough choice to risk an already way too short time as a productive developer to deal with lawsuits and what not.
Just a few thoughts
(I trust Rob to provide the "anonymizing technology")
Re:I just wonder... (Score:2)
Pay no attn to the billionaire behind the curtain (Score:2, Insightful)
India's hangups over making a deal with MS w/r/t their educational programs have much more to do with MS's rabid interest in dominating the hearts and minds of the next generation of computer users.
As such, India should be asking to see MS's internal business model, not their source code...
The Secret Source Code!!! (Score:3, Funny)
IBM counters Bill Gates "gifts" to India (Score:5, Informative)
http://in.news.yahoo.com/021212/43/1z0mv.html [yahoo.com]
I think IBM realizes what's at stake here and is willing to put more $$ where it's mouth is. That's gotta piss Bill and Steve off.
LoB
Nothing to do with Benevolence (Score:4, Interesting)
These are all for good reason. Not only will one massive lost market initate several others, but India also represents a leading software high-tech zone that Microsoft does not want to lose. Think of the number of Linux programmers that would be learning to work on a real platform in five year if the government does not 'sell out' to this US monopoly.
I can't disclose really any more than this, but expect more concessions from the Redmond Giant before all is said and done. Hopefully India's Linux initiatives have not been just to facilitate dealing with M$.
Microsoft's dike is springing many holes. Thiy might fill this one, but products like the one below will be taking serious bites out of MSFT in the coming months...
http://www.distrowatch.com/review-xandros.php
I wonder (Score:4, Interesting)
Just seeing the source isn't enough (Score:3, Interesting)
Don't think so.
Comment removed (Score:3, Interesting)
[ My Friend Got The Code Already! ] (Score:4, Funny)
#include "win31.h"
#include "win95.h"
#include "win98.h"
#include "workst~1.h"
#include "evenmore.h"
#include "oldstuff.h"
#include "billrulz.h"
#include "monopoly.h"
#include "backdoor.h"
#define INSTALL = HARD
char make_prog_look_big(16000000);
void main()
{
while(!CRASHED)
{
display_copyright_message();
display_bill_rules_message();
do_nothing_loop();
if (first_time_installation)
{
make_100_megabyte_swapfile();
do_nothing_loop();
totally_screw_up_HPFS_file_system();
search_and_destroy_the_rest_of-OS2();
make_futile_attempt_to_damage_Linux();
disable_Netscape();
disable_RealPlayer();
disable_Lotus_Products();
hang_system();
}
write_something(anything);
display_copyright_message();
do_nothing_loop();
do_some_stuff();
if (still_not_crashed)
{
display_copyright_message();
do_nothing_loop();
basically_run_windows_31();
do_nothing_loop();
}
}
if (detect_cache())
disable_cache();
if (fast_cpu())
{
set_wait_states(lots);
set_mouse(speed,very_slow);
set_mouse(action,jumpy);
set_mouse(reaction,sometimes);
}
printf("Welcome to Windows 2000");
if (system_ok())
crash(to_dos_prompt)
else
system_memory = open("a:\swp0001.swp",O_CREATE);
while(something)
{
sleep(5);
get_user_input();
sleep(5);
act_on_user_input();
sleep(5);
}
create_general_protection_fault();
}
(Hehe. Code courtesy of this funny site [johnfound.hit.bg] and reproduced here for your enjoyment.)
Done before (Score:3, Interesting)
It does help you check for backdoors, at least if you are allowed to compile, and can check the compiler too. [acm.org]
On the other hand, the terms will clearly not allow you to do anything that might actually threaten the Microsoft monopolization of critical infrastructure.
"Shared Source" is the worst of both worlds (Score:3, Insightful)
What are they going to say when it's not just industrial spies, but a whopping big subcontinent that can find holes to exploit by code review? And we still can't patch it ourselves?
Ugh - frozen software, whose every flaw is there for the reader.
The only plus I see here is that only very obfuscated MS trojans will surivive.
Didn't India already know? (Score:2)
Just a response to open source..... (Score:3, Insightful)
"Hey kid, the first one is free."
India I hope (Score:4, Insightful)
What guarantee does India have that when Windows 2004 comes out, it won't be a total re-write of the code that Microsoft doesnt want to share? Then their investment in MS code today will be useless tomorrow. Not to mention the myriad of overbearing restrictions that MS is bound to place on the use of their code.
