The Chinese Socialist MMOG 200
GP writes "How different is China? In the online game version of the idealized Socialist state, you gain experience points by 'doing good deeds' and 'thwarting spys'. You can even meet Chairman Mao!" From a great writeup by Scott Jennings on the game: "And now we have the online MMO version, 'Learn From Lei Feng Online', which allows you to... mend socks. Again - not making any of this up. To quote from the original Xinhua story 'For beginners, sewing and mending socks is the only way to increase experience and to upgrade,' said Jiao Jian, a six-grade pupil in Yuexiu District, quoted by the newspaper. He then continues. 'Every time you are promoted to a higher level, your clothes will become more average,' he said. I'm pretty sure this isn't a translation screw up. The longer you grind, the more you look like everyone else. I guess new users wear designer pastels or something."
what about their TOS? (Score:5, Funny)
Hmm (Score:2, Insightful)
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Hey mods!!! That's not off topic (Score:2)
Here are some facts for other mods to read:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5953508 [msn.com]
Re:Hey mods!!! That's not off topic (Score:4, Interesting)
Infanticide does not happen "all the time" in China. Your MSN reference noted two phenomena: sex determination via selective abortion and infanticide. One is much more pervasive in China and I can assure you it's not infanticide, which was more common before the advent of Communism in China.
Speaking of Communism, you're also way off base blaming "Communism" for this phenomenon. China has a one-child policy which most experts feel is a necessary thing. It's because of their population size, not ideology. The preference for sons has its origins in China's agrarian/Confucian roots. It's an unfortunate thing that when you combine the "good" one-child policy with the "bad" preference for sons, you end up with trouble on a large scale.
In fact, if it hadn't been for China's best-known "Communist" leader, i.e., Mao Zedong, the population problem might not be so extreme, but unfortunately Mao held that China's greatest exploitable resource was manpower and thus more babies was more power, so he ignored calls for population control and urged baby-making instead. So in a sense the situation is opposite of how you portray it.
Parent is right (Score:4, Insightful)
"Man, I just re-formatted my processor because I got a virus or a bug or something in my window."
"Yeah I know, you should use that linux-program I heard it really zaps those bugs!"
Re:Parent is right (Score:2)
Re:Hey mods!!! That's not off topic (Score:4, Insightful)
OTOH (Score:2)
Holocaust Denial 101 (Score:2)
That is Communist China, is it not? Or are you arguing that it is happening in alternative-universe China? Sidereal China? Capitalist and Democratic China? Huh? Help me out here. If it isn't happening in Communist China then where is it happening?
Here's a reading comprehension aid for you: I said it was happening in China, not because of Communism. I do stand by the fact that the Comm
Re:Hey mods!!! That's not off topic (Score:3, Interesting)
If you want to see something really disturbing, look at the 15-65 age group for mid-east countries such as Kuwait and Qatar: 63.8% and 69.5% respectively.. ~2:1.
Re:Hey mods!!! That's not off topic (Score:3, Insightful)
The thing, you see, is that Kuwait and Qatar don't have a population of a billion people.
There are like 840,000 Quatari and 2.2 million Kuwaiti, that's respective male excedents of 155,400 and 256,000. China's 53% vs 51% for a population of 1,300,000,000 translates into a male excess of 26,000,000...
You could replace the whole Kuwaiti population by women 10 times and you still wouldn't have enough wives for these guys...
Re:Hey mods!!! That's not off topic (Score:2)
Re:Hmm (Score:5, Insightful)
(Before you ask--yes, Chinese people really do consider us barbaric for our cultural idiosyncracies. And killing infant girls really isn't pervasive in modern China, even in rural areas, regardless of whatever uninformed drivel Microsoft-NBC is spewing today. Gain some perspective, please.)
Re:Hmm (Score:2, Informative)
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For those not familiar with the law: if you get a son, you aren't allowed more children; if you get a daughter, you are allowed a "second chance". Thus, any family with a boy does not have a girl, while ev
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Re:Hmm (Score:5, Funny)
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Assuming the occurence is only 1 in 10,000, that's only 60,000. Nothing to get worked up over. Not like it's pervasive or anything.
Try out in the rural areas (Score:2)
Hell, even if it happened in the U.S. some people wouldn't question it. "The pillows accidently smothered it in its sleep. We should be sueing the pillow company instead for this tragedy!"
Re:Hmm (Score:2)
Let's assume
Re:Hmm (Score:3, Interesting)
I know two girls who are only around today because the doctor misread the ultrasound and thought they were a boy. Let me tell you, this doesn't lead to good relations with your parents later in life.
And sure, it's illegal. Whatever. What the doctor does is smile if it's a boy, frown if it's a girl. Then without anything obvious at all being said, the parents spontaneously decide to abort or not.
