This discussion has been archived.
No new comments can be posted.
Justin Frankel Resigns From Nullsoft
Related Links Top of the: day, week, month.
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. -- Arthur C. Clarke
queue the llama noises (Score:5, Funny)
Mike
Re:queue the llama noises (Score:3, Funny)
Re:queue the llama noises (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:queue the llama noises (Score:5, Insightful)
For many years, I have been impressed with the work of Nullsoft and their unique style and approach and I have always had the impression that Justin one of the key driving forces at Nullsoft. I fear that under AOL's corporate thumb Nullsoft (like Netscape) may be well on its way to becoming Null.
Good luck, Justin, and thanks for giving us Winamp.
Re:queue the llama noises (Score:3, Informative)
It's just DOT COM-ism (Score:5, Insightful)
june 1, 1999: aol buys nullsoft for $86m
june 2, 2003: justin announces resignation due to creative differences
For those who can't connect the dots, he had a 4 year stock vesting schedule. Justin didn't have enough trouble with his free expression while his stock was still vesting, but now that it's done he suddenly feels the pangs of regret for working for the corporate machine.
There's nothing wrong with leaving after your contracts are up, but why not be a man about it? Releasing a ton of code you don't own under the GPL (and indeed, has code in it that can't be released this way due to RSA copyright) and yamering on in public about your former employer is at best pretty immature.
Justin obviously made out quite well selling a media player for nearly $100m. Anyone that's followed the ups and extreme downs of the industry knows that its unlikely nullsoft was ever worth that big of a price tag. Why not exit out of the situation gracefully and be thankful for the luck he had in getting the deal instead of granstanding for your hacker friends.
Sucks for him... (Score:3, Funny)
In Frankel's Defense (Score:5, Interesting)
You say that, of him, that "yamering on in public about [his] former employer is at best pretty immature." While this is true, he isn't guilty of this particular thing (at least in the links that slashdot provided; i would welcome others if you have them). In fact, he says (of AOLTW), "I have nothing but respect for the company". All he claims is that the company owns his code, and it seem to me that you agree with that statement.
If there was financial timing involved, its possible that he came to his conclusion about leaving a while ago (perhaps after gnutella got ganked), and just postponed his departure until after he was financially secure. This too, to me, is totally valid; its a lot easier to practice your art (whatever that may be) if you don't have to worry about money. Four years of compromise might mean, for Frankel, a lifetime of doing just what he's wanted.
Which brings us to WASTE. First of all, I need to plead ignorance here; perhaps you can explain to me why Mozilla folk can release GPL code while still working for AOLTW, and Frankel can't. Is it a difference in their contracts? If so, do you have access to their contracts to show me the differences? But alas, I promised to assume that your factual information is accurate. So, he did something wrong and illegal by claiming to release GPLed code under Nullsoft. However, I'd like to think that this is another part of self-expression, perhaps similar to graffiti (which, although it is wrong, and ought to be wrong, is still sometimes beautiful/powerful art, and a real form of self expression). Sometimes, the method of communicating your art (in his case, as his last act of working for Nullsoft) is as important as the art itself. It sounds illogical, and grounded more in romantic ideals than in fact, but I can imagine that being important to Frankel.
Thanks for your comment, and please respond or email me if I've misrepresented your opinion in any way.
Re:In Frankel's Defense (Score:3, Interesting)
The big difference between the GPL and the Mozilla Public License: Any patches, features, and whatnot that the Mozilla project accepts have their copyright transferred to the Mozilla project. This leaves them the option of closing future releases (though they cannot take back rights granted to the code already out there.
With the regular ol' GPL, once you've incorporated someone else's code into your project, you have to get their permission to license it under ot
Re:In Frankel's Defense (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:It's just DOT COM-ism (Score:3, Insightful)
Judging from what happened, and from Justin's blog, it sounds like he thought he owned the code, but AOL asserted its rights. Perhaps he used WASTE as a test case, to see if the corporate AOL culture was compatable with his attitude.
That's just a theory, of course.
Anything to do with Waste... (Score:4, Insightful)
Wonder? When he says, "The company controls what I do with my code [in the past, it seemed I had freedom, but it turns out all of that was not really the case--rather, I was somehow avoiding the control illicitly (for 4 years)]," it becomes rather clear as to exactly what he is talking about.
