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Are We About To Enter The Age of Book Piracy?

Posted by CowboyNeal on Sat Aug 09, 2003 08:24 AM
from the ebooks-are-for-me-books dept.
theodp writes "The speed with which the 4MB e-mail hoax purporting to be the new cookbook from the Naked Chef streaked across the Internet suggests to Slate that a new, disquieting era for the publishing world may be in sight. Indeed, the latest Harry Potter tale made the rounds on the Web just hours after the book went on sale, its 870 pages apparently scanned in and distributed by rabid fans. The old argument that no one likes reading on a computer has pretty much eroded. Just because publishing people can't conceive of book piracy doesn't mean it can't happen."
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  • just look up by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:26AM
    • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
  • But still.. by Lord Bitman (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:27AM
    • Re:But still.. by NevermindPhreak (Score:3) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:41AM
      • Re:But still.. by dnoyeb (Score:3) Saturday August 09 2003, @12:03PM
        • Re:But still.. by Feztaa (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @04:06PM
          • Re:But still.. by Lord Bitman (Score:1) Sunday August 10 2003, @09:43AM
        • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
      • Re:But still.. by vasqzr (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @12:23PM
        • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
    • Re:But still.. by QueenofSheba (Score:1) Sunday August 10 2003, @09:14PM
  • this is old news... by Anonymous Coward (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:29AM
  • Comics too. (Score:5, Interesting)

    by eddy (18759) on Saturday August 09 2003, @08:30AM (#6653996)
    (http://gazonk.org/~eloj/ | Last Journal: Tuesday June 07 2005, @01:18PM)

    Not only books, but comics too. Already I've seen complete archives of all X-Men, Spiderman, etc. I think that might actually become a bigger problem, because comics are easy to scan and distribute, and their readers probably fit very well the profile of your typical "downloader".

    • Re:Comics too. (Score:4, Insightful)

      by gatzke (2977) on Saturday August 09 2003, @08:44AM (#6654069)
      (http://www.che.sc.edu/faculty/gatzke/ | Last Journal: Monday May 29 2006, @10:02AM)
      I cannot pay hundreds of dollars for classic comic books.

      Having these online so that people could read from the start of the series would be wonderful.

      Having them online so that you don't have to pay a couple of buck for a recent issue is silly.

      Plus, comics are about collecting. I doubt this would hurt the industry too much.
      [ Parent ]
      • Re:Comics too. by eddy (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:51AM
      • Re:Comics too. (Score:4, Insightful)

        by clifyt (11768) <{moc.liamg} {ta} {rettamkinos}> on Saturday August 09 2003, @09:19AM (#6654206)
        (http://sonikmatter.com/)
        "Having these online so that people could read from the start of the series would be wonderful."

        Never heard of trade paperbacks? I have several sets of comics I was too lazy to pick up every issue (that and I hate going into the comic shop where you are guaranteed that some 35 year old with middling education is going to try to convince you that both Star Wars and the Matrix actually contain intellectual philosophies) -- all of them in trade paperbacks.

        Too lazy to pick up issues 1 -20, but the story arc in paperback form. Sick of folks handling your precious copies? Get the trade paperback -- the only one actually went out of my way to collect was the Sandman (still need to find issue #4 to fill out the collection -- haven't looked too hard) -- but I won't let those out of my home.

        These don't exist for every comic, but they do for quite a bit. hit the comic section of the local Barnes and Noble and you will see what is newly available...and ya can probably find the rest by order.

        If I wrote something 15 years ago, one would think I was still entitled to copyright protection. Folks today think 3 years and not published in the 2 places they looked means its 'abandonware'. Then again, these are the same type of peoples as the 35 year old comic shop employee mentioned above so I don't put much credence in their logic.

        People that have never created something creative will always believe that it isn't real work and this stuff comes readily to ones mind. "It only took me 30 minutes to read this comic, heck, I'll be generous and believe that it could have taken up to 2 hours to write. " Intellectual properties are much harder to develop and need far more protection than any manual labour, but the /. crowd wants to literally put us further down the scale with the ditch diggers and that ilk.
        [ Parent ]
    • Re:Comics too. by el_gregorio (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:46AM
      • Re:Comics too. (Score:5, Interesting)

        by tgibbs (83782) on Saturday August 09 2003, @09:49AM (#6654347)
        but comics are often less about "reading" and more about "collecting".

        But one reason they are collected is their ephemeral nature. You can't go to the library and check out issue number 31 of Spiderman. There will be some people who will collect any physical item, but there are many people who buy collectible comics just to read them. Without these purchasers, demand and price of old comics is likely to fall.