Regardless of if
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Okay. Drop barbaric. How about they're a deeply sexist culture with widespread disregard for human life?
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http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?story Id=3499024 [npr.org]
http://www.bowdoin.edu/news/archives/sociology/000 040.shtml [bowdoin.edu]
"China's demographics don't add up, according to a new study. The country's 2000 census indicates 120 boys are born for every 100 girls, the highest ratio ever recorded in human history (in average populations, the sex ratio is 105
Re:Hmm (Score:3, Insightful)
Yes because it means the person in question is not part of the "we" and will have different ideas of what rights are fundamental.
Re:Hmm (Score:2, Interesting)
Are you telling me you lack the basic ability to make moral judgements? In other words you could sit by and let someone kill a child because it was culturally exceptable for them? Rationalize it away because of your twisted moral relativism? Beat women and hang teenagers for sexual activity? I want to call you stupid but I am not sure that is appropriate. If you really believe that is right, you aren't only dumb, you are evil.
That's just silly (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Hmm (Score:2)
Secondly, direct infanticide is fairly rare (a lot rarer than the American press would have you believe). Now, gender-select abortion, that's a huge issue.
Re:Hmm (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Mod parent flamebait (Score:2)
So, there's some sort of change in the DNA when someone is born that makes them human?
Legally, in the US, fetus != person, but biologically fetus = human. We've just legally determined some humans aren't persons.
Re:Mod parent flamebait (Score:2)
Revolutionary idea! (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Revolutionary idea! (Score:2)
Excellent advice (Score:5, Funny)
in real life, Mao believed that deflowering virgins would help him live longer
All I need now is a steady stream of corsage bearing virgins.
Just one question: What do I do with the flowers?
Re:Excellent advice (Score:5, Informative)
Gettin' some ying for their yang! (There goes my karma...)
Minor point - it's Yin not Ying (Score:2)
Re:Excellent advice (Score:2)
He lived to be 84!
Re:Excellent advice (Score:2)
Re:Excellent advice (Score:2)
Behold! (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Behold! (Score:2)
Easy way to install rootkits onto computers (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Easy way to install rootkits onto computers (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Easy way to install rootkits onto computers (Score:3, Insightful)
However, the US isn't quite as experienced in these matters as China. My communications might get monitored for mentioning said keywords, but that doesn't mean the FBI or NSA is going to show up at my door and disappear me right away. It's just beginning to
Re:Easy way to install rootkits onto computers (Score:2)
Re:Easy way to install rootkits onto computers (Score:2)
I know. It was just a joke. I actually knew someone who claimed that they were visited CIA
Re:Easy way to install rootkits onto computers (Score:3, Insightful)
Or, as an alter
Re:Easy way to install rootkits onto computers (Score:3, Informative)
BTW, what makes you think
GBLT Friendly? (Score:1)
Re:GBLT Friendly? (Score:2)
You look more and more like everyone else.. (Score:5, Funny)
And this is different from WoW in what way?
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A good fit (Score:5, Interesting)
Of course, not only is the gameplay of multi-player online games ideologically communist, but the mechanics of game economies are explicitly communist. They are planned economies. Gold farming and black markets are exactly the same phenomenon. The Chinese Socialist online game will be interesting to watch for observers due to this inevitablity. How will they deal with external and internal black markets? Will it be possible to distinguish countermeasures gameplay from reality as ingame countermeasures are taken?
Talk about missing the point (Score:4, Insightful)
In fact, probably even before. I can imagine some "but I really want to start directly at the top of Pong's high score table" whiner sitting on the side and spewing rationalizations about how actually playing the game is "work", and how those poor Pong players got scammed into working in their free time and paying for it. (And make no mistake, playing arcade games used to cost a _lot_ more than 13$ a month.) Fast forward a bit in time and you find the same kind of people whining about how deluded people are to invest any kind of time or effort into their entertainment and, god forbid, to cooperate with other players.
That's all that levels, xp, epic equipment, or PvP ranks are: a way to keep the score, not all that different from Pong's or PacMan's high score table, or from a RL football team's rank in the leagues and championships. And some people "grind" for that score (in fact, for some trying to beat the high score _is_ the challenge and the fun), some people just play the game for what it is and let the score just happen on its own, and... some busibodies stay on the sideline and try to sound deeply philosophical in their lament about how sad it is that people put up with "having" to spend hours on their entertainment, or "having" to interact with other people or whole groups. (E.g., the group around the arcade machine.)
