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The Internet

Navi-Like Network Predicted 119

randomErr writes "ZDNET has this article about how a universal network similar the one in SE Lain will evolve. The author say it's not a matter of 'if' but 'when' this network will happen."
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Navi-Like Network Predicted

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  • Oh no... (Score:4, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday May 13, 2002 @02:57PM (#3511470)
    That's all we need, a network that says "Listen!" every three seconds.

    (Those who have played Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time will get that).
    • Re:Oh no... (Score:4, Funny)

      by dmorin ( 25609 ) <dmorin@gmai l . com> on Monday May 13, 2002 @03:16PM (#3511592) Homepage Journal
      "Billy Pilgrim has come unstuck in time."

      And any one who has read Slaughterhouse Five will get *that*.

      Poo tee weet?

    • Q: What does the ZDNET article, Navi-Like Network[s] and the SE Lain link have to do with each other?

      A: Nothing!!!

    • Oh, I don't know. If it could detect Cinematically Important stuff for me to pay attention to amidst the background noise of marketroids, that might be useful. Especially if it gained a reputation for doing so: all I'd need to do for most meetings would be show up and demonstrate that Navi is detecting no significance in anything that is about to be discussed, so I could get back to work instead of falling asleep in the meeting. (Of course, if it was company-issued, it'd probably be set to always detect the CEO or any other high exec who happened to be present, regardless of actual significance...)
  • by argStyopa ( 232550 ) on Monday May 13, 2002 @02:59PM (#3511484) Journal
    "...I get email from dead people..."
  • by plastik55 ( 218435 ) on Monday May 13, 2002 @03:00PM (#3511492) Homepage
    It's some masturbatory "new Economy" business-Internet tripe. Nothing to do with your beloved anime show, and the logical connection is tenuous at best.
  • by hettb ( 569863 )
    Las Vegas--For the last few years the NetWorld+Interop confab fell out of favor. It lost the buzz native to events that help define the industry's new inflection points.

    This year the atmosphere is different. The "cool" Internet of pervasive e-commerce and e-marketplaces eclipsing the brick-and-mortar world has passed into history for now. Instead, the Internet has returned to its roots (which were first exposed at Interop conferences in the 1990s) as core network infrastructure and applications platform, and grown way beyond its heritage in academic circles.

    [zdnet.com]

    In fact, we are truly at an inflection point, bridging into the next phase of the Internet. We will be able to look back at this year's N+I and say we saw not just a few indications of an economic recovery, but signs of a future in which the network truly is the computer, to borrow a phrase from Sun Microsystems [cnet.com].

    The inflection point in evidence at N+I is the push toward a global, unified network infrastructure, based on Internet protocols. The benefits are well articulated at this juncture in terms of cost savings and flexibility, as well as industry standards and support.

    N+I keynote speakers [zdnet.com] Serge Tchuruk, CEO of Alcatel [cnet.com], and Cisco [cnet.com] CEO John Chambers both identified interconnected IP-based LANs and WANs that move voice, data, and video as a key enabler for more cost effective and useful Web-based applications. Tchuruk termed this ultimate evolution of IP networking protocols and open standards as the "borderless enterprise. Chambers called it the "network virtual organization."

    Whatever you call this movement, it's more a question of when and how rather than if IP-networks will become the network of networks. "Almost no CIO I talk to today disagrees that within five years we will have a single infrastructure for data, voice, and video," Chambers said. The when and how is tied to providing migration paths that allow for more gradual replacement or upgrading of existing equipment within businesses.

    Tchuruk said that enterprises don't need to take a "forklift" approach and replace legacy systems, but should be able to migrate to IP-based network services at their own pace. For example, deploying voice over IP (VOIP) can be done in combination with traditional phone services.

    Vendors hope that this migration to a more IP-based solutions will catalyze spending and a return to profitability for their customers and themselves. In reality, unifying network architectures with Internet protocols is just a first step. Both Chambers and Tchuruk stressed that these networks must have carrier-class reliability, quality of service, and bulletproof security to succeed with enterprise customers and consumers.

    • OT: I wonder if you could make a filter for Apache that would detect hits from Slashdot editors; thus warned of an imenent Slashdot posting, the server could brace for the Slashdot Effect, perhaps by putting up a static page or using some other defense.

      Nah, wouldn't work -- clearly, the editors don't read the links before they post the stories.

  • by joshv ( 13017 ) on Monday May 13, 2002 @03:03PM (#3511513)
    Ok, I don't know how VOIP and video on demand have much to do with the anime page linked to in the story header.

    This is the same Everything over IP story the pundits have been whipping for the last 4 years. Nothing new here, move along.