        [ Parent ]
        • Re:Comics too. by canadian_right (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @04:45PM
      • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
    • Re:Comics too. by Malfeas (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:24AM
    • Re:Comics too. by Catbeller (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:27AM
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    • Re:Comics too. by carolinef (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @01:51PM
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  • article -1 Troll (Score:5, Insightful)

    by HBI (604924) <pelander.eyemud@com> on Saturday August 09 2003, @08:30AM (#6653998)
    (http://www.eyemud.com/ | Last Journal: Thursday August 02, @11:28AM)
    Book piracy is too much of a pain in the ass. Plus, people want to own the book and feel it in their hands.

    Like someone wants to have a stapled stack of recycled copier paper in a fuzzy inkjet font. Even worse is the suggestion of reading it off the screen. The whole concept is just silly.

    In the case of music, I seriously doubt most people get the mp3 and then buy the CD. I would suggest in this case that anyone interested in reading an 870 page book would go out and buy it, or at least borrow it from the library.
    • Re:article -1 Troll by Eric Ass Raymond (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:37AM
      • Really? by danila (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @11:30AM
        • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
      • Re:article -1 Troll by portnux (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @12:24PM
    • Re:article -1 Troll by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:40AM
      • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
    • Re:article -1 Troll by blincoln (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:42AM
    • Re:article -1 Troll by jesser (Score:3) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:43AM
    • Re:article -1 Troll by reynaert (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:50AM
    • Re:article -1 Troll (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Albanach (527650) on Saturday August 09 2003, @08:53AM (#6654114)
      (http://albanach.com/)
      Books too can be too much of a pain in the ass

      Ever tried flying somewhere, awaw for a couple of weeks... DO you carry 10lbs of books or one memory stick / cf card / whatever your palm/pocket pc takes.

      Books are big, heave and inconvenient. Palmtops are small, multifunctional, light and their screens are getting better all the time. Battery life on all bar the ones with Pocket PC is good enough for a transatlantic flight.

      Anyway, the fact they are being distributed means there is a demand. Look at the facts, if someone can be bothered to scan an entire book and then distribute it with no hope of recognition or reward they must be doing it for the satisfaction of themselves and others enjoying their efforts.

      The book industry doesn't make every book available in an ebook format. Whyever not? It's not like they don't have the work in a computer? They can sell it for a bit less than a paper book, but he savings must be astronomical - no distrobution chain to run, no bookshops to pay... If they don't see the advantages they'll be left behind just like the music an video industries.

      [ Parent ]
      • Re:article -1 Troll by Eric Ass Raymond (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:07AM
      • Re:article -1 Troll by RenaissanceGeek (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:36AM
      • Re:article -1 Troll by Jeff DeMaagd (Score:3) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:41AM
        • Re:article -1 Troll (Score:4, Informative)

          by Jason Earl (1894) on Saturday August 09 2003, @01:37PM (#6655593)
          (http://jearl.0catch.com/)

          It's pretty clear that you have never actually read a book on a PDA. You should try it.

          Personally I have gotten to the point where I am not interested in reading books by authors I am unfamiliar with unless I can read the book on my PDA.

          First of all, the tiny screen on a PDA is not a problem. Small pages would be a problem in a book because it takes two hands to turn the pages. With a PDA turning the pages is a one-handed affair, and it is as simple as pressing a button. Most readers will even autoscroll for you if you so desire. Even using the largest bold font on my Visor Handspring I am still able to blaze through books with ease. In fact, if you read up about page layout you would find that narrow text columns make it easy for your eyes to find the next line.

          Secondly, the coarse DPI only matters if you are using a font that is designed for paper. I, for one, don't care if the font is jaggy as long as it is perfectly clear what the letter is. It's when you start anti-aliasing the fonts that they start to be problematic.

          Thirdly, my Visor Handspring didn't cost $300, it cost $80. Combined with a $30 CF springboard attachment and a cheap CF card I can comfortably carry around hundreds of books. My Visor is lighter than a paperback, and I can read it in the dark. Heck, the gizmo even helps me make sure I don't miss any meetings. Batteries aren't a problem as the Visor I have takes AAA batteries. I currently use rechargeables, but I have used standard batteries in a pinch. Even reading 3 books a week I still usually get a couple weeks worth of juice out of standard AAA batteries.