This has everything to do with WASTE and any other projects that AOL canned.
Re:Anything to do with Waste... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Anything to do with Waste... (Score:5, Interesting)
I think it has everything to do with the lack of independance of coding, not WASTE or any other particular project. Those are just symptoms of the problem.
I've worked for companies before that have draconian contracts, "Anything you think is our property! Hah!"
you're free not to work for them. (Score:5, Interesting)
If you take the contract, you shouldn't complain about the conditions later. I don't mean just you, Xerithane, personally, but anyone in general, and him especially. If he really agreed to this kind of contract, he's given AOL the high road in this matter.
Besides that, even if he worked on it completely independently, without Nullsoft resources, and without a contract giving all IP developed during employment to AOL, they're still free to refuse to let it sit on corporate servers, where it generates legal liability and bandwidth costs for them.
Re:you're free not to work for them. (Score:5, Interesting)
Not to sound trite, but I think this is maybe oversimplified. Contracts are compromises, and compromises always leave room for either side to get an advantage over the other. As with many corporations, the power dynamic is such that a contractee may in effect be forced to agree to less than fair provisions because they have become 'standard,' or the job market is tough, or the company is exerting monopoly power, etc. That agreement doesn't make draconian clauses or terms any less draconian, and the "free-market, free choice" ideal shouldn't be an absolute argument when there are such exceptions.
That said, I think it looks like Frankel more or less agrees with you, and that's why he's resigning instead of filing a frivolous lawsuit.
Re:you're free not to work for them. (Score:5, Insightful)
He's not just complaining about it, he's doing something about it, which is leaving the company. Don't act like he's just bitching and moaning about a contract that he could easily get out of, but is still holding himself to for the sake of money and position. He doesn't like his situation, so he's taking action to resolve it. That is not just pathetic little piss ant whining. That's really following through and I think that's worthy of a little respect.
Re:you're free not to work for them. (Score:4, Insightful)
That's crap. The company has all the power and you have none. If you say no, I don't agree to that clause, then the company (and all companies over a certain size have this clause) will say, "Sorry, we won't hire you."
If you want to work, you don't have a choice. They could say "We demand your firstborn.", and you'd have to sign cheerfully or you're screwed. Does that mean they can make it stick later in court? Almost certainly not... but never fool yourself into thinking you can negotiate as an individual with a multi-national corporation. They will just drop you and grab another disposable employee from the world pool.
Re:Anything to do with Waste... (Score:3, Interesting)
I don't sign contracts like that. My current employer sends a gentle reminder every 6 months that I need to sign that contract, and every 6 months I say, "Not until the work for the company vs. work during personal time issue is corrected". They have not pressed it too hard because many of my co-workers have not signed it either.
Re:Anything to do with Waste... (Score:3, Funny)
Don't for get the non-compete clause: "for the next 17 years you agree not to think on behalf of any other company".... guess that means you can only get a new job if it's in management.
Or a job down at the Patent Office.
Good for him (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Good for him (Score:4, Insightful)
Huh, dont follow you amigo (Score:5, Insightful)
Money has little to do with happiness. Unhappy people are unhappy with or without material possessions in most cases.
The man has chosen a wise path, placing his own life ahead of maximizing financial gain at any cost. I dont know the man, but I would bet he is in a much better position in life now. There is a shortage of people following their own life path in this world, and an oversupply of sheep mindlessly plodding along.
As to saying it is easier because he is wealthy, I disagree. Because he is wealthy, it is EASIER for him to get trapped in a world where only money matters, making the choice more difficult.
Another thought on this (Score:5, Insightful)
There are poor people who are happy and rich who are unhappy. there are also starving people who are too busy looking for something to eat to discuss the question, and rich people who really do enjoy their lives and give back to the community. IANAM (i am not a millionaire) far far far FAR from it in fact, but i think that a person should choose their own path in such a way that it preferably doesn't leave them starving and gives them enough that they can share. And to do this by ethical means in the American culture is sometimes difficult, yes, but a good thing to aim for.
