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Slashback: Attenuation, Maturity, Packaging

Posted by timothy on Wed Jun 28, 2000 04:00 PM
from the second-time-around dept.
In this episode of slashback, there's more on NanoStuff, censorship in various forms and venues, and further proof that the word "upstart" uttered or tapped in computer journalism regarding Linux is ever so much twaddle. You have been warned.

Sorry, but the print doesn't get any smaller. If the recent release of the Foresight Institute's nanotech guidelines intriguing to you, you might want to check out the new forum for nanotech advances and issues. bento writes: "From the press release: "I'm happy to report that one of Foresight's long-term goals -- to have a way to meet online that truly works -- is now a reality at http://nanodot.org. We think of this site as our daily newspaper -- all the news that's fit to "print" -- combined with a continual Nanoschmooze discussion. No login is needed to read the site." For those who are interested in nanotechnology's social and technological implications, this site should prove a great resource in finding out what's up in the field of nanotechnology."

One man's trash is other people's trash, too. psxndc writes: "FGNOnline has the scoop about the Interactive Entertainment Merchants Association unveiling new packaging options for PC Games at their annual conference. It brings up the point about games with large documentation not fitting into smaller DVD-type Keep Cases, but wasn't the digital revolution supposed to cut down if not eliminate the need for paper in the first place?? Most game-box contents are a jewel-cased CD, some docs, some ads, and a whole lot of unused space? Why?" Well, in the bad old days of the CD longbox (which are not that long ago), the most commonly cited reasons for the box of mostly-air were 1) the space is helpful for marketing purposes (pictures and blurbs and artwork, oh my!) and 2) everyone's favorite eupehmism for shoplifting, "shrinkage." Probably the same rules apply; game makers want to "stand out on the shelf." But if CDs can handle the switch, I bet games can, too.

How will the children survive? CuriousGeorge113 writes: "In a major decision today, a Federal Appeals Court has struck down COPA (The Children's Online Protection Act). According to this ACLU Press Release, a federal appeals court has deemed the law unconstitutional in nature and 'impossible to establish one "community standard" by which Internet speech could be governed.' You can also see the official court case here."

And in news that can only be called related ... Rude Turnip writes: "It looks like Mattel, one of the most despised toy companies discussed on Slashdot, is sellling off its notorious Cyber Patrol censorware. Cyber Patrol's parent company, The Learning Co., which is also owned by Mattel, is being sold off separately. Mattel said they would like to concentrate on their "core competency" of toys. The lucky buyer of Cyber Patrol is the British firm, JSB Software Technologies, PLC, who paid $100 million. With people like Jamie McCarthy out there fighting these purveyours of censorship and great sites like peacefire.org, I bet JSB will soon realize they paid just a little too much :-)" Maybe it's just not a sellers market; the article indicating that Cyber Patrol was to be sold went up a few months ago.

In six years, Tux will be driving. xannax writes: "I just bought a new IWILL VD133 motherboard, and after the usual setup and such, popped in the configuration cdrom - and was suprised to see a Linux kernel boot up on the monitor. When the cd boots, it gives users without an fdisk'ed partition a chance to make disks for board and chipset config; but the neat thing is the use of Linux for the cd. I mean, two years ago, when I wore my "Penguin Power" t-shirt, most of the attention I got was from hockey fans. But just as the logo on the shirt has faded from repeated washing, the exact opposite has happened to the visibility of the Linux OS; it's gone from hackers and nerds only to mainstream. Great to see a company with a reputation like IWILL use Linux in this fashion."

Come sirrah Jack Straw! MrM writes: "An IDG.net story on CNN says that in the face of increasing pressure from privacy groups, business groups and Internet service providers (ISPs), the U.K. government is backing away from some of the more controversial aspects of its e-mail surveillance bill currently under consideration in the House of Lords." The controversy is mostly over little things like, oh, (from the article) "Under the provisions of the RIP bill, the U.K. government -- specifically the Home Office and its head, the Home Secretary -- can demand encryption keys to any and all data communications with a prison sentence of two years for those who do not comply with the order."

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  • Re:Print manuals are always best by shepd (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @02:00PM
  • Re:Software that comes with books by brunes69 (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @12:00PM
  • Re:That last thing... by Garpenlov (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @02:11PM
  • Hrmm by Dungeon Dweller (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @02:13PM
  • Game packaging (Score:4)

    by coldguy (31631) on Wednesday June 28 2000, @02:17PM (#970135) Homepage
    I don't know about anyone else, and maybe it's some sort of crime or something to say this here, but I like printed material and almost always prefer it to online or CD based documentation. Here's my reasoning.

    • Books are portable. Yeah, so are CDs, but to use them, I also need to haul around some portable computer-like device, which would cost me at the very least around $300 to accquire.
    • Books are durable. Nobody freaks when you knock a book off the table. The same can't be said for laptops. Spilled beverages might result in stains and wrinkled pages on books, instead of the major damage they often do to electronic devices. With CDs, you have to worry about scratches...
    • Books are malleable. What I mean by this is that I can fold pages, make notes in margins, highlight sections, etc, all with the simple and cheap tool known as a pen.
    • Books are easier to read than screens. This one is completely subjective, but I find that it's a lot more tolerable to stare at print for 8 hours straight than it is to stare at a CRT or LCD.
    • Books are reliable. They don't run out of batteries, they don't run out of bandwidth and they never ever crash
    • Books are easier to use. You don't have to wait for them to boot, and flipping pages is even simpler than clicking a mouse.
    • Print makes more efficient use of display space. You can fit a lot more readable text on one 8 1/2 by 11 sheet of paper than you could ever fit on a standard 17 inch monitor.

