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Microsoft demands http://linux.de removes slogan

Posted by sengan on Mon Apr 12, 1999 01:48 PM
from the I-own-the-English-Language dept.
The German branch of Microsoft has demanded that our collegues at the German Linux Web site remove their slogan "Where do you want to go tomorrow?". They have complied by blacking out their slogan, but Microsoft's legal position appears tenuous: A search on Altavista for that phrase produced over 400 hits, and ... this trademark is pending for Cybernet Systems Corporation of Michigan anyway..
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  • Yes, make their trademark worthless! by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @02:40PM
  • KDE has this slogan - not anymore by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:27PM
  • Get informed by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @02:05PM
  • How would a reasonable person see it? by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @03:22PM
  • Top 10 Rejected Slogans at Microsoft by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @02:07PM
  • Who's next? by Russ Steffen (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @04:42PM
  • Laws Regarding Parody.... by kju (Score:1) Tuesday April 13 1999, @01:02AM
  • New Slogan by Jordy (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @05:10PM
  • Got a Linux Web Page? by farrellj (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:10PM
  • Backing down. by Trepidity (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @02:13PM
  • better M$ slogan by gavinhall (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @02:31PM
  • HUH? by gavinhall (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @02:19PM
  • I love all of this wasted time... by pb (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @05:39PM
  • Or, post this... by Tim Macinta (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @02:29PM
  • New Slogans: by Craig Maloney (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @10:43PM
  • VA Research and LHS both. by chrisd (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @06:55PM
  • Backing down. by Enahs (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @07:52PM
  • Backing down. by Enahs (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @07:41PM
  • Backing down. by Enahs (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @07:49PM
  • Other companies... by Wirehead (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:12PM
  • Backing down. by nstrug (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @04:16PM
  • The M$ slogan really ought to be... by nanun (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @08:49PM
  • defending Microsoft by nanun (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @08:44PM
  • The Once and Future OS by tony@work (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:33PM
  • Hmmm... by WWWWolf (Score:1) Tuesday April 13 1999, @12:11AM
  • Who's next? by WWWWolf (Score:1) Tuesday April 13 1999, @12:21AM
  • Slashdot sig updated and e-mail sig too. by Wheely (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @02:28PM
  • They're already feeling the heat... by Svartalf (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:50PM
  • New slogan suggestions for Linux by SpiceWare (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @02:02PM
  • Who's next? by jbc (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @02:28PM
  • Who's next? by morbid (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @02:42PM
  • Fairness. by Samhailt (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @02:07PM
  • Now we know. by Samhailt (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:47PM
  • Here's a nice banner! by wilhelm (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:19PM
  • The two laws... by yvain (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @07:44PM
  • Here's a nice banner! by ocie (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @07:12PM
  • VA Research by Kit Cosper (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @02:09PM
  • A phrase as a trademark? by freaker_TuC (Score:1) Tuesday April 13 1999, @05:51AM
  • KDE by fishbowl (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:43PM
  • What's with COMPLYING? by fishbowl (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:40PM
  • No, read it again by JoeBuck (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:14PM
  • KDE still has the slogan by johnd (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @05:07PM
  • Or, post this... by Cid Highwind (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @04:17PM
  • Remember what Ghandi said? by Cid Highwind (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @04:24PM
  • Backing down nonsense by blocked (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @08:22PM
  • Nonsense, just use the slogan ;) by blocked (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @08:15PM
  • Hell yeah! by Dast (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:16PM
  • Use of slogan by centurion (Score:1) Tuesday April 13 1999, @07:47AM
  • hmm.. by cswiii (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:14PM
  • Now that was funny by Bricktoad (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @03:01PM
  • KDE by finkployd (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @03:06PM
  • "Microsoft endorsing"? by TA (Score:1) Tuesday April 13 1999, @12:41PM
  • You missed the point! by TA (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @04:41PM
  • Backing down. by TA (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @04:24PM
  • Which part did they violate? by TA (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @04:28PM
