thanks for being cool...sorry i was a dick...

really i do know better but sometimes I just dont

posting this here too...

yes...you all were right and I was wrong...

see, this is my fault for being so angry about the 'multiverse' theory...it's a ridiculous tautology (which we can argue about another time)

but yeah...it get what you guys were trying to say about expansion of space vs light age...

yeah...sorry

yes...you all were right and I was wrong...

see, this is my fault for being so angry about the 'multiverse' theory...it's a ridiculous tautology...

but yeah...it get what you guys were trying to say about expansion of space vs light age...

yeah...sorry

there is a long list of galaxies and quasars that are further away than that (going out to a z=8 at least

what is your point?

you're saying that those galaxies/quasars were formed before the CMB?

you know enough to be dangerous...that's all...have fun with your redshift calculator...there's no productive discussion to be had here

but still didnt engage in the actual discussion...regarding your links...***i already knew that***...or the basics of that...your second link...yes...it's "just a theory" that is unproven...based on several assumptions...but fine

**GIVEN ALL THAT**

you still haven't counted my point, which was that however we age the universe, it is based on certain criteria...therefore, my point still stands...this whole thread is pointless bullshit posturing

it's pointless to argue about the age of the universe...better to talk about the current theories than just fire off bon mots that contribute nothing to the conversation

it's not that you don't *want* to explain, or that you think i wont' understand...no...

you can't explain it

you actually don't understand it yourself and are BS'ing

i did make a coherent point, referencing the two main things we have that give us the age of the universe now

> Cosmic Microwave Background

> Gamma Ray Bursts

There are others, but any new distant event is usually first compared to the two things listed above

you could have explained it more simply

your response is crap...you're being a condescention troll...telling me i need to read up on 'X, Y, or Z thing'

if my response was so dumb, you'd be able to correct things with a paragraph, maybe a bit more

if it's too complex to correct, then it's not something everyone with a college degree (or w/e condescending thing you made it out to be) would know

so explain in detail or STFU

your analogy, which i read elsewhere on this thread, is incorrect

**we don't know** the nature of 'space' and the 'universe' like you're making out

'space' is not like a rubberband and 'light' is not analogous to an ant crawling on said rubber band...it's just a bad analogy that doesn't prove anything either way

just confuses things

you talk as if the problem in TFA is a funding issue...

there needs to be more public funding of research for sure, and bigger budgets for state universities...yes all true

however, you're giving these professors in TFA a free pass and blameshifting

TFA is about **THE TOP PUBLISHERS** not just the highest PhD in each department...

to call this a funding issue is to miss the root cause: the professors themselves

it's out of control in academia...really it is become awful...narcissistic tenured prof's staying on 20 years past when they should have retired to make room for new younger talent

Because the expansion of space is independent of the light traveling through it

nonsense statement...had to read twice to be sure, but this is just technobabble and not based on scientific definitions of "space" and "light"

and the light that has just arrived came to us in some cased from objects that are now much further away than 14B lightyears

if I understand you correctly, you're wrong...the whole point of GP, one which I think you're attempting to address, is that the only reason we know the universe's shape is because of "light"...wether the CMB or a GRB...

the CMB & the light from the most distant/oldest objects indicates the 14Billion number...if what you say is true, we'd have to revise the figure

in other words, **NO** there is not 'light' hitting us from 14B ly+ because if that were true we'd have evidence of an older universe, so we'd revise our figure of the age of the universe accordingly

i was going to post something similar (i usually use blockquote) but you pretty much hit it

i lol'ed when i saw "quantify outcomes"...

seriously..."quantify outcomes"...might as well say "keep toilet paper stocked"...the whole fskign world runs on quantified outcomes...i'm dismayed not because a M$ CEO is throwing out doublespeak BS...no, that is expected of course...it's what he chose to say that indicates his vision for M$ will be more of the same only more efficient internally

heh...

so above there are a few people arguing over whether parent is a 'plant' comment...

either way...it made me laugh

if MarsOne was in any way legit, nations and orgs would be lining up to get these payloads...Russia, China, ESA, NASA, MIT, UCLA, India, not to mention private companies including mining companies

i'd put a rover up to test preselected areas...

-OR-

have a rover -AND- a craft that detaches in orbit or before that goes an explores a pre-select asteroid

i saw someone suggest "Lego Mindstorms" above...that's where this is at...really...it'll be like a Raspberry Pi thing they select

it's different and you know it

anyone still reading...jeez...BTC isn't "money" like a currency is "money"

No fan of the Republicans here, but enforcement is the Executive Branch's bailiwick. :/

yeah...I addressed your point, directly...from the post you responded to:

> enforcement: GOP excuse: "can't...no money to do it...we got us a budget crisis b/c of government spending"

the GOP controls the budget...exec branch included...this is the end of the discussion