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Bill Would Outlaw Digital Receiver Recorders 487

mjdroner writes "ZD-Net has the latest on a sweeping telecom bill in the Senate. The bill provides no support for net neutrality. The bill does, however, include a provision to authorize the FCC to outlaw digital receivers that record broadcasts. The article states that those receivers would be replaced with devices that treat anything with an audio broadcast flag as copy-protected."
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Bill Would Outlaw Digital Receiver Recorders

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  • by slashname3 ( 739398 ) on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @05:15PM (#15249053)
    So the FCC is going to replace my mythtv box with a new system? Are they planning to do this just after they confiscate all the firearms from the public?
  • I am so sick (Score:1, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @05:16PM (#15249065)
    of this incessant bullshit being brought upon us by our government. To think that the American people voted these retards into office to begin with!? F*ck the FCC, **AA, the president, his cabinet and all the other little cronies. God Bless the USA? God Damned the USA seems to be more fitting at this point.
  • by Fulcrum of Evil ( 560260 ) on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @05:17PM (#15249071)

    "These measures will help assure that the information superhighway does not turn into a red light district," Exon said at the time. "It will help protect children from being exposed to obscene, lewd, or indecent messages."

    Yeah, that worked out so well.

  • by RareButSeriousSideEf ( 968810 ) on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @05:22PM (#15249119) Homepage Journal
    Nope, this comes first - mythtv users are the "dry run" exercise in preparation for the subsequent firearm seizure.
  • by deathcloset ( 626704 ) on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @05:28PM (#15249168) Journal
    You know, I'm starting to think that broadcast television, motion pictures and recorded music might not be worth all this trouble.

    Perhaps it's time to start enjoying live plays and musical performances again. Seriously, my digital entertainment is video games and documentaries. I am starting to think the unthinkable: maybe I can live without TV and Movies.

    People will continue to create entertainment and education for download right? Oh, right...Unless network neutrality is abolished and my provider decides that I can't access this freely created content.

    I wonder, is it time that I start figuring out how to set up a HAM-based Internet connection?
  • by popo ( 107611 ) on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @05:32PM (#15249194) Homepage

    Would that be like, "a computer"?

    Newsflash: There's no hardware unique to a TiVo.

    They'd have to outlaw PC's for this bill to work.

    Let them try. It will be a death sentence for every commercially manufactured, dedicated PVR. And the birth of some truly wonderful opensource software.

    Sounds good to me.
  • Question... (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Lobo ( 10944 ) on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @05:33PM (#15249206) Homepage
    Does anyone have suggestions of a device that will do this before the law is passed?
  • Re:freaking MPAA (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @05:38PM (#15249242)
    good question. Seems the MPAA is a bunch of money-hungry scum-sucking lawyers and I doubt any one of them in the corporate office was ever a professional musician. Otherwise they might consider doing something like actually representing the interests of musicians and, oh, maybe paying them for their work instead of paying a heard lawyers to sue people.

    Last I checked, corporate lawyers are bottom-feeders known for filing lawsuits especially against those who beat their respective organization to the latest and greatest innovation (esp. anyone who has RIM envy). Lawyers are great at bend....er....presenting facts for the sake of truth*, not innovating new ideas to capture the minds and hearts of consumers. And I'm wondering what the ratio of legal staff to represented artists is in the MPAA in the 80's vs today.

    (*truth as it relates to their client's best interests)

    final word about innovation as it relates to the MPAA: For the love of pete, every artist they promote sounds the freaking same. They can't even be innovative and promote original-sounding music. What makes you think they can positively embrace new forms of distribution and advertising? (jesus, what happened to MTV?!)

    If anyone out there is a corporate lawyer and is offended by the above statements, then good. And I'm also kind of surprised you read comments on slashdot. And assuming you are still a corporate lawyer by the end of this sentence, suck my left nut and get a profession that will benefit humanity for crying out loud.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @05:40PM (#15249253)
    sounds like a good use for BitTorrent....
  • by MushMouth ( 5650 ) on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @05:42PM (#15249267) Homepage
    Bruce Perens warned us all this would happen 6 years ago in his "Napster Hurts Free Software [nettime.org]" essay.