          [ Parent ]
      • Re:article -1 Troll by Mr. Piddle (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:41AM
      • by SmackCrackandPot (641205) on Saturday August 09 2003, @10:19AM (#6654499)
        Well, I can see two sides of this argument.

        If I'm going on holiday, then a book bought at the airport bookshop is far more convenient than a PDA. I'll still be able to read it on the flight and take it with me to the hotel swimming pool/beach. With a PDA or laptop, I probably won't be able to use it on the plane, while at the beach I'd be too concerned about it being stolen, buried in the sand, soaked by rain/drinks/the large guy jumping into the swimming pool/the little kids splashing about learning to swim, to really feel relaxed. Having any of these things happen to a $10 book is an acceptable risk. Similarly, when attending a conference I'd prefer to have a hardcopy of the paper than the author is presenting. If a cheap CD-ROM reader/LCD display with long-lasting life came along, then I would change my mind and say E-books would be a good idea.

        If I'm learning technical stuff at home or in the office, then saving as much space as possible is definitely a good thing. I'd prefer not to have to lumber a large book back and forth between office and home. If I need the information from a book, then I can either buy it brand new, second-hand, or borrow it from the library, copy the relevant pages and then sell or return it. Photocopying has the disadvantage of creating as much paper as was copied. Scanning the book electronically allows me to create my own virtual bookshelf, and make backups onto CD-ROM whenever required. Having the all the relevant chapters on a single CD-ROM is no bad thing. I would consider buying a technical book electronically, if it were possible.

        My preferences are based entirely on how much space is available, and how safe the surroundings are.
        [ Parent ]
      • Re:article -1 Troll by Moridineas (Score:3) Saturday August 09 2003, @11:51AM
      • some obvious reasons by YllabianBitPipe (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @12:17PM
      • Re:article -1 Troll by occamsarmyknife (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @03:04PM
      • Re:article -1 Troll ~~~ Palm life same as PPC by iamhassi (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @04:35PM
      • Common Sense by DerekLyons (Score:2) Sunday August 10 2003, @02:40PM
      • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
    • Re:article -1 Troll by Frambooz (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:54AM
    • I'm not so sure (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Chuck Chunder (21021) on Saturday August 09 2003, @09:04AM (#6654158)
      (http://blog.paulmcgarry.com/ | Last Journal: Friday July 25 2003, @12:57AM)
      I own the Harry Potter book but I read the whole thing on my laptop.

      I like to read in bed and I found the 766 behemoth unwieldy (or I would if I tried it, I've found shorter books unwieldy).

      With my laptop I just stuck it on my bedside table, turned down the brightness, chose acceptable font and background colours in Acrobat, flipped the page 90 degrees and went full screen.

      A pleasant reading experience in a comfortable position with no book to support and reposition with every page turn.

      My only fear was that some joker might edit the book and interject with a spoiler part way through. With a song if a track is spoiled you can chuck it and still enjoy the track from other sources. If you get a book from an untrusted source and it spoils it then it could ruin your enjoyment of the book completely.
      [ Parent ]
    • Re:article -1 Troll by bulchanm (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:23AM
    • Re:Yeah right.... by botzi (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:32AM
    • Re:article -1 Troll by halr9000 (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:35AM
    • Re:article -1 Troll by Robotech_Master (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:43AM
    • Re:article -1 Troll by Thing 1 (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:45AM
    • Re:article -1 Troll by gandhii (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @11:16AM
    • Re:article -1 Troll by Dogun (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @11:42AM
    • Re:article -1 Troll by bcrowell (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @11:53AM
    • Re:article -1 Troll by ziggles (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @11:57AM
    • Heard it before! by Eric_Cartman_South_P (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @12:12PM
    • Re:article -1 Troll by gmuslera (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @12:32PM
    • Re:article -1 Troll by Jason Earl (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @12:43PM
      • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
    • post -1 Didn't RTFA by AnotherBlackHat (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @02:33PM
    • Re:article by tundog (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @02:53PM
    • Re:article -1 Troll by Joe Tie. (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @04:11PM
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  • Let's call it what it is (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Stiletto (12066) on Saturday August 09 2003, @08:30AM (#6654000)
    (http://existens.org/)
    It's copyright infringement, not a bunch of people sailing around with their swords in the air looting the natives and stashing thier booty (ARRGH!) [gnu.org]
  • It's all about having it (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Hwatzu (89518) on Saturday August 09 2003, @08:31AM (#6654005)
    It's been my observation that sites that distribute pirated books have far, far too many to read -- and many of the books there are obviously scanned through OCR, with no attempt made at legibility. And yet they're still offered.
    For most book pirates (and pirates in general, really), it's not about getting books to read for free -- it's all about having the book. To these pirates, if you don't have a bigger collection than everyone else, you're nothin'.
  • duh (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Tirel (692085) on Saturday August 09 2003, @08:33AM (#6654010)
    I get all my books from #bw (hi guys!). sure, it's sort of illegal, but you could similarly get it for free from the library, and if I really like the book I buy it anyway.