Will leaving make his life better? Probably. Will it make him poorer? In the short run, probably. In the long run, probably not- if he has the skills, there will be a way to apply them, and hopefully in an environment which better suits his temperament. Mind you, this is coming from someone who works a day job unrelated to any of her interests (but not against my ethics) in order to stay solvent. For the moment, it's where i'm at. I couldn't imagine doing it for the rest of my life, however.
May we all have jobs that we can live for, enough to live on and to share, and the good sense to appreciate both??
Re:Huh, dont follow you amigo (Score:5, Insightful)
The lack of money, however, does. The lack of money can lead to living in piss-poor conditions, or being homeless, or not having enough food to eat. The lack of money, in many places in the world, can lead to death.
When one is simply concerned with scraping enough together to feed one's family, the question of 'happiness' is irrelevant. These questions come *after* the basics have been taken care of.
Max
Re:Anything to do with Waste... (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Anything to do with Waste... (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Anything to do with Waste... (Score:5, Insightful)
Alright, I'll bite.
Perhaps you weren't around when WinAMP was in it's infancy. I remember only one other player that even came CLOSE to the stability WinAMP provided. I even registered my copy with Nullsoft, back when it was shareware. It's not like you had "all the MP3 players on FreshMeat" to choose from. It was either WinAMP or it's crappy runner-up. Couple that with the fact that WinAMP was a) skinnable, b) had some badass graphical features, and c) impressed non-geeks. It also extended mp3 support with some attempts at backward compatability.
I know it's been a while, but computers used to be slow. WinAMP would play on a 95 box running on a 486/dx2. That's IMPRESSIVE, my friend. You couldn't do jack-shit else while it was playing or it'd skip, but the fact that it would play this fancy new MP3 format that only took a couple megs for a song was nice. It made people take notice. What did you do that ranks anywhere near that? I know that crap I did in Comp Sci & Eng didn't land me anything like the deal he made for himself. I don't think he got lucky at all, he saw a need and he wrote something that took care of said need.
Why did he have to release it at nullsoft.com? (Score:4, Interesting)
I don't get his complaining about freedom and oppression and stuff. Why can't he just publish his software on some other web page, maybe even under a pseudonym or something.
Re:Why did he have to release it at nullsoft.com? (Score:3, Informative)
Some people would rather... (Score:4, Insightful)
"I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!" -Patrick Henry
Oh, but this is the modern day United States; we're all supposed to be corporate butt boys and prostitute our lives as wage slaves. All hail the almighty dollar!
Not Yet... (Score:2, Informative)
Long Decline Anyway (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Long Decline Anyway (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Long Decline Anyway (Score:3, Funny)
* a dustball rolls across the slash page
Uh, just thought that I should mention it.:)
Re:Long Decline Anyway - Actually we are gaining (Score:3, Insightful)
So are we really losing bigtime here?
Actually, I think we are gaining. After all, AOL is losing a good programmer, and the world is gaining a programmer that is not bound by corporate interests.
Re:Long Decline Anyway (Score:3, Informative)
Yes, but those "old versions of Winamp" (the 2.x series) is still under development. It has had a lot of useful bugfixes and improvements, some pretty major. Take a look at the Winamp 2.9 release notes for example, to see what I'm talking about.
Re:Long Decline Anyway (Score:3, Informative)
Non-compete clauses (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Non-compete clauses (Score:3, Interesting)
All that really means is that your current or former company can't prevent you from taking another job regardless of what you've signed, IF your other option would be not working.
This guy released code which was created using Nullsoft resources (brainpower, cpu power, company time) and released it under the name of the company. They have every right to rescind that release. The only real issue here is the
Correct, in my experience (Score:3, Informative)
It's usually not a serious bone of contention, because the unspoken reality is this: non-competes, particularly geographic ones (ie. you cannot practice within a 60-mile radius) are generally viewed negatively by the courts, and do not hold up.
As for programmers... that might be a different story.
Re:Long Decline Anyway (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Long Decline Anyway (Score:5, Informative)
Since winamp 2.61 there are some support for "content management" for microsoft
You should install winamp 2.60 copy the plugins/in_wm.dll file to replace the one shipped with winamp 2.91, otherwise you won't be able to convert your
Tip courtesy of apachez [slashdot.org]
That's the point... (Score:2, Redundant)
Justin Frankel (Score:3, Interesting)
I remember talking to the guy on IRC years ago when he was working on his old 3D engine, Plush.
