The End is Nigh for XP 893
SlinkySausage writes "Computer makers have been told they'll no longer be able to get Windows XP OEM by the end of this year, despite strong ongoing demand for the OS. Analysts and computer makers are wondering if the move is premature given Vista's ongoing performance and compatibility issues. Dell recently said it would reintroduce XP on a range of machines due to customer demand but Microsoft will only allow this until the end of the year."
Will anyone gain anything from this? (Score:5, Insightful)
Was Microsofts older versions of Windows phased out this fast too?
I guess the people at Microsoft have a really hard time accepting that many people (and companies!) have gotten comfortable with XP and does not want to get something different. Maybe Microsoft have been taking to long to come with a "new OS" this time?
I think this will definitely be a good thing for those who wish more people would use Linux on the desktop and possible also laptop market. People like Mark Shuttleworth and his fanboys can start cheering already.
I myself am no longer so certain that getting everyone to use Linux is what is best for Linux as a whole right now.
My main reason for thinking this is seeing how little Ubuntu contributes to the rest of the "open-source community".
Maybe I am wrong, in that case I would love to hear why.
I gladly leave the picking up of unsatisfied Windows users to other flavors of Linux, I myself prefer to stick with Gentoo and wish that all the developers at Gentoo would realize that Gentoo just isn't and is not supposed to become an "click and go" OS.
Others who will cheer at this news will probably be those trying to earn some money by selling cracked software, only this time people are not going to come to them to get the newest software but will want the "good old XP". I don't think they care much though, as long as they can make money.
Maybe there will even become a real market for buying and selling those XP-licenses that people have lying around?
It's a shame (Score:5, Insightful)
Another bad move by MS (Score:2, Insightful)
Another thing is this just doesn't make a whole lot of sense. If XP is selling, why loose customers, and thus profit, to something that is going to shy customers away.
Re:Another bad move by MS (Score:4, Insightful)
But what are they to tell their share holders?
Sorry guys, we sunk 5 billion developing Vista. But nobody wants it.
Better luck next time.
Guess not...
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? (Score:4, Insightful)
I don't know how much Ubuntu developers/official people contribute to the community directly (whatever that means), but because there are thousands of people moving to Linux because Ubuntu exists (Ubuntu is what got me to switch), there is a large increase of patches (most software on Ubuntu isn't Ubuntu exclusive), guides + FAQs + community help (which makes Linux and more user-friendly), bug reports, and a greater exposure to Linux in general. How is that a little contribution to the community?
Re:Foot? (Score:5, Insightful)
I think this is a great description of the situation. [ctrlaltdel-online.com].
The thing is, I imagine that only the Windows "power users" really care and/or know the reasons behind wanting to stick with XP (at least until a service pack or two is released for Vista). Most average users just see Vista as the new Windows. Pretty much everything they do--Office, web browsing, email, Solitaire--still works and it's shiny and bouncy and see-through...wow! Most probably won't even notice a slowdown because they get Vista with new hardware and it offsets the new performance requirements.
Microsoft is probably just trying to give people they see as just not liking change a push to move to the new OS. I'm not too concerned because I've got a couple XP Pro licenses hanging around, a few OEMs and one from MSDNAA, so I'll "upgrade" when I'm good and ready.
Re:Prediction (Score:5, Insightful)
Don't forget that these are only the OEM copies which are going to be phased out by the end of the year. You can't just go out and buy 4 or 5 OEM copies of windows, and its (as far as I know) illegal to sell them on eBay, as you aren't selling them with hardware.
I think people that want to do the right thing would probably but a retail version anyhow, and everyone else will just pirate it. The biggest demand is going to come from people building their own computers, and by that time I think even that group will have moved onto Vista. They are mostly gamers, and gamers sort of are tied to Vista whether they like it or not...
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? Not Linux (Score:5, Insightful)
Really? Try doing that with non-MS software or you do not use any?
AutoDesk or Maya or OpenOffice or Turbo Tax or any other application you can think of that is not MS. Can you use Windows Update and it is incredibly simple?
Linux distros are MUCH easier to patch because they are open source and because they are distributions not just bare-bone OS. Last I checked, I could update my Debian boxes with just aptitude or apt-get. And any non-Debian software usually has their own archive or provides a deb file. And installing a deb file is usually easier than installing a
Yes, I'm speaking from experience in all of these areas.
Hardware / Software Lifecycles (Score:3, Insightful)
Mainstream product support for XP ends on April 14th, 2009, with extended support (security patches only) until April 8th, 2014.
