Slashdot Log In
China Deploys IPv9 Network
Posted by
CowboyNeal
on Sat Jul 03, 2004 09:31 AM
from the jumping-the-gun dept.
from the jumping-the-gun dept.
jeber writes "At the New Generation Internet Ten-Digit Network Industrialization & Development Seminar held on June 25th at Zhejiang University, it was announced that China's Internet technology, IPv9, had been formally adapted and popularized into the civil and commercial sectors.
Based on a ten-digit computing method, IPv9 has its own address protocol, nameplate protocol, transitional protocol, and digital domain name regulations and standards as stated by Mr. Xie Jianping, founder of the IPv9 protocol and leader of the Ten-Digit Network Technology Standard Team. Along with being compatible with IPv4 and IPv6, IPv9 can also realize logistic separations between them and safely control them. On small-scale trials in Shanghai's Changing and Jinshan Districts, IPv9 technology has proven stable and safe."
This discussion has been archived.
No new comments can be posted.
The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.
Oh yeah? (Score:5, Funny)
Well I'm using IPvInfinityPlusOne, so :-P to you!
Re:Oh yeah? (Score:5, Funny)
IPvFreely
Parent
key word "control" (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:key word "control" (Score:5, Insightful)
Parent
Re:key word "control" (Score:5, Insightful)
As such China's protocols are the standards, as far as they are concerned.
Parent
1/5 to 1/4 quarter of the world popolution (Score:4, Insightful)
Boy is that a standard.
Parent
Re:1/5 to 1/4 quarter of the world popolution (Score:5, Insightful)
Parent
Re:key word "control" (Score:5, Interesting)
I remember taking a Chinese history course back in college. It was a requirement, and Eastern Studies had never really gripped my interests. But as we started it I became fascinated with the oceanic depth of their culture and history. I'm sorry I never persued it.
I remember that the *"People of Han" (as they called themselves) who founded the original Chin Dynasty considered themselves the center of the universe. So naturally, they too considered themselves the center of all culture and refinement. I see modern communism as a more contemporary expression of this belief. It seems almost bred into their cultural psychology. A very deep meme that is very difficult to erase.
So, while control may or may not have anything to do with the nature of IPv9, my interpretation of the matter (after taking that class) is that they are a very prideful people. It must irk them on some level that all of the important technologies (cars, computers, networking, flying, you name it) come from the west. Maybe this is their way of reasserting themselves as a force to be reckoned with. Which they are.
*Interestingly enough, they were so sure of their superiority that when they had their first runins with westerners they would make them cow-tow to the emperor. Which REALLY pissed off the European Nobles when they came to visit because cow-towing is literally debasing oneself in front of imperial greatness. Getting down on both knees and bowing repeatedly. The Chinese of that day (I forget what Dynasty it was) considered ALL westerners to be barbarians! I don't necessarily think they were wrong about that, after what I've learned about history.
The name "Han" actually meant in their language "The People" just as it does in almost all languages. It's the same in Navajo (Dine) and Cherokee (Tsalagee). Interestingly enough, when the Cherokee first encountered westerners THEY thought they were the most civilized people. They thought the Europeans were babrarous. Mainly because the English and other European languages have the 'b' and 'r' sound which sounded awful to them. It may seem odd that the Cherokees would have no 'r' sound. The reason for that is that the language of the main body of Cherokee speakers don't have those sounds and call themselves Tsalagee. Europeans totally misheard that sound and started calling them Cherokees.
Parent
Re:key word "control" (Score:5, Funny)
So.....nothing like the modern-day USA then ?
Parent
Re:key word "control" (Score:5, Insightful)
No, you're absolutely right. American's do think that they're the center of the universe [blogspot.com]. I know because I am one. I'm a Jerseyite, I live very near Princeton which had beautiful minds [abeautifulmind.com] and where Einstein's Unified Field Theory [lrz-muenchen.de] was first concocted. Plains, trains, automobiles, computers, networks all invented her in the good ol' rockin' US of friggin' A!
We are jingoisitic and think we are the center of the universe. But compare our piddling few hundred odd years to China's 7000 years or more!
