Ethernet MP3 Player

Erik Johansson writes: "You can now stream mp3s to your stereo, the guys at slimdevices seems to be building a bonafide ethernet mp3 player. There are some cool pictures of the soldering sweatshop, so perhaps it isn't vaporware?"

Oh sweet!

That is one sweet little device! Nice to see someone go with a flourescent display instead of backlit LCD - they are more expensive, but so easier to read!

Man - hand soldering SMD board s- not a fun task! More power to these guys! I'm signing up for one for sure - my MP3 server is screaming for something like this!

The more of us that sign up and buy - the sooner they'll get ne in a nice box :)

Insaine!

That looks insanely hard to solder. Wow. I'd not believe it, but look at all those chips. A good fake if it is fake.

Re:Insaine!

Its actually not impossible. SMD chips come with solder coated pins. The PCBs have a coat of solder on the pads as well. You spary flux on the board and heat the pins to join the pins and pad together. They make special heads for soldering irons to fit various SMD package types so you can heat all the pins at once.

Its not easy but it can be done. If enough folks order them, however, it'll make economic sense for them to get them made in a fab facility.

And I'm sure its not a fake. Embedded devices have gotten very powerful. You can fit an entire ethernet capable Java computer [ibutton.com] with its own embedded JVM, filesystem, etc on a SIMM size card. An MP3 player that just reads a socket stream, decodes the MP3 and outputs audio is not super complex. Its not childs play but its certainly something an embedded system could do. Can't wait to get mine - gonna be fun to finally hook up my stereo to my RAID5 MP3 array :)

Re:Insaine!

It is certainly possible, but it's not easy. The SliMP3 firmware is, AFAIK, the only modern IP stack to have been entirely hand-coded in assembler. The hardware we're using is a PIC microcontroller, along with a custom chip (prototyped in a Xilinx CPLD) for doing DMA transfer through an SRAM to the MPEG decoder. It's a rather different design than other embedded Internet platforms - we're cranking 10Mbps through system built around a 20Mhz, 8-bit microcontroller. Of course you don't need this kind of throughput for an MPEG *audio* stream...

It's gonna be awile

I'm going to venture a guess and say it isn't going to be available commercially for about another 25 years....at least if they are soldering all the surface mount stuff by hand. 5000 caps is a lot of soldering, especially if what you are soldering is about a square millimeter in size.

Re:It's gonna be awile

We'll start shipping in about two weeks. I expect our first batch to sell out rather quickly (thanks, Slashdot!) and we'll start taking pre-orders as soon as that happens.

Reminds me of how core memory used to be made

Hopefully, they will not go as blind as bats doing the first few production runs.

What I'd really like to know is this:

When is the wireless version coming out?

What if?

With all these new "smart" devices, what happens if someone streams his music into his toaster-oven accidently?

The Rio Receiver

Found here (http://www.riohome.com/products/receiver.htm), the Rio Receiver does basicaly the same thing, and is already available in stores.

It also has the advantage of being able to stream over standard phone lines, for those of us who don't have cat5 strung out to the living room.

Re:The Rio Receiver

Problem with the Rio is you have to run a special Win32 app to stream to the thing. its not as flexbile as I would wish.

Actually, that's not necessarily true. Jeff Mock (http://www.mock.com/receiver/ [mock.com]) has hacked together a linux server for it. Basically, it's a bunch of mod_perl scripts for apache, along with a real simple perl server to answer the device's initial request.

That, and it runs linux, too (sort of). Basically, it spits out a DHCP request for an IP address, sends a broadcast request to a particular port to ask for servers (which is answered by the little perl server), and from there it learns of the IP address and TFTP directory of the server. It then NFS mounts a directory from that server, and reboots with the image it pulls from that directory. So, to upgrade it, just change the files in the server's directory. Real cool. Once running, everything (all artist, track lookups, and audio fetching) happens over HTTP on the fly.

They've even got a cross-compiler for it, so you can write some of your own programs, and a couple kernel hacks already. I'm waiting for someone to improve the UI a little -- it's good, but not quite all there. Maybe 80% perfect.

I got mine for, like, $150, on E-Bay. Also branded specifically by Rio, though the front panel looks much weirder.

There's also the AudioTron, which I looked at first, but that scans your net for SMB servers, then builds its own internal database. Lose power, lose the database, and you've got to re-scan all over again.

