Mainstream Media To Start "Crowdsourcing" 158
guanxi writes "Gannett, one of the largest newspaper publishers in the U.S., plans to change its newsrooms to utilize Crowdsourcing, a new term for something Slashdot readers have been familiar with for years: \From the article, they will 'use crowdsourcing methods to put readers to work as watchdogs, whistle-blowers and researchers in large, investigative features.' Last summer, the The News-Press in Fort Myers, Florida asked readers to help investigate a local scandal. The response was overwhelming: 'Readers spontaneously organized their own investigations: Retired engineers analyzed blueprints, accountants pored over balance sheets, and an inside whistle-blower leaked documents showing evidence of bid-rigging.' Public service isn't their only concern, of course: 'We've learned that no one wants to read a 400-column-inch investigative feature online. But when you make them a part of the process they get incredibly engaged.' Is this the beginning of a revolution at major media organizations? Can they successfully duplicate what online communities have been doing for years?"
Yes. (Score:2)
Next article please.
The worst features of MSM and the worst... (Score:2)
Oh boy (Score:3, Funny)
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So (Score:2)
Re:So (Score:4, Insightful)
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Cutting journalist costs sounds like the logical next step to me...
I guess it's the newspaper variant of reality shows. Have regular people star in your TV shows for minimal payment (often just the winner get anything to speak of) in comparison to the income from very frequent advertising. The next step from having celebrities star in various TV entertainment -- just let regular people do who're often more than pl
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Bah. The Salem Times did this YEARS ago. (Score:3, Interesting)
Um... or are we still using editors before we go public with this stuff? And, does that mean that we're still talking about having to check sources, understand the legal ramifications of publishing stuff, and all of that old stodgy professional behavior? So, really, this is just about making things sensational enough to get a lot of people to volunteer to do the basic research that staffers used to do?
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How can exercise of First Amendment rights (in the form of amateur journalism) be equated with amateur police?
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The analogy actually isn't too far off the mark. One of the points of having a free press is to 'police' the government -- making sure that people know about the goings on in government. Without the press, we wouldn't have known about things about Mark Foley hitting on his male interns via IM and we wouldn't know about the scandals involving many others in power, such as Tom Delay.
Knowledge of thes
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Really? Yet, nothing about that is mentioned in the defense of the "free press". Thus, press/speech that criticizes the government is treated no better and no worse than free speech that praises the government. No difference. I actually have seen many people demand censorship of news organizations that they perceive to be pro-government, on the idea that such speech s
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Yes there is. See the part about free speech. There's no clause anywhere in there that requires that free speech must past some muster of what someone's objective view of "truth" is.
"This will only succeed in flushing what little integrity there is left in the process."
Hard to do a worse job of that than Dan Rather. And he was one of those with journalistic experience and training: prob
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Of course there is. There are laws specifically prohibiting certain kinds of speech. Free speech does not entitle you to say anything you like.
"...probably one of those few that you think should be able to exercise the privilege of First Amendment rights.
Don't know where you get that idea nor where you get the idea that I co
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The knee-jerk use of the term "lie" for something someone disagrees with is a perfect example of why there should not be some standard enforced based on someone's subjective view of what is a lie or not.
"When there is no accountability all you will get is uncontrollable vigilantism, "
"No accountability" meaning no censor to control and enforce? Look up the definition of vigilantism: it involves law enforcement and viol
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It was no knee-jerk response. You put words in my mouth:
"...probably one of those few that you think should be able to exercise the privilege of First Amendment rights."
I never characterized first amendment rights as privileges. You made up that lie in order to cast me as a fool. It wasn't simply that you disagreed with me, you had to lie about me in order to argue with me.
"...why there should not be some standard enforced based on someone's subjective view of what
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I went back up through the parent postings. I did not misquote you (no words in your mouth, keyboard, or whatever).
"No accountability" meaning people don't get penalized for knowingly making false or insufficiently researched statements"
Which means realization of freedom of the press because someone is not held "accountable" to the opinions of the censor for disagreeing with the censor.
"Vigilantism is the taking of law into one's own hands
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You didn't quote me at all. You attributed first amendment rights as "privilege" to me. I quoted it already; no need to do so again.
"Which means realization of freedom of the press because someone is not held "accountable" to the opinions of the censor for disagreeing with the censor. "
I have no idea what you are trying to say. I understand what freedom of the press is.
"Your second sentence contradicts the first. If someone takes the
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There's quite often a difference between whether or not someone did something and whether or not they have been charge or convicted.
"The first amendment does not grant anyone the right to state, as fact, that Mark Foley is a pedophile. Doing so would be libel/slander"
I checked the definition of "pedophile". It involved love for "children". In some definitions, but not most, high-school agers count into the group that is "children
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My disclaimer was appropriate considered I didn't have any personal knowledge of the matter.