That's actually better than Windows 2000's support: 13 years of security updates as against 10 years for Win 2000 (whose extended support ends on July 13th, 2010).
http://support.microsoft.com/lifecycle/ [microsoft.com]
Re:Another bad move by MS (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? Not Linux (Score:3, Insightful)
Eventually, as it always happens, there will be bug releases and new drivers for Windows Vista. Upgrading to them is as easily as doing "Windows Update." Linux (and BSD) distros will never be this easily patched due to the very nature of being open source. I only have to go to 1 web site to update my PC's - Windows Update - and it's incredibly simple - just click on Update and voila, it's done and everything works.
Again, wrong, Ubuntu has software update service siting in their version of the systray where windows has theirs.
And Microsofts turn around on patches have been worse then mac and Linux's track record in the past. Despite what you may think, Linux and MacOS foundation and design is better equipped to deal with legacy issues and the implementation patches. Microsoft has struggled continuously with this issue and if im correct recently struggled releasing a set of patches just the other day, I think this is the 3rd day in a row Microsoft had to do an update on my PC, the 2nd update left my pc with a memory violation which the next update had to fix.
My advise is really see the new and upcoming, linux developers arnet really that short sighted to allow the same issues that has always been an issue get in the way this time.
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? Not Linux (Score:5, Insightful)
And the vast majority of forced Windows users are corporations. They have Windows Server 2003, Outlook, NetMeeting, etc. all integrated into their back office systems. They are not going to switch out their entire infrastructure to Linux due to some OEM issues.
They will if their IT officers actually took the time to see what the rest of the market offered. You'll find most of these "specific" solutions are not that specific to Microsoft branded software anymore. And if you can show the cost of migrating their systems to the new Microsoft software (all new vista etc) against other alternate solutions and show the definite cost advantage then businesses will defiantly change over.
The fear that you have as an sysadmin is (well founded however) the reason why your infrastructure wont change. Consider, You move over to open source and you fail doing so then yes you'll loose your job and look bad to your bosses. Pick a Microsoft solution to do the job and it fails, you'll keep your job and simply blame Microsoft for your failure.
AND THAT MY FRIEND! is a true tech admins duty these days :)
Damn (Score:5, Insightful)
I have been a long time user of Windows (since the 3.1 days) and have tried every OS they released (except for ME) since then.
I must say I liked Win 98SE a lot. And then I discovered Win2k. But to me Xp was the amalgamation of both.
It runs smoothly and doing what I do on the PC (web browsing, Winamp listening, Battlefield 2 (and other games) and VLC movie watching) it works perfectly. Nearly 100% of the time without an issue.
I have tried Ubuntu (and I did actually like it a lot) and also FreeBSD back in the day (was impossible for a high school teenager with other things on my mind to try to comprehend it).
I am currently a help desk technician. I help people (regular Joes) with their problems. Problems with printing or email archiving etc.
I must say XP is very easy to navigate and do things from simple commands to powerful policy lock downs.
Now I did experiment with Vista (No I didn't buy it and I wasn't one of the beta testers) and the first thing I encountered was my dislike for it.
Microsoft has changed the way that their OS looks (well minor/major improvements are good but....) to the point of making the functionality of it severely hindered.
So I installed Vista Ultimate on my machine. The very first thing I noticed was that navigating my folders was quite a lot more difficult than in XP (or any other MS OS. Why I ask?? I mean its not like navigating folders is something that people don't regularly want to do!!). Now with the default interface I found it almost impossible (it literally took me an hours worth of forum reading etc.) to work out how to turn on hidden files and how to get the familiar File, Edit, View menu up the top of explorer (WTF? Removing that as a Window's default isn't an improvement!!).
Eventually the company I work for (a government health provider) will go over to Vista. This will make help desk support and general troubleshooting a problem. Instead of being able to say (over the phone) "Click Start and then My Computer. Click on File and then Open and then browse to D drive and select the template folder there" I will now have to say something like "Now click the colourful icon in the bottom left corner. Go to Computer then click the icon of a little man running. Now click the brown box that looks like a little house. Now type in "D" and then hit enter. Now select the little flashing house icon again and then type in "Templates". Now eventually you should see a listing of flashing grey and black text on a transparent background. Click the third option which should read "Show in Explorer""!!
Why did they change the appearance of a perfectly viable and working, efficient interface (XP I am refering to here) and replace it with colourful meaningless icons and pictures.
My opinion if Vista is that I will never use it again. I will not be buying it. If I am forced to use it (which is what the article seems to allude to. That MS will eventually (and quickly I might add) drop their support for XP and push everyone to Vista) I will give up using MS products and move to Linux to get the things done I want to get done (I have used Firefox for a long time and i know of the XMMS(??) player for music. I like what WINE and Cedega are doing with games).