     
  • by cayenne8 ( 626475 ) on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @05:49PM (#15249324) Homepage Journal
    "Vote in a Democratic Congress this fall."

    You know...I don't think that will work either. Best solution, is to wipe the slate clean with both houses and executive branch...no one in office can be re-elected....start from scratch.

    Not only would it get rid of the status quo of corruption and non-representation of the people, but, alternate competing parties would stand a chance.

    Of course as long as we are making 'wishes'....I'd like to have a pony.

    :-)

  • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @05:51PM (#15249333)

    As someone who doesn't illegally steal material, I'm starting to find all this DRM stuff annoying.

    For example: I bought the latest Nine Inch Nails album With Teeth, only to discover that you can only play it on a PC through a proprietary software player (assuming your OS can run it, of course). That player sucks, and does annoying things like messing up my computer's volume levels. I haven't tried personally, but I'm reliably informed that it won't work in some car CD players as well.

    The point here is that what I bought was marketed as a CD. It was right there on the shelf in the CD section, next to other CDs, with nothing obviously saying that it wasn't. To be fair, there might have been a note about whether or not you could play it on PCs visible in the small print– I can't remember and don't have it with me to check. But who reads all the small print when buying a CD?

    Now, the word "Compact disc" is a trademark of Philips (as indicated by the funny symbol), as is the "CD" logo you see on all the cases. Philips officially denies permission to use that mark to companies using technology that prevents playing the disc properly on standard equipment. Therefore, anyone marketing the material in the manner that I saw it (be it a record shop, the music publishers, or wherever) is infringing on Philips' rights, and deserves to be sued to high heaven for it.

    It's a shame Philips doesn't go after this more aggressively, because preventing this kind of bastardization of a mark is exactly what trademark law was made for. I'd imagine that if all record shops were suddenly required to separate out normal and copy-protected CDs in an obvious way, sales of the latter would probably drop ASAFP, and the problem would disappear just as fast. I can only assume that since everyone's doing it, they want a clear test case in their favor first to make it quick, easy, and most of all cheap to follow up with others. Maybe they're looking for such a test case and just waiting to make their move. Maybe they just don't care, but as one of the world's biggest manufacturers of CD/DVD burners, that seems unlikely.

    Anyway, the gist of this comment is that I really haven't bought a new CD since that album. I was always selective, but I did buy a few every few months or so until that point. They've really have lost a genuine, paying customer. I don't find the loss has ruined my life; I listen to the radio if I want to hear some new music, and occasionally use a legal download service [apple.com] if I really like a track I've heard. Now I'm a living own-goal for the media industry's DRM technology. Anyone else?

  • by i_want_you_to_throw_ ( 559379 ) on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @05:53PM (#15249346) Journal
    that money can buy in the United States. Seriously, look no further than the DMCA, a piece of legislation introduced by the long brain dead Orrin Hatch that is so vaguely written that anything is illegal if a corporation doesn't like it.

    How does this happen? Why with money of course!

    It's proof positive that EVERY law written in this country needs to have a sunset date of one or two years when it's reconsidered for renewal.

    What I would suggest is for you to find ways to use these laws for your benefit. It's not just for corporations.

    Here's an example, it's illegal for travel agents to get together and collude, it's against the Sherman Anti-Trust act. They should be able to band together and do whatever the hell they want. I started a travel agents mailing list that after a year had been infiltrated by members of the airline industry. The solution? Start a new one, this time started with a core group of trusted people and any new agents would have to be recommended by a current member and seconded by another. Next, protect the list under provisions of the DMCA, so if a travel vendor happened to get their hands on a transmission, they would be in violation because of the DMCA.

    Here's the payoff: Delta gives 10% off their fares to a particular mega agency in Chicago and American gives 10% off their fares to another large regional agency in Atlanta (one of several ticketing deals that agencies have around the country). This wonderful set up allows the agency in Chicago and Atlanta to talk and they ticket each other's discounts helping each other to not only give cheaper deals but to meet their requirements for a nice big fat override check from the airline every year.