    -josh
    • Cmdr Taco likes networks. Cmdr Taco likes Lain. Cmdr Taco is some kind of nexus here, and Slashdot is but the cat 5 patch cord that connect us to that great Cisco router known as Cmdr Taco's brain stem.
    • "the anime page linked to in the story header" - least you got to see an anime page - all I got was
      Software error:

      Unable to get database connection! at /usr/local/share/perl/5.6.1/Everything/NodeBase . m line 58.

      For help, please send mail to the webmaster (kurt@animefu.com), giving this error message and the time and date of the error.
  • by tps12 ( 105590 )
    Hm. My first reaction is that it is already here. The concept of an Internet alter-ego who is in some senses "more real" than its real-life counterpart is immediately recognizable on todays global network. Moreover, the memetic behaviors portrayed in SEL are familiar as well. All we're missing is the pseudo-AI voice interface, which wasn't even all that convincing in the series. Nanotech drugs won't be far off either.

    OTOH (devil's advocate here >:) the Navi and the Wired are a little too present-day, it seems. The concept of the PC as communications tool, basically a box with a screen, is still there. I think we might be headed more towards the kind of ubiquitous computing common in lots of other series. Namely, connectivity through built-in or wearable devices, with interfaces that are largely subconscious or learned from early childhood.

    What a great time to be a computer enthusiast.

    Hehe, just thought of something...once bionics gets more widespread, case mods are going to get way scary.

    • I think one good point brought up in the article, which in fact has been beaten to death here on /., is that the broadband tech needs to be in place. With only 20% of the US pop having the capability. From prev articles talking about G3 and broadband I think it is very possible but not sure how far down the line it will be.

      I do think the majority of what was stated in the aticle is old news. But without the resources to spread throughout the US and eventually the World I think a 5 year time period is justified.

    • Anybody who has played through Hideo Kojima's masterpiece of a PS2 game, Metal Gear Solid 2, will see immediate parallels with this "everything is a network" thing. MGS2 makes the connection between the data on the internet and the "data" contained in our DNA, and postulates some ways to preserve both.

      Another good inspiration for this kind of philosophical techno-babble is The Diamond Age by, of course, Neil Stephenson. I think he hits it on the nose by essentially saying that in the future, the entire net will be fully peer to peer. These days, bandwdith concerns and searchability seem to be the main factors holding back p2p, but in the future, I think it's safe to say the bandwidth problem will be solved.

      The organic qualities of Stephenson's futuristic Internet fascinate me. I don't want to spoil anything for those who haven't read the book, but suffice to say that Stephenson looks at what may happen when people are integrated into the network as well (through the primary plot device of the book, nanomachines).
  • yeah (Score:1, Insightful)

    "ZDNET has this article about how a universal network similar the one in SE Lain will evolve. The author say it's not a matter of 'if' but 'when' this network will happen."

    I see the english classes are going well.
    • Er....

      We already have a network like The Wired.

      It's called the Internet.

      Email on your handheld/cellphone? Been there, done that. Check out NTT's DoCoMo service, and remember that cellphone penetration is much, much higher in Japan than it is in the US.

      Email/information surfing interface? Check out Netscape. (what do you think "Navi" is short for?)

      The Navi itself appears to be a Macintosh with
      limited voice recognition - both are technologies we have today...

      Online multi-player games with avatars - yep.

      I even noticed Wired-versions of chatrooms and usenet.

      Give it a few more years, and we'll a Japan that is eerily similar to Lain's...
  • To avoid spoilers, I'll just say I recommend we NOT use the bloated network protocol used in Lain. I don't have enough bandwidth as it is. Yet another advantage to using open protocols.
  • Largest Issue (Score:3, Insightful)

    by stoolpigeon ( 454276 ) <bittercode@gmail> on Monday May 13, 2002 @03:07PM (#3511544) Homepage Journal
    Both Chambers and Tchuruk stressed that these networks must have carrier-class reliability, quality of service, and bulletproof security to succeed with enterprise customers and consumers.
    emphasis mine

    Security will be the largest issue to everything that he is talking about. It is not a problem that can ever be 'solved.' But right now they are not even far enough along in the process to make this at all attractive to anyone w/concerns in regards to keeping data secure.
    • Bulletproof security?

      This sounds like a job for RoboCop!
    • Security is not as hard as quality of service. We have some idea of how to do security (in IPv6 everything is encrypted at the network layer, where it belongs), but we have no kind of QoS in IPv4. There is a field in the header for it, but it is mostly left at 0 by everyone. I am not sure how they plan to do it in IPv6.

      And of course the article has nothing to do with Lain, it's mostly about VoIP, IPv6, etc.
    • Is it likely to have "TrustE" quality security? Seems quite likely to me.

    • The phrase "bulletproof security" is used too often in my opinion; I'd like to see a OpenBSD server take a full clip of AP rounds at point blank range.