XP is the last MS operating system I think I will use. By dropping support for it so quickly (granted this is just Dell not supporting it anymore but I do hope that Microsoft keeps up their support for many years to come as they did with 98 and 2000) they are forcing me, a loyal paying customer of all of their OS range (not inclusing ME. God... WhY?!@) and a supporter of their environment through my work for many years as a help desk technician, to be forced to use an alternative OS. I'm not a big fan of Macs just as I am not a big fan of Linux yet. For one reason, theres not really many native, fun gaming environments (like the BF franchise or SWAT/Rainbow Six tactical shooters) available. Also the things I do like and am grateful for within a Windows OS (m
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? Not Linux (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? Not Linux (Score:5, Insightful)
Comment removed (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:It's a shame (Score:4, Insightful)
Somebody help us
One potential gain... (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? (Score:3, Insightful)
Comparison with Win98 isn't even that valid, because with Win98 there were more reasons to upgrade than there are now. Win98's instability and lack of security made an upgrade to NT 5 much more appealing that an upgrade from WinXP to Vista. (I guess this is why you see far more old Win2k machines around than Win98 in businesses and schools despite only a couple of years between their releases.)
Asymptototic Death: Arrogance and Stupidity. (Score:5, Insightful)
That's about all one could ever say in favor of a Microsoft product. They will always asymptotically approach useability.
That's true if you consider "dumb" usable. The trend I've noticed is less control, less flexibility, fewer 3rd party vendors (aka choice) and more annoyance and auto-wrong features. Security and stability have remained poor and have trended down.
They have pulled out the stops in their breakage of XP though. Today I watched someone try to rebuild an XP laptop. He'd done it manytimes before because someone stuck him with admin responsibility for 15 of them. The process had changed on him this time and it failed. The usual tedious process of manually downloading "updates" fell apart and the automatic process took over and could not be stopped. A couple hours later, I stuck my head in to see how it was going and he was reading a M$ support page about "silent failures". Better him than me.
This "upgrade" cycle has the feeling 95 to 98 did but worse. Eerything fell apart at once and the answer was to buy a new one. This time the "new one" is a computer with about 4 times the hardware. BadVista's got the scoop [fsf.org] on this one, Vista - Arrogance & Stupidity [aaxnet.com], "No sane person wants Vista, so Microsoft is making sure they have no choice."
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? (Score:5, Insightful)
That's the great thing about linux though, there's room for user friendly distributions like [k|x]ubuntu as well as distributions aimed at people who are allergic to sunlight, like gentoo. (I've used both distributions, liked both very much, and have stuck with one. No, I'm not saying which...)
Push to Vista (Score:5, Insightful)
While they still dominate the market, it's not an unchallenged dominance anymore. A failure the size of Vista would mean considerable market share gains for Linux, OSX and maybe even other/new competitors over the next 3-5 years while they struggle to get a new windos out. By the time they're ready to release it, the market could've moved elsewhere.
So they're going to force Vista on us, figuring that like all windos versions prior, once we have no other choice, we'll accept it and consider all its shortcomings and problems as a "that's just how computers are" thing.
Not Linux - my reply to everyone (Score:3, Insightful)
I'm speaking from experience - over 10 years in I.T. This is how real world works. More examples:
Part of the regulations in the financial sector is to secure all data, including laptops. That means Whole Disk Encryption. To manage an entire corporate structure requires an enterprise solution. Utimaco and PGP provide such a solution - for Windows XP & soon Vista. It's certified, tested, and secure. In fact, the US gov has an RFP out to various vendors for WDE - all for Windows solutions.
All the big financial trading software runs on Windows: Schwab's CyberTrader, TradeStation, Townsend Analytics, E-Signal, etc., etc., etc. Traders are not going to risk their $$$ trying to use Windows emulators under Linux "just because they like Linux." No, they like $$$, are practical, and use the best tool for the job. Further, all of the helpdesks at the firms know that 99.9% of their customers use Microsoft. Even if they got off of Windows, they would still need to support their customer base. That is, the mass of people who buy Dells which have Winfows pre-installed.
Ubuntu has been out for how long? 5 years? A CEO of an S&P 500, S&P MidCap, S&P SmallCap, etc. corporation is not going to risk his publicly traded corporation's entire infrastructure (the "heart" of the communications between all co-workers) to a 5 year old company (is Ubuntu even a corporation?) that also has many, many competitors. There is only 1 vendor for Windows: Microsoft. There are a ton of vendors for Linux.
Further, do you know the nightmare it will take to switch over thousands of employees? Employees aren't just sitting around - they are working a minimum 40 hours a week. There would be productivity loss, lots of retraining, lots of hardware expenses (have to duplicate workstations so users can migrate from their Windows PC to their Linux PC), etc. No VP or Product Manager or shareholders will endure that kind of disruption. And for what? To move from an established DOW 30 corporation to a 5 year old one-of-many Linux distros?
