Tom's Hardware Reviews First Player for DivX Video

Idimmu Xul writes "Tom's Hardware has a review of the DP-450: the first player for DivX video in Hi-Fi format! Until now, movies in space-saving DivX (MPEG-4) format could only be viewed on a PC. The KiSS DVD player is the first standalone device for TVs and projectors." Very cool, although it will render my stacks of VCDs obsolete.

Great!

[Omkar]

This is a step forward for DivX. I don't think most normal people know much about DivX though - perhaps this will help. Did any of you know there's even a DivX dev kit for the GameCube?

DVD player info page

[mr.henry]

This page [vcdhelp.com] has a huge database of players and tells you how well they play VCD, SVCD, XSVCD, DVD-R, etc. I used it recently to make sure my new Panasonic could player SVCD's.

Re:How is this possible?

[Anonymous Coward]

Divx [fightdivx.com] and DivX [divx.com] are not the same format.

There's more

[BusterB]

It also supports ogg/vorbis files. Ogg Traffic [vorbis.com]

Re:How is this possible?

[Anonymous Coward]

DivX (the compression algorithm) is not the same as Divx (the pay-for-play DVD scheme.) The DivX discussed in this article plays files compressed with the DivX compression scheme. A standard DivX file is roughly 120-200 MB per half hour of video.

Fansubbed anime releases are done nowadays through DivX instead of sending tapes out (like the old days...)

subject

[Inf0phreak]

From what I hear, it doesn't work quite as well as one could hope. First of all, it doesn't support DivX3.11 so all those illegal DVD-rips won't play on it. Second: It doesn't support MPEG-4 Advanced Simple Profile, so if you encoded your video with Quarter Pixel Motion Estimation or Global Motion Compensation it won't play. And finally, I've heard reports that it doesn't work on MPEG-4 compliant videos encoded with XviD, so I'd say that it is pretty much a piece of crap. And don't forget that its MPEG-4 decoding chip was made by Sigma Designs. The very same company that stole code from XviD. I won't EVER buy anything made by those thieving bastards. And my last gripe: If it isn't region free, then it's worthless.

Re:DivX = MPEG-4?

[Anonymous Coward]

The DivX in question here does indeed
equal MPEG-4.. so.. DivX, the product
most people who have a little computer
know-how associate with the name, is
indeed == MPEG-4. So keep your facts
correct, please.

If you're thinking of the old divx-scheme
that was a fiasco.. well, as I said, anyone
with a little computer know-how associates
divx with the premier mpeg-4 compression format
for personal use.. not some long-forgotten
thingy that never took off.

Re:How is this possible?

[Zillatron]

Divx was created as a means of dvd rentals on the first generation of DVD players. I think circuit city came up with the format. Get the disc, watch it for a week, then it wouldnt work anymore, so you threw it away. My friend has a DVD player like 4 years ago that played Divx discs.

While true in and of itself, this is not at all the same thing as the DivX video compression codec that enterprising people are using to store their videos now.

Some folks are kind enough to help us see that distinction by refering to it at DivX ;-) You can grab the codec over at http://www.divx-digest.com/software/divxcodec.htm l if you want to take it for a test drive.

Re:This is useless.

[0111 1110]

divx is even more lossy than earlier compression schemes. The quality is like VHS, not even SVHS. Also, the resolution is limited by the original NTSC (or PAL) signal which isn't exactly 1080i. If you want quality, you'd better stick with the mpeg2 format from the original DVD (unless you're doing your own film transfer), and even then, televisions can display it as well as a computer monitor. When 1080i HD-DVDs are finally released you will have a point however.

an ancient acronym

[MondoMor]

Now if only someone could tell me why they named this thing "Kiss" ...

Keep it Simple, Stupid. A reminder to yourself that what you're building, designing, etc. should be simple and not unnecessarily complex.

It's probably as old as FUBAR.

Just think, when our grandkids are psychic-text messenging each other with "OMG STFU FAG", we'll get to explain it to them.

