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United States

Kid-Safe Domain Created 657

Jadecristal writes "The Washington Post announces that President Bush has signed legislation to create a .kids.us domain. The legislation mandates that those with a .kids.us site not be allowed to link to any site outside the .kids.us domain." At the very least, it makes filtering easy.
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Kid-Safe Domain Created

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  • by duras ( 34902 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @09:17PM (#4823157) Homepage
    So any site under kids.us is safe for kids. Sites are only safe for kids if they're under kids.us. Why not just create a whitelist of kids-safe sites. In order to get on the list, you must not link to sites that aren't on the whitelist.

    Works out the same, but eliminates the cost of the domain to the website owner.
  • uh, gee (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 05, 2002 @09:18PM (#4823161)
    It sure is good to know that our children will be safe from being accidentally redirected to dangerous, kid-unfriendly sites like www.cnn.com when they're hanging around nickelodeon.kids.us. Way to go, GWB.

    Actually, i'm just being cynical, i guess that is a pretty good idea.. a kid-safe playground that you can let your children run free on without any worry they'll run across anything "bad". I'm liking this idea the more i think about it, but i'm worried about what happens when they start deciding what is and isn't "kid-safe".. for example, what happens the first time someone puts something that really isn't kid-appropriate up on kids.us.. or what happens the first time that someone attempts to claim that something like, say, the web page for that Nickelodeon special about kids who have gay parents, and the intolerance they face (you know, the one that all the child psychologists lauded and all the religious groups tried to have nickelodeon boycotted for) declared "unsafe for kids.us"...

    I wonder if the fact that actual laws have to be passed to introduce any changes in the administration of the .us domain is the reason there's absolutely nothing there.
  • by foniksonik ( 573572 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @09:22PM (#4823183) Homepage Journal
    I hope they realize that they are passing legislation which disallows linking to international sites, even if they are kid safe... i guess our kids will only be getting US approved history as usual.

    Well hopefully the librarians at schools will keep at least one or two computers available for doing real research on sites like BBC, etc. who may not feel the need to create a special US version of their material available just for kids in the US.

  • Good solution (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Cato the Elder ( 520133 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @09:22PM (#4823185) Homepage
    It would be much more sensible to create a domain of non-kid-"safe" content


    No it wouldn't. That wouldn't be at all useful. Sure, you couldn't block children from going there, but you can't force everything non "kid-safe" into that one corner. This way, you can have an inclusion only filter, which is always easier to set up. I don't see a few "redundant" registrations as being a problem, they don't exactly eat up a noticible amount of money or Internet resources.

  • Ban advertising too (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Sanity ( 1431 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @09:23PM (#4823194) Homepage Journal
    On the whole, this is a good thing for those of us concerned about censorship. Having said that, I think that they should take a leaf out of Sweden's book, and ban advertising on the kids.us domain too. Advertising is manipulation for profit, and psychological manipulation of children for profit is revolting IMHO, more so than most of the things that won't be permitted under the kids.us domain.
  • by addikt10 ( 461932 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @09:24PM (#4823214)
    How can they enforce, or even implement no linking outside of kids.us domains? What about IP addresses? What about virtual servers, that share IP addresses?

    It might make it easier to filter, but still far from easy. And any kid that knows how to use nslookup (oh, sorry - that's been depricated. Of course I meant dig) can bypass it.
  • by Tyler Eaves ( 344284 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @09:34PM (#4823302)
    Actually, I think this would, for the most part. Basically every ad I've ever seen is clickable ( == link). They're only allowed to link to .kids.us. So presumably any ads could be for other kids.us sites.
  • MOD PARENT UP (Score:5, Interesting)

    by mike3411 ( 558976 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @09:37PM (#4823320) Homepage
    I was about to post this response. Giving parents more options & making it easier on them is never a bad idea. And clearly, nothing will prevent poor parenting from fscking up a kid. But given that even the best parents do not have an unlimited amount of time/energy to devote to their kids, and legislation like this can help them use that time more efficiently. I hope that continuing legislation allows for .kids.uk, .kids.de, etc., although I have a feeling we're going to run into some major "what should kids be allowed to see?" issues, even within .kids.us
  • Not constitutional (Score:1, Interesting)

    by AnonymousCowheard ( 239159 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @09:38PM (#4823322) Homepage
    They are not allowed to create any regulation of the .kids.us domain or otherwise.