As you mature in your career job, you realize that there is so much more to life than your PC. You have a girlfriend, wife, baby, young children, overtime, etc. that now take up a significant (and nearly all) of your time. Even if you were a geek growing up (I was), there is no time to dork around with Linux trying to get this new piece of hardware/software to work with this kernel and this distro. My friends only have a couple of hours on a Friday to spend for themselves. The rest of the time is with the kids (helping w/ homework, etc.) or the wife (going out to dinner, married life). With Windows, it truly is Plug-And-Play. Every piece of hardware that I've bought from Bluetooth devices to HDTV video cards to a bunch of different USB devices (GPS, storage, etc.) just works. I plug it in, install the Windows drivers that came on the CD, and I'm done. At the bare minimum for Linux, I'd have to hope there was a Linux driver, find it, install it, etc. That takes precious time which a lot of people don't have.
I think those that modded me down as Troll/Flamebait are high school / college kids or young adults barely into the workforce. Sorry, but this is the real world. You have to think like a CEO. You have to think like those above you if you want to learn from them and advance up the corporate ladder. Starting out at a job and telling everyone that you like Linux so much and want your company to move to Linux will only show how green and inexperienced you are. Once you move up to department manager you can start seeing the bigger picture. Once you move up to regional manager and oversee at least a few hundred employees you will see the big picture.
The only force that can bring down Microsoft from desktop domination is a combination of Microsoft screwing up horribly AND a truly viable alternate solution being available to take advantage. The only one I can think of is Apple - another big, established publicly traded corporation.
Upgrade issues were never so severe before (Score:2, Insightful)
Was Microsofts older versions of Windows phased out this fast too?
New Windows versions always used to demand more computing power than their predecessors, but there never was as massive an increase in demands as with Vista compared to XP. New Windows versions always used to lay out their system applications, settings pages and management options less clearly than their predecessors, but they never came as badly arranged as within Vista. And I won't even start to talk about Vista's excessive confirmation dialogs.
I guess that most people's applications have a lot less demand for computing power than is needed just to run Vista, and that in many cases their applications will perform worse under Vista than they would under XP. And I didn't even say 'compatibility issues' yet.
The problem is, in many cases there are always a few important ones under the applications people are using regularly, for which there do not exist real alternatives under alternative operating systems. Right, I agree that probably a lot of people will think even more intensely about switching, but sad as it is, many will still come to the conclusion that they have to bite the bullet and continue to have their operating system imposed on them by the monopolist, as long as real-world application support does not get even better for alternative operating systems than it already is.
MS as their own biggest competitor (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? (Score:5, Insightful)
That's just revisionist bullshit, IMO. When XP came out, everybody was bitching about how it was a lamed-down 2000, with ugly interface, stupid features, etc., and claimed that they wouldn't use it until at least 2 service packs came out. Now everybody likes (as much as it's possible) XP and complain about Vista in exactly the same manner.
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? Not Linux (Score:5, Insightful)
The problem is the pestering for a reboot and the automatic reboot if I don't press a button within 2 minutes (or is it one minute?).
I leave my windows software doing a nice simple task (that usually takes ~15 minutes), walk off to take a break, and come back to my Ubuntu login screen. The first couple times did this I really thought I either had a hardware error or my rendering software had actually forced a reboot somehow.
I can't freakin' believe that an OS can force a mandatory reboot unless I answer a prompt within a set time period. Second of all, I can't believe that they haven't gotten enough complaints to patch it as of yet.
Why? If they really need a reboot to install their software, why can't they just download it when we tell them it's okay, and then just do the install at the next reboot? Do they really think there are windows desktops that don't get rebooted for 6 months or longer?
I call BS - Linux is easier (Score:5, Insightful)
Which is easier to get a working system? I can boot to Knoppix in a couple of minutes. With the Knoppix DVD I have not only OpenOffice, but LaTeX editors and other resources. I can boot to DSL or Puppy Linux even faster. Even with a HD install, Ubuntu still installs faster than any Windows version I've installed. Installing Ubuntu, Automatix, and a couple of Latex editors, and I'm largely done.
How many hours of searching the web for the freeware programs I want will it take to get Windows usable for my needs? Yes, Openoffice, Texmaker, Abiword, Google Earth, Adobe Reader, and media codecs/players are all available for Windows, but I have to go to those webpages, download the programs to a folder, and then install. I can install most of them via one apt-get line in Linux, or use Automatix for one-stop shopping. How is Windows easier?