But if you trace American culture, we basically go back to ye olde England to about the time of Cromwell or slightly before (history is not my forte). Until the late 1800s, most of American Society (around 70% I believe) was English/Irish in descent. After the turn of that century American Society was essentially re-made [barnesandnoble.com] with an influx of new immigrants from the rest of Europe, including Germany, Poland, and Italy (for example). It was a time when our culture was "unravelling" (according to Strauss and Howe) in a period that was not unlike the what the past 20 years of American Society has been like. Scarily, eerily similar. No, no OJ's getting chased by police in White Ford Broncos down the 405, no Monica Lewinsky, no Punk Rock [amazon.com]. But just like today, America was being thought anew to include all of the new cultures that were calling america home. It was also being shaken to it's foundations by spasmodic bursts of new technological developments like Movies, Telephones, the Automobile, and Flight. It was also a time when we first heard the beginnings of a dirty and dissident form of music known as...brace yourself...JAZZ!!!!!! *GASP*. I know hard to imagine, but Jazz was really regarded just that way by prominent members of our society instead of the rich subtle tapestry of powerful creative expression that it is.
So, what's been happening for the past 20 years? Well, computers have been around for a long while, but I really don't think the couch potatoes started buying them until they became of the internet at about the same time. We had dirty dissident punk and instrial, and indie rock and underground cinema. And the immigration is ENORMOUS and will definitely chage the way America thinks of itself. Latin American immigration is simply jaw-dropping. In the town I used to live in, almost everyone there is mono-lingual. And it ain't english! Whether your in a "latin neighborhood" or no, Spanish is on all the ATMs and an option for nearly all phone support calls. I think Spanish should be a high school requirement! Asian immigration is completely boundless as well. Up in Fort Lee NJ (right by the GW bridge) almost all of the street signs and business are in both Korean and English...or in just Korean. Including some street signs!
So a *DEFINITE* on my to-do list is to bone up on Spanish [languagere...online.com] and to give Korean [languagere...online.com] a serious go. While wer'e at it, why stop there? I'd also like to get to speaking
Parent
Re:key word "control" (Score:5, Interesting)
China sees us as warlords holding temporary advantage due to the outcome of WWII. Chinese warlords have always extorted horrific tribute/taxation from their subjects, but wrapped it in a framework of celestial-academic (or, more recently, communist-rhetorical) self-justification. This is what they think we're doing to them when we say "you have to pay us billions of dollars because (mumble software patent mumble genome license mumble royalty blah blah)".
China has made numerous moves lately that indicate they no longer consider us to be an unstoppable force. They haven't done anything drastically provocative, but they will. The Taiwan question is intolerable for the Chinese government. Sooner or later, if China stays on its current path, they will arrive at the point where they think they can get away with an invasion. And all I can say is, I sure as hell hope there's a moderate in the White House on that particular day.
-Graham
Parent
Re:key word "control" (Score:5, Interesting)
Several things stood out to me. This is a dynamic society, with construction everywhere. Yet they also spend money making their freeways signs look good, with a little extra neon. At night, the big cities are a neon wonderland. The freeways themselves have lighted lane markers and such. Lots of use of light.
And to the point on this topic, everyone he talked to seem to consider Taiwan a province of China, even the Taiwanise tourists, of which there are many. Now what I actually think is that neither government tolerate anything but the party line, and so people do not speak candidly on this issue. The real deal is that China considers Chinese populated territory to be properly under common rule. And most of the Taiwanese share that view. The Taiwanese government of course thinks it should be ruling China.
My idea is that everyone should agree that Taiwan is part of China and set a date, say in the next century, to realize it.
Parent
Re:key word "control" (Score:4, Insightful)
EVERY Taiwanese person that I have ever met thinks that the island should be completely and formally a seperate nation. Oddly enough, every mainland chinese person that I've met disagrees and belives as you have stated. Most of them also believe that Tibet rightfully belongs to China too.
Here's why -- that's what they teach them in the schools. Both sides get a full load of propaganda growing up and it takes a serious amount of critical thinking for any of them to get beyond it.