    It is written, in the Constitution of the united States of America:

    ARTICLE [I]:
    Congress shall make no law respecting the establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press,; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

    And further, I protest that it is written in the United States Code:

    18 USC Sec. 242:
    Whoever, under color of any law, statute, ordinance, regulation, or custom, willfully subjects any person in any State Teritory, or District to the deprivation of any rights, privileges, or immunities secured or protected by the Constitution or laws of the United States, [...] shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than one year, or both.

    And further establishes that the violator:

    42 USC Sec. 1983:
    [...] shall be liable to the party injured in an action at law, suit in equity, or other proper proceeding for redress."

  • Re:so? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by FyRE666 ( 263011 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @09:40PM (#4823341) Homepage
    [Original poster posits linking to goatse.cx]

    Of course this raises the question: what is inappropriate content?

    I'm pretty sure that goatse would be classed slightly inappropriate for small children. I mean, christ I'm over 30 and I found it traumatic enough to add an entry pointing goatse.cx->127.0.0.1 on my nameserver!
  • I am waiting for (Score:1, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 05, 2002 @09:40PM (#4823346)
    http://www.timecube.kids.us
    http://www.alexchiu.k ids.us

    And to a much greater extent, i am waiting for http://www.jesus-is-lord.kids.us [jesus-is-lord.com] or http://www.wicca.kids.us [mothersmagic.net]. I am waiting for someone to set up some kind of racist, anticatholic, hyper-right-wing site clothed as a "christian values site for kids" and have a bunch of left-wing mothers wig out. I am waiting for someone to set up a page of basic information and activities on pagan religions for kids, and have a bunch of right-wing mothers wig out. I am waiting to see if there is really any long-term effects from either of these scenarios.

    Remember, there are people out there who consider it just as offensive and criminally rediculous that you have some kind of right to tell their children to worship doormats, as they would find it offensive and rediculous that you have some kind of right to tell their children it's okay to be gay. And there are people out there who consider http://www.chick.com just as bad as your average white-supremacist hate site (there are pages on there claiming that the holocaust was orchestrated by the Roman Catholic Church, with the nazis just as a puppet government for their greater plan. Do You Want Your Children Reading That?). And there are also people in both of the above groups who consider it either vitally important that kids have access to information on alternate religions, or vitally important that kids read chick tracts and know The Truth.

    Welcome to america, where thankfully we are all still divided by design.. for now, anyway..
  • by Pxtl ( 151020 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @09:42PM (#4823357) Homepage
    That's interesting... can the kids get a note from their parents allowing them to use the unfiltered machine?
  • Looks good to me (Score:4, Interesting)

    by TekPolitik ( 147802 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @09:45PM (#4823383) Journal

    The idea here is obviously to create a domain that kids can use unsupervised, so you would limit their machines to that domain by use of a proxy of some description. If they need access to things outside that domain, they can do so under supervision

    Inability to access other content is unlikely to be a problem anyway, since it's not merely a question of whether content is suitable for kids, but whether it is targetted to kids. Pre-teen kids aren't usually much interested in content that's not designed for kids anyway.

    If the content is targetted to kids, the domain owner is likely to register under that domain anyway.

    The only thing I'd like to have seen is that it be .kids, rather than .kids.us, but I guess the limitation to .us is for political reasons - surprisingly, for Bush, in an effort not to appear to be acting as the President of the World.

  • by lommer ( 566164 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @09:48PM (#4823402)
    Actually, what I want to know is whether there are any provisions that the kids.us domain could be extended to other countries. The article said that sites in kids.us would only be allowed to link to other sites in kids.us, but does the legislation provide for the event that other countries' kids-friendly domain names could be linked to? i.e. If Canada created a kids.ca or the UK created kids.uk, are there provisions that would allow sites in kids.us to link to these sites?