People have very selective perception on this issue. Yes, Linux has stumped me. I had the bright idea of installing TrueCrypt and VMPlayer on Damn Small Linux, and could get neither to work at all. Fine. But they both work on Fedora, Suse, Debian, and Ubuntu, so I'll live with it. Windows often leaves people stuck as well, but no one considers that a show-stopper. I've even read hardware reviews in Maximum PC where they couldn't get a particular something or other to work at all, due to bad drivers or whatever, but no one said "Well, Windows just isn't ready for prime time!" People take the flaws of Windows with a grain of salt and move on, but if they have to type one command into a terminal, then Linux is "impossible for normal people." Spare me. Use it or don't, as you like, but the idea that Windows is easier than Linux is a very arbitrary and misleading statement.
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? (Score:5, Insightful)
I'm not normally a grammer nazi, but I assume English is not your first language, so here are a few suggestions
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? Not Linux (Score:3, Insightful)
I was going to reply to your original post, but thought I'd reply to this instead.
From experience, I think that _using_ Linux no easier or harder than _using_ Windows. Any difficulties that arise are usually due to particular pieces of software not having a native Linux port. Having said that, the GPL community has been excellent in replicating almost all functionality of almost all common Windows-based software.
It's the _maintenance_ where Linux beats Windows. Out-of-the-box installs of user-friendly distributions will detect and install appropriate drivers for almost all hardware, will auto-configure networks (DHCP), will install a bounty of useful software (intenet, email, chat, office, paint, photo, music, video, etc) and has incredibly easy update procedures. Windows can, in no way, come close to competing with this.
If you want to give Linux a try, I suggest you install (k)Ubuntu or Fedora. Prepare to be amazed! I use only Ubuntu at home on my primary computer - although I have a Windows PC (music studio) and a Mac laptop - and in many ways Ubuntu is my favourite OS.
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? Not Linux (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Not Linux - my reply to everyone (Score:5, Insightful)
So please enlighten me with what it is that causes your Windows PC to be unreliable after 2 months after a fresh install. I'm not a Windows fanboy (slowly switching everything to Apple) but these sort of comments just seem so baseless that they make the rest of your arguments struggle to maintain integrity.
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? (Score:5, Insightful)
But there was something else going during these switches that wasn't present with Vista, The hardware market had made so many advances that some popular software needed the increase power to run on so people were happy to buy new computers to get the extra performance. Right now, they are just replacing them or getting new ones. This incentive isn't there and from the way it looks, it would be a sideways if not downwards move if someone upgraded to new hardware with Vista pre-installed.
Re:Not Linux - my reply to everyone (Score:3, Insightful)
I was willing to read your argument for Windows up to this point. You know, when you called other OS users "immature" (and throw in "irresponsible"). Then I realized that you're just another crank who got promoted up to the level of his incompetence.
Oh, don't like my personal comment? It's a little late for that. Go ahead, call me "undependable", too.
The fact of the matter is, your OS choice has nothing to do with age or maturity. If you really were as old as you thought you were, you'd remember that all the companies/sectors you mentioned were using good old IBM big iron 30 years ago (those that existed). Because no one gets fired for buying IBM. And their middle managers were saying the exact same things you are now.
Re:My predictions for Wndows over the next year... (Score:3, Insightful)
You mean, Dell is saying things that may cause a potential customer to spend more money buying, erm, something from Dell?
Gosh! I never knew how evil and deceptive the world really is!
Re:Not Linux - my reply to everyone (Score:3, Insightful)
Match you, raise you a decade.
Your commentary regarding the "financial sector" seems accurate based on my experience in that industry. Please understand that the "financial sector", on a pure population basis, is miniscule, so what may be necessary for that particular niche may not be necessary for the wide array of other niches that make up the Big Wide World.
By that token, a "CEO of an S&P 500, S&P MidCap, S&P SmallCap, etc. corporation is not going to risk his publicly traded corporation's entire" physical infrastructure (the "skeleton" of the organization, if you will) to steel girders, which have only been around for a handful of decades. Real people use mud brick!
In other words, firms large and small make countless infrastructure selections. Age of the firm is one small criterion. Availability of substitutes is another. There are many more criteria that get taken into account. Age isn't the one-and-only criterion. If it were, major firms wouldn't ever write their own software, since by definition that software hasn't been tested nearly as much as whatever process the software is replacing.
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? (Score:3, Insightful)
I agree. But I disagree with your reasons.
"When XP came out, everybody was bitching about how it was a lamed-down 2000, with ugly interface, stupid features, etc., and claimed that they wouldn't use it until at least 2 service packs came out."