Time sure flies!
Good riddance :P (Score:5, Insightful)
I'm glad he's leaving, AOL doesn't need him anyway; after all they have lawyers. Let the lawyers write the code. I'm sure AOL 10.0 will rock the house.
On the other hand this unleashes a creative, boisterous, unwielding and stubborn geek on the world, perhaps even to join the ranks of all those amateur open source hacks. In the end you get AOL run by a squeeky-clean army of professional lawyers and another rogue hacker who acknowledges no ones authority to dictate what he contributes to their quasi-communist "community" of freedom fighters. Altogether I think both sides are getting exactly what they deserve. ;-)
Re:Good riddance :P (Score:5, Insightful)
One doesn't have to wonder... (Score:5, Interesting)
He's probably just pissed that what he works on gets the "Copyright AOL/Time Warner" header on it, and understandably so.
Re:One doesn't have to wonder... (Score:5, Informative)
IIRC, at the time that WASTE was developed, Nullsoft was owned by AOL/Time Warner. This would mean that anything created by employees of Nullsoft had to be cleared with AOL.
Therefore, it couldn't be produced under the GPL unless AOL said so. Most employment contracts specifically state that any thing or idea created, conceived, developed, etc. while employeed becomes property of the employeer (in this case, AOL/Time Warner)
Re:One doesn't have to wonder... (Score:5, Interesting)
This was discussed to death in the previous WASTE discussion. Justin, as an employee of AOL, tried to put WASTE under the GPL. AOL then came forward and said that Justin had no authority to do so.
However, just because an employee makes a deal outside of their authority doesn't automatically reverse the deal. The test is whether the other party to the deal in good faith believed that the employee had the authority, or should have known that something was amiss. That's a tough question and would likely take a judge to answer completely...
Re:One doesn't have to wonder... (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Assignment of copyright and the GPL (Score:3, Insightful)
Bullshit. The fact that someone works for a company does not ipso facto give them the right to negotiate contracts. For instance, if Justin had publicly said "Hey, AOL's monthly charges are now all $0.00! Have fun, everybody!" he would be instantly fired and his statements would be unenforceable, as he does not have the right to make such decisions. Likewise,
Re:Assignment of copyright and the GPL (Score:4, Interesting)
The janitor couldn't release this software. Well, he could, but it's unlikely that a reasonable person would think that a janitor could speak for a company. Not so the CEO. Similarly, Justin is not CEO at AOL, so could not change pricing there. However, whoever replaced Steve Case could do something like that.
The car salesman probably couldn't give away fifty free cars. The owner could. Further, if there was a sales manager, he could probably give away the cars.
Re:One doesn't have to wonder... (Score:5, Insightful)
Don't know how serious this may be, but if AOL wanted to, they might be able to sue for loss of IP due to the dumpage of WASTE into the GPL realm. That's the real bitch when you write code for a company. Unless you beg & plead with the lawyers (or your managers) to give you a little freedom, they own your stuff.
And this leads right into non-compete clauses in your contract. Even thinking about the code you wrote for another company could be considered competing against your previous employer.
Re:One doesn't have to wonder... (Score:5, Insightful)
You have to remember that NullSoft is a subsidary of AOL Time Warner. Which probably means that Justin is under contract from Nullsoft and not AOL.
He probably has pretty much all the control over what he can do with what Nullsoft creates. The problem is probably in the contract that binds Nullsoft to AOL. I think that indirectly, Justin's code is owned by AOL, but since Nullsoft is an entity of its own, it can do many things on its own: creating software, releasing code, being a pain for AOL, etc... BUT only to some extent, because Nullsoft is a subsidary of (or controlled by) AOL.
So it's probably not just a matter of a simple contract between an employer and its employees... It goes deeper than that I'm afraid.
Re:One doesn't have to wonder... (Score:3, Interesting)
Actually, though, RSAREF (which WASTE uses) is under a license that is (very) incompatable with the GPL. Nothing stopping you from distributing the source (assuming you don't mind AOL possibly coming after you), but no binaries.
