US Said To Plan New Limits on China's AI and Supercomputing Firms (nytimes.com) 53
The Biden administration is expected to announce new measures to restrict Chinese companies from accessing technologies that enable high-performance computing, The New York Times reported Monday, citing several people familiar with the matter, the latest in a series of moves aimed at hobbling Beijing's ambitions to craft next-generation weapons and automate large-scale surveillance systems. From a report: The measures, which could be announced as soon as this week, would be some of the most significant steps taken by the Biden administration to cut off China's access to advanced semiconductor technology. They would build on a Trump-era rule that struck a blow to the Chinese telecom giant Huawei by prohibiting companies around the world from sending it products made with the use of American technology, machinery or software. A number of Chinese firms, government research labs and other entities are expected to face restrictions similar to Huawei, according to two people with knowledge of the plans. In effect, any firm that uses American-made technologies would be blocked from selling to the Chinese entities that are targeted by the administration. It's not yet clear which Chinese firms and labs would be impacted. The broad expansion of what is known as the foreign direct product rule is just one part of Washington's planned restrictions. The administration is also expected to try to control the sale of cutting-edge U.S.-made tools to China's domestic chip makers.
Re: (Score:3)
I find it far more likely that our officials are making blind and downright idiotic decisions in a bubble without thinking about consequences. I know it's fun to think there's some grander vision behind really dumb moves when the government pulls them. But really? They're just people looking out for whatever the next quarterly statement will be on whatever business is offering them the biggest kickbacks for the quarter. It's not much deeper than that.
Re: (Score:3)
There isn't much they can do. It takes a long time to ramp up R&D.
These sanctions have never worked.
Re: (Score:3)
These sanctions have never worked.
What's worse, they decrease the sanctioners' diplomatic influence in the target country, and make future cooperation much less likely. Not to mention possibly shooting your own economy in the foot by pissing off a major trading partner.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
China probably won't retaliate with similar sanctions on the US, because that's one of the arguments they use to convince other countries to partner with China. The argument is basically that China doesn't make judgements about how a country chooses to use technology, doesn't try to enforce its laws beyond its borders, and doesn't use sanctions for economic gain.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Why do you think the US wants a China/Taiwan war?
How would we benefit from that?
As far as why we would cut them off from tech, money, etc... do you think we should have support Nazi Germany before we entered the war? Should we support Iran and North Korea today? Or how about Russia? Or (pick your favorite shitty evil country)?
Maybe we just shouldn't deal with evil regimes and do things to help prop them up because that is just wrong?
(And please no one do the whataboutism thing and say the US is evil. Th
Re: (Score:2)
The US has done more evil than Nazi Germany, modern Iran, North Korea, and Russia combined?
Ok, yeah, we're way out in the la la land of "never took a history class" now.
Re: (Score:1)
Sorry you can't read but "modern" is there in the thread already.
Try again. List the evils of each or stfu.
AC was very good call for you.
Re: (Score:2)
yea cause Stalin never killed anyone dipshit
Re: (Score:2)
the people killed by US proxies, wars and proxy wars is way too numerous to count
Re: (Score:2)
moving goalposts
Re: (Score:2)
The US has done more evil than Nazi Germany, modern Iran, North Korea, and Russia combined?
Ok, yeah, we're way out in the la la land of "never took a history class" now.
We're responsible for the evils of modern Iran, because we torpedoed their democracy.
I wrote a paragraph with links about how we also share responsibility for the holocaust, but the lame filter stopped it. Then I tried to put it on pastebin, and pastebin's filter stopped it too. So I put it on controlc [controlc.com], which apparently has less interest in sheltering Nazis than Slashdot or Pastebin.
Re: (Score:1)
Finally someone actually addressed the topic. Thank you.
Yes, I agree that we have created directly or been partially responsible for many evil shitty third world governments. I whole heartedly and readily agree. These were mostly stupid CIA Cold War plots thought up by the stunningly low grade morons running the agency like loose cannons in a fireworks factory. That being said, once a shitty evil regime is created, are we still responsible and solely responsible for their actions decades later? It's a
Re: (Score:2)
once a shitty evil regime is created, are we still responsible and solely responsible for their actions decades later? It's a philosophical question. I don't think there's necessarily a single right answer beyond, "it depends".
We generally don't just walk away. We keep fiddling and fucking around with foreign governments forever. Then We The People find out decades later because we're not allowed to know about it while it's happening... it's "classified". So we generally have more responsibility than is acknowledged.
As far as Iran goes, we helped the Shah, who was a piece of work until it was clear he was out.
Well, that's the thing... Mossadegh was on his way to the same destination but with less militarism but we helped remove him because of the oil industry nationalization [fpri.org].
Corporate support for the Nazis: Yes that happened. Our government allowed US corps to cash in helping Hitler. And this is my point on China. Why should we support China today? It is the equivalent crime to supporting Nazi Germany then.