Umm...XP IS a lamed down 2000, it does still have an ugly interface (people had to get *used* to the colors, they didn't ooh and ahh over them or find them decent to begin with), and I think you confuse stupid features with stupidly *implemented* features; many features were requested, just that they were fubar'd and non-standard compared to convention (if there was a convention to begin with).
Also, XP didn't hit it's paces until those service packs were released, and many websites were formed to solve many mundane problems MS refused to fix (like going to an AVI file and the CPU on the OS spiking because it was trying to generate a preview...of the whole video file and that's if it recognized what was in the AVI container). In any case, that is support for what most people are saying here; MS is forcing Vista, in early buggy form, upon users when another OS of theirs exists fine.
Fact is, XP (finally) works fairly well. The problem really isn't the new versus old OS MS has released, it's the abandonment of their OS support. When MS killed Win98, I moved those machines to Linux. When MS kills XP, I will move to Ubuntu or whatever gets support. I had 5 Windows boxes; 2 were Win98 that wouldn't work very well with XP so I went with Linux. 3 XP boxes; all 3 can go with Vista, but Vista is such a step down compared to the Linux or FreeBSD migration that there's only about 2 software packages that don't have a *good* Open Source analog for what I want to do, so I'll probably keep 1 around and move the other 2 over.
The discussion about keeping around support--hello? They already have that support infrastructure *in place*. What they should be doing is charging some minor yearly fee for additional support instead of losing out on licenses entirely. But this is MS--typical arrogance, and after 3 generation of OS upgrades (Win98->Win2000/ME which I skipped->XP->Vista) I'm sick of it.
So MS loses upgraders because of hardware incompatibility. MS is arrogant and keeps trying to do what they've always done--force upgrades. This time, however, XP has an absolutely huge user base; MS isn't adapting that users don't want to upgrade, and they risk alienating those users who will look elsewhere if they can. Quite frankly, this is *the* reason why getting Dell or Gateway to provide OSless machines or basic Linux installs (pick your poison on boot) is so essential.
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? Not Linux (Score:2, Insightful)
Come to think of Parallels, why should we stick to fucking Wine (MS Libs ersatz) when we could use the original MS libraries on top of Linux, like parallels does with Macs.
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Not Linux - my reply to everyone (Score:4, Insightful)
yet vista magically has none of this? are you high or just making things up. Vista is dramatically different and dont even start on the huge difference on Microsoft Office. we demoed it to a couple of managers here and they freaked out.
I love how guys like you try like hell to make platofrm changes seem impossibly difficult yet ignore that every Major MS release is 100% identical to what you are describing.
when Comcast upgraded from 2000 to XP on desktops they had a huge productivity problem, it was lessened by de-xpifying the desktops, that is not an option in vista. Upgrades from office 2000 t o 2003 cause huge downtime with document incompatability, images beign displayed backwards and other problems with 2003 being incompatable with 2000.
so please, tell us how upgrading to vista will be zero impact and cause no downtime. Because you make a linux change sound like the end of the world.
Be kind to Bill Gates (Score:3, Insightful)
Bill Gates is software's Dr. Death. It doesn't matter what the customer wants; Bill Gates, the richest man in the world, wants more money, and will drag everyone through his neurosis.
I agree with most of the rest of your post, but I do think this line is unfair. It's easier (and probably more correct) to attribute Microsoft missteps to incompetence rather than malice on the part of Bill Gates.
Through the Gates foundation, Bill Gates has donated billions of dollars to worthy charities around the world. It provides 17% of the world's polio eradication budget, as well as other monies for vaccines and HIV research. On the education front, the foundation has donated over a billion dollars to various scholarship programs to help needy students. The Wikipedia has a list of its other activities.
With its current assets, the Gates foundation will be donating at least $1.5 billion per year for the forseeable future. The doesn't mesh with the greed so often ascribed to Gates.
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? (Score:3, Insightful)
99% of the XP users I know are unaware of the existence of IRC (and Usenet, etc.), but of course that kind of person is not your typical Ubuntu switcher (yet), I guess.
Re:Be kind to Bill Gates (Score:3, Insightful)
As for the "donating at least $1.5 billion per year" what else is he going to do with it? Put it under his mattress? He's only "giving away" that portion of his wealth that he couldn't spend if he tried. From I see, he's spending it^H^H giving it away in such a way to "buy" a nice shiny new reputation as a philanthropist. I wouldn't attribute his goal to greed, but more to megalomania at this point. Perhaps he needs to visit Belgium [zpub.com] more often.