That and the display is impossible to read from across the room.

That I will give you. :(

I definitely recommend the Rio Receiver, though. I'd love to see more people hacking it, and improving it. I'm really amazed it hasn't been a bigger hit around here so far...

david.

oh man

wtf, i cant pass calculus, but these bastards can do this soldering while drinking beer? I'm going to be workign at McDonald's the rest of my frickin' life...

Don't worry...

Drink beer and you too can solder.

Just don't do it on your hand; drops of molten silver do NOT look cool, no matter what your drunken buddies say.

slashdotted

cool. The site is ./ed after 17 comments.. Thats very, very good.. :)

Audiotron

Turtle Beach has the Audiotron which does the same thimg works great and can be found at some best buys for $149. I love mine.

first run by hand

I would highly doubt that they'll do all of the production runs by hand. It would literally take years.

-neil

Difference??

Hmm the site is already slashdotted with only 20 comments here ahaha, stream slashdot hits! :)

from Google cache:

If you already have an Ethernet LAN and a machine to use as the server, setting up the SliMP3 will take you just a few minutes, and all you will need is this quick start guide - each step is boldfaced, followed by a brief explanation. If this is your first time setting up Ethernet and IP addresses, then you may wish to visit the additional documentation links, on the left.
Setting up the player

Connect the Ethernet port to your hub using a standard RJ45 patch cord

Connect the player your Ethernet hub or switch using a standard CAT3 or CAT5 patch cord. If you are connecting it directly to the Ethernet card in your server machine, use a crossover cable.

Connect the players RCA outputs to the inputs on your receiver

The player has a pair of standard, line level, RCA audio output jacks - connect these to the inputs on your amplifier, receiver, or powered speakers.

Configure the IR remote: press "S, DVD, 0, 0, 7, ENT"

A Sony RM-V301 universal remote is supplied with the SliMP3. In addition to controlling the SliMP3, this remote may be used to operate the volume controls on your receiver, or any other equipment you may have.

The SliMP3 uses the IR codes for a JVC brand DVD player - we chose to use the JVC codes because we wanted to use an off-the-shelf universal remote, and so we chose a brand of DVD player that was standard enough to be supported by the remote, but not so common that it would be likely to conflict with your existing stereo equipment.

See the instruction manual that comes with the remote for more information on its additional features.

Connect the power supply

The SliMP3 comes with a 5V, 1000ma regulated power supply. Please be careful to use ONLY this power supply - connecting a different power supply may damage the player, and such damage is not covered by warranty.

The player is intended you be left plugged in at all times. When not in use, it enters a "standby" mode, powering down the display and drawing only a few milliamps.

Enter the IP address information

When the player is first powered up, it asks you if you want to configure it. Pressing "OK" will take you through a series of four screens - server's IP address, player's IP address, subnet mask, and gateway address. To enter the IP addresses, use the UP/DOWN buttons to edit each digit, and LEFT/RIGHT to go to the next digit, then press OK to complete each entry. Zero out the beginning of each number to make it three digits - eg "10.5.35.164" would be entered as "010.005.035.164"

Testing your LAN setup

ping the player from your server

On your server, type:

ping your.players.ip.address

If your IP addresses are set up correctly, the player will respond to the pings, and display a message indicating where it received the ping from.

Installing the server

Download and extract the tarball

Download the latest version of the server here. To extract the tarball, type:

tar xvfz slimp3_server.tgz
cd slimp3_server

Run the server

You need to tell the server where your mp3files are stored. You can specify this on the command line as:

./server.pl /path-to-your-mp3-files &

Or, you can leave the path blank, and the server will look for your mp3 files in a directory called "mp3files", in the same directory as the server:

./server.pl &

The '&' tells it to run in the background, so that the server continues running after you log out.

That's it!

Just use the cursor keys to browse around, and enjoy your music collection

No shoutcast support tho...

It seems this only alows you to stream from your computer with their software, and not from Shoutcast-style [liquidstreamer.com] streaming servers. if it could do that...I'd buy/make one. you dont know how much i hate it when my streams stop because my computer froze/kernel paniced/bsod'ed/caught fire.
too bad the site seems to have been /.'ed now...

Ethernet stereos?

