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iPod Killers For the Holidays 344

An anonymous reader writes, "MP3 Newswire has an excellent rundown of 29 new digital portables for the upcoming season. From the article: 'We have run the iPod Killers for Christmas/Summer series since 2004. In that time we [have] reported on 149 portable players and NOT one iPod killer from the bunch. That said, [this time] we may actually have a couple of genuine challengers to Apple. This holiday season will see Microsoft pump tens-of-millions of dollars to hawk their new Zune portable, and SanDisk's 8GB e280 flash unit is compelling high-end users. Both can realistically grab double-digit market share from the iPod... Whether they do or not waits to be seen.' The article also makes a good case as to why the Sony PSP should be included in market figures for digital media portables."
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iPod Killers For the Holidays

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  • Let's make a rule (Score:2, Insightful)

    by mrandre ( 530920 ) <[moc.yawym] [ta] [erdna]> on Saturday October 14, 2006 @10:54PM (#16440889)
    Nobody gets to call something an iPod killer until it, you know, kills some iPods.
  • by CastrTroy ( 595695 ) on Saturday October 14, 2006 @10:55PM (#16440895)
    I don't think anything that i've seen really has the power to kill the iPod, or even in any way harm the iPod. Sure SanDisk has an 8 GB model. But I just checked the Apple site, and they have an 8GB model for the same price as sandisk. The Zune does look kind of interesting. It has a nice price point for the features, but I don't really see it being an iPod killer. Where do you buy videos to play on it? Nobody knows, but everybody knows you can buy videos for the iPod from iTunes. Same goes for songs. Although it's nice to see a couple of real competitors, I don't think either of these will take top spot.
  • Trends (Score:1, Insightful)

    by Dopefish128 ( 516350 ) on Saturday October 14, 2006 @11:03PM (#16440933)
    Seems like what makes a DAP qualify as an iPod killer is being small and overpriced. The addition of video playing is nice but not new. I do like the fact that Vorbis playback is becoming more standard.

    That said, I would not willingly own any of these, and my next DAP will probably be a Cowon iAudio X5.
  • by kinglink ( 195330 ) on Saturday October 14, 2006 @11:10PM (#16440971)
    The PSP is a digital media platform for the simple reason it was basically built for it. It has a bigger screen then most devices, and it has games on it as a bonus. I purchased one and have used it quite a bit in the 2 monthes I've had it. Probably 90 percent of the usage is with anime eps that I convert myself, or Mp3s.

    The biggest problem with the article is thr's little data on price ranges for some objects. If the Ipod killer is stylish but costs 1000 dollars, what's the use? On the other hand, if it's 100 bucks and looks like crap (those football helmets for most people) who cares what size the ram is?

    The Ipod is stylish, "inexpensive" but with a good sized ram. Now however they have made them more expensive then they should be but still easy to use. Competitors go for so many markets but they fail to miss the reason why the ipod is the killer is because it's a status symbol as well as a mp3 player, and it's easy to use (supposidly)
  • by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 14, 2006 @11:28PM (#16441083)
    "That make 146000 unsuccessful human hunts in a row. But I have a good feeling about tomorrow."
  • by mitchell_pgh ( 536538 ) on Saturday October 14, 2006 @11:31PM (#16441097)
    I own both a PSP and iPod.

    Unless Sony comes out with something similar to iTunes... the PSP is little more than a novelty music player. It's much larger than the iPod, more expensive (when you add a good sized memory card) doesn't hold as much music, doesn't have a music store, doesn't have the market share [must I go on?].

    I could buy a nice 2GB iPod mini for $149... or hundreds more for a PSP with similar storage.

    In my case, I purchased both... because they both have their areas where they excel. The iPod for portable music, the PSP for portable gaming.
  • Really? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Comatose51 ( 687974 ) on Saturday October 14, 2006 @11:33PM (#16441107) Homepage
    Are these going to be iPod killers or more along the lines of those henchmen sent to kill James Bond? The iPod's still going strong after years of predictions and they're still making Bond movies. On a more serious note, why is everyone so obsessed with making an iPod killer? How about just making a damn good MP3/music player? When companies become so obsessed with killing the iPod, they will inevitably try to imitate it and box in their own thinking. Maybe the iPod isn't the thing to focus on at all.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 14, 2006 @11:37PM (#16441127)
    While it might be a moderately enjoyable gaming platform to some, PSP is by no means a portable mp3 device in the traditional sense and should not be included in the same category. For one, it's crippled from the outset with a sub-standard storage media - UMD. It has a terrible battery life, does not offer the same kids of options you would get from Archos, Cowon, or even iPod.