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? (Score:3, Insightful)
While I agree that the number of options for an Apple are much more limited than for PCs, it is I feel an inevitable byproduct of producing an OS that "just works" without the insane costs faced by Microsoft, or the hardware support issues faced by Linux distros. By being both the hardware manufacturer and software author, Apple can provide a high-quality UI that always works on its hardware. And games will come with market share. I do game on a Mac, and it provides a much better experience than a PC. Admittedly the vastly superior hardware to my last PC might also help. IIRC every recent Blizzard game title has come Windows/Mac on the same CD.
Re:Be kind to Bill Gates (Score:4, Insightful)
It's also invested in companies that are polluting and causing health problems. [latimes.com] And they have announced in so many words that they will not be reviewing their investment portfolio for abuses like the ones detailed in the LA Times article linked above, because it would be an onerous process.
This is closely akin to washing oil off some ducks while christening a new oil tanker and sending it off to do its part in polluting the globe. Except it's more personal.
The simple fact, backed up by the fact that the foundation will not be ensuring that their investments are not killing people, is that the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation is not about helping people. Period, the end. It's about power. Bill gets to continue to be in control of all that money, and he buys himself PR with it. But he's still sitting on more money than he could ever spend! Charity is still appreciated regardless of the situation, but if you're not actually putting yourself to any hardship - not even the small amount of hardship needed to make sure that your money isn't killing people that you claim to be trying to save - then I'm not fucking impressed. And nor should be anyone else.
Did you get paid to prop up Mr. Gates, or are you just easily led?
Who Wants To Move Apartments Every Year? (Score:3, Insightful)
There is a common thread in modern human life. During the early years, in college and for a few years after, people change their living space every single year - sometimes more often. But as you get on in years, this slows down. First you might only move every few years. Then you buy a house. Then you want to stay in a house for a long time.
Generally, in the material world, this is because you have too much stuff to make moving an inexpensive and hassle-free proposition. But is it really any different in the digital world?
What about these operating systems is changing *so* fundamentally that it requires a major system overhaul every few years? How long do we have to wait for a stable kernel upon which we can build the rest of our systems? The fact of the matter is that in a few short years, all of our systems will be distributed anyway. Already our applications live on servers in an environment whose hardware and underlying software can change instantly - without the end user noticing so much as a hiccup. Why is it that our desktop and laptop machines suffer from such a stuttering inability to avoid a major disruption all the freaking time?
I heartily applaud anyone who loves to get into the nitty gritty of how to put a computer together, or install an os, or fix a car, or brew their own beer. I've even had excellent, informative forays into those areas. But, frankly, they don't hold my interest. I'm paying cash on the barrelhead. I want an os that works. That is not a megalomaniacal freak that insists I tinker with it every few weeks, just so it doesn't start spewing "Squeegee The Pickle Wallaby!" whenever I try to boot it up. How is that so wrong? How is that Microsoft hasn't caught on yet?
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? Not Linux (Score:3, Insightful)
You know what's worse? Windows Server 2003 will automatically reboot itself in the middle of the night after it's been updated. What kind of crazy shit is that?! If you tell your server to automatically download critical security fixes, it will reboot itself without warning?
I know, some know-it-all will tell me that Windows Server 2003 won't actually do that and that I'm just spreading FUD. And, you know, maybe all my servers just occasionally crash in the middle of the night, right after running updates, and they fail to report the unplanned reboot in the Event Log. If that's the case, it doesn't make me feel any better.
Re:Will anyone gain anything from this? Not Linux (Score:1, Insightful)
That's the problem. If you have 50 applications, you have 50 different update schemes. It is redundant.
On the other hand, in most Linux distributions any one can hook into the update API. On Debian you do that with a text editor by adding a new deb line to the config file.
Wait a minute... (Score:3, Insightful)
I understand giving up support for Windows XP to force users to move to Vista, but selling XP seems to just continue bringing money in. In fact, in another year, someone who buys an XP machine today might buy a Vista upgrade. I can't see how this is bad for Microsoft. It to be a win, win... win situation.
Re:Be kind to Bill Gates (Score:1, Insightful)
A quick history of the Gates Foundation. It was created during one of Microsoft's most heated legal battles. It came to the foreground right after Gates publicly botched a court hearing where he took the stand and showed what a pompous ass he really is. The Foundation is merely a PR broker. They'll give money to those that will sing the loudest about how great Bill Gates is.
Also, look how he distributes the Foundations money. Microsoft wanted to open a campus in India so they buy themselves favor with heavy donations to India. Microsoft wants to open a campus in China so they buy themselves favor with heavy donations to China. And so on. One would have to be a complete imbecile not to get it.
Another bit of trivia that people seem to forget is that Gates is heavily invested in bio-tech. He's building a nice conduit that his chosen investments can utilize to generate sales. Heck he's even talked about!