"I checked the definition of "pedophile". It involved love for "children".
Pedophilia is the sexual attraction to prepubescent/peripubescent children. It does not include young adults after puberty but younger than the age of the majority (which high school seniors would be with rare e
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There's no connection between speech and vigilantism.
"I like to watch "Barney" and "The Wiggles"
Isn't that a little off-topic?
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I can lead you to water but I can't make you drink. There is no connection between speech and vigilantism, but there is a connection between the deterrent of illegal speech and the deterrent of vigilantism. That is what the laws are for!
If I had a free shot at someone that I hated and I knew that a lie couldn't get back to me (and I were a sleazeball) I'd be tempted to take it. Of course, that isn't vigilantism, but if the person were a hated group,
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You have yet to make a connection between saying something and "taking the law into your own hands". You are leading me to a dry well. There is certainly no connection between deterring free speech and "and the deterrent of vigilantism".
"If I had a free shot at someone that I hated and I knew that a lie couldn't get back to me..."
If that shot involved a gun and bullets, you might be able to argue vigilantism. If is just words, you can't.
"Of cou
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Bullshit, krell. Since you refuse to acknowledge the meaning of "vigilante" there is no point in arguing how speech might relate to it. Furthermore, your insistence on referring to slander as "free speech" is tiring. There is no constitutionally protected right to slander and there is no legal deterrent to "free speech".
"If that shot involved a gun and bullets, you might be able to argue vigilantism.
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But more to the point, it's not "vigilanism" for "amateur police" to report a crime.
Assuming you're old enough to vote, kindly don't until you get a clue.
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And all of the Gannett newspapers (and broadcast stations) already do this "crowdsourcing", although not so explicitly or as openly as the article details. Many artic
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Can you identify such markets? Most all that I have checked out have several newspapers, and there is thus no monopoly.
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Looking more closely at Gannett properties, I'm surprised there aren't more duopolies. I know the other big media groups are buying up competing companies in the dense markets (e.g., one newspaper and one television station). The biggest duopoly that I think Gannett has is the KUSA and KTVD, two competing television stations, both in Denver.
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I counted the newspapers in Denver and stopped counting at 6. There's 6 or so stations, and unless Gannett owns all or most of them, how can there be anything "-opoly" in this less-than-majority media share they have?
I checked out Wisconsin. Picked at random Wisconsin Rapids as the first small market to check. Yes, they do have the only locally made paper there. However, I bet if you
Proper Professional Journalism? (Score:2)
The old style media was so >good [cbsnews.com] at that, right?
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Happily, I wasn't confusing Dan Rather and his producer with being in any way professional. Um, other than being professional political operatives, in that case.
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Dan Rather, however, is a major representative of the old-school journalism, with all of its rock-solid research, that is being defended here. You know what? I have a mini-DVD that someone taped live with a camcorder during some of Dan Rather's early studio appearances in the mid-1970s that will prove it.
the idiotic "vigilantism" comparison (Score:2)
This is in line with those who have commented in this item that having more people participate in "freedom of the press" is the same as having vigilantes going around enforcing the law. They feel that First Amendment free speech/free press rights should only belong to a special authorized few, and that letting the average person exercise these rights is just like having the average citizen enforce the law on their o
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Good thing I'm not talking about the company, per se. I'm talking about the general way in which things tend to happen when (no matter how much of the "community" you ask to get involved) people with a lot of time on their hands - and frequently with an axe to grind - become central to the research behind repo
Haven't they read anything on the 'web? (Score:2)
And every fool with an agenda (space aliens, government cover-ups, etc) will be spewing their own brand of "information".
It isn't that the mass of humanity is better equipped to provide this information. It is that the news organizations are now no better trained in journalism or research than your average TV watcher.
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There was never a time that Sturgeon's Law did not apply.
"It is that the news organizations are now no better trained in journalism or research than your average TV watcher."
Yeah. It's not like a trained experienced proper journalist would knowingly air and stand behind a story based on faked documents on a major network news show!
"And every fool with an agenda (space aliens, govern
Thanks for making my point. (Score:2)
I never said that they were perfect. But for every story like that you can find, I can link to 1,000 nut cases on the 'web.
Again, that's for making my point. Freedom of the Press means that the government cannot stop you from printing your fantasies about space aliens. But Democracy requires an informed public. And
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But those who believe in the space alien stuff will consider themselves even more informed. This has nothing to do with democracy.
Thank you but I don't need more examples. (Score:3, Insightful)
And you are the perfect example of the flaw in your approach.
This has EVERYTHING to do with Democracy. It isn't whether any person or group of people considers him/themselves to be "more informed". It matters whether they ARE more informed.
Democracy depends upon the participation of informed citizens. When you take away that "informed", Democracy fails. That is why every totalita
Absolutely nothing to do with democracy. (Score:2)
Totalitarians crack down on the media because totalitarians are very vain: they don't want anyone to say anything bad about them (whether or not anyone is "informed"). In fact, it has absolutely nothing to do with whether anyone is informed or not.