If you already have ethernet cable strung through your house, wouldn't it just make more sense to connect your computer to the network, and then just listen to the mp3 files by connecting a stereo to that computer? Works fine for me, and it only costs $0.

Re:Ethernet stereos?

Given the environment inside your computer, you may get some interference included in your audio signal. Stereo-Link [stereo-link.com] manufactures a USB device that will allow the computer generated audio to be piped into a stereo w/o any of the included noise picked up from a sound card. It is available from this [studio-stuff.com] site too for $159. I would like to see how the ethernet device stacks up against this product.

Ok, now just add toslink output...

Someone please add an optical digital output to this thing... I don't want any analog signals entering my amplifier. No ground loops or any of that shit with fiber either.

But where is the Ogg Ethernet player?

Sorry... but with the patent restrictions on MP3 I will skip it. Not unless they support Ogg.

Kevin

Re:But where is the Ogg Ethernet player?

It would have supported OGG, had there been a low-cost chip for Ogg decoding (like the STA013 and MAS3507D for MP3).

Slashdotted!

So I'm sitting here looking at my MRTG graphs [seanadams.com] and saying WTF - my server's trying to push out 2.5MBps onto my T1. Oops.

Thanks everyone for you interest in the SliMP3. Yes, we *are* building these by hand, at least the first 100, and we plan to ship in about two weeks. No we're not planning to build our next batch this way.

I'll do my best to answer everyone's questions. Again, thanks for the traffic, and sorry my server can't keep up!

Sean Adams
Slim Devices, Inc.

Turtle Beach Audiotron

Turtle beach makes (or just distributes?) a similar device. More details are available at TG [thinkgeek.com]. This one officially supports windows only, but linux support is available (through samba, if I remember correctly). Uses ethernet or regular phone lines..

One of these with an 802.11 wireless ethernet card would be perfect...

BSOD

Imagine enjoying your MP3 collection on those big speakers in your living room, away from the distractions of fans, hard drives, and the occasional blue screen of death!

um, if i get the BSOD, how the h am i supposed to be listening to MP3s, i hate poorly thought out marketing propaganda :P

More similar devices...

The idea isn't very new or radical as it use to be. If you go here [evozine.com], then you can see some stuff that is already capable of doing what was mentioned in the article.

Review of unit on mp3newswire

www.mp3newswire.net has a short review of the unit at http://www.mp3newswire.net/stories/2001/slimp3.htm l
Basicly it's just a summary of the info on the official pages, but it's good since the official page is ./'d (but still accessable, just VERY slowly).

Buy a $2 cable from Radio Shack

That's what I do. I've been listening to MP3's through my stereo for years. No need to buy anything fancy.

Cool!

While this is cool, I'd love it if it did wavelan. Heck, I'd love a wavelan mp3 player. Something I can carry around the house or office and stream mp3's off an NFS directory, web site or samba share. I know, I could go get an iPaq but it's just a little too much.

Any ideas?
Geoffeg

bah, do it wireless

Picked up a set of these [thinkgeek.com] from thinkgeek. They stream analog from a 1/8" stereo jack to RCA jacks. Works fine. At $69 it's hard to beat.

Since I have wireless ethernet too, I can control the output on the server from my laptop anywhere in the house (or outside).

so what?

Dell and Gateway have both sold ethernet-enabled MP3 players for about a year now. They're component-based, designed to plug right into your stereo.

Search around on their sites for them.

- A.P.

Other Ethernet Based MP3 players

One that has been tested and works is the MP3Elf [mp3elf.net], based on the cool Java-based TINI board from Dallas Semi. Another TINI-based MP3 player is here [greenend.org.uk],
although it's still in the planning stages. The nifty thing about the MP3Elf is that it's open source _and_ hardware so you can build your own. They've sold some bare boards so you can assemble your own, although I'm not sure what they're planning for the future.

MP3s keep growing, but they don't.

Why is it that all these companies are now making advances in MP3 technology while the music itself is being destroyed? Let's face it, how many people use MP3s for legal purposes (like listening to their own band). Even cell phones have MP3 players now, but what's the use? If the crackdown on pirated MP3s continues, these companies will lose their money to consumers no longer interested in free music.

scars are souveniers you never lose.

This is nothing new...