    Is this fair? No, but then again paying travel agents no comission isn't either. You CAN make a difference folks, stop bitching and be creative. These laws are written for you, bit e back.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @05:59PM (#15249393)
    Then don't panic. They haven't even killed the pig yet. This will grind on for years.
  • by aqfire ( 885545 ) on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @06:03PM (#15249424)
    Great solution, but with all due thanks to Bush we're going to have a completely Democratic President and Congress pretty soon. And the march of inane laws will continue...
  • by mrraven ( 129238 ) on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @06:07PM (#15249455)
    Not only do they stop "piracy" but they keep the means for making digital media from becoming too cheap. The reason is this, in practical terms the corporation will cease to manufacture digital recorders (or operating systems?) for "consumers" and will enable these features on on multi-thousand dollar "professional" level equipment. After all we can't let the rabble have an independent media and report things the corporations don't want us to know right? Fortunately I can always keep Tiger on my OS X G5 box, or put Linux on a generic box, but watch "consumer" level (cheap) digital recorders and OSs (end to end encryption ring a bell) fade out not, for technical reasons but so the corporations can gain ever more control on what content is made and how it's distributed.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @06:44PM (#15249736)
    I will make up a device that can add the "broadcast flag" signal into any type of audio transmission: phone calls, Slashdot postings, public speaking (through the PA system), etc. That would make wiretapping devices either illegal or ineffective, right?

    On a more serious note, this is a dumb idea. I know they have been talking for a while about making all A-to-D converters have some kind of shut-off flag. I love the idea of being able to hit "mute" on every recording device within earshot, but this is a bad bill.

    Wow, I'm posting anonymously and my Captcha code was "Echelon" (100% serious not joking). Is the Slashcode psychic or something?

  • Re:Gerrymandering (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Kinetix303 ( 471831 ) on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @07:16PM (#15249967) Homepage
    I don't think you understand proportional representation. PR has nothing to do with equalizing demographic segments; rather, proportional representation ensures that within a certain state, if 40% of people vote for one party, 40% of the members from that party will be elected... it means that gerrymandering within a first past the post electoral system would effectively be over.

    I think you should read up a little bit more. This is a good primer:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proportional_represen tation [wikipedia.org]

    Of course, with only two political parties and a political system that forces voters to register as members of either, it is less effective. How to fix that? Bring back civics classes and engage the public. How to do that in the US? Don't ask me. I think you guys are fscked.
  • Comment removed (Score:3, Interesting)

    by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @07:20PM (#15249997)
    Comment removed based on user account deletion
  • by opencity ( 582224 ) on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @07:31PM (#15250083) Homepage
    Much of the good recorded music (most pop pre 1980) was recorded by people who were playing live 6 nights a week. Since midi and protools pop music has been made by programmers - we literally have machines that do that now. I like modern sound sculpture music, but the lack of live music means the dying off of a skill set. Without hours on the bandstand, there is no Louis Armstrong, Bird, Motown, Beatles.
    "Unplug the jukebox, do us all a favor
    That music's lost its taste
    Try another flavor
    Live music"
  • won't work either (Score:1, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @09:07PM (#15250582)
    we already see that in states that are both very large and contain at least one humongous city. Witness the crap that goes on in NY state, because it happens to contain NYC. A lot of issues divide on geographical location. I live in Georgia. What might be good for atlanta might just suck for the rest of that state (well, we need to bump up the state income tax to add a dozen new freeways around metro atlanta...)..that wouldn't help folks who don't go there much, would it Out here in cowville, we might need a pipsqueak bridge fixed,,but the money goes to Atlanta instead...

    And, look around, even in the more rural states, the news organizations and big money is always concentrated in the larger urban areas, hence, even with the proportional representation, you could have 100% of the Ds, Rs, Independents and others all being "urban centric" and therefore not really represent the bulk of the state geographicallyu, disenfranchising a lot of people.