      But maybe that's because I prefer FreeBSD ;)

      graspee

  • I loved Lain series! Now I'll love network
  • by kingpin2k ( 523489 ) on Monday May 13, 2002 @03:09PM (#3511558)
    In five years, I predict that people will be making five-year predictions. This trend will continue to provide column writers with material and give keynote speakers at conferences neatly relevant topics.
    • It just occurred to me today that I need to move my computer next to my stereo so I can transfer my LPs to CDs. The end is nigh! This is really the major obstacle to convergence--getting everything in the same room. Once somebody solves this problem in a practical manner, it will happen. We're talking furniture design here, not technology!
  • by GutBomb ( 541585 ) on Monday May 13, 2002 @03:09PM (#3511563) Homepage
    hmm, a worldwide computer network that allows business, academic, and home users communicate and transfer data. WOW, where do I sign up to the amazingly new service? I do not see the relation to Lain. Lain is possibly the best anime ever made, and it covers a large worldwide network that allows for communication, but Lain is a science fiction story about moving your conciousness into that network, and having the network hardwired into your conciousness by transitting it as waves that are compatible with the human brain.
  • sun probably paid... to have this article written... "The network is the computer.." yea... and oh, by the way, here is a pop-up ad for sun on that article...
  • by tweakt ( 325224 ) on Monday May 13, 2002 @03:18PM (#3511603) Homepage
    The animefu link:

    Software error:

    Unable to get database connection! at /usr/local/share/perl/5.6.1/Everything/NodeBase . m line 58.

    For help, please send mail to the webmaster (kurt@animefu.com), giving this error message and the time and date of the error.

    BWAHAHAHHA!

  • "ZDNET has this article about how a universal network similar the one in SE Latin America will evolve.

    I predict it will evolve first in Uruguay, then Argentine and finally Chile.

  • about the things to come....but when LainOS.org posted its info on here it got some flames. PFFT hypocrits. Personally i don't think the network is the computer, nor that it should ever come to that. However, i do like the fact that all the cool things we see in anime are turning from fiction into fact. When will we reach the point where SciFi is just a thing of the past, and we no longer have futuristic expectations?
  • It will happen first on company LANs where a department make use of it. Companies will expand it to all machines at one location and then they will tunnel to other locations. It will be a while before web services, grid computing, etc. reach out to the common man except in small ways.
  • "Consumers will drive more investment in broadband because they want video on demand on their handheld devices? So far, that's not the case."

    Actually, I disagree. Considerable amount of money is being spent in all areas of technology to make this vision come real (so "so far", investments are being made). Blaming the inability to call your kids today from your video wrist watch on the mysterious "Entertainment Industry" syndicate clouds the truth: technological innovations take time to spawn products for the consumer (read: cheap technology takes time).

    It only takes longer and costs more when the REAL RACKETS take place, like "selling" bandwidth to exclusive licensees under the auspices of policing a medium that doesn't need policing and raising money for "under-privlaged" children to use the Internet. Even enforcing a utility monopoly contributes to the slow grind of innovation (ever wonder why the government has to FORCE a telco to open their CO's to competitors? would it have anything to do with utility companies being granted monopolies with their "telephone" poles?).

    We'll get there, though, in spite of "last-century business models." Just be patient and vote out your local incumbant.
  • Well, I predict... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Lethyos ( 408045 ) on Monday May 13, 2002 @03:36PM (#3511704) Journal
    ...that when the events transcribed in Revelations begin to occur, we will build giganitic, sky-scraper sized mechs called Evangelion. These mechs will allow us to combat Angels and bring us to a higher state of evolution, assuming of course that some little brat doesn't decide to wish us all to death.

    Come on. This one is just too stupid. People sometimes get silly ideas like this in their head from taking entertainment too literally. (For example, everyone was certain that we'd be living in disk-shaped houses high on poles and flying to work every day after seeing The Jetsons. Now while some things have come true, most has not.) In Serial Experiments: Lain, the Wired was an analogy. A symbolic construct that represented a higher state of consciousness. The authors were in no way suggesting that the actual Net would be a place for souls to gather. This guy needs to watch Lain again and get a better clue.
  • nak! (Score:5, Insightful)

    by shren ( 134692 ) on Monday May 13, 2002 @03:36PM (#3511706) Homepage Journal
    All of the buzzwords make my head spin. Did anyone else spot any content in that article? I was keeping my eye open, but it was mostly yadda yadda unified media yadda yadda web services yadda yadda etc.
    • Don't you know by now that if you actually try and distribute content on the web, the xyAA will come after you with an army of lawyers?

      Welcome to the web of the future...
  • Does the SE in the link stand for "Software error"? I think they have networks like that out now...
  • Yes, predicted in Serial Experiments: Lain !

    wtf?

    Space travel to the moon predicted in early film!
    Romances predicted in summer movie!
    Natural disasters predicted in book written 10 years ago!