Also, there is a huge degree of subjectivity over whether someone is "inform
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What is your justification for this? Many travesties have been started democratically. Can you prove democracy is an inherent good?
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This is slash dot, you're stating the obvious.
Code of the playground (Score:2)
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Why citizen, how unpatriotic. Don't you understand that criminals are really hurting the children and helping the terrorists win? It is your duty to turn in your fellow citizen to the party for re-education. You're not a terrorist, are you?
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So... (Score:2)
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If they will do it for free why pay them? If that mean the news gets worse, don't buy that paper. Newspapers these days rely on wire services like AP. However, there are some news papers like the Christian Science Monitor that do their own reporting. People that appreciate that use their services. Is anyone forcing you to read these papers or work for them for free? Whats your problem?
Crowdsourcing? (Score:2)
*snerk*
Newspapers will win (Score:2, Interesting)
One more way to cut costs. (Score:2)
And to think, they want to SELL subscriptions to Crowdsourcing publications? Yeah, right...
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Heres an cool example (Score:2)
http://www.getoutthewhy.com/weblog/
The will pay you $300 to ask a house representative why we vote on Tuesday, and $500 for a senate member or a governor. To get the reward, you must post a video of the transaction on youtube. Its a pretty cool idea.
People Powered Military Journalism (Score:3, Interesting)
Tomorrow, the day before the US Congressional election, all the Military Times individual papers will publish a rare joint editorial calling for the immediate resignation of Donald Rumsfeld [sfgate.com], the US Defense Secretary. I don't know that those military papers have ever called for a Defense Sect'y to resign before, and surely not the day before an election. That editorial is aligned with its military readers, rather than its Pentagon and military contractor "suppliers" who both support Rumsfeld, and often report to him.
It looks like Gannett is choosing to plug in directly to its consumers to survive the ongoing shakeout of plummeting newspaper circulation [latimes.com]. The real question about the "revolution" at major newspapers is not whether these Gannett moves are the beginning, but rather whether they're an exit strategy, and whether to victory.
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Actually, they have [cnn.com]. More to the point, they have called for Rumsfeld to resign before (at the height of Abu Gharab). The military times denies the timing of this had anything to do with the election, however, given that they have already asked from Rumsfelds resignation - I find that argument rather weak.
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The point that they deny the timing has to do with the election, when their editor said "it was inspired after Bush's stated earlier this week [cnn.com] that he wants Rumsfeld and Vice President Dick Cheney in their posts through the end of his term."?
When they already called for his resignation outside "election season" (whenever that is, now that Republicans do nothing but campaign t
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Both parties abuse the power of incumbency to campaign; neither is worse than the other. That's why I lean more and more toward the idea of a term limit of one single term.
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But I agree that incumbents have the unfair privilege of campaigning through their term at taxpayer expense, on taxpayer time. Controlling the nuanced difference between campaigning and legitimate constituent communications is much too complex to work by rules. It's supposed to be overbalanced by campaign challengers, who are supposed to expose the endless campaigning of the in
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Liability laws and other situations encourage any but the smallest businesses and organizations to organize into a corporation. You'd be surprised at how much of the media is run by a corporation: including "Democracy Now".
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In fact, you're talking to a corporation right now, one that I control which owns my Internet connection and other related assets. Again, I don't like it, but I'm not a martyr. OTOH, I don't use my corporations to do bad things with their limited liability. My choice - all too unpopular.
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Frivolous lawyers get 2 strikes, go on automatic probation, and go under review (a trial). Three strikes and they have to argue in court to defend themselves from disbarment and fines. Lame lawyers claiming "frivolous" to just deny representation should have a similar sy
Wired already did this - laid off all reporters (Score:2)
There was the famous layoff at Wired News [com.com], where they laid off all the reporters and kept some of the editors.
Of course, what happened is that press releases took over. Wired Magazine is now a version of the Sharper Image catalog. Who needs reporters? Content is what fills in the space between the ads. And if you just use press releases for that, nobody notices.
Not a Good Thing (tm) (Score:2, Insightful)
Are you serious? (Score:3, Insightful)
Are you really serious? I've seen those on the left whine about right-wing conspiracies modding them down on Slashdot...and I've seen those on the right whine about left-wing conspiracies modding them down on Slashdot. I've also observed much of the modding behavior applied to overtly political comments: it goes equally both ways. Only a "nutjob" could see such bias in Slashdot. I did not brand you as one: your own conspirac
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I was finding myself agreeing until I came to the quote above. Now you have shown yourself to be just another American-hating bigot.
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Revolution? (Score:2)
It's one thing to contribute to a project with an free license that everyone can benefit from. This kind of cooperation might one day save the world.