However, despite my American-propaganda filled youth, I can independently say that it is absolutely true that while Taiwan and the mainland obivously share a strong cultural bond, their current-day societies are different enough that any such integration would be extremely difficult and very destructive to smaller of the two. Far worse than what is happening in HK.
Parent
Re:key word "control" (Score:4, Insightful)
Parent
Re:key word "control" (Score:4, Insightful)
When you are talking about countries, you are talking about soveriegn entities which, in spite of however much the United Nations might like it, are by definition completely under there own control. We have the right (a word that isn't appropriate to use in reference to nations) to intervene in anything that is convenient to us. It is in our best interest that Taiwan remains a free and democratic society, and not fall under the control of the mainland communists. It is most definitely in the best interests of the Taiwanese that they remain free.
Parent
Re:key word "control" (Score:5, Insightful)
Please explain to me what body you have to license IPv* from?
Tell me again why I would need a commercial product to support IPv* when it has been in some form in free OEs for -years-?
Explain how IPv* has anything to do with "formats" when those "formats" (I'm assuming you're thinking things like video codecs, etc) are not part of the network layer?
China's IPv9 can only exist for one of 2 reasons:
1) They want more control over their own networks, perhaps by having China on IPv9 they have ways of better filtering IPv4/6 (I don't know) or maybe they suffer from the most common of all new network protocol designer's problems
2) Perhaps IPv9 has definite technical advantages over IPv4/6 that will become more obvious as adoption goes on.
It doesn't really matter
It is supply and demand
Parent
Welcome China (Score:5, Funny)
Read this: So far, China is the only country in the world that has consolidated domain names, IP addresses and MAC addresses into ten-digit text files. China and the United States are currently the only two countries that possess root domain name analysis servers, IP address servers, independent domain names, IP addresses and MAC address sources.
Re:The dragon rises ... (Score:4, Funny)
Parent
Standards? (Score:4, Interesting)
RFC (Score:5, Informative)
Parent
Re:RFC (Score:5, Interesting)
Parent
Re:RFC (Score:5, Funny)
Parent
Re:Standards? (Score:4, Informative)
Parent
IPv9 (Score:5, Funny)
Re:IPv9 (Score:4, Funny)
At some point in the future we might need to address the particles that are currently swapped out.
Parent
IPV4-IPV6-IPV9-??? (Score:5, Funny)
Of course, I'll beat them all when I announce my patented IPV12 (tm).
Welcome to last week (Score:5, Funny)
A good thing for Spam (Score:5, Funny)
April fools joke? (Score:5, Interesting)
Googling for IP V9 reveals an april fool's joke from 1994:
RFC 1606 [faqs.org]
RFC 1607 [faqs.org]
Re:April fools joke? (Score:5, Informative)
Parent
Re:April fools joke? (Score:5, Informative)
The original RFC is here [faqs.org].
Parent
Obligatory Great Firewall of China reference (Score:4, Insightful)
Last week there was a large pro-democracy rally in Hong Kong, which was (shamefully) handed over to the Chinese by the British in 1997, in circumstances that were never envisaged in the original treaty. The British built Hong Kong into a capitalist economy, educated the Chinese and taught them all about Western systems of government, and then said "Well, forget all that stuff about the Rights of Man and government by the people, we're handing you over to the 800lb gorilla who thinks Genghis Khan was an enlightened ruler." The people of Hong Kong seem, so some reason, to think this was a retrograde step. I guess the Chinese Government doesn't want that sort of thing happening in Shanghai or Beijing, and turning their back on the rest of the world may look like a good way to maintain the status quo.
Re:Obligatory Great Firewall of China reference (Score:5, Informative)
When people refer to "Hong Kong" now they refer to "Hong Kong Island", "Kwoloon", and a bunch of much smaller island. The vast majority of the population live in "Hong Kong Island" and "Kwoloon", with less then 5% living in the smaller island.
By treaty stipulations, again which China still claims were forced upon them, Kwoloon was to be returned to China in 1997. If the British just return "Kwoloon" as by treaty and kept "Hong Kong Island", it would be totaly redilicious. It would be like diving London into two pieces and saying this half now belong to France and you need a visa to cross between them.
