Taiwan Says It Has Not Been Informed of 'Chip 4' Meeting (reuters.com) 19
Taiwan said on Friday it has not been informed about a so-called 'Chip 4' meeting that would include it, the United States, South Korea and Japan but added the island has always cooperated closely with the United States on supply chains. From a report: South Korean Foreign Minister Park Jin this week said Seoul expects to attend a preliminary meeting of the four chip manufacturing nations, describing the gathering as U.S.-led. He did not elaborate on what would be discussed. A meeting would come amid a global chip crunch that began two years ago with the onset of the pandemic and on the heels of a new U.S. law this month called the CHIPS Act that includes $52 billion in subsidies for companies that make chips or conduct chip research in the United States. The Biden administration has also sought deeper cooperation with Japan and South Korea to become more competitive with China's science and technology efforts.
This should be interesting (Score:2)
I'd imagine that the result of the CHIPS act will be a glut of cheap semiconductors on the market, as the US is messing with the natural supply/demand balance of this ecosystem.
That's not necessarily a bad thing for consumers, though. I personally wouldn't mind getting a cheap CPU and cheap GPU for my next gaming PC. Who knows, there might even be enough manufacturing capacity left over to see the Raspberry Pi getting shipped in volume again. One can dream, right?
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Subsidies don't typically result in a glut of good product. Instead we get shit like Solyndra. Those subsidies are going to be used to prop up companies who can't otherwise compete, like Intel, presently.
As for saving money, which sap paid for the subsidies?
Re: This should be interesting (Score:2)
China paid for the subsidies by lending money for very little interest.
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How much capacity will come online in a few year? Tell me who will buy all those chips.
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I don't see where anyone is 'forcing' companies to build fabs in the states. Nobody has to accept the subsidies or the terms.
Re:This should be interesting (Score:5, Informative)
Instead we get shit like Solyndra
It's been a decade, maybe it's time to get a better counterexample? Sure Solyndra defaulting was bad but part of the goal of that loan program was to take some risks on new tech companies at the time and it ended up working anyway, the program on the whole itself turned a profit.
Exclusive: Controversial U.S. energy loan program has wiped out losses [reuters.com]
And looking back Solyndra defaulting on some odd $500MM out of a $40B loan program seems kinda quaint actually and considering a decade later the US is in a renewable energy gold rush the program on the whole is an example of how government spending even if it turns a loss directly usually ends up a net positive for the economy and it's people on the whole.
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Why would we want someone to risk another person's capital? Talk about a moral hazard.
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Wouldn't that concept apply just the same to most of the private financal industry?
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The subsidies are likely to merely offset some of the expenses of building chip plants in the USA that were the reason a lot of that manufacturing went overseas, so I don't expect component prices to fall.
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That's not necessarily a bad thing for consumers, though. I personally wouldn't mind getting a cheap CPU and cheap GPU for my next gaming PC. Who knows, there might even be enough manufacturing capacity left over to see the Raspberry Pi getting shipped in volume again. One can dream, right?
We all would. It remains to be seen if the CHIPS act would do that. A few things to remember is that building a fab can take years especially if it is a brand new plant as opposed to adding to an existing one, and a new fab does does not mean the fab itself will make the newest products. For example, TSMC's Arizona plant to be finished in 2024 will have 4nm and 5nm nodes but their plant in Taiwan will start on 3nm this year. Lastly, some of the supply chain issues may not necessarily be caused by shortage o
Probably Nancy (Score:1)
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That's a pretty good point, more or less. Not move it, but add some similar production here. There's sufficient demand. Intel doesn't seem to be able to do any kind of volume in their finest process. Frankly I would have thought it would be an obvious move, why not build a plant in a country where you're going to sell a lot of product, if they're going to hand you some money to get started?
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Chip 4 (Score:4, Insightful)
Semiconductors are a critical national security asset for the 'Chip 4' and they fuel the economies. I suspect this meeting is at least partly about making sure that China doesn't wind up dominating the semiconductor industry like it has done in many other manufacturing categories. The advanced tech ecosystem there is still relatively small so it isn't too late. China wants to attract foreign investment by companies with technology that can help them move up the value-chain. Those companies are in the 'Chip 4', so the principles need to talk about how to keep that from happening.
The CHIPS Act was a smart move for the US. If a firm accepts a subsidy it can’t then expand overseas semiconductor output in any way competing with US operations. The other countries should enact similar legislation.
Discover (Score:1)
I use Discover card, who has all US-based CSRs. They appear to currently be as widely accepted as VISA and MC. I don't recall them deplatforming anyone. I don't know how they clear payments, however.
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You missed, the story wanted to to comment in that way ------> dawm the hall a bit :)
https://news.slashdot.org/story/22/08/18/2133224/can-the-visa-mastercard-duopoly-be-broken
Include *China* (Score:5, Interesting)
The whole kerfuffle about whether Taiwan is an independent country or not is a psyop meant to keep the international community "thinking past the sale".
Taiwan is home to the rightful democratic government of China, the mainland of which is currently occupied by the Communist Party with a totalitarian state.
A majority of Taiwan residents do not want independence from mainland China - they want to liberate it.
And you're supposed to debate Taiwanese Independence. See the trick? Who benefits?
So, yes, the US should include the Republic of China. And maybe they can get down to brass tacks about who loaded NSA spyware into Supermicro boards made in Taipai.
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Do you know any people from Taiwan?
I do. They describe themselves as Taiwanese -they will interrupt others and correct them that they are Taiwanese not Chinese.
While earlier generations wanted to "liberate China from the CCP", the current generations see themselves as separate.
I think that the CCP can afford to be patient and believes that, like Hong Kong, Taiwan will eventually come back into the fold -willingly or not; and that they will continue to apply pressure of both the carrot and stick variety unt