And yes, some form of coop play always existed even in those arcade machines. Ever since the first game got a fire button to mash, in addition to the directional joystick/trackball/whatever, I recall people "grouping" and having specialized "group roles" at the arcades. E.g., one would guide the character/ship/whatever around and dodge enemy fire, and one was mashing the fire button and dropping the AOE "bomb" at the right moment for maximum effect. I.e., using the modern MMO terms very loosely, one was the "tank" keeping the team from taking damage and one was the "damage dealer", even if noone used those words at the time. I.e., even when the game didn't actually offer the in-game mechanics for that, some found their own makeshift ways to cooperate and interact with other humans, regardless of how many others sit around and whine about how everyone else should be a loner.
Get this: it's not a matter of "work" or "grind" to some end. That's the actual game. It's ok if I "have" to spend some hours doing quests in WoW, because exactly that was the whole point and purpose in the first place: to waste some hours in a game. Gaining some level or armour piece at the end is just a virtual pat on the back, but the real purpose was to waste those hours in the first place. That's what entertainment is all about: filling your time with something better than staring at the walls.
It may surprise you, but it's not just MMOs. Actually _most_ of the RL passtimes need some time or effort, and most are someone else's "work". Do you enjoy tweaking your car? That's a mechanic's "work". Do you enjoy going dancing? A professional dancer would call that "work". Taking digital photos in the park with your cool new camera? Yep, pro photographers would call that "work". Play tennis or basketball with your friends? That's a pro athlete's "work". _Watch_ sports? Sports journalists do that for a living. Watch a movie and maybe discuss them with your pals? Yep, that's a movie reviewer's "work". Etc.
You'll notice that they also all involve some time spent on that hobby. E.g., a movie buff may spend hours a day "grinding" through movies on their DVD player. E.g., someone with a digital camera may "grind" for hours taking photos of squirrels in the park. Etc. Some of those, *gasp* may even involve "grouping" with people. E.g., going dancing with a couple of friends instead of doing it solo. Some of those *gasp* may involve joining some kind of a "guild". E.g., joining some photo community or whatever kind of associati
Re:Talk about missing the point (Score:3, Insightful)
a) Playing the game for the fun. Enjoying walking around, iteracting with other players, discovering new places, facing new challenges and beating them and maybe getting a cool outfit for your avatar in the process - playing because it feels good.
b) Being the best, having the fattest loot and letting everybody else know about it. Being able to publicly proclaiming one's 1337ness, rubbing it in everybody else's face and going around calling all else noob
You mean Bartle's player types, perchance? (Score:3, Interesting)
- socializers: basically the people who are there to chat, make friends, organize a guild, organize a player town/community/whatever, and generally be social about it
- achievers: people who want to have the highest score, a level 60 character, the biggest player house or the full epic suit for their class, etc.
- explorers: people who l
Re:Talk about missing the point (Score:2)
I play pool now and again. It is unfair that I can't compete with people who play it for several hours every day? Should the pockets be made 12" across to level the playing field?
The difference is that in pool (and every meatspace game I can think of), an experienced player's advantage comes from his, um, experience. Pool doesn't innately reward you for playing a lot--it's your ability to learn from your past successes and mistakes that makes you a better player. The rules are the same for both players
Re:A good fit (Score:3, Insightful)
Communism:
- in America the manifestation of anything evil, repressive or stupidly unrealistic is labelled 'communism'. Satan is a Communist, no doubt. Nobody knows why.
- in the rest of the world 'Communism' is a political viewpoint, something about sharing etc etc.
Capitalism:
- in America the manifestation of anything good, true and beautiful. God is
Re:A good fit (Score:2)
I'd always assumed that Satan was a capitalist. Either way I know I feel his presence when I walk into walmart... Maybe he just likes the cheap lighter fluid.
Re:A good fit (Score:2)
Re:A good fit (Score:2, Flamebait)
Re:A good fit (Score:5, Insightful)
No. Trying to enforce _your_ own point of view, regardless of what people want, is what's incompatible with democracy. It's not even just about communism. The USA McCarthy era trying to enforce capitalism and weed out any communist thinking wasn't a particularly democratic process or a case of "land of the free".
Freedom and democracy mean that the people are able to choose whatever they choose, including communism, capitalism, something in between, or something very stupid. (E.g., ancient Athens democratically chose to wage war on Sparta, even though the power of Athens was naval and Sparta was landlocked on a mountain. And most land battles had been won for Athens by the Spartan elites. Let's just say Athens never recovered from that mistake.) But that's what democracy means: letting the people choose for themselves.
And there's this fundamentally post-McCarthy American point of view that, given freedom and a right to choose, anyone would choose a cult of the psychopaths. (In the medical sense, not in the axe murderer sense.) That anyone would choose a dog-eat-dog world, where it's only right to be chewed up and spit out by those more powerful than you. And that there are no other shades of grey.
In practice, in Europe for example most countries have democratically chosen something in between. Something where enough economic freedom is left to keep the economy going, but there are plenty of safety nets for those who aren't CEOs. Some countries, as was pointed out, veered pretty far to the left.