Parent
Re:Obligatory Great Firewall of China Reference (Score:4, Insightful)
Let's remove some of that misinformation, shall we?
First of all, things are not as easy as they seem. Maybe you think it is easy to distribute the wealth in China to all its people, but think about the logistics of it. China has a landmass comparable to the US with over 1.3 billion citizens. Getting the wealth from the coast to the inland areas is not easily feasible and it is one of the major economic reforms China is trying right now. In fact, the government attempts more and more to encourage development inland.
Party officials certainly do not "drive Ferraris." Yes, some party officials are better off than the people, but that's case even in the US. The salaries that the politicians make in the US put them into the upper-middle class.
If you think the Bush attitude to global warming, pollution and the rights of the citizen is backward, it's probably better for your blood pressure not to ask about China.
China actually does care about the environment. For example, during all years of schooling, children are required to learn about environmental issues in ways ranging from lectures to taking care of plants. Yes, citizens' rights is a concern, however, refer to a comment I have posted previously, It's 2004 People [slashdot.org].
Last week there was a large pro-democracy rally in Hong Kong, which was (shamefully) handed over to the Chinese by the British in 1997, in circumstances that were never envisaged in the original treaty.
It was certainly not "shamefully" handed back to the Chinese. First, HK was rightfully part of China until the British took it by force and trickery. Instead of assuming the eurocentric viewpoint (you seem to imply a preference of Western education and government), let's examine the history: The opium wars... where the British addicted millions of Chinese to opium and then used force to get better trade negotiations and Hong Kong. It's not a shame that HK was returned to its rightful owner. Hong Kong is still a major economic center in Asia today under China's rule.
The British built Hong Kong into a capitalist economy, educated the Chinese and taught them all about Western systems of government
I disagree. Regardless of who ruled Hong Kong, it would have turned into a great economic force. It is one of the most important ports in Asia and it cannot be ignored.
we're handing you over to the 800lb gorilla who thinks Genghis Khan was an enlightened ruler
You want to cite your sources on this one? Genghis Khan ruled China by force, no one liked him, and he was overthrown by the Chinese because they hated him (Yuan dynasty, one of the only non-Han dynasties). That's hardly the kind of action the people would show for "an enlightened ruler."
I'm not criticizing you in particular, there are a lot of posts similar to yours on /. in general. Yours happened to have a bunch of the topics I wanted to address. I'm not saying China is the greatest place to live either, but let's give it some credit.
Parent
Re:Obligatory Great Firewall of China Reference (Score:5, Interesting)
Of course not, They drive Mercedes [mercedes-benz.com.cn].
It's not a shame that HK was returned to its rightful owner.
The China that HK was a part of was Imperial China. This country does not exist any more. It's just as true, and just as irrelevant to say that the Communists stole China from its "rightful" owner, the Emperor.
And we're not talking about real estate, but 6 million people who were delivered to the rule of a government that many had risked their lives to escape from when they came to Hong Kong, of their own free will.
Genghis Khan ruled China by force, no one liked him
One thing I have to agree with, he wasn't even Chinese. However, Mao Zedong was, he did kill upwards of 50 million in the Great Leap Forward and Cultural Revolution, when of course people were risking their lives to escape in to Hong Kong.
Parent
Article shows lack of education of the globe. (Score:5, Funny)
I chalk this up as a clear and abject failure of our education system.
Re:Article shows lack of education of the globe. (Score:5, Funny)
wait.. then it wouldn't be IPv6 for them either, it'd be 9^dI.
Parent
we can never have enough (Score:5, Insightful)
IPv9 and Linux (Score:5, Funny)
It's the only protocol that has in-built, native support for RFC2549 [faqs.org] and, more importantly RFC527 [faqs.org].
Linus Torvalds has already announced that 2.7 will have kernel-level support for RFC2549, but maybe now the kernel developers will go the whole hog and adopt IPv9 ?
Article text (Score:5, Informative)
July 2, 2004
At the New Generation Internet Ten-Digit Network Industrialization & Development Seminar held on June 25th at Zhejiang University, it was announced that China's Internet technology, IPv9, had been formally adapted and popularized into the civil and commercial sectors.