Sure, or for that matter, Israel. We don't suppo
Re: (Score:1)
IBM support, heh ok, that makes more sense than software :-)
Ok, I wasn't thinking that far back on Iran but granted yes we did fuck over Mossadegh for the oil companies which was both evil and bad long term foreign policy. It was not a Cold War anti-Soviet move like some other CIA garbage, just pure greed on behalf of corporations. But then the Shah gets sick and bails to the US and we get the current shit heads instead. In someway yes you can trace all the way back to the 50s but at some point you have
Re: (Score:2)
Israel: we haven't always supported them. Certainly not in their earlier days.
Without us, by which I mean the U.S., there likely wouldn't be an Israel right now. And I don't mean that in a won-the-war kind of way, either.
China is in a -much- stronger position than Israel, obviously, having the largest population, second largest economy, fairly large number of well educated people, and so on. All stuff we all know and should easily agree on. The problem is they also have a very recent track record (like 5 seconds ago) of all sorts of horrors
The difference there between Israel or the US is one of degree, not recency.
Re: (Score:1)
Israel and US help: which events or time period are you talking about where Israel would be toast without US help? We have certainly supplied them with aid, military gear, tech, intelligence etc for many decades but they fought their own wars. No Americans ever showed up to defend Israeli land or people during any fighting. If anything the US has pressured Israel to stop when winning such as when they went as far as Beirut to flush Lebanon of terrorists.
Degree vs recency. Absolutely but I think both are
Re: (Score:2)
Which is worse?
I don't know if that's my call to make, though I certainly know which one is more urgent.
Re: (Score:2)
Ok so now it's not profit but hegemony. Can you explain to an ignorant dumbass like me how goading China into attacking Taiwan promotes American empire?
Re: (Score:2)
So you think Taiwan, a tiny country of about 23m is going to be a great proxy to fight against China, the largest country on the planet.
Yes obviously I'm the idiot in this conversation.
So, please explain to this idiot how a war between China and Taiwan which the Chinese will win without our direct intervention is of benefit to the US.
I'm sure I will find this educational and be a better person after you share your echo chamber knowledge about how the hegemonic US will somehow benefit from a clusterfuck like
Re: (Score:2)
Maybe I have been reading way more than you about this for years down to the level of various potential strategies, tactics, troop movements, weapon storage depots, simulations conducted by various people in and out of government, the politics involved in all 3 countries, financial considerations and several other factors. So yeah I am definitely smarter than you.
Without US help, the Chinese have already shown the world exactly what they will do: surround Taiwan, cut her off, attack from all directions, sh
Re: (Score:1)
Way to completely ignore the huge progress China has made since they flubbed their Vietnam attack. That you,would even mention such a thing is ridiculous.
And you completely ignored my statement that China v Taiwan is a one sided slam. Taiwan's -only- chance is outside help. Period.
And you ignored everything I said about what the west could win from Taiwan falling.
You just keep repeating your unfounded ad hominem based on nothing that you're smart and I'm not based on... nothing.
It was only a few weeks ag
Re: (Score:1)
It won't be a war, dummy. It'll be a smashing.
I'm still waiting to hear what benefit the US gets from China smashing Taiwan in your very brief "proxy war".
You'll never even try to answer because it's a nonsensical statement. We do not want China to attack Taiwan under any circumstances as the results are highly negative and the benefits are zero.
Re: (Score:1)
Taiwan v China is not a war we will make money on. Without direct intervention from the US, China will isolate and invade Taiwan. That will cost the west a zillion dollars in lost productivity from inability to get Taiwanese made chips, lost trade, and incalculable loss of prestige around the world. The US would be at high risk for losing her empire. For what? To sell a few extra missiles? Madness. Makes no sense.
As opposed to Ukraine. Who gives a shit about Ukraine? Totally different situation than
Re: (Score:1)
(And please no one do the whataboutism thing and say the US is evil. That's a boring reply and doesn't at all address why we should support an evil regime even if we were just as evil).
If you are going to call out other countries as Evil then it is not whataboutism or boring, you are just a hypocrite.
Re: (Score:1)
1) all evil are not equally so
2) evil of now is a greater evil than evil of the past
3) supporting an evil makes you complicit with their evil
Boring and whataboutism and deflection.
Why should we support evil regimes?
Because we are evil? Uh ok whatever.
Want to compete with China (Score:3)
Ah shit, it's already tough at kindergarten level: https://twitter.com/wowinteres... [twitter.com]
Not soon enough (Score:2)
Mukilteo Washington based Battery Maker Faces Accusations It Gave U.S.-Owned Tech To China [invw.org]
US firms will benefit from these restrictions (Score:2)
as China will now defund all development in this area?
Yeah wight.
Re: (Score:2)
much more likely that china will become independant in these matters...
7nm crypto chips are only the beginning
If you can't beat them... (Score:2)
I don't see the point in these bans (Score:1)
stupid (Score:2)
It only affects certain Chinese "entities." So what? Workarounds are easy: just get the stuff using other entities. This will do nothing except cause reprisals and hurt western companies.