Gateway has had a product like this availible for quite some time now. It has an ethernet port to connect to the server, a display, and connectors for the home audio system.

Why did this story make it? Was it a slow news day?

802.11 streaming

I use my laptop with 802.11 wireless to play MP3s. I hit a web page on a server on my office, which plays MP3s through the server's soundcard. I have RCA jacks running in the crawlspace under my house from the server soundcard to an input on my receiver. The web page can also serve up the MP3s over http if I want to listen through headphones on the laptop itself.

I use MSDE [microsoft.com] to store the album info and playlists. I am looking at moving the database to MySQL.

I originally started this project using LiRC [lirc.org], but then I realized how much cooler a web interface would be.

I used to open the http port through the firewall, but yahoos were hitting my page and cranking up my stereo while I was at work, and freaking out my dog.

already done

yeah, i already play my mp3's through my stereo. i plug the aux out of my sound card into the aux in of my stereo. and there is 0 latency! and i only had to spend $2 or so at Radio Shack to get a headphone-jack-to-rca-jack converter.

Ogg support?

Sean? Is it possible to add this?

Thanks,

Zilch.

ESD, Anyone?

Let's see, soldering them together on a polished
wood table with no ESD protection in sight?

What are these people thinking?

Clearly, not much.

Another soon to be victum of the music industry

Yeah, that's a really great idea. The guys at Slim Devices are really on to something that could totally be revolutionary. Too bad these music nazi's in the music industry will never let you have the actual songs to use the new technology provided by Slim Devices.

How nice.

Internet Server?

I assume it will be possible to hook up your net server/home machine and allow anonymous people stream your music? ...can anybody go into the technical details? ..sounds like the beginning of something big ..legal issues?

shameless plug..

There's even another ethernet player project: visit www.kreapc.de [kreapc.de], and here are some [kreapc.de]
pictures of the player.

all source code is GPL'ed.

MP3-internet player : it exists for quite a whille

Gateway has developped one few time ago and was
for sale since beginning of this year
I had one in my own hands and was quite handy to configure

I Like it, but..

I think I'd like it a bit more if it was USB or 802.11.

-jcr

what's the difference....

between this and the Dell Audio Reciever? I have one it works well, collecting dust on my shelf right now cuz i just moved and have drilled holes for network cable yet.

Already exists: Turtle Beach Audiotron

This definately isn't a big deal... a few companies have these already. The one I ended up with is a Turtle Beach Audiotron ($300), also sold by Gateway as the Gateway Connected Music Player ($200). Features?

• Standard A/V component size -- Looks good with your VCR, receiver, etc.
• Rackmountable.
• Ethernet or home-phone-line networking (I forget the acronym)
• Reads files via SMB [From any windows box, or linux with samba. Means normal folks can use it, too. I just can't see my mom installing perl on windows...]
• Linux+Samba officially supported by Turtle Beach.
• Vacuum display (40x2)
• Web browser interface for configuration and playing [in current 2.0 beta software]
• Random play, repeat play
• Supports icecast/shoutcast streaming [in current 2.0 beta software]
• Analog (RCA) and digital (TOSlink) outputs
• Good front-panel interface (or small remote)
• GREAT support -- Turtle beach has implemented almost every feature requested on their audiotron mailing list.

I really suggest these to anyone that needs an mp3 player in their stereo system. The sound quality is good, the interface is good, the support is stellar, the price is right... Since the new beta software has started coming out, I've had _no_ complaints of any type (in some 6 months of use).

Anyone who gets one of these should definately keep up with the mailing list (maillist.voyetra.com) and download the 1.9.xx beta software. A -lot- of user interface changes (for the (much) better) have gone into this newer software, along with a bunch of other nifty features.

Definately run right out and get one. They're great, they're cheap, and, well, they're great.

Make it wireless!

Instead of wiring it to a fixed point in the house (meaning I have to wire the WHOLE house with CAT5) they should put rechargable batteries in the thing and an 802.11 card instead of plain old ethernet.

That way, I can take the thing anywhere! My own MP3 radio station! (Well, within limits, of course... ) But I do think that wireless would be the true killer app for this stuff.

Firmware written in assembler?

Uh-oh. This looks like trouble. What happens when the CPU is discontinued? Will they have to re-write the firmware with every product revision? This looks like a support nightmare in the works.