And, oh, my. Just finished reading the last clasues of the RSAREF license. Looks like WASTE violates those, meaning WASTE isn't legal anyway (at least until/unless someone re-writes it w/o RSAREF).
Re:One doesn't have to wonder... (Score:3, Informative)
apparent authority [law.com]
ostensible authority [law.com]
The fact that neither of these terms have shown up in the discussion thus far indicate how little business training most slashbots have. See, sometimes, there's value to an MBA. If nothing else, we're more conversent with lawyer-ese than most programmers.
(And in case you were wondering what all this means, basically, anyone who downloaded the software might have it free and clear. AOL, via Nullsoft, via authority of Justin, may ha
Suprisingly he lasted this long (Score:5, Interesting)
I didn't really have him pegged as a corporate kinda guy from the start. I am really suprised that he could take it this long before he left. Corps are often to stifling to creativity.
Why don't they ever ask politely? (Score:5, Funny)
Other valid means are:
- just throw the whole computer out. That way we'll have covered all the bases for future potential license violations
- hmm can't think of anymore (well this list sure fizzled out fast)
``Any license that you may believe you acquired with the software is void, revoked and terminated.''
Well Schrodinger's license is definitely dead then. I never downloaded it but now I'm wondered if I got one through some quantum license-tunnelling effect.
I wonder about the order of voiding, revoking, and terminating? Was it in series or in parallel? Sounds like the license got taken out back and worked over by the three of them at once.
Slashdot won't like this but... (Score:2, Interesting)
I'm sure that the Slash crowd won't like this opinion but it's mine. Flame on.
Re:Slashdot won't like this but... (Score:5, Insightful)
Executives don't write software.
He is, at worst, a software programmer who manages a division. In the software world--especially the free software world--keeping a weblog and being honest in it have come to be hallmarks of a professional.
Re:Slashdot won't like this but... (Score:5, Insightful)
When you can afford most of the things you want, why is WASTE so important?
Your code is your kids... (Score:5, Insightful)
seriously. Money is great, I like money, it pays the rent and lets me do what i want half the year. But if all I did was "nothing" I would not be happy. Coding makes me happy. I'm sure coding a app like WASTE for Justin made him happy.
I feel there are at minimum two kind of coders out there right now. Type A joined the ranks because they want to make money. They could have easily done something else. Most were drawn into the big bright light of the Internet boom. They want to code from 9 to 5pm, and then be done. They expect to move into mangement at some point, and consider coding a menial task that can be pushed down the ranks.
Type X started coding because someting intially didn't do what they wanted it to do. This led to coding addiction, consuming massive amounts of dry reading material, working crazy hours, but always coming back to the keyboard like the crack head to his pipe. The irony is, in present economy, Type X makes the money, and the Type A is trying to learn another skill, move to project management, go back to school and get a degress in business...etc..etc.
It's his baby. You'll understand if you ever code a baby of your own.
Having said all this, I think I would have fought it out until they fired me. but not knowing his legal/contractual situation resigning may be his best bet.
-malakai
Re:Your code is your kids... (Score:3, Insightful)
I prefix my statment with: "I feel there are at a minimum two kind of coders out there right now".
And then choose variable A and variable X, leaving a lot of variables in between.
I simply feel it's an upside down bell curve. I'm not a statistician, I could be wrong, but this is my instinct from my experiences.
Yes i've met succesfull, happy coders t
Re:Slashdot won't like this but... (Score:4, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Slashdot won't like this but... (Score:5, Insightful)
You know what, im sick of this 'unprofessional' trash. "Professional" is inhuman. Usually, any act of honesty is described as 'unprofessional' Im tired of my personal relations being filtered through the Blanket-of-Commerce that requires people to be a cog or a tool.
I could care less that a person was 'unprofessional' -- because a person's character is not defined by how well he conforms to his employers view of how best to achieve profit.
Justin has grown tired of being a wage-slave -- so have I.. I just dont have the resources to buy life back from my Corporate Masters just yet...
'99 (Score:5, Insightful)
The dream is still alive people. Demand your fair dues.
__
Cheap web hosting [cheap-web-...ing.com.au] Dragon Action Figures [mibglobal.com.au]
justin's blog ... probably gonna be slashdotted (Score:3, Informative)
For me, coding is a form of self-expression.