I don't see any harm in being in a corpoation run community such as Slashdot and making some off the cuff remarks. It's a kind of social exch
Why in *my* day... (Score:2)
These days though, all the "reporters" are just going after stories that are fed to them by government or corporate press releases, and are totally uninterested in what we used to call "sticking it to the man". So maybe, this is a *good* thing.
An early example perhaps (Score:2)
I crowdsourced once.... (Score:3, Funny)
That was YOU??!?!?! (Score:2)
Oh. that was YOU??? I found the shoe and the wallet. I opened it and found your name and phone number alright, but I looked at the single shoe and considered that its likely came from a peg-legged man, like a pirate. And I was going to be damned if I was going to make the acquaintance of a pirate just to give the wallet back.
I quite enjoyed the remaining Seinfeld DVD boxed sets I bought with the cash.
I think they have already had these for years (Score:2)
you found me (Score:2)
You found me. I'm sorry, I've not been in the office. I went on lunch break at 11:30 on May 18th 2002 and have not returned yet. That explains while your phone call has not been answered.
I am quite happy to help you with your problem, however. Most problems with our DVD burners happen when you place DVDs inside them and/or connect them to an electrical source. In fact, both activites violate the warranty.
You did not know this? It was print
Too late. (Score:2)
CNN has been doing this for a while now... (Score:2)
Why do I have a strange feeling that Faux News won't be doing this...
Distributed (Score:2)
Every now and then, I log into Project Gutenberg Distributed Proofreading [pgdp.net]. There, I proofread a couple of scanned pages and then leave it at that for a few weeks. It's not much but that's OK; it's the power of numbers that kicks in.
What are you people thinking? (Score:2)
I've been a member of a church at several times that was transitio
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your fee (Score:2)
People have been tryng to
Compare to indie vs. RIAA threads (Score:2)
That the aggregator-the record label-provides the structure and distribution channels and pays for the full time employees is fair enough for them to get the record sales revenue, doncha think?
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Why not? The vast majority of them are law-abiding, and are here only to do productive work. If you are really SO concerned about crime, why not demand to deport native-born Americans? Most of the crime is committed
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I mean breaking REAL laws. Not ones that amount to jaywalking in their harmlessness.
"Then many of them drive with NO license and NO insurance. They run businesses using their newly arrived relatives and pay NO Taxes and have NO health or disability insurance"
No duh. They'd get busted if they tried to enroll into such programs where they have to pay these fees. It should not be a crime to want
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Actually, it is more likely that if "the average Joe" had been presented with the fake Bush AWOL story they dealt with, they probably would have done enough fact-checking to see that the evidence was forged. And only the worst idiot would actually have done with Dan Rather did: insist tha
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Thanks for generalizing an entire medium. It's much more mentally taxing to look at it as a case by case basis, having to seperate the excellent 1% from the mediocre and the bad 99%.
The evening news, as shown on TV, is mostly not news either. Either there are trivial local stories about Aunt Betty's cat stuck in a tree with a nice fireman coming to rescue it, or "stories" originating from a press conference in the whitehouse or some corporate press conference wh
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Bah! I think it is a great idea! And after we "crowdsource" journalism... I think we should move on to "crowdsourcing" NASA, the FAA, maybe even law enforcement! What about the FDA and CDC? I am sure there are lots of amatuers out there who would love to have a say in important food quality and disease information...
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The Bill of Rights actually contains "crowdsourcing" (freedom of the press and free speech for the people) already. That's not the case for the government agencies you name. You also seem to be confusing freedom to provide information with freedom to enforce the law. As such, there already are amateurs who have a say in "important food quality and
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o<----your head
/\
T
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lowering of research and writing standards, dealing with too much or just plain unbalanced information, corporate red-herrings, conflicts of interest, fanboyism, private agendas...
Well, granted, it might seem like it would be hard for bloggers and independent parties to mimic all the flaws of mainstream media you just listed, especially since all those problems have been dramatically worsening in recent years... but I have faith that the crowdsourcing contributors will be able to mangle their contributio
Is blogging bad enough to call "news"? (Score:2)
Yes, the news corporations have managed all of this with their wonderful writers, editors, and other staff. It will be a difficult job for the bloggers to stoop down to these standards, but I'm sure they'll strive for it. So one day blogging might become so [slate.com] bad [washingtonpost.com] that it can count as (old style)
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Of course this asshattery has immediately caught on
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Regarding the use of the the standard English word "rechristened," you wrote:
It's remarkable how much Christian mythology is used in common language. Stop and think before you keep promoting Faith over Reason.
Right. We should always keep in mind the etymology of every word we use, avoiding any with ascientific roots. In the future, please refrain from using the words "goodbye," "soulful," "Wednesday," "Thursday," well all the days of the week really, maybe the months too, and heck, let's throw in "brea