  • "Where do you want to go" history by YeOldeGnurd (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:12PM
  • Backing down. by Todd Knarr (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @04:05PM
  • Backing down. by Todd Knarr (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:56PM
  • Backing down. by Morden (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @04:53PM
  • Got a Linux Web Page? by mcv16 (Score:1) Wednesday April 14 1999, @07:38AM
  • Here's a nice banner! by Gottjager (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:27PM
  • Which part did they violate? by MeanGene (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @07:04PM
  • Another Slogan by madsen (Score:1) Tuesday April 13 1999, @02:41AM
  • Who's next? by Mr. Piccolo (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:23PM
  • Ow! Babelfish sure mangled that one! by MikeTurk (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @03:44PM
  • Ow! Babelfish sure mangled that one! by MikeTurk (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @08:35PM
  • Which part did they violate? by MikeTurk (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @03:37PM
  • Get yer "WDYWTG Tomorrow" banners here! by Evro (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @04:13PM
  • So. This one is for real? by vead (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @02:32PM
  • Where do you want to be tommorow?(tm) by NotZed (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @04:35PM
  • Fight The Man by the_tsi (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:17PM
  • Laws Regarding Parody.... by TomQ (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @02:20PM
  • Fight The Man by vitaflo (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @02:49PM
  • You are here by TreesCanHurt (Score:1) Tuesday April 13 1999, @12:20PM
  • slogan contest by bluehell (Score:1) Tuesday April 13 1999, @01:20AM
  • My modest contribution. by Cedric C. Girouard (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @07:49PM
  • Meat of the Loom by Anti-Sean (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:26PM
  • Microsoft didn't sue Billy Graham in '97 for this by Peachy (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @03:21PM
  • What about the Borg. by W3S (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @02:17PM
  • Microsoft stole the idea from this group by kipling (Score:1) Tuesday April 13 1999, @12:04AM
  • Where do you want to go to die? by kipling (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @11:54PM
  • What about Oracle? by afx (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:42PM
  • Where do you want to go today by wolvie (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:20PM
  • defending Microsoft by spiffy_guy (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @02:08PM
  • Backing down. by spectecjr (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @06:44PM
  • Which part did they violate? by spectecjr (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @04:46PM
  • Backing down. by spectecjr (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @04:48PM
  • Backing down nonsense by spectecjr (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @08:51PM
  • Which part did they violate? by spectecjr (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @03:27PM
  • Microsoft is a bully. by spectecjr (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @03:29PM
  • Microsoft didn't sue Billy Graham in '97 for this by spectecjr (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @03:32PM
  • Backing down. by spectecjr (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:47PM
  • Which part did they violate? by spectecjr (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @04:29PM
  • Backing down. by spectecjr (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @06:40PM
  • I have no problem with it... by schon (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @05:10PM
  • A simple rule by leereyno (Score:1) Tuesday April 13 1999, @12:14AM
  • Where do you want to go by Chuck Jacobus (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @03:59PM
  • Who's next? by lgraba (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @03:51PM
  • Got a Linux Web Page? by Frodpo (Score:1) Tuesday April 13 1999, @03:58AM
  • Microsoft stole the idea from this group by Flip_1 (Score:1) Tuesday April 13 1999, @08:26PM
  • KDE has this slogan - not anymore by O.d. (Score:1) Wednesday April 14 1999, @06:32PM
  • more harm than good for MS? by dangerboy (Score:1) Monday April 12 1999, @01:18PM
  • KMFMS by TheCubic (Score:1) Tuesday April 13 1999, @11:06AM
  • Backing down. by ajdavis (Score:2) Monday April 12 1999, @01:12PM
  • KDE by finkployd (Score:2) Monday April 12 1999, @01:12PM
  • probably good for Linux by jetson123 (Score:2) Monday April 12 1999, @03:43PM
  • A phrase as a trademark? by jabber (Score:2) Monday April 12 1999, @09:28PM
  • VA Research by sammy baby (Score:2) Monday April 12 1999, @01:49PM
  • Backing down. by sammy baby (Score:2) Monday April 12 1999, @01:47PM
  • Who's next? by Mr. Piccolo (Score:2) Monday April 12 1999, @01:21PM
  • I love all of this wasted time... by AshleyB (Score:2) Monday April 12 1999, @01:34PM
  • Ow! Babelfish sure mangled that one! by SeanNi (Score:2) Monday April 12 1999, @07:17PM
  • Ow! Babelfish sure mangled that one! by SeanNi (Score:2) Monday April 12 1999, @02:39PM
  • Greyhound Slogan by AJWM (Score:2) Monday April 12 1999, @01:37PM
  • VA Research by AllDewedUp (Score:2) Monday April 12 1999, @01:12PM
  • Thanks for the citation, it was definitely informative (Where did you get it, btw?). Now my question is what did www.linux.de violate?