    IMO, more interesting than the fact that book "piracy" happens is the fact that with todays "electronic entertainment systems" people are actually willing to read a book instead of playing repetative action games.
  • Scannned? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by waffle zero (322430) on Saturday August 09 2003, @08:33AM (#6654013)
    (Last Journal: Tuesday June 22 2004, @02:01PM)
    I was under the impression that some of the pdfs were made from the printer's source postscript file or something to that effect. I know a guy who pull D&D manuals off KaZaa that are perfect copies. I think he's the reason that the campus computer labs instituted printer quotas.
    • Re:Scannned? by Jugalator (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:05AM
  • Fake books (Score:3, Interesting)

    by marcopo (646180) on Saturday August 09 2003, @08:34AM (#6654017)
    A couple of friends of mine who received a book purporting to be the new Harry Potter a couple of days before the original release have read it. Their conclusion is that while it would have benefitted from a good editor going over it, it was basically better then the real one (which they read a few days later), with more character developement. The fake also did not ignore the effect of hormones on behavior.

    It was also remarkably similar in plot, probably due to both authors reading fan discussions on what will happen for the last couple of years.

  • 'About to Enter'? (Score:5, Informative)

    by jonathan_ingram (30440) on Saturday August 09 2003, @08:34AM (#6654019)
    (http://www.pgdp.net/)
    Book piracy has been around for hundreds of years.

    In the 16th and 17th century actors and stenographers would conspire to rush off unlicenced copies of popular plays. The most famous example of this is the 'Bad Quarto' of Hamlet. This appeared in print several years before the authorised edition, and was based on the memory of two or three of the principal actors, with much filling from other popular works.

    In the 19th century the USA was the piracy centre of the English speaking world -- bootleg editions of every popular British work would be printed, with no money getting back to the original British writers. You can read many complaints from English authors of the time about this situation.

    Even if we restrict ourselves to illegal distribution through the internet, this is not a new phenomenon. The alt.binaries.ebook newsgroup has been around for many years -- the only thing which has changed is the mass availabilty of scanners which would have cost thousands only ten years ago. So, instead of having to manually type a book to copy it, we can now scan and OCR.

    Just as with music distribution, we need to emphasise that there is an incredible amount of *legal* book distribution on the internet. The standard bearer is Project Gutenberg [promo.net] -- creating free electronic copies of out of copyright texts since 1971.

  • New Piracy Software (Score:5, Insightful)

    by fdiskne1 (219834) on Saturday August 09 2003, @08:35AM (#6654020)

    So instead of Kazaa, Gnutella and Napster, book piracy will be by email? God help us! Just when I'm trying to convince my higher-ups that emailing that graphics-laden instruction manual (10 MB) to everyone in the company is NOT a good idea.

    Hey! Maybe then they'll outlaw email and it will give us a chance to revamp SMTP!

  • Copy protection by PyromanFO (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:35AM
  • I read on the palm but don't pirate by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:36AM
  • It may have already started by dacarr (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:36AM
  • Book Piracy by Hamfist (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:37AM
    • Re:Book Piracy by Thing 1 (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:54AM
      • Re:Book Piracy by aardvarkjoe (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @11:41AM
    • Re:Book Piracy by DerekLyons (Score:2) Sunday August 10 2003, @02:53PM
      • Re:Book Piracy by Hamfist (Score:1) Monday August 11 2003, @07:52AM
        • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
    • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
  • hmm by miruku (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:37AM
    • Re:hmm by SmallFurryCreature (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:11AM
  • Self-correcting problem by genessy (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:37AM
  • Now it's getting pointless (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Phoenix (2762) on Saturday August 09 2003, @08:37AM (#6654032)
    Piracy against the RIAA is still ilegal, but considering the way that the RIAA screws everyone (the artists included), it's understandable.

    Piract against the Movie Industry is again ilegal but it can be rationalized when you consider some of the dodgy things they want to try and pull against the consumers.