Re:Be kind to Bill Gates (Score:2, Insightful)
I'm saying that his donations are less than charitable, which does not refute that he is donating money. You can view the giving money part and be happy, or you can look at the bigger picture and see something less.
Re:Be kind to Bill Gates (Score:2, Insightful)
The Foundation has much better PR than Microsoft, but it's pushing exactly the same agenda.
Re:Be kind to Bill Gates (Score:2, Insightful)
And when his donations buy him enough press to in turn develop enough positive reputation to be elected POTUS, and he embraces and extends all over all of our asses, the laughter will be silent.
2% of the world's population holds 50% of the wealth. Maybe I'm just a cynic, but I can only see BillyG's goals as to maintain that situation. If his first concern was helping people, then he'd be dumping every iota of his personal wealth and focusing on that goal.
I'm not expecting anyone to do that! But my point is that he is not motivated by altruism. And the claims that they want to help the world are shown to be hypocritical by the fact that they won't even use caution when making investments. It is quite simply not difficult to find environmentally- and otherwise friendly corporations to invest in, with a good human rights record, et cetera. But that would be difficult, and they're not willing to actually expend effort to help people. Just money.
And finally, let us not forget the fact, proven in numerous courts around the world, that the fortune in question was made illegally through the use of improper business practices and abuse of a monopoly position. Do you really think that BillyG is some kind of modern-day Robin Hood, stealing from the comparatively rich (try going down to someplace like Costa Rica sometime, tell the locals you own a car or two, then try convincing them that you're not rich) and giving to the poor? They invest in companies that kill people! If there's one, and they're willing to put out PR saying that they're not going to review their investments, there must be more, otherwise what are they afraid of?
If I ran a nonprofit whose charter stated it helped house the homeless, and then I invested some of its holdings in a corporation that specializes in identifying buildings squatted in by the homeless, and razing them for redevelopment, I don't think anyone would take me very seriously.
I can't even find the Gates Foundation's charter on their home page. They do have a page that talks about Guiding Principles [gatesfoundation.org], in which they disseminate several lies. For example, "We must be humble and mindful in our actions and words. We seek and heed the counsel of outside voices." Yeah, except when they tell you to be responsible about where you put your money, which is basically the most important decision you can make in a capitalistic world or society. Or how about "We treat our grantees as valued partners, and we treat the ultimate beneficiaries of our work with respect." Yes, it's very respectful to immunize people, and at the same time make investments in companies that are killing them. And of course, pure comedy gold: "We demand ethical behavior of ourselves." Riiiight. Tell that to the children with trouble breathing, whose degradation of health you are bankrolling.
The hits just keep coming, of course. Bill and Melinda believe that "every life has equal value [gatesfoundation.org]". Unless that life is inconvenient to their investments, of course. Here's another goody: "The goal of the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation is to make sure that all people--no matter where they live--get the chance to live a healthy, productive life." Sure, unless they live next to a polluting investment.
Do I really need to provide more evidence of hypocrisy?
Re:Where is the magic button buddy? (Score:3, Insightful)
I'm interested (Score:3, Insightful)
One big area would be in support for smart phones and PDAs. There are server components that integrate with Exchange that do over air synchronization of Exchange mailboxes (email, contacts, calendar) for Palm OS, Blackberry and Windows Mobile. Can you synchronize all of these over air to the same email box under a Linux solution? The smart phone/PDA issue is a real thorn in my side but corporate management demands it.
Re:Be kind to Bill Gates (Score:3, Insightful)
you should be careful with that vaguely christian ideal, lest you get banninated from the intarwebs for not being an atheist. or at least stay off digg.
in any case bill gates is lucky to have been the right guy, in the right place, at the right time, with the right ideas. american dream all the way i think, i dont fault him for it. im glad he at least realizes he doesnt personally need all the money and is willing to put in some effort to see that some of it gets to people who do.
besides that, what the heck is people's big problem with vista anyway?? i have vista at home and it works great, (ok not great, but just as well as XP did anyway). god freaking forbid people have to install a few new drivers, i think all these vista haters are either just jumping on the anti-vista bandwagon, and have never tried it themselves, or are a bunch of incompetants and whiners who don't feel like doing even the most basic system admin tasks. i just dont understand how a community which is so progressive in most ways is anachronistic about the very thing they make their living at.
bill gates != anti christ (Score:2, Insightful)
>Period, the end. It's about power.
Bill gates is not the anti christ, deal with it. He's contributed far more to the betterment of this world than you have, or ever could, or ever tried to. Dick.
Just because someone made some software you don't like doesn't make them a bad person, and doesn't negate all of the good things they've done.
>Did you get paid to prop up Mr. Gates, or are you just easily led?
Do even you really believe what your write? Stop being so fucking paranoid and deal with he real world.