But even if I was to accept your points, the GP point still stands: there's something particularly stupid in claiming basically "everything I don't like is communistic." In this case someone argues that "working" in WoW to gain an advantage over other players is somehow communistic, because he doesn't like that. Excuse me? Last I've heard having to work to gain an advantage was the very fundament of capitalism.
That's really the whole problem. For some people "communism", "capitalism" and so on have lost any trace of their real meaning and are some generic synonim for "evil" and "good". Everything they like, including getting a free meal, is "capitalistic" and "democratic". Everything they dislike, e.g., having to work to get a reward, is inherently "communist" and "totalitarian". They've become just buzzwords triggering some Pavlov's Dog kind of prescribed response, without any thinking involved.
Re:A good fit (Score:2, Insightful)
I recently learned that Benito Mussolini's granddaughter Alessandra Mussolini (who is also a fascist) has a seat in the European Parliament [eu.int].
In a free society you can't prevent people from being assholes; even elected to democratic institutions.
Re:A good fit (Score:2)
You might be surprised (Score:2)
Marx's communism,
Re:A good fit (Score:2)
I prefer to think:
1. Communism isn't "defeated".
2. The Soviet Union "defeated" itself in the end.
Payback (Score:4, Funny)
Do we get to protest standing infront of tanks? (Score:1)
Balanced Economy? (Score:2, Funny)
Seriously, I want to try this! (Score:5, Interesting)
Doesn't anyone see how this could be fun? Yeah, mending socks doesn't sound like a thrill, but what do you do for XPs when you're weak in a commercial fantasy game? Endlessly stab chickens? How is that more fun? No, I think mending socks in a sweatshop that more of a feel of honest labor.
I think my talent would be in being a newspaper reporter for the government. I'd try my best to sound like this North Korean paper [kcna.co.jp]. Really, it would be a blast! And I bet there would be all sorts of neat quests, like stopping burglars, helping fishermen, getting a village to quit smoking... the sort of stuff that would be really refreshing after months of "deliver this scroll to Naldemor and you shall receive this +2 sword and lots of XP!" Yes, it would take a lot of creativity to make this game fun, but I guess I am one of these people who still appreciates creativity.
translation mess up? (Score:5, Informative)
From this article "Every time you are promoted to a higher level, your clothes will become more average."
"More average" is not it is supposed to mean. That word should mean "simple".
Also, the title should read the Chinese Revolutionary MMO.This has to do with the person Lei Feng itself and the background at that time. "He was characterized by propaganda as a selfless and modest figure after his death and consequently was an idol to many." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lei_Feng [wikipedia.org]
He is protrayed as a selfless person, including his accidential death at 22. A quote from him: "Life is limited, but the service to the country is boundless. I want to use my limited life to boundless serve the country."
It was the time whe loyality to the party that matter's most. In was in the 1950 and 60's in the history, see:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Leap_Forward [wikipedia.org]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_Revolution [wikipedia.org]
Score one for propaganda (Score:4, Funny)
[/goes back to playing America's Army]
So... (Score:2)
Westwood Would've Done Better (Score:2)
Hot Chicks, Rock Music, Evil Masterminds, Superweapons, Giant Squids...
Sigh, Real Communists are so boring....
Year of the Dog (Score:2)
Some people must feel funny now :-) (Score:2)
Oups
(although I'm sure that the PR CP has some PC games for the PC (in latin languages its even more "alliterative" CP becoming PC)
Sorry to end my mail here I have to mend some socks before my batery closes down due to electricity shortage
Re:wow (Score:5, Insightful)
Not "Bad" So Much As "Boring" (Score:2)
What's odd is that the game is a throwback to something the CPC really quit trying to sell to anyone but party cadres. However, there's never homogeneity of opinion in any organization, including the Party.
Re:wow (Score:1)
Re:wow (Score:1)
Re:wow (Score:2, Informative)
--
I'll be the karma whore.
Propaganda is a promotion of a cause or a particular idea - often times presented with a one-sided or distorted bias.
Advertising is a promotion of a product or service - often times presented with a one-sided or distorted bias
Put it another way, advertising may compel me to become fat or poor while propaganda may lead me to the gallows or the gas chamber.
Re:wow (Score:1)
A Question of Fun (Score:2)
There's no way in hell that this rumored game could be fun. There's no way that people would voluntarily sign up for this. This is likely to be forced on people or to become just another ritual to go through to prove one's loyalty to the government.
Re:wow (Score:4, Funny)
A virtual sweatshop.
Re:wow (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:wow (Score:2)
It's only a better life relatively speaking, and once China becomes too expensive for the multinationals those people are going to be just as fucked as they were before - it's not like they could buy a house or save some money on the wages they
Re:wow (Score:2)
Re:Oblig (Score:1)
OT (Score:2)