    Piracy against the book publishing firms makes no damn sense. They don't screw the customers, price increases for books have been very slight and can be explained by the normal rate of inflation (my personal average is $1.50 over the past 10 years) and if you really want to read the book for free there is a *legal* way to do it. Just go to the local library and check it out

    There is no "robin hood" rationalization for this, there is no way to justify it, this is just a bunch of cheap fuckers who can't be bothered to fork over $18 on Amazon.com for a pre-order.

    In my opinion it's *now* a case of the consumers (the ones sharing the books on the web) screwing the authors. Remember, JK Rowling was a starving single mother when she wrote HP:ATSS...Think about *that* when HP #6 comes out

  • "no one likes reading on a computer" by mercx (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:38AM
  • Hopefully, no (Score:5, Insightful)

    by JimDabell (42870) on Saturday August 09 2003, @08:38AM (#6654038)
    (http://www.jimdabell.com/)

    Hopefully, "book piracy" won't suddenly catch on. I suspect it will slowly rise, but a sharp increase will only prompt publishers to have a knee-jerk reaction and jump towards some kind of lock-down attempt. A slow increase will give publishers time to think about the most sensible way of altering their business model in the face of copyright infringement. Some have found that giving away electronic copies is profitable [baen.com].

  • Solution. by Anonymous Coward (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:39AM
    • Re:Solution. by Eric Ass Raymond (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:46AM
    • Re:Solution. by hype7 (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:59AM
    • Re:Solution. by SuperFrink (Score:1) Sunday August 10 2003, @01:20AM
    • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
  • Getting books for free is easy by waffle zero (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:39AM
  • Encourages kids to read (Score:3, Insightful)

    by BillsPetMonkey (654200) on Saturday August 09 2003, @08:41AM (#6654052)
    is the official reason the Harry Potter phenomenon is labelled A Good Thing.

    The other reason is that it also encourages adults to read. I've got few objections to literature being pirated on the internet, and although they wouldn't admit it in public, I'd imagine the books authors don't object much either. If you really love a book, you'll want a hard copy.
    It makes a change from all the "How To Drive a Woman Wild in 30 Seconds.pdf" crap circulating on Kazaa anyway.

    Would you object to your kids downloading Shakespeare's sonnets from th'Internet?
    Then what's wrong with downloading modern literature from a personal development point of view?
  • I love books. Always have. I can hang out in a bookstore all day long. I love the smell of them (even the musty smell of older books), the feel of good books in my hand. When you find a book with really nice paper and binding, you've found a treasure. This even goes for paperbacks.

    There is no substitute for holding that book in your hands, and having the pleasure of turning the pages. It's slow, perhaps (unless you're one of those heathen speedreaders; reading was meant to be enjoyed), but it's a satisfying expirience.

    As much as I love computers and all things gadget-like, no electronic contraption with a small sreen will ever replace my books. And having a personal library is just plain damn cool.
  • The old argument still holds.. by Fuzuli (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:41AM
  • ARRRRR by grug0 (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:41AM
    • Re:ARRRRR by Repugnant_Shit (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:21AM
  • Jamie Oliver.. Metallica of our time? by Woxbert (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:42AM
    • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
  • First SCO-related post! by pwroberts (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:42AM
  • BIG difference... (Score:3, Funny)

    by 403Forbidden (610018) on Saturday August 09 2003, @08:43AM (#6654063)
    Books don't ALL cost 20 bucks (in fact much much less normally) and there isn't just one page that is good.
  • Dead tree editions are the best protection... by gearmonger (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:44AM
  • We have standards by JanneM (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:45AM
  • Whatever happened to ebook readers by Raul654 (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:46AM
  • by Hungus (585181) on Saturday August 09 2003, @08:47AM (#6654086)
    (Last Journal: Tuesday July 19 2005, @03:24PM)
    Baen [baen.com] has make a point of releasing its books free online. [baen.com] Their reasoning [baen.com] includes such as this "Losses any author suffers from piracy are almost certainly offset by the additional publicity which, in practice, any kind of free copies of a book usually engender. Whatever the moral difference, which certainly exists, the practical effect of online piracy is no different from that of any existing method by which readers may obtain books for free or at reduced cost: public libraries, friends borrowing and loaning each other books, used book stores, promotional copies, etc." and they note that "After all, Dave Weber's On Basilisk Station has been available for free as a "loss leader" for Baen's for-pay experiment "Webscriptions" for months now. And -- hey, whaddaya know? -- over that time it's become Baen's most popular backlist title in paper!"
  • Books on audio & college textbooks by RyanFenton (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:48AM
    • Re:Books on audio & college textbooks by timeOday (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:06AM
    • Re:Books on audio & college textbooks (Score:5, Interesting)

      by jfengel (409917) on Saturday August 09 2003, @10:12AM (#6654469)
      (http://slashdot.org/ | Last Journal: Monday November 03 2003, @03:59PM)
      Recorded books are actually a massive undertaking. They are a performance by an actor doing multiple roles (in the case of Jim Dale for Order of the Phoenix, over 150 roles). Each moment is glitch-free: he never ever stumbles or clears his throat. That's a combination of talent, editing, and multiple takes. Each reading takes multiple rehearsals, plus many hours more in the editing studios.