    The important phrases seem to be:
    "...in connection with the sale, offering for sale, distribution, or advertising of any goods or services or in connection with which such use is likely to cause confusion, or to cause mistake, or to deceive"

    and
    well, actually, the second one is a reprinting of the first in a different tense (corrent me if I'm wrong) in order to indicate those who make the infringement rather than those who use it.

    Anyhow, linux.de doesn't seem to qualify for:
    sale
    offering for sale
    distribution

    of any goods or services. Can they be called advertising for it? It looks like it, I guess. Is this the one that qualifies? Or do you say that it's the "likely to cause confusion, or to cause mistake, or to decieve" part?

    Btw, is "Where do you want to go tomorrow?" a "colorable imitation" of "Where do you want to go today?" What is the legal definition of colorable imitation? Do you know where it can be found? Can you find a dictionary definition of colorable imitation? I'm not used to that sort of language, so I'm curious to know what it means.

    Thanks for the info.


  • Backing down. (Score:4)

    by spectecjr (31235) on Monday April 12 1999, @02:33PM (#1938129) Homepage
    Where is it trademark infringement? Last I checked MS had "Where do you want to go today?" trademarked, not the slogan in question. Sure they're similar, but the criteria for trademarks is "Is it's use likely to cause confusion between products?", and there's no way Linux will ever be confused with an MS product.

    Look at it this way:

    If Pepsi had their cans EXACTLY as they are now, but put the Pepsi logo in the Coca Cola font (and I'm not talking about the swoosh here), it'd be no contest -- Coca Cola would win the ensuing lawsuit. But! You say, "It says PEPSI, not Coca-Cola! how can that be confusing"?

    Answer: Doesn't matter.

    Here's part of the reason:

    http://www.law.cornell.edu/topics/trademark.html

    Under state common law, trademarks are protected as part of the common law of unfair competition and registration is not required. See Unfair Competition. States' statutory provisions on trademarks differ but most have adopted a version of the Model Trademark Bill (MTB) or the Uniform Deceptive Trade Practices Act (UDTPA). The MTB provides for registration of trademarks while the UDTPA does not.

    ---

    And here's the kicker:


    The Lanham Act of 1946. ( http://www.law.cornell. edu/lanham/lanham.act.html#15usc1114 [cornell.edu])


    Sect. 1114. Remedies; infringement; innocent infringement by printers and publishers
    (1) Any person who shall, without the consent of the registrant--

    (a) use in commerce any reproduction, counterfeit, copy, or colorable imitation of a registered mark in connection with the sale, offering for sale, distribution, or advertising of any goods or services on or in connection with which such use is likely to cause confusion, or to cause mistake, or to deceive; or

    (b) reproduce, counterfeit, copy, or colorably imitate a registered mark and apply such reproduction, counterfeit, copy, or colorable imitation to labels, signs, prints, packages, wrappers, receptacles or advertisements intended to be used in commerce upon or in connection with the sale, offering for sale, distribution, or advertising of goods or services on or in connection with which such use is likely to cause confusion, or to cause mistake, or to deceive, shall be liable in a civil action by the registrant for the remedies hereinafter provided. Under subsection (b) hereof, the registrant shall not be entitled to recover profits or damages unless the acts have been committed with knowledge that such imitation is intended to be used to cause confusion, or to cause mistake, or to deceive.

    (2) Notwithstanding any other provision of this Act, the remedies given to the owner of a right infringed under this Act or to a person bringing an action under section 43(a) [15 USCS Sect. 1125(a)] shall be limited as follows:

    (A) Where any infringer or violator is engaged solely in the business of printing the mark or violating matter for others and establishes that he or she was an innocent infringer or innocent violator, the owner of the right infringed or person bringing the action under section 43(a) [15 USCS Sect. 1125(a)] shall be entitled as against such infringer or violator only to an injunction against future printing.

    (B) Where the infringement or violation complained of is contained in or is part of paid advertising matter in a newspaper, magazine, or other similar periodical or in an electronic communication as defined in section 2510(12) of title 18, United States Code, the remedies of the owner of the right infringed or person bringing the action under section 43(a) [15 USCS Sect. 1125(a)] as against the publisher or distributor of such newspaper, magazine, or other similar periodical or electronic communication shall be limited to an injunction against the presentation of such advertising matter in future issues of such newspapers, magazines, or other similar periodicals or in future transmissions of such electronic communications. The limitations of this subparagraph shall apply only to innocent infringers and innocent violators.

    (C) Injunctive relief shall not be available to the owher of the right infringed or person bringing the action under section 43(a) [15 USCS Sect. 1125(a)] with respect to an issue of a newspaper, magazine, or other similar periodical or an electronic communication containing infringing matter or violating matter where restraining the dissemination of such infringing matter or violating matter in any particular issue of such periodical or in an electronic communication would delay the delivery of such issue or transmission of such electronic communication after the regular time for such delivery or transmission, and such delay would be due to the method by which publication and distribution of such periodical or transmission of such electronic communication is customarily conducted in accordance with sound business practice, and not due to any method or device adopted to evade this section or to prevent or delay the issuance of an injunction or restraining order with respect to such infringing matter or violating matter.

    (D) As used in this paragraph--

    (i) the term "violator" means a person who violates section 43(a) [15 USCS Sect. 1125(a)]; and

    (ii) the term "violating matter" means matter that is the subject of a violation under section 43(a) [15 USCS Sect. 1125(a)].


    So there you have it. Most other countries' trademark laws follow the Lanham Act; this was all settled down around the time of the Geneva Copyright Convention.

    According to the letter (and spirit) of the law, Linux.De was indeed infringing a trademark.

    Also, the Michigan guy who's trying to register Where Do You Want To Go Tomorrow? ... well, he's still waiting for the patent to file. And by the look of it, he ain't going to get it.

    Simon
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