If India wants to excel in the software development field, I think it's in their best interest to go with an Open solution e.g. Linux or some flavor of BSD. This is what will benefit them the most in the long run.
Source != binaries? (Score:3, Insightful)
I mean, even at m$, nobody as a view at the entire source. What are the proofs that backdoors aren't added just after the programmers labs by NSA or even... Al-Quaida?
And don't tell me Indian government will be allowed to compile their own versions for their whole staff!
Maybe I'm paranoid, but NO, I don't trust m$...
Which source base? 95,CE,NT? (Score:3, Interesting)
It might make a lot of sense for MS to give out the source to the windows 95 codebase, as it is old and decrepit and would cost more to understand than to reimplement.
Windows CE has a very small market and giving out the source base might be its last gasp.
An Indian Techie's perspective (Score:5, Insightful)
- Sooner or later India will grow strong enough to challenge US. Then Windows will be viewed with the kind of suspicion that the Chinese/Europeans do now.
- It is simply not attractive (market size) for MS to "Indianize" Windows, the way we Indians can do to Linux (eg All Native Languages, etc)
- I already see a trend that very IT savvy Indians tend to dislike MS for various reasons (trustworthiness, price-gouging,
- Pride. With MS & its software, you can only do sweatshop style jobs. With Linux, we can turn our programmers into reputable contributors, recognised the world over.
take a step back guys (Score:3, Funny)
it doesn't matter as long as it works in the real world
this is one place where i think capitalism really shines
people won't stand for something ineffecient just because so and so would like to keep it that way so they can get rich, and the market will kill off companies that can't adapt as needed
Act of War? (Score:3, Funny)
SETI@India? (Score:5, Funny)
#include ba_doom_ching.h
microsoft's biggest nightmare (Score:4, Insightful)
India becomes a free software country
why : free software's history has mostly been in the 'developed' world - here it is flourishing in spite of the fact that it is playing from a catch-up position
in these countries most of the places where it makes sense to use computers are already doing so and have been for a while - and most of these are using proprietary society
despite this, free software is making significant inroads
now factor in the world's (soon to be) most populous country turning down the free software path much earlier in it's computerisation process than the countries it is following - moreover a country where english is (fairly widely) known and which has a culture possibly unrivalled in it's ability to deal with abstract thought (witness the highly sophisticated ancient vedic and dravidian cultures and the contemporary reputation of indian programmers)
result : the free software movement - steady and stable and resolutely making progress gets a massive shot in the arm - india becomes an example to all other 'devloping countries' - the microsoft pyramid scheme starts to develop massive cracks in it's base
free software in india - well worth while keeping a watching brief on
Windows source? Not now, please... (Score:3, Funny)
Legal Stuff (Score:3, Insightful)
Yawn (Score:3, Insightful)
Also notice the big $$$ MS has invested recntly (Score:3, Interesting)
It would seem that this 'open source' move is an attempt to silence the remaining critics who say that access to the source is more important than the $$$ that MS is throwing at them.
The sad thing is that this isn't comparable to having the Linux source. Very few will have access to it and those that do will only be able to look at it, rather than being able to modify the OS itself and redistribut it.
Basically the only benefit you get is the ability to look for bugs and trojans to make sure that you aren't being spied on. That is certainly reasonable for a government to want to do, but it is only one of the many benefits of true 'open source'.
How could you believe them? (Score:3, Insightful)
Thing is, how can you be sure it's really the actual production windows source code? Sure it will probably compile and even run, but he could leave certain bits out and it would take YEARS to discover that fact if it's a subtle deficiency.
No thanks, getting the source to Windows is like getting those low-interest rate checks from your credit card company. It sounds good on the surface, but when you really read it, you realize what a load it is....
Frankly My Dear (Score:2)
Re:An Open Letter^H^H^Hmetatroll (Score:2)
I'm .... off to feed the trolls, the wonderful trolls of /.
I'm here to feed the microsoft serfs because bill gates software sux,
if ever there was a troll, this was, because, because, because...
Ok, nice piece of irony, dude! I'm willing to bet that people bite, 'cause it's late in the day.
Re:An Open Letter... (Score:2)
Re:Open Source FUD (Score:3, Interesting)
Remember, Microsoft invented "embrace and extend" and FUD.
Perhaps the former, but for the latter, you can thank IBM. They perfected FUD in the Mainframe market when the finally had some competition in the form of a disgruntled engineer, Gene Amdahl.