      I don't really know how long it took Jim Dale to get 23+ hours of Harry Potter laid down on tape, but it must have been months of work. I have no objection to seeing him get paid for that (and since the CDs are available for under $50, only a few bucks per CD, it seems quite reasonable compared to music.)

      Other recorded books are, of course, much more expensive. Overall I've found that Order of the Phoenix could have been priced much higher than they did based on demand, in any format. I assume this is an economic decision rather than a friendly one, but I know that it enabled married friends of mine to purchase two copies rather than one so neither had to wait.

      Now, that's just to point out that this is more than just a "golden voice"; it's a major effort by an actor with rare talent. If you want to put together an Internet project to read books aloud, I think that would be noble and interesting. For out-of-print books, you might check out AudioBooksForFree [audiobooksforfree.com]. Just don't be too disappointed when your efforts don't sound nearly as good as the professional ones, and take more work than you expect.

      For copyrighted works, well, the publishers wouldn't be happy if you're competing with their efforts, especially if they have their own recordings. But I'd press you to think about the value of new books versus old; if you'd rather record a new, copyrighted book than an old one, maybe you'll see why that book has value to the one who paid to publish it.

      Disclaimer (too late): I am an actor and do recorded readings (and am unbelievably jealous of a voice like Jim Dale's).

      [ Parent ]
  • publishing books is tougher than publishing music by castellan (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:48AM
  • many reasons for downloading books. by blanks (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:48AM
  • Where's the scam? by mlush (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:49AM
  • It's simple by Muttonhead (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:54AM
  • Excuse me, I think I'm stuck in a time warp... by Kjella (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:06AM
  • What's it all coming to by dheltzel (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:07AM
  • Literacy by DickBreath (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:13AM
  • Odd by gspr (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:13AM
  • God I hope so (Score:3, Insightful)

    by CrazyJim0 (324487) on Saturday August 09 2003, @09:14AM (#6654187)
    Why did man make libraries?

    To store all his information.

    Why will man not share his information?

    To hold power over other men.

  • Why the knee-jerk reaction? by dmayle (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:15AM
  • Piracy Vs. Publication by Mirko.S (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:19AM
  • why not use the free market? by fermion (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:19AM
  • by grimani (215677) on Saturday August 09 2003, @09:21AM (#6654212)
    It's just not popular, coz...as a society we don't read nearly as much as we watch movies or play games.

    But believe me, any book you'd want is available in text format and pdf.

    I mean, seriously, a insane number of classics are already available legally from Project Gutenberg - how many people use that regularly?

    There's just not as much prestige in releasing a pirated book, when the most highly anticipated movies can make a group famous.

    That's just my 2 cents.
  • Potential Positive Effect (Score:5, Interesting)

    by libertynews (304820) on Saturday August 09 2003, @09:24AM (#6654226)
    (http://www.brianlane.com/)
    First off, I agree that it is Piracy and is wrong. But the effects may not be what you would first expect. Baen books has an experiment with their Free Library, www.baen.com/library [baen.com] where they are giving away some of their books and watching the results on sales.

    They are finding that sales actually go up on the author's other books! Having freely available books gives readers an introduction to authors they may have never picked up before, they tend to buy other books written by the same author. According to Baen the life-cycle of your typical book really isn't that long.

    This isn't to justify book piracy, but just as we have seen in the Music industry we may be dealing with a bit of exaggeration on the part of the publishers (and on the part of some authors who seem to have gone a bit rabid on the subject).