After ten years of research and development, IPv9 will be used on projects with the National Safety Defense System, National Digital TV Network, IPv9 network experimental programs and many other organizations.
Based on a ten-digit computing method, IPv9 has its own address protocol, nameplate protocol, transitional protocol, and digital domain name regulations and standards as stated by Mr. Xie Jianping, founder of the IPv9 protocol and leader of the Ten-Digit Network Technology Standard Team. Along with being compatible with IPv4 and IPv6, IPv9 can also realize logistic separations between them and safely control them. On small-scale trials in Shanghai's Changing and Jinshan Districts, IPv9 technology has proven stable and safe.
IPv9 consists of three sets of root domain name servers and two sets of hard-connect servers. The two sets of domain name parsing servers each have a parsing capacity of three million users and fifty percent simultaneously. Digital domain name parsing servers, English domain name parsing servers, Chinese domain name parsing servers, IP address primal allotment server, DHCP server, IPv4/IPv9 duel-used 1000M routers, 1000M channel router, IPv4/IPv9 address switching server, crystal circuit transmitter and crystal circuit light routers have been applied to IPv9 protocol demonstrative projects.
So far, China is the only country in the world that has consolidated domain names, IP addresses and MAC addresses into ten-digit text files. China and the United States are currently the only two countries that possess root domain name analysis servers, IP address servers, independent domain names, IP addresses and MAC address sources. Shanghai Jiuyao Digital Network Co., Ltd has been established to popularize the IPv9 technology. The company will work with telecom operators such as China Telecom, China Unicom, China Mobile and China Netcom to better publicize the IPv9 technology.
Like IPv6 isn't good enough (Score:5, Informative)
Isn't this enough?
Re:Like IPv6 isn't good enough (Score:5, Insightful)
If the addresses were going to be assigned serially (ok, who wants IP address # 000000001?, ok 0000000002...) then you never run out.
But if you slice the 128 bits in half immediately, as a way to divide them up among companies, and then the companies subnet them, and the 128 bits keep getting whittled down, then you start crowding the address space. Yes, 2^128 is PLENTY, but the problem will be the 2^100- sized gaps between various assigned numbers.
To answer your question, "isn't this enough?", it's plenty for the short term, if managed properly. Hard to say about the long term, and hard to say about the "proper management". YOu have to weigh the costs of having a bigger address space, and ask "is the benefit worth the cost" (The benefits being the ability to poorly manage the number assignments, and the potential longevity of the protocol).
Just my opinion.
Parent
Look at History (Score:4, Funny)
Bill Gates 2004
Parent
China needs to control technology (Score:4, Interesting)
There are reasons for this:
- Chinese are very nationalisitc by definition (in chinese, China (Zhong Guo) mean the "Kindgom of the middle", they really thought -and still do to a certain extent- that China is the center of the world) and they are proud to "re-invent" or "re-conquer" to make it their own.
- they do not want to license foreign Intellectual Property, so they develop their own video format for instance, for both pride and economic reasons as well.
- The Chinese government think it needs to control information.
I believe that the latest is probably behind the move to IPv9.
By encouraging non-standard protocols, they ensure that the equipment has more chance to be manufactured in China, and they have more ways to control the information passing through it.
China recognizes the importance of the Internet and know it is essential to its progress, yet they also realize that it is the most dangerous way to propagate those "subversive" ideas like democracy and freedom of speech. So the best thing to do is probably to "embrace and extend"...
Now, where have I heard that before...?
Safe? (Score:4, Insightful)
this isn't much different (Score:4, Interesting)
We aren't that much different; we're just a lot more global and less self-centered.
Re:this isn't much different (Score:4, Insightful)
Parent
Series of Experiments (Score:4, Funny)
Let's all hope this works out better than those unfortunate IPv7 experiments [cjas.org] based around the Schumann Resonance [cjas.org]. Restoring reality from an offsite backup can be a real bitch.
Re:And what about IPv7 ? (Score:4, Funny)
Parent
Re:Ten Digit Computing (Score:4, Funny)
Imagine my disappointment when I found out that my "Digital Prostate Exam" didn't mean that it was computerized.
What a pain in the a$$.
Parent