    Sorry if I'm not impressed... but hey, i'm a little jaded today.

    certron
  • MPLS (Score:3, Interesting)

    by chill ( 34294 ) on Monday May 13, 2002 @04:05PM (#3511952) Journal
    The entire article can be summed up as "MPLS is coming. Soon everything will be IP-based."

    Cisco is very big in Layer-3 switching and MPLS, but their Layer-2 switches (ATM and such) are trash compared to Nortel and Lucent. They are pushing big to move large telcos to MPLS and replace their ATM and Frame Relay networks.
  • Probably what will happen will be somewhere in the middle. Companies will become more connected in general and more users will have broadband but I think it wil take many more than 5 years before all the current technical incompatibilities and problems are ironed out, if ever. One simple reason is that, while e-mail and normal html over http web browsing have become ubiquitous, hundreds of other net tevhnologies have started and died. Another reason is the simple commercial competition between companies. Microsoft and AOL will not agree on a common IM format for instance. So, probably, some technologies will gain acceptance but most defintely won't.
  • The impact of this story was felt nowhere more than bt the development team for LainOS [sourceforge.net].

    While previous coverage of the OS [slashdot.org] mostly centered on technical issues, this revelation about the future of global network will hopefully involve an upswing in LainOS development,

    Lead developer Neoevangelist [slashdot.org], last reported looking for some good Open Source spech recognition libraries, was unavailable for comment.

  • ...that this network isn't so great after all; the web site is down already.
  • Watch it a few time over and still can't understand it. Maybe I'm just too dumb.
  • by stevarooski ( 121971 ) on Monday May 13, 2002 @05:16PM (#3512503) Homepage
    While its really too easy to make jokes about these kind of articles, has anyone actually sat down and wondered where we're going in terms of user interfaces for the internet? Honestly, folks, it can't and won't stay just html text and pictures forever. One of the reasons I thought Lain was interesting was that it left most of its technology undefined. Some people apparently got to go fully online in an apparently VR-like experience, while others still used monitors.

    With the level of activity in VR research, bandwidth across the globe on the increase, and items on the market like 3d monitors, 3d operating systems, etc, I would be willing to bet that in 20 years or so we WILL have some kind of immersive interface for accessing information. Just think of how cool it would be to represent sql tables, etc in true 3d. Or to be able to walk around your 3d model like a sculptor instead of dragging it with a mouse?

    Another description of a possible future for the internet is Tad William's Otherland series. For those who haven't read it, think Lain with the idea of the Net expanded and examined. Its a great series, I highly recommend it.
    • Imminent death of text predicted! Film at 11.

      Seriously, that's been predicted since the '80s. Sure, pictures have their uses - human pattern-recognition capability, both visual and otherwise, is continually underutilized - but for communicating back from the human to the computer, for instance to set up the pretty pictures and all those other uses? The one advantage of text that has become somewhat mitigated with time is low bandwidth. Modern human languages are, basically, text and voice because those modes can express so much relative to any other mode...and of the two, text can be used almost everywhere voice can, but voice is not appropriate for many situations.
    • It's "really too easy to make jokes" about these kinds of articles because they're a load of suit-speak, marketroid,b2b, p2p, xml BULLSHIT!

      At the risk, nay the certainty! of being modded down, I will point out that it's "News for Nerds, Stuff that matters", not "News for Suits, Stuff people pretend to be interested in".

      graspee

  • but I'm not sure that article was about. Consumers will be broadband, but won't be driven by entertainment; IP networks will take over.

    I have broadband, and it has several uses, including but not limited to music and video. IP networks already have taken over in my world.

    He probably gets paid by the word. Perhaps this was a teaching tool by Slashdot to show you how to really pad a story. That he got two pages out of that was pretty amazing.

  • Who cares about anime anyway? Isn't that stuff supposed to be for kids? Grow up Taco...

  • Not that it really matters, but the universal network in "Serial Experiments: Lain" was called "the Wired"; Navi (short for Navigator?) was what they called the computer used to access the Wired.

    Also, VoIP wouldn't be quite the same thing as the Wired, where everyone also represented themselves with virtual effigees (sp?), much like some 3D chatrooms, or the world in Neal Stephenson's "Snow Crash".

  • The network in Lain was far more scientifically and technologically out there than the "unified IP network". Lain was about a secret experiment with a man-machine network that uses the ultra-low frequencies that match the human brainwaves to network people directed to the "wired" by sending out the waves through the air. The Navi network is not that different from what we got now either...
    it was just an excuse to slip in an anime reference....
  • One of the comments I remember from that anime was the one where she was wondering whether a new modchip would work in her Navi, and her mentor talked about how Navi's were able to be compatible with almost any kind of mod.

    I think _that_ would be even more of a miracle than a global, seamless, ever-present network...

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