    Brian
  • 2 things by Mr. Piddle (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:29AM
    • Re:2 things by bj8rn (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @11:42AM
  • There has already been a copyright lawsuit by eric76 (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:37AM
    • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
  • Face it by Julian Morrison (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:41AM
  • Deal with the new world by ricksmith (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:43AM
    • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
  • Bigger monitors, better gadgets by ihummel (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:46AM
  • the textz manifesto by rolux (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:49AM
  • I don't think so... by The Master Control P (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:52AM
  • my 2 cents: give it a try by neglige (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @09:53AM
  • just an FYI by the_2nd_coming (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:00AM
  • Changes my mind about DMCA by tjstork (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:02AM
  • And well it should by Crashmarik (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:03AM
  • I beg your pardon by rabtech (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:04AM
  • It's been going on for some time now by Selanit (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:05AM
  • Libraries (Score:3, Insightful)

    by fruity1983 (561851) on Saturday August 09 2003, @10:05AM (#6654430)
    I get books from the library. I do own a few books that I routinely reference, but for most of my reading, I go the route that means I dont have to pay.

    Why would book piracy put publishers in a great deal more trouble than libraries? Someone still has to buy the books. Likely there are several groups of book piraters, I am sure they all buy their own copies.

    Oh, and I dont like reading on a computer. Maybe my CRT just sucks.
  • Publishing... by softspokenrevolution (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:05AM
  • Amen, brother! by finallyHasANickname (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:12AM
  • A comparison of the industries by Unregistered (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:13AM
  • Of course books are next by nurb432 (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:14AM
  • Erg, Well.. by poity (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:21AM
  • alt.binaries.e-book on Usenet is where action is by Cryofan (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:23AM
  • Another article about the Potter ebook by Robotech_Master (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:30AM
  • Disquieting indeed... by exp(pi*sqrt(163)) (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:40AM
  • Yes (Score:3, Informative)

    by DoorFrame (22108) on Saturday August 09 2003, @10:45AM (#6654663)
    (http://www.rumorsdaily.com/)
    About a year ago I started downloading books to my Handspring and carrying them around with me. It took a few days to get used to the constant scrolling, but once you get past that you've got a small device which you always have with you that you can read from at a moment's notice. No more sitting around on the train doing nothing... I just pop out the Handspring and I'm reading Harry Potter V, or Michael Chricton's Prey, or Ender's Game or older books like Fahrenheit 451 or Brave New World or 1984. They're all available online and the list is growing. Publishing is in for the same thing the music world is already fighting... as soon as people become accustomed to reading digital books the industry is in trouble.
  • Says Who? by reallocate (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:55AM
    • Re:Says Who? by alexandre (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @11:08AM
      • Re:Says Who? by reallocate (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @11:18AM
        • Re:Says Who? by alexandre (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @12:01PM
  • maybe PDA, not desktop by jdkane (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:59AM
  • It IS a problem by canajin56 (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @11:01AM
  • interesting moments... by alexandre (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @11:04AM
  • Book piracy? by Omnifarious (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @11:12AM
  • I've downloaded books ... by Ignorant Aardvark (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @11:22AM
  • So, what does this really indicate? by lifebouy (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @11:23AM
  • Availability of e-book != no demand for paper book by MntlChaos (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @11:27AM
  • Again (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Dogun (7502) on Saturday August 09 2003, @11:33AM (#6654980)
    (http://www.indistinct.net)
    I myself downloaded a copy of 'arry's latest adventure. It was good. I actually finished the entire thing before the hard copy that I ordered online showed up on my doorstep. I've reread the entire "Myth" series in the past month or two. (Nevermind the fact that I actually OWN the damned things but can't find three of the books.)

    I've said it before and I'll say it again. Book piracy is no big deal.

    Anybody who has the patience to read a book on their computer REALLY REALLY wants the book that they're reading. So much so, that they tend to either already own the book, but have lost it, left it at home and they're somewhere else, or something of that nature.

    Piracy of textbooks and, say, RPG manuals is another story, however. I think most people who acquire that stuff might actually have purchased the real deal, but because they don't want to shell out for a reference manual, as they already have it, they won't go out and buy the real thing.

    Book piracy may have a negative impact on sales, however. I think that would-be book pirates should be aware of that and restrict themselves to downloading books they already own or would immediately purchase if they saw it on a shelf, and then order it immediately online before making a real dent in the sucker, BEFORE deciding if it's worth finishing.

    Why?
    I had the pleasure of meeting Joe Haldeman a couple years ago, and he explained the financial facts about writing.

    It's important to remember that most authors are in pretty bad financial shape - they don't make a whole lot on a book, or for that matter for shorts and articles. "Bridget Jone's Diary" and it's like are the exception, not the rule. Science fiction and fantasy - minus JK Rowling and a very small set of other lucky ducks - are probably the worst paying genres.