Re:Doh.. no xvid?

[tempmpi]

It supports all real MPEG-4 Codecs as long as they only use Advanced Simple Profile functions. As long as your XVID Video doesn't use QPel motion compensation or global motion compensation your xvid file will work. (You also can't use these features in DivX 5.0 files if you want to play them on this player.)

Re:User leeway mentioned

[jetmarc]

From their naming, they provide access to write the flash memory (maybe when a cdr flash failed due to power brown out) and to an I2C data memory (which may hold configuration or product serial number).

Re:This is useless.

[Anonymous Coward]

I care to differ.

VCD suffers from blockiness even at very high bitrates.

VHS/VCD is only at 2xx*3xx resolution and is not suited for widescreen. Also, the audio in general sucks.

mpeg4 like divx is much more intelligent and tends to soften/blur the image as opposed to generating blockiness. Which is what the eye prefers.

I watched some of these recent XViD/DiVX dvd-screener releases in a friends "multimedia room" on a 4m wide screen and a surround with subwoofer and it was _really_ enjoyable. Either you get the original 5.1 DD sound ripped from the DVD or you get a 130+kbit/s LAME VBR mp3 track. Very enjoyable indeed. :))

It's not as good as the original of course, but at one tenth of the size ...

Yes and no

[Jubii]

Circuit city created "a" divx format to go head to head with DVD. However it failed. The name DivX;) was a jab at that failed venture by a group of people that made a video compression scheme. Hence the ";)" that used to adorn the end of the name.

Re:subject

[number]

What are you talking about? DivX, XviD and ffmpeg are all creating MPEG-4 spec-compliant video streams. As far as the decoder can see, streams created by any of them were created by the same encoder.

If you don't like the work the XviD team is doing (i.e. a free, open-source implementation of the MPEG-4 video spec), don't use it.

It runs Linux!

[Taurim]

I have my DP-450 since 1 month.

First of all, this DVD/DivX player runs Linux kernel 2.4.17.
If you did not believe me, download the ISO containing the firmware upgrade on the Kiss site :

http://www.kiss-technology.com/support/DRIVERS/450 fw261.zip

Unzip it, mount the ISO, retrieve the romfs.bin file, mount it and check it's content :

drwxr-xr-x 1 root root 32 jan 1 1970 bin
drwxr-xr-x 1 root root 32 jan 1 1970 cdrom
drwxr-xr-x 1 root root 32 jan 1 1970 dev
-rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 279064 jan 1 1970 fileplayer.bin
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 7063 jan 1 1970 fipmodule.o
drwxr-xr-x 1 root root 32 jan 1 1970 img
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 308894 jan 1 1970 khwl.o
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 310850 jan 1 1970 linux.bin.gz
-rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 114392 jan 1 1970 mpegplayer.bin
drwxr-xr-x 1 root root 32 jan 1 1970 proc

zcat linux.bin.gz | strings | grep Linux
Linux version 2.4.17-uc0 ([e-mail]) (gcc version 2.95.3 20010315 (release)) #1 Wed Jan 22 15:30:35 CET 2003

This player works perfectly with any MPEG-4 file. Mencoder (part of MPlayer) with libavcodec creates files compatible with the DP-450.

The image quality when playing a DivX (on a Sony 32" 16/9 TV) is FAR superior to the quality of the same file played on a PC hooked to the TV. (I made some comparisons with my Linux PC + NVidia GF4200, S-Video + MPlayer and a friends PC running Windoz + WMP + ATI Radeon card + S-Video link)

I know there is the 3.11 issue but it's really simple to convert films to MPEG4 to make them compatible with the Kiss player.