    The writer (Richard Menta) has a well-known bias for PSP. For example: [mp3newswire.net]
    It's interesting how the best portable media player on the market today is never mentioned as an iPod Killer. That honor goes to the Sony PSP, which offers a good MP3 player and a superior video/movie player that trumps the iPod in picture quality.

    PSP is the most user-hostile portable device out there, complete with awful, proprietary technologies usually found in Sony products. That's the reason why DS/Lite is eating Sony's lunch. The market even rejected PSP on its own turf.

    Plugging PSP into the iPod competitor column is disingenuous. My cellphone can play MP3s too, I don't see it on there.
  • by Jeff DeMaagd ( 2015 ) on Saturday October 14, 2006 @11:40PM (#16441139) Homepage Journal
    I think Palm made the mistake of standing still technologically. I really don't think Apple is going to make that mistake. Palm was somewhat stagnant, being pretty slow to offer high-res screens, color, audio and things like that. I really don't think their Palm Desktop software was as nice as it could have been, and maybe what really hurt them was poor or lacking integration with Office and Exchange.

    What has kept Apple pretty safe is the marketing, both in the media and in terms of "viral" marketing, and they've been a moving target in terms of design and cost. Apple made the iPod cool with nice, sleek aesthetics, good UI and making it generally easy for the less than computer-savvy to use, basically doing something very well, despite its unfortunate lack of certain features that competitors have built-in.

    The Zune does seem to be an interesting product, I will grant it that. My own personal skepticism to whether I will like it is that the screen is rotated on its side. I've seen several phones and music players like that, the apparent contrast ratio for each eye is different because the screen in question was not designed to be used on its side like that. I also wonder whether offering the color brown might make people think that it's so hopelessly out of touch. Personally, I think there is a spectrum of other colors to choose, I've never seen brown succeed with any piece of consumer electronics.
  • Re:High Quality (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Firehed ( 942385 ) on Saturday October 14, 2006 @11:42PM (#16441151) Homepage
    I can't really comment on the output quality of iPods seeing that I'm a non-audiophile with non-audiophile gear, but they've always supported lossless, in the forms of wav and Apple Lossless. I've never really been dissatisfied with the output quality, but then again I don't have any of my music ripped losslessly so I wouldn't even be able to rule out the source as a problem.

    But in general, portables aren't really designed to be audiophile gear. They certainly could be, but the market really isn't large enough to justify the increased cost.
  • by fermion ( 181285 ) * on Sunday October 15, 2006 @12:54AM (#16441485) Homepage Journal
    Look at many advancement in "content delivery" and we see that consumer acceptance of the machine is only half the issue. The other half is convincing "content owners" to buy into the product. These are somewhat competing goals. Consumers want a cool product and don't necessarily want to buy new content every time the format changes. Producers want to sell content and make sure consumers can't steal it.

    What Apple has done, and is continuing to do, is forcing the "content producers" to stop the chain of forced redundacy. My father replaced discs with 8 tracks with LPs. I replaced tapes with LPs with CDs. Now with music in MP3 form, will I every have to buy an old song again. No. Do I think it was easy for Apple to convince the music label to give up this cash cow. No, even though the labels had little choice because it was the only way to have sales. However, Apple has done us a great favor by insisting on a reasonable price.

    Now that the labels have done the hard work, all the other electronic manufacturers are on the band wagon, claiming superior products. The problem is that I buy music in WMP format, I am not any better off than just buying a CD. So I have a choice of buying a player whose songs might have a limited lifetime, or a player that will likely be supported for a long time. Face it, MS has already given up on play for sure, so how long will those songs be useful?

    But music isn't really the issue. Apple is moving against the movie studios, and right now video is not even a huge issue. A good quality half hour show is going to be twice as big as a good quality copy of a CD. Other than hugely popular shows, the level of sharing of movies is not as great as music. And despite the fact that the movie studios are not a present threatened, Apple is still forcing them to make deals that will force a new model of making money, even more so than the VCR, which was a huge cash cow, and now the DVD.