    At the national level it is LONG gone, I knew that the first time I heard some bleached blonde news talking head say some guy who had barbed wire around his place had a "compound". They equate barbed wire with prison camps and armored bunkers. They have no conception of reality outside their little vertical concrete world of taxis, jet airplanes and the NYC/DC/LA axis of maximum profits.

    I have a better idea, no more professional politicians nor career government workers. Ten years max total and inclusive "government service",elected, appointed or hired-on, then back to private industry, no pensions, no lifetime benefits, no double dipping, suffer with the rest of us non priveleged peons. It'll make them think twice and thrice over the laws they pass-or don't pass. Eliminate all non personal campaign contributions, not a penny hard or soft from corps or NGOs or lobby groups. Not a cent, not a burger, not a golf ball not a ...anything. Maximum inclusive personal political contributions capped at 100$ a year. No "general" contributions, all contributions have to go for a named candidate in a named election who you are entitled to vote for, nothing outside your district, and nothing to the general party apparatus, ie, "no professional politicians". No soft money.

    Next up, automatic sunshine provisions on all new laws, set number of years, then they expire.As it is now, we have no set outside limit on numbers of laws! There are already *millions*. whemn will enough be enough?? Further effort towards review of old laws, to see if they lived up to their promises-no results, bad results, the law becomes null and void.

    All new laws get vetted in the restructured supreme court FIRST before they become law. Not pass a law, screw over some poor guy, then make him pay millions to fight it to see if it is really "legal" or not. That is bass ackwards and always has been.

    Any independent or third party candidate who can garner 5% during an open primary-open meaning anything goes, no closed party primaries- must be included in printed name form on all the ballots during the election, and must be allowed to participate in any "national" debates if they are broadcast on the public's airwaves. The news media giants don't own the air, we the people do, they lease selected business opportunities but must be of the public service-all the public, not just a few selected rich segments of the public and just two for profit political parties. End the hijacking.

    Automatic dissolution of corporations the third time they are caught commmitting fraud, breaking anti trust regulations, etc or fleecing the public in government contracts. The first time if it is bribery of any governmental employee. Immediate dissolution, all shares become null, worthless, must be destroyed (treat it like seized drugs in other words), all top management and the majority shareholder personally liable..

    And so on and so forth. There are practical measures to take that would actually work. All of them upset the entrenched monied status qu
  • by 1053r ( 903458 ) on Tuesday May 02, 2006 @10:26PM (#15250929)
    ... there shouldn't be any anymore: hollywood doesn't care about your rights or any others, except for their "right" to Digital "rights" management and their "right" to royally screw you over:
    ... But the bill does say that Americans should enjoy the right to share recorded broadcast TV over their home networks, make "short excerpts" available over the Internet, and that news programming generally should not be flagged. Those sections are likely to draw opposition from the Motion Picture Association of America and its allies; one source close to Hollywood told CNET News.com on Monday that "the movie industry has real problems with the broadcast flag language as it appears in the bill."
    You mean that hollywood opposes news programming NOT being flagged? What can I record then, infomercials? If I can't make short excerpts available over the internet, what can I make them available over? Or can I not make them available at all? What happened to freedom of speech and information? I guess those science fiction novels weren't too far off: America will be turned into a dictatorship (if we continue to sit on our hands on not do anything about this and other disturbing laws), but not by the government: by corperations.

    Maybe I'll move to sweden, i heard they have sane copyright laws there (from thepiratebay.org, though. Don't know if I can trust those guys.)
  • Not in the UK! (Score:1, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday May 03, 2006 @06:32AM (#15252337)
    Here in the UK, I own a digital radio and a digital TV receiver. Both of them will record broadcasts. The radio is "The Bug" and records MP2 files onto an SD card. The TV is really a Topfield TF5800 PVR with two digital TV receivers and 160 gig hard drive for recorded shows. It even has a USB port if I want to copy shows off the hard drive.

    To me, the MAIN FEATURE of digital radio and digital TV is that it can be recorded. I use this to listen to or watch shows at different times and on the PVR, I often pause or rewind the TV when I'm interrupted.

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