    I know this would make the domain system even more complicated, but it could prove useful.
  • by stratjakt ( 596332 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @09:48PM (#4823406) Journal
    How can you force porn to .xxx domain? They have every right to free expression, and a .com domain, that you have.

    THAT would be the start of a police state. This isn't. This is voluntary on both ends, and a perfectly practical solution to the problem.

    If you want to set up a kiddy site, you don't have to do it on kids.us, and if you want your kids to see cnn.com, you can let 'em.

    But, of course, everything to someone like you is 'another sign of the US becoming a police state.'
  • by Halo5 ( 63934 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @09:50PM (#4823423) Homepage
    Are they gonna prosecute porn spammers to email servers on that domain? If so, a lot of adults (including me) will want a .kid.us email account!

    Also, a new venture as a non-free (say $5-$10 a month) email service might be a good idea. As an ISP, all you would have to do is report spammers to the USG.

  • Re:so? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by brsmith4 ( 567390 ) <.brsmith4. .at. .gmail.com.> on Thursday December 05, 2002 @09:51PM (#4823424)
    You'd simply be an asshole if you did and your site would probably be shut down. I think it's great that there will be a domain for children's web sites. It will make parents' jobs easier when it comes to keeping track of what they are doing and making sure they do not come across things they shouldn't.
  • by stratjakt ( 596332 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @09:54PM (#4823453) Journal
    Have you ever tried to set up a filter for 8-10 year olds to be able to browse the 'net, and do so safely?

    I have. I don't want to sit over their shoulders all the time - I want them to enjoy playing around with computers on their own as I did when I was their age.

    They aren't going to actively seek out porn or hate speech - they're much to young to know or care. But they might, and have, tried to search for video game tips.

    Searching for a game faq for one of my kids games, I realized just how sleazy and shitty the 'net is. Porn banners galore on video game sites.

    So, I have a whitelist set up for their machines. Right now, when they hear a site mentioned on tv (like nickelodeon.com or cartoonnetwork.com) or whatever, they try it, it wont work, and they tell me, and I add it. After I search through it, make sure there's nothing they can accidentally click on.

    This is just a whole TLD I can add to that whitelist. It's easier, and its a hell of a start. And it doesn't complicate the internet any more than any other TLD has.

    It's either this, or real censorship. I think this is a great compromise.
  • So.... (Score:2, Interesting)

    by jsse ( 254124 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @09:54PM (#4823455) Homepage Journal
    our kids are safe now, dear Bush?

    I'm awaiting next legistration to mandate that those kids are not allowed to access anything other than kids.us.

    Thanks a lot, God Bless America.
  • by johnpaul191 ( 240105 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @09:56PM (#4823471) Homepage
    so they would have to disable any offsite links that are not going to *.kids.us.... and i assume that would include banner ads? wierd..... so would there be kid-specific pop ups too?
    i would think the news would be a mess to run because they sometimes include links. it would end up being a whole new site, so i guess they could "tone it down". i guess i should have looked to see what the target age group is before overpondering.
    maybe it's more thought out.. but in general it seems like a major headache.... though maybe a good idea. talking to some parents i have noticed how darn scared they are about letting their kids online (even early teenagers).....
    i could see people liking it if there is someplace you could let your 6 year old romp with no fears of pr0n, or them signing up for credit cards or something.
  • Re:uh, gee (Score:2, Interesting)

    by nule.org ( 591224 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @10:09PM (#4823568) Homepage
    I get your cynicism, but I'd have to say that if I had kids there's no way in hell I'd let them go to cnn.com. Too many pictures of people blown into little tiny chunks in various places in the world. I'll save such imagery for my FPS games, thank you very much.

    Seriously though - does Yahoo and CNN really have to show such graphic pictures? Stories about X many people being shot up or blown up are enough to make anyone cry without pictures of tormented loved ones and juicy bits everywhere.

    It's not that I don't want to acknowledge that it happens. I just really don't need to see the GIBs. Doh! I'm way off topic!