    And the competition is responding by making MP3 players with radios and 'wireless' sharing, even though we have been sharing "wireless" for years. Maybe if it was a HD radio I might be impressed, but style has always been secondary to content. Look around you. The 12-25 year old demographic is thinking which one of these can I get free music on. It is like the the 12-25 demographic 20 years ago, buying computers based on what had free software. One kid buys a CD, rips it to WMP, ops, can't give load it onto another play for sure player. Another kids rips the CD to ACC. No problem loading it onto many iPods, or burning it onto a CD. As the past 50 years of widely profitable Music has shown, the kids will eventually buy music. And everyone will be rich beyond belief, but the labels ignore history. Just remember how much they hated MTV, and in a large part was responsible for the lack of music on MTV, even though MTV was arguably a major player in the revitalization of music. I see the same thing with iTunes, with people buying music for the first time in years.

  • Re:Nothing new (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Toby_Tyke ( 797359 ) on Sunday October 15, 2006 @01:09AM (#16441537) Journal
    I used to think along the same lines. I was planning to buy a player that supported ogg, but I never found one that I liked, and I have since given up on the ogg format. It is simply never, ever, going to be widely adopted enough for the player manufacturers to bother supporting it. Sorry.

    The reasons are many and varied, but the main one is, quite simply, the problem it solves is not a problem many people actually have. Ogg was an attempt to create a compressed audio standard unencumbered by licensing, which could replace MP3. Which is all well and good, except I have never, since the day I first became aware of MP3, been unable to download a piece of free (as in beer) software which would encode MP3s for me. I have never been unable to do something with an MP3 because of the license the format is issued under. In short, MP3 is free enough for me.

    If you look at the two other most widely used compressed audio formats, WMA and AAC, they both have (near) monopolies pushing them. The most popular digital audio player and online music store uses AAC. The OS preinstalled on 90+ percent of computers sold in the world ships with a media player that supports playing and ripping WMAs. Who is pushing ogg?

    The market for ogg is basically limited to linux users, and most of us are using MP3 anyway. There is no reason for any company to push it, and really very little reason to use it. I know it's supposed to be highter quality, but A, I can't hear the difference, and B, why would I want a high quality compressed audio format? To play on my portable music player, which supports which formats? Oh, yeah.

    *NOTE TO PEDANTS - Yes, I am aware of the difference between the ogg container format and the vorbis codec. I just can't be bothered to type ogg vorbis every time.
  • Re:High Quality (Score:1, Insightful)

    by Bing Tsher E ( 943915 ) on Sunday October 15, 2006 @01:56AM (#16441759) Journal
    At what level of power output? You sound like you're just quoting specs.
  • by bky1701 ( 979071 ) on Sunday October 15, 2006 @02:06AM (#16441807) Homepage
    "One kid buys a CD, rips it to WMP, ops, can't give load it onto another play for sure player. Another kids rips the CD to ACC. No problem loading it onto many iPods, or burning it onto a CD. As the past 50 years of widely profitable Music has shown, the kids will eventually buy music." Or... they can take 10 min to rip it to MP3 and play it on anything they can think of with a speaker and 2-5 MB of space.
  • by michaeldot ( 751590 ) on Sunday October 15, 2006 @03:31AM (#16442051)
    True to an extent, but actually the iPod was really the first (and arguably only so far) to crack the effortless sync aspect of maintaining a large (multi-thousand), indexed and accessible song & spoken word library.

    The fact that people still don't get this is evidenced by the frequent "but I just want to drag files to it" comments here. That works for about 20-30 songs or videos, but fails when you are managing thousands of music tracks from multiple albums, audiobooks, and syndicated podcasts and videoblogs.

    As to your condescension about "average people" associating iPod with MP3 player and buying it because they don't know any better, I think you'll find most buyers of the high-end, high capacity iPods are by and large at the elite end of savvy techies. Yes, maybe the average folk are attracted by the pretty colors and dancing cartoon advertising for the mid-range models, but don't dismiss the instinctive appeal of a very well thought out design of the unit itself. Many owners I know fell in love with it as soon as they held it - the brand is not all there is.

    Just an observation.
  • by Aceticon ( 140883 ) on Sunday October 15, 2006 @07:14AM (#16442805)
    I strongly suspect that at this point, the iPod killer will not be an iPod-like device, but instead will be some device which will shift the paradigm.