It's probably the form I'm most effective at.
Everything I code is arguably owned by the company.
The company controls what I do with my code [in the past, it seemed I had
freedom, but it turns out all of that was not really the case--rather, I
was somehow avoiding the control illicitly (for 4 years)]
The company controls the most effective means of self-expression I have.
This is unacceptable to me as an individual, therefore I must leav.
I don't know when it will be, but I'm not going to last much longer.
I have nothing but respect for the company--I've just come to realize that
it is time to do something different.
May 31 2003 @ 3:00pm or so
Moving my
the (lame) network rebuild, so it's hosed.
The last few days have been, erm, interesting, it will be, erm, interesting
to see how they end up panning out. But I'm feeling pretty good, though like
usual feeling misunderstood. I'll try to clear it up next week.
At Ian's suggestion been listening to Slint a bit. Good shit. So funny that
one of the guys from Slint is now in Zwan, and Zwan sucks so hard. Well, they
rule as musicians, but their songs suck. I don't want to listen to
christian rock.
Winamp 2.92 will have CD ripping support, with support for OGG. OGG VBR at
0.0 sounds pretty decent, listenable, at like 60kbps. I'm pretty impressed
with it.
Yesterday driving home I listened to Lamb - Zero a couple times. Such a good
song. So simple. Mmmm.
Re:"everything i code is owned by the company" (Score:4, Informative)
If I have a spark of creativity one Saturday afternoon whilst drinking a beer on my deck, and it's such a good idea that I think I can quit my job and start a company based on the idea, I will have to get my employer's permission to use that idea, or else cut them in on the profits, because the idea, legally, belongs to them.
I'm pretty sure that applies to our friend Justin as well. Welcome to the world of Corporate Domination of our Very Existence.
Yes, it was WASTE (Score:3, Interesting)
I completely support him here...he sees code as a form of expression, and being censored is one of the worst things you can get paid to do.
Besides, I guess we have an answer to the question of whether Nullsoft is a legal entity free from the tentacles of AOL or not
I cannot beleive that he is too upset... (Score:2)
He hasn't resigned... (Score:5, Informative)
About time... (Score:5, Insightful)
-Eyston
Question about article (Score:5, Interesting)
I wonder if the GPL license is valid at this point for WASTE? Or did Justin not have the rights to release it under GPL?
Re:Question about article (Score:3, Insightful)
Looks like WASTE is.. (Score:5, Informative)
Strange they haven't pulled it off the web.
Disclaimer:
This post is of course provided as "AS IS". And I do NOT encourage any copyright enfringement.
Most Winamp coders left already (Score:5, Interesting)
He wrote his own player instead, which is, eh, quite different from Winamp, Foobar2000 [hydrogenaudio.org].
Anyway, Frankel has little to complain about. Nullsoft was bought out for almost 86M$. For that much money, he'll never have to code, err, express himself ever again.
Re:Most Winamp coders left already (Score:3, Insightful)
The compelling desire to express yourself doesn't always end when you make money.
The Nullsoft folks sound like they made money because they had the drive to express themselves in a heartfelt way - resulting in compelling, well written applications.
--Pat / zippy@cs.brandeis.edu
Non-Free? (Score:5, Insightful)
I never liked it when they proudly boasted that there were NO ADS! and it was FREE!
iTunes for windows anybody??? (Score:5, Interesting)
A good thing, i think. (Score:3)
I think this is a great thing, other than the obvious distaste you have in your mouth right now from leaving a job. Resigning always sucks, even when it sucks a lot less than not resigning.
But I belive you can do some more cool shit now without worrying about getting your work eliminated, and I think your stuff has made the world a better place. (I don't however, believe that demanding the right to distribute other people's property is a good thing, music swappers.) gnutella is a good thing though, and waste was (is?) too.
keep using that noggin you got and keep writing more cool software. you'll be happy again (or happier) in no time.
About time! (Score:3, Interesting)
Yeah, but... (Score:5, Informative)
'bout damn time. Hopefully his leaving won't change Nullsoft's plans to provide real OGG support. I still can't get it to pick up very low bitrate HTTP Vorbis streams via a straight .m3u ala XMMS.