  • by Newer Guy ( 520108 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @10:30PM (#4823722)
    I got modded down 'cause I was against this..which shows how purely clueless some are. First off, the Government is going about this BACKWARDS...they should have instead adopted the domain .xxx or similar and required all the 'bad' stuff to be there! What they did instead is the equilavent of fencing the children IN as opposed to keeping the bad stuff OUT! But then we do this all the time in the USA these days, don't we? Instead of cleaning the streets of criminals, we instead lock ourselves in our homes! Look, I'm tired of the Govt. in the USA deciding things for me and my family. I raised three kids, the oldest a girl who's a Freshman at Harvard now..and I did it without Govt. help. My kids all used (and use) the 'net and I supervise them. Also, I raised them right...they know what to look at and what not to..and they ask me when they need advice. Why should I (and they) be forced have to lower myself to SOMEONE ELSE'S lowest common denominator..why can't they RAISE themselves up to mine? We have laws that limit people's access by age to movies,..to cigarettes, to drinking..to driving...even to viewing certain TV shows. We don't BAN them from coming into a movie theater building where there's an R movie playing on the next screen..or a food store that happens to sell cigarettes and liquor..or the TV completely..yet so many of you here are simply GUSHING about a domain that does EXACTLY that! Why would you want to do this? Again I say..it's stupid and makes no sense!
  • Re:Bad solution. (Score:2, Interesting)

    by ShadowDrake ( 588020 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @10:43PM (#4823788)
    I just see it as very inefficient to create a "closed set" domain, because so much of the Web's usefulness depends on free linking.

    Many news sites, for example, are essentially "link farms", pointing people to articles of interest. Is that not what /. is? If you wanted to make a kid-friendly one in .kids.us, you'd either have to mirror everything within the domain (logistical nightmare, possible lawsuits), or take your chances of being shut down for linking to the outside world. The effect would be that you'd have a hard time creating a high-quality specimen of that sort of site.

    It would be difficult to make a valuable site in that domain without a lot of your own content.

    Wonderful... a new playground, tailoring the flexibility of the Web for the needs of the large media concerns.

    What happened to all those "site rating schemes" that were supposed to be built into our browsers many moons ago? You want kid business, set those flags, encourage the sites you link to to set their flags, and use the browser controls. If there's a problem with misleading flags (maliciously), consider a false-advertising claim.
  • by CaptainSuperBoy ( 17170 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @10:45PM (#4823794) Homepage Journal
    Overly technical legislation is never good.. this is like spam laws that say you have to put ADV in the subject. What about wireless and other non-SMTP spam? There are plenty of ways to spam someone that don't include a subject field.

    In the same way, there are plenty of ways to 'link' to a site. Does this only restrict A HREF? How about setting window.location in Javascript? Or I could make a dummy form and use buttons for links. What if I put in the URL of a porn site but don't make the link clickable? What if I just mention a web site's name, as in "I bought it on the eBay site?" Also, if I own a .kids.us domain am I liable for content on message boards? Am I liable if my site gets hacked and someone posts links to Yahoo.com?
  • Re:Bad solution. (Score:3, Interesting)

    by shaitand ( 626655 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @11:26PM (#4824031) Journal
    The problem is that the kids are smarter than the parents, and this will continue to be a problem. When the kids are grown, their kids will be more intelligent. Adapting, evolving call it what you will. I don't know about you, but I can knock out content advisor without a password, and without a hack, all you have to do is edit the registry. Hell 5yr olds hack the registry these days while their parents are still on the phone with tech support figuring out what their mouse is so they can follow the instructions to activate content advisor. Most tech savvy parents are intellectuals and are more in tune with reality (imho) and thus are less apt to be as heavy into content restriction.
  • by Erpo ( 237853 ) on Thursday December 05, 2002 @11:42PM (#4824128)
    This is an awful idea! It's been asked over and over again: Who decides what is safe for kids? Since there are so many differing opinions on what is ok, it only makes sense to let the parents decide individually.

    Specific metadata needs to be available for content which can then be filtered by policy. There's already a well defined system in place to support this: ICRA (formerly RSACi). A simple tag on each web page (or just the root for the site) tells what content the page or site contains. It can then be left up to parents to set access permissions, like no viewing of nudity except in an artistic context, or no graphic violence.