    At this point, the best contestant in the horizon seems to be the mobile phone which can play MP3s. My reasoning is as follows:
    - Nowadays most people already have mobile phones.
    - The cycle of replacement on mobile phones is about 3 years. Mobile phones that can play MP3s just came out.
    - Carrying around just a mobile phone is always lighter than carrying around a mobile phone plus a dedicated MP3 player.
    - Playing MP3s isn't such a special thing anymore. The technology is widespread and the processing power inside a mobile phone is more than enough for the task.
    - Mobile phone manufacturers have an enormous amount of experience with things like saving batery power.
    - The competition on making portable MP3 players with more storage has long reached the point of diminishing returns - unless you're going on vacations, carrying around weeks worth of music is of little use. One can already see the consumers changing tack by going for smaller devices which use flash memory and have less storage capacity (for example iPod Nano). This makes it easier to build MP3 playing functionality on a mobile phone with an amount of storage which is acceptable for consumers.
    - Ever since the number of new mobile phone users started falling (because in some countries everybody and their cat has a mobile phone), mobile phone manufacturers have been trying to differenciate their products by adding cool new features to them. The ability to play MP3s is just another of those.

    My expectation is that, slowly, as people change their old phones for newer ones, more and more people will have mobile phones that play MP3s (if it takes off like cameras on phones, people will be hard pressed to find mobile phones that don't play MP3s) and leave their dedicated MP3 players at home since there's no point in carrying around 2 devices that do the same.

    Eventualy dedicated MP3 players (including iPods) will be a niche market.
  • by ejp1082 ( 934575 ) on Sunday October 15, 2006 @10:34AM (#16443659)
    The biggest barrier to an mp3 playing phone isn't a technological one, it's the mobile phone carriers. They're all chomping their bits at the idea of a music player phone - but they want to make sure you can only buy music from them, at an exorbitant price, with no way to move the tracks off the phone (forcing you to buy again if you lose or replace the phone). In short, they're greedy SOB's that can't see past the ends of their noses, so a viable mp3 phone is going to be a long time coming.
  • by brxndxn ( 461473 ) on Sunday October 15, 2006 @11:07AM (#16443773)
    I'd change that around a bit..

    1. Does not require Itunes or any other proprietary software; should show up as a drive letter in Windows XP and you can move songs that way.

    2. Menu scrolls FAST, allows for browsing other songs while current one is playing..

    3. Supports all song formats and allows for flash upgrade to support more.. ie.. Ogg Vorbis

    4. It should be at least as tough as a cell phone.

    5. Wait.. why the fvck isn't my mp3 player built in to my cell phone? How about we just do it that way. Cell phones are now mp3 and video players.
  • by Cid Highwind ( 9258 ) on Sunday October 15, 2006 @02:28PM (#16444877) Homepage
    The technical problem isn't gathering metadata on the player, there are perl programs to build an iPod track database without iTunes [gnu.org]. The problem is with the user having to select, drag, and drop 3,000 songs to fill up a 20GB player.

    It works when the player can hold your entire music collection, you can just drag&drop everything at once. It breaks down when you want to fill a 20GB player from a 32GB music collection. Building an iTunes playlist for all tracks rated 3 stars or more and syncing it to an iPod takes about 5 mouse clicks. Putting the same set of songs onto a drag&drop player requires spending hours of quality time with Windows Explorer, Finder, or "man rsync".
  • Batteries... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by evilviper ( 135110 ) on Sunday October 15, 2006 @03:18PM (#16445157) Journal
    I have precisely one criteria that has never been met by ANY DAP... NORMAL BATTERIES

    I don't want crappy, low capacity, hard to change batteries. I want to swap a few AAAs (or AA) in 10 seconds, and have my DAP working non-stop. No need to be plugged-in to a cord for hours every day. Not to mention that battery capacity is continually increasing, and CD players that had a 10 hour battery life some 10 years ago, now have about 30 hours thanks to newer rechargable batteries.

    Just add that simple feature to a couple DAPs, and you'll have something that might actually appeal to people like me who wouldn't ever consider an iPod. Meanwhile, I'm sticking with my MP3 CD player that gets 50+ hours on a pair of rechargable AAs.

    My other criteria are large (40GB+) hard drive and FLAC/Musepack/Vorbis playback, and any rockbox-supported players will handle those easily.

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