    So if you're planning on purchasing a book but find yourself downloading the book instead, whether or not it turns out the book is your style, buy it anyhow, unless you're that guy who sits for 3 hours in the bookstore trying to determine if the book is worth buying.

    Counter as you will, people.
    • Re:Again by Wolfstar (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @02:09PM
    • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
  • LIB.RU by danila (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @12:02PM
  • Baen has the right strategy by McLae (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @12:07PM
  • Book Piracy is a pain by PsibrII (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @12:07PM
  • The requirements for eBook piracy... by YllabianBitPipe (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @12:11PM
  • Alarmist crap. (Score:3, Interesting)

    by qtp (461286) on Saturday August 09 2003, @12:16PM (#6655233)
    (Last Journal: Thursday August 12 2004, @10:56PM)
    If this is going to be a serious problem, then it would already be one. The technology to "pirate" books via the internet has been around 10 or more years now, and reading extensive texts on a terminal hasn't really improved to the point that people would be willing to read "Anna Kerennina" or "Gavity's Rainbow" on a screen. Web pads and tablet PCs are unlikely to change that as long as bound paper is still available.

    My guess is that someone in the industry (think big, DRM friendly software vendor) has come up with a solution to sell, and is now looking to create a problem. The "Harry Potter" leak has all of the earmarks of a media stunt engineered to prevent the inevitable downswing of popularity that the trendy serial will (and already has) expirienced.

    Alarmist Crap.

    Keep your DRM, thank you.

    And no, SMTP works just fine for me, thank you. If you think you have something better, then release it and see if anyone switches.

  • Ebook devices by henben (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @12:31PM
  • Why this won't be a big political issue by 1iar_parad0x (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @12:38PM
  • Evolution by dbc001 (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @12:48PM
  • For Technical Books the GFDL makes sense by mdubinko (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @12:54PM
  • Could we have a vote please by jago25_98 (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @01:06PM
  • College Books by argoff (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @01:07PM
  • Anything worth pirating? by ChilyWily (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @01:21PM
  • Age of Book Piracy: The 19th Century (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Brown Line (542536) on Saturday August 09 2003, @01:38PM (#6655600)
    Book piracy was widespread in the 19th century. In particular, American publishers copied popular English works: the works of Charles Dickens, for example, were widely pirated in the United States.

    Closer to our own time, Taiwan did not sign the international copyright convention until late in the 1970s. Up to then, Taiwanese publishers routinely ripped off popular books and sold their editions for a fraction of the what the legal editions cost.

    My point is that book piracy is nothing new.

  • Yeah right... by Anita Coney (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @01:41PM
  • Not a Problem by dmarx (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @01:41PM
  • Driving 45 on the highway: reading speeds... by geekotourist (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @02:20PM
  • Much noise, no answers by AbintraPress (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @02:55PM
  • Ebooks in universities by billso (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @03:08PM
  • Baen gives them away when... by mrmeval (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @03:33PM
  • Fair use is keeping it from being a major problem by jasonditz (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @03:39PM
  • Doubtfull by autopr0n (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @03:43PM
  • It's amazing to flip through the project Gutenburg list of books. Pretty much any English (and increasingly other languages) classic is available. Completely free because copyrights have long since expired, and legal. Who really wants to pirate "pop fiction" anyway?
  • Watch Out by Redbw6 (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @05:56PM
    • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
  • I Hope So by Master of Transhuman (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @07:00PM
  • Too **** late. by Karth (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:59PM
  • Confessions of a Low-Tech Book Pirate by JackBuckley (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @10:37PM
  • My Prayer by zo219 (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @11:04PM
  • Gameboy Advance for reading by NerdENerd (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @11:12PM
  • My few "pirated" books by Sabalon (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @11:38PM
  • The Worst Book Piracy on Earth! by Tiresias_Mons (Score:1) Sunday August 10 2003, @12:24AM
  • Reading on a computer... by evilviper (Score:2) Sunday August 10 2003, @02:31AM
  • Richard Stallman about book "Piracy" (1997) by fidros (Score:2) Sunday August 10 2003, @04:09AM
  • Ebooks by tommyboyprime (Score:1) Monday August 11 2003, @05:43AM
  • Books are Timeless by dBLiSS (Score:1) Wednesday August 13 2003, @10:56AM
  • Re:Can be turned to the publisher/author's advanta by Phoenix (Score:2) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:45AM
  • Re:Nothing new by WgT2 (Score:1) Saturday August 09 2003, @08:46AM
  • 26 replies beneath your current threshold.
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