Re:Yeah, but... (Score:5, Informative)
No, WinAmp 2.92 is newer than the current Winamp 3 release. Winamp 3 was more of an experiment that pretty much failed and they are scrapping it for the most part. They are taking some of the Winamp 3 features and adding them to 2. This new version is tentatively going to be called Winamp 5 (2 + 3), and to be released end of summer 2003. This is what I read on the message boards a while ago, their plans may have changed.
I'm kinda pissed that Winamp 3 for Linux pretty much disappeared. The alpha version, though really buggy, sounded much better than XMMS. Hopefully they will release a Linux player some time in the future, but I don't see it happening.
/. Mishap again (Score:5, Informative)
Yes, it is probably inevitable, but this writeup is wrong as so many others have because some
Not much of a surprise... (Score:5, Interesting)
P2P time, baby (Score:3, Funny)
Why did this take so long? (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Why did this take so long? (Score:5, Insightful)
Last thing we need, another unemployed programmer on the market. Quit in this economy?! The fool.
Re:Why did this take so long? This is why! (Score:3, Insightful)
You are clearly not familiar with most buyouts. The buyout is contingent on an identified number of key people remaining with the company, usually for set periods of time. Buyouts can be reduced, or cancelled entirely, if enough key people refuse to sign-on to the new company. (Btw, being a key person in a buyout is a great place to be.)
Furthermore, top people are often contracted to remain for a set number of years. These are usually the people who are getting the bulk of
Justin Frankel (Score:3, Informative)
I give it up to Justin for being a good guy, and giving a lot of cool little utilities to the programming community.
Selective (Score:5, Insightful)
I find it really strange that AOL should pull things like Gnutella and WASTE, considering that Nullsoft's primary product, WinAmp, is perhaps the most frequently used by Joe Internet for playing often illegal MP3s. Admittedly, people can use it for legal music too - but go on, most people don't give a fuck.
Likewise, Gnutella/WASTE could be used for good or evil (in the political sense). What makes them so different from WinAmp? Why is file sharing worse than playing music? Given that they already provide the criminal community (so to speak, I mean - call me a crim) an excellent tool for playing their often illegaly acquired music, as well as to the RIAA-friendly users out there - what makes file sharing so goddamn different?
It amazes me (Score:5, Insightful)
Frankel sold out to AOL. He made a LOT of money doing it, but he should (and maybe did) understand the price of that money is freedom. AOL controls Winamp, and as long as he's an employee they control much of his actions and ability to publish.
Were I him I would have not published anything new until the contract requirements to stay with the company were over, then I'd leave and start a new company with all the money. I'm sure his share of 86 million, after taxes could start a new company to do new things.
If you value your life based on what you have done, then investors and selling out is often a bad idea. You are selling control over the products you have created. If on the other hand you value your life based on what your able to do going forward, take the 86 million, walk away from one software product and do something new. Sure, it's a PITA, but 86 million funds a lot of new things. If nothing else you could probably manage a half million a year from investment (even in this market) and live off that while writing new software and paying a buddy or two to write with you. There's bound to be a new idea in there somewhere that will start another company that sells for twice as much, which gives you more allowance, and so on.
It's all personal values.
Justin, if you're reading this... (Score:5, Insightful)
NYTimes gets it wrong...again... (Score:3, Insightful)
Nullsoft's latest creation was a file-sharing program that allowed users to set up secure networks of no more than 50 people.
WASTE was pretty obviously not a filesharing program. It was a small group collaboration program, that allowed encrypted chat and transfers. Its use as a file-sharing mechanism in the way that your average NYTimes reader would interpret that term is extremely limited to non existent. It's a "file sharing program" in the same way that AOL Instant Messenger is. Does the NYT refer to AIM that way?
Then again, maybe I'm the silly one for expecting accuracy, nay, competence, in reporting in the major media outlets.
losing millions? (Score:5, Informative)
The pruchase was in stock currency, so its value declined with AOL Time Warner stock price. Could have been worse considering other dot.coms.
Re:Hmm... (Score:4, Funny)
unfortunately, they use fake information when writing stories.
Re:Hmm... (Score:3, Funny)
Username: Jayson Blair
Password: IMakeItUpAsIGoAlong
Re:Ah well. (Score:3, Interesting)