Re:subject

[Briareos]

While I agree with you about the limited usefulness of this device when it doesn't support MP4 ASP (don't give a damn about DivX 3.11...) there's no reason why you couldn't make the drive region free; there's even a page with illustrated step-by-step instructions [rpc1.org] so probably even Joe Sixpack could do it, as long as he owns a PC...

np: Sabi - A Scene When The Train Leaves (Metamatics - Rewired In My Manor)

All this is available on the PS2 WITHOUT any mods

[specialized_sworks]

Just a quick note about the review of the standalone DIVX player... I hope
he realized when he wrote that article that there exists a DIVX player for
the Playstation2? This is a real player... no mods, no hacks to perform.
Just buy the software and play.

It takes advantage of the Sony network adapter for the PS2. I know a lot of
people got these for christmas, so there is no additional cost above the
cost of the software. The system uses a very little cpu consuming program on
the PC to stream the data to the PS2. The PS2 does the decoding in many
different formats, and is kept up to date automatically by the PC.

The best part is that you do not have to burn CD/DVD to get them to play.
You just stream them right off the PC.

Check it out... http://www.broadq.com

Re:This is useless.

[specialized_sworks]

I'll differ with you on this...
With *the same data rates* the divx encoding will provide better video. It's a more efficient compression scheme which allows *more* detail to be encoded.

The issue is that many people encode at abismal data rates so the quality is bad. The file size is 1/2 of the MPEG2 but the quality is worse. Given the same file size in MPEG2 or DIVX and the DIVX will look better.

-Dubya

Re:subject

[number]

That is a limitation of the AVI format, which people continue to stuff MPEG-4 video into for reasons unknown. It requires that you write "FourCC" identification codes, and those codes are what determines which codec is required to decompress it.

XviD will decode AVI files with the FourCC IDs XVID, DIVX or DX50, whereas DivX only decodes its own DIVX/DX50. FFvfw (a VFW port of libavcodec) will decode XVID, XVIX, DIVX, DX50, FVFW and a number of other FourCC codes which all identify video that is purely MPEG-4.

The MPEG-4 systems format (i.e. *.mp4, just as *.mpg is for MPEG-1/2) is what MPEG-4 video is supposed to reside in, and once you mux an XviD/DivX/ffmpeg MPEG-4 stream into it, the FourCC mess is left behind, and any spec-compliant MPEG-4 decoder (say, Envivio) will be able to decode it.

Re:Is GMC and QPEL that hard in hardware?

[number]

Support for full GMC is quite complex (and potentially *extremely* computationally expensive), and I'm guessing that's why support isn't included. QPel is quite simple, it's just a different interpolation filter.

DivX 5.x doesn't encode with the full range of options that GMC allows however (only uses 1 warping point), and is therefore quite simple to decode. I suppose they could have included that quite easily, but decided to pass on it since it would only be implementing "half a feature."

Re:well, this may be cool

[GMontag451]

If you have a DVD Burner, you could put the DivXs on a DVD and have a full season of 30 minute TV episodes all on one disc and still have great quality.

Re:hehehe

[Anonymous Coward]

I believe he said that because divx movies in general, can have a lot better quality for a lot less space. IIRC, VCD's use simple mpg video for encoding, which takes up a bunch more space than current divx.

Sigma Designs again

[jeroen94704]

Note that this player is powered by the Sigma Designs EM8500 chip.

Apart from the issue some people may have with SD (They were the ones who stole some Open Source code from the XVid project), this is the same chip that powers this company's XCard DVD/DivX PC-card.

I own one of these XCards and have basically given up on using it for DivX playback. It's works great for DVD, and the image quality is much better than their older Hollywood Plus, but DivX playback is just terrible.

Among other issues, the the XCard does not support DivX 3.11 and some advanced features from DivX 5. More seriously, even a theoretically compatible DivX movie is often unwatchable because of Jerky playback. This is partly due to poor support for VBR audio, but there also seems to be an issue with the frame-rate: It seems to use 30 fps, instead of 29.970. Small difference, but enough to be clearly noticable. Oh, and did I mention their software is quite buggy and unstable (Yes, this includes the driver)?

In short, this is potentially a nice product, but definitely something I want to have reviewed THOROUGHLY, using a lot of different movies and encodings, before I trust it.