    The only possible advantages I see in online documentation:

    • It has the potential to pull fresh, updated content from a remote location.
    • You can do full-text searches.
    • You can embed video, audio, 3D worlds, whatever into it.

    Those are nice features, but I'd still choose paper any day of the week. I'm particularly fond of the emerging trend of packaging books with a CD-ROM containing the text of the book plus extra goodies - that way, you get the best of both worlds.

    In summary, if it comes down to a choice between large packaging and online-only docs, I'll take the large packaging any day. Maybe I'm just selfish, but hey, I like books.

  • Re:Incorect... by Estanislao Martínez (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @02:37PM
  • Simple Solution for larger manuals by phuzzie (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @04:33PM
  • Yeah... by Greyfox (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @02:49PM
  • Re:Free speech by Estanislao Martínez (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @02:50PM
  • No "Community Standards" by khog (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @03:00PM
  • Re:Incorect (drifting offtopic)... by TheReverand (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @04:37PM
  • No... by SvnLyrBrto (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @04:38PM
  • Re:Time to use StegFS by Booker (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @04:39PM
  • I should give a shit about the poor? by No-op (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @04:54PM
  • Re:Yeah... by ChadN (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @04:57PM
  • Re:Do you think I don't know my own name? by No-op (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @05:00PM
  • Re:Single CD Games by Destrius (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:31PM
  • Re:Ooo! Pretty Picture! Must be true! by Matrix42 (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @05:24PM
  • One more reason by restless_ne'erdowell (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @12:30AM
  • Re:Software that comes with books by fiziko (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @12:48AM
  • Re:No "Community Standards" by FunkyChild (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @01:13AM
  • Re:The net is a clique of the privileged. by Steve B (Score:2) Thursday June 29 2000, @01:38AM
  • Re:Look further (still offtopic)... by TheReverand (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @01:45AM
  • Request for Information about human computers by BigTom (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @02:03AM
  • Re:Single CD Games by Cederic (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @02:04AM
  • by rjh (40933) <rjh@NoSpAm.sixdemonbag.org> on Wednesday June 28 2000, @12:07PM (#970156)
    (I am an InfoSec professional IRL, but this is absolutely not professional advice. Nor am I speaking for my company.)

    Who says you'd even have to go to the trouble of actually encrypting it. Well encrypted data should be indistiguishable from randomness.

    Not quite. Look at a PGP message, for instance. Most people would probably agree that, properly used, PGP provides good encryption--but it also has a very recognizable message format. There's an entity which specifies the algorithm to use (IDEA, 3DES, CAST128, etc.), an entity which is the sender's public key, an entity which is... etc., and so on. If the PGP message format was not precisely defined and recognizable, it would be vastly more difficult to use PGP. ("Damn! Err, okay, so what algorithm did they use to encrypt this, anyway?")

    If all you want to do is run data through a cryptographic algorithm, then yes, it will come back out as something which should pass every statistical test for randomness.

    Running data through a cryptographic system, what comes back out should be easily recognizable as the output of that specific system (unless, of course, the system was specifically designed to be indistinguishable from random noise).

    Very few people use cryptographic algorithms by themselves. Most of the time, when people say "I encrypted it with Blowfish", they mean "I encrypted it using a cryptosystem which used Blowfish for its cryptographic core".
  • say, this would be a perfect time to ask.. by mcc (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @12:11PM
  • Re:Software that comes with books by eufaula (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @12:13PM
  • Re:Print manuals are always best by RingTailedLemur (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @12:18PM
  • Time to use StegFS by Booker (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @12:21PM
  • Re:Print manuals are always best by PlazMan (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @12:22PM
  • Re:Just a few facts for you.. by Estanislao Martínez (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @03:02PM
  • Check out STAND by JimDabell (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @12:27PM
  • Re:I like game manuals.. by raresilk (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @03:05PM
  • You misread the graph by quokka70 (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @03:17PM
  • Re:Time to use StegFS by Alpha State (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @03:18PM
  • Do ACs know how to form an arguement... by SvnLyrBrto (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @03:19PM
  • Re:Incorect (drifting offtopic)... by Estanislao Martínez (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @05:45PM
  • by Smack (977) on Wednesday June 28 2000, @03:19PM (#970169) Homepage
    Someone has to make their boxes smaller first, and then their product will be less visible on the shelf. There ARE people who buy computer software by looking at the front and back of the box, and they're going to go for the bigger box. So the manufacturer will lose if they're the only ones who make their boxes smaller...

    Now console game companies can do it because the console maker can impose packaging standards from above in a way that noone can in the PC world. Everyone's equal, and no one has to go first.
  • Guide to sewing up the divide by Rares