Tim Bray on Microsoft Office

jgeelan writes "The co-inventor of XML, Tim Bray, has been talking about the newly XML-enabled version of Microsoft Office, code-named 'Office 11' and tells XML-Journal that 'when the huge universe of MS Office documents becomes available for processing by any programmer with a Perl script and a bit of intelligence, all sorts of wonderful new things can be invented that you and I can't imagine.'"

*when* ?

[Monty Worm]

when the huge universe of MS Office documents becomes available for processing by any programmer

I beg you pardon? Smelly programmers can keep their hands off my documents. If I wanted you to have them, I'd have emailed them to you as plaintext. I wasn't aware the the Office license meant my documents were common property....

imagination

[selderrr]

...all sorts of wonderful new things can be invented that you and I can't imagine...

When will MS ever learn that we don't WANT to imagine how wonderfull the MS Office Universe is ?

Re:Codename?

[Dausha]

See! They succeeded in mystifying you. Now while you are tettering in amazement they will move in and 'embrace and extend' you into the MS cloud.

Dogbert the Evil software consultant

[choka]

Dogbert: Here's the new XML-enabled Micro$oft Office 11 our company should upgrade to.
PHB: ...
Dogbert: The suite is saving their documents in a format they have invented called M$ Xtremely Malformed Language (XML), and they are impossible to decipher and reverse-engineer for compatibility.
PHB: (looks closely at the box Dogbert handed to him)...
Dogbert: But that's okay, because you don't undestand anyway.

Skeptical

[PizzaFace]

Three questions about Word's XML format:

• How's it encrypted?
• Do I need a Passport account to open it?
• Thank you, sir, may I please have another?

The new Word XML document format:

[Bazman]

<?xml version="1.0"?>
<uueWord2kDocument>
M"@D)("!'3E4 @3$E"4D%262!'14Y%4D%,(%!50DQ)0R!,24-%3 E-%"@D)("`@
M("`@(%9E7)I9VAT("A#*2`Q.3DQ
M($9R96 4@4V]F='=A6]N92!I2!A;F0@9&ES=')I8G5T
M92!V97)B871 I;2!C;W!I97,*(&]F('1H:7,@;&EC96YS92!D; V-U;65N="P@
</uueWord2kDocument>

An eXaMpLe of MSWord XML...

[FyRE666]

<?xml version="1.0"?>
<Data>
MSWORD$$g$%jk$%sxx"d$%^$% ^($%^m$k^a$%j^$%B$JJ"£"$M £K
</Data>

I can see it now...

[dimator]

<?xml version="1.0"?>
<document type="word">
<![CDATA[
@%MYD<V@Q4VEA8^`!AX0>DN6UIJE=^1J;1F\ @! (P@@<$Y(@OL%AS`0B=$<S*
4&A399HT2*S-@*+U&1)+KCS>J4 HJTZ=^F534G%_S8\6=YS7?#59_.U!YI[_^
AU$`HOG^5/N3A9 9'<\V/YP`(T*'MZ6)3UVSCDYF&+B;0H?7I3'O7'(2/H(Z>
U= ;N1:`!4*"4U/ATNK5GOO+^B\O?/\QK^3KE>KVYL"PN-3O2'/^9 3/U)I.PP
FXG3%*.RR)0.R'/&N!?>U'*;4FK6B,U:B<4@-6O% 1D!!%Z/31&E(R*MCU,HH
15RT`H`P2H$,O5FB!R,`"*`!J5FJ -4@TNEB5)E:'"D;AO4.?>-Z1FGVQN"3O
VN6RANM76P&((F=# 3GYM05%C;E%C1F[MQ>P:*".O*3VW,<-9`T:D.^O2BE@*
4N25 U@$0X#X!(B8*+H-1(3'!Y9'%ZF1B%7P9E#"^90&U72560M1E`R F$1;4$
:%/(I$JY3"67*"&E5,4&X.2>R]!F@"#7VLH>;5`>@( "`!IX4A`FK)LG*7O%D
P^$G)10Y"^L:FO_^\,GTP-"V:_R/GL %-,**[?^UIWRK2YT.;70-KW8.LG;)[
]]>
</document>

Re:What will be the default save format?

[Rinikusu]

Stop right there.
If you continue with that line of reasoning, someone's gonna demand that it be called SGML/XML.

Grr.

Re:An eXaMpLe of MSWord XML...

[narkotix]

MSWORD$$t@%(*SDAN*SN*(*#our evil plans to dominate the world are succeding!!...oh shit forgot to take this out%(*#&%#(*S*FCSHC(*#@N

Re:Yay Evil Monopoly Of Doom!

[jsse]

I don't beleive any of this crap is goingto happen from MS. Not for a New York second.

Dark-masked B.Gates approaching you:
"I find your lack of faith....disturbing."

what a cool codename

[Anonymous Coward]

code-named 'Office 11'

awesome. Apparently the next version of the linux kernel is code named 2.6! Wow!

Re:I doubt it.

[spongman]

what are you talking about? you can 'muck about' with office documents right now with whatever language you want, Perl included. You don't need XML to do it.

Re:Codename?

[spongman]

it is. it's just written in pig-Roman numerals.

Nice, but redundant statement

[cwernli]

any programmer with a Perl script and a bit of intelligence

and I thought intelligence was a prerequisite to be able to handle perl ? :)

Re:what a cool codename

[Anonymous Coward]

Yep and the release name will be linux 3.0 :-)

Re:What I heard....

[AnEmbodiedMind]

More like

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>
<!DOCTYPE msword PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD WORD 1.0//EN"
"http://www.microsoft.com/word11.dtd">
< worddoc >
<![CDATA[ ??????????You'd be lucky????????? ]]>
</worddoc>

;)

Re:However...

[PhotoGuy]

They'll find some way to make MSXML difficult or impossible to access, assuming that they haven't already.... encrypted data or something like that.

What?!?!?!? You mean they'll try and pass something off as a a "security feature," when it's really intended to protect them?

Nah, that's not really their style.

I expect them to use legal means

[Greyfox]

My bet is they either use proprietary patented portions of XML or they'll copyright the DTD, schema or stylesheets with the EULA insisting that you only read the XML with MS or non-GPL software.

Re:Yay Evil Monopoly Of Doom!

[passthecrackpipe]

OH NO!!!! An anonymous poster, who I don't know and will never meet has decided to NOT pledge his/her alliance with me on an Internet-based forum. I am shocked! My self-esteem has plummeted! How will I survive this massive blow to my ego!?!

Re:An eXaMpLe of MSWord XML...

[phong3d]

No, No, No. It's...

MSWORD$IFERFHFO$FFKFJWJEFOJ$FJ$FJ*J#$J$RJ$R$J)JE*F J$Netscape engineers are weenies()$()#*$)*$U*$U*U$%*

Re:Tim here with a bit more background

[Anonymous Coward]

Hey, no fair injecting actual information, from a primary source, no less, into a /. discussion! That's totally cheating! #@$! karma whore...

Re:Yay Evil Monopoly Of Doom!

[Anonymous Coward]

Also, how would a "binary, proprietary, encrypted file format" fit into everything else Microsoft is doing with .NET?

It would help binary, proprietary, encrypted MS apps interchange data within a framework.