A hint for success

I think I'd buy one of these things if they supported IPv6 with anycast.
This is exactly the kind of thing IPv6 was designed for, and since I'm going
to start converting my home network to primarily use IPv6, this would be a
perfect addition to my setup.

Good effort, guys...

That is pretty cool, just not as practical as it might be, and I'm guessing a bit expensive. Cool display units in small quantities are generally extremely bad deals, most good deals on project displays are pulls, obsolete or weird surplus/seconds lots, but you don't want to go selling that kind of stuff to people. ICs have interesting economics also, I recollect for some simplex repeater project I thought was cool way back in my active ham days an IC required (I think a 30 second digital recorder) could be sourced from Radio Shack for about $25 and was also available from a supplier for like $100 plus $7 shipping for 1-25. That wasn't the price break, if you sent a MO for $107 they'd send you however many you wanted up to 25. The real pricing didn't start until you wanted 501 or more.

One of the lessons I learned hard way is when you're trying to produce anything destined for retail is "if you didn't buy by the pallet you paid too much" and I'm starting to think "if you didn't buy a truckload you paid too much" is the better way to put it. Chips and boards is made in a whole 'nother hemisphere from where I is, and I know they don't float 'em across individually in pie tins. The guy I'm going to get the best deal from is the guy who unloaded the big-ass container ship in CA, and he's not going to pop open a tote for me when I call him and say "yeah, I'd like to buy 50 Morimoto GNR2010X's." He's going to call me unkind names and hang up. This seems like common sense, but then you read in your local paper about the guy going into businss selling custom lcd rearview mirrors for trucks, with his superclever wireless ccd camera that goes infrared at night, where he casually mentions they generally cost $1000 installed. Um, I don't own a trucking company, but the trucking industry cried like bitches when the gubbernment here told them they had to apply $150 (the industry said, which means it was probably really $20) worth of reflective tape to their trailers so that it was less likely that motorists would plow into them and DIE if a truck jackknifed in bad weather. If a trailer doesn't have $150 margin to spare over say, a year, to legitimately keep people from dying, what the hell makes you think there's $1000 of margin for you to mount some junk you bought from x10.com on there to keep them from bashing the loading dock as hard?

All that aside, my current short-term solutions for mp3s are an old thinkpad and patch cable on top of my Aiwa, which is also impractical and expensive, but at least I can read my email on it, and a chopped and hacked iopener that has mp3 duty when it's not the breakfast table/tv room xterm.

I just deleted several paragraphs describing the media appliance I've been working on because a) somebody will steal my ideas b) nobody helpful will read it anyway c) I might not be done before December as I was planning to be d) somebody else might come out with the same thing or better as I'm working on before me e) all of the above.

Let's just say mine has an ethernet port too, can do Ogg (you know kids, patented technology doesn't make it BAD as such), and doesn't require specific server software, but it works well with several things. It should start at about $60-80 (maybe less, $80 is worst case), is mainstream enough for average humans, but is quite hackable. I'm not your average vapor-spewing crackpot, either. I have reason to believe I have even less personality and am less likable, but I can do deals.

SPAM!!!

I post a story at slashdot and then get spamed like there is no tomorrow.. 36 spams in one day...

Re:Everybody loves COCK

Isn't it nice to see that someone has figured out how to beat the ASCII art filter. *Groan*

Re:Everybody loves COCK

Also, you are meant to check your links.

None of your goddamn links work!

Re: Look what I found, uncle malda.

I have no idea where the original went, but it's not the first time a comment has gone missing lately. Long story short: it looks like Andover knew they were going to be acquired by VA when /. was purchased. Rob turned down offers from VA and Andover was used to get /. under the VA umbrella one way or another....there was a link in the original comment (not mine) that appears to support the whole thing (I thought it was Newstrolls, but I can't find anything relevant there, so who knows). If any of this is true, it's a serious bitch move by VA.

Now watch this post vanish....

Re:Ummm, headphone jack?

A headphone jack would not be too to rig up with the right gear from the rat-shack though it would'nt have volume control.

I think the general premise is that this is for use with a stereo, and not a portable device.

Also, you could easily serve mp3s from that old 486, a machine which could'nt play 44kHz/16 in mono without stuttering. If you hapen to run this with a P3, it should produce performace loss as near to nothing as makes no odds.