    Labeling can't be mandated directly, but here's an easy way to make ICRA universal:

    1. Give tax incentives to businesses that use ICRA labels, and make it a crime to misrepresent a site by placing incorrect ICRA labels in pages. There wouldn't be any legal suits (at least any with merit) over page misrepresentation as ICRA tags describe in very concrete terms what a page contains (e.g. full frontal nudity, descriptions of drug use, etc...) rather than value judgements (e.g. kid safe).

    2. Wait until ICRA becomes mainstream, then ship browsers that default to blocking sites that don't rate themselves.

    3. Remove the tax incentives.

    Unlike creating a new .us domain (or tld, I've seen both reported), there are no ongoing costs. After the tax incentives are repealed, web page authors will be forced to rate their pages if they want to be seen.

    I'm not saying anything new here. This has been around for a long time.
  • Advertising Revenue (Score:2, Interesting)

    by tekunokurato ( 531385 ) <jackphelps@gmail.com> on Thursday December 05, 2002 @11:57PM (#4824222) Homepage
    I worry about the loss in ad revenue that will affect sites that move some content to .kids. Even though it's less of a factor than it used to be, it's still important, and there will be little financial benefit to creating kids-only content for non-kiddy sites.
  • Re:so? (Score:2, Interesting)

    by catscan2000 ( 211521 ) on Friday December 06, 2002 @12:58AM (#4824529)
    I'm totally with you on that :-). The only thing my parents "sheltered" me from was violence, not naked bodies. I agree with my parents' assessments on that. People are not repulsive, but violence is.

    Yet, although we are supposed to be training our children to become productive members of society, many fellow Americans feel the need to hide as much of the world as they can from their children, ultimately putting their children at a competitive disadvantage to others and forcing them to play catch-up in college and afterward. Children are smart little buggers, and by bringing them up to become responsible members of society, it's one less thing for them to worry about later down the road.

    Teaching one-sided views and cramming it down childrens' throats raises really warped kids, and I'm not talking about OS/2 ;-). It's actually a strategy that power-hungry institutions use to gain power and/or profit. WWII Germany did it, the Taliban did it, Communist China did it, and, as one of the most glaring examples in modern society, religion did and still does it. Let kids make up their own minds, but be there when they need you and provide sound guidence balanced with clear reasoning. The more kids who actually understand the reasoning behind America's freedoms and the importance of maintaining civilization, the better :-), and hopefully less violence and crime. Telling them to do things "because I said so" is counterproductive and become things that they rebel against in their mid-to-late teens. I'd love to see kids rebelling against their parents on things like what Operating System they like best when they get to that phase in their lives rather than rebelling against what their parents said on drug, alcohol, credit, graffiti, and gambling abuse, wouldn't you ;-)? Kids in LUGs/WUGs/MUGs, not gangs! ;-). That would also lead to fewer a*hole managers in our workforce once they reach age, since they'll know how to reason rather than just using their powers to cram stuff down peoples' throats like their parents taught them. Perhaps this is wishful thinking on my part ;-).
  • by nanop ( 155318 ) on Friday December 06, 2002 @01:48AM (#4824703)
    So I'm curious ...
    I'd like to register ThereIsNoSanta.kids.us. My target audience would be elementary school children. My goals would be to dispell the myth of Santa in a non-confrontational manner and explain the true nature of the holiday season (where friends and family matter more than the number of gifts under the tree).

    The belief: if children where to spend less time wondering what Santa was bringing them and more time being thankful for what they have, perhaps this manner of thinking would be carried on as they mature.

    A far-fetched idea? Maybe. But would a government-appointed agency by able to define this as inappropriate for kids?

  • by BlackHawk-666 ( 560896 ) on Friday December 06, 2002 @09:30AM (#4826063)
    I'm with you...all porn moved to .porn, then we can doa search on google and filter out all the rubbish.

    P.S. I quite enjoy porn, but it's really getting in the way of getting back meanful results from the net.

  • Re:Uhm (Score:3, Interesting)

    by cscx ( 541332 ) on Friday December 06, 2002 @10:24AM (#4826328) Homepage
    Uh, yeah, it does.

    Go try and register a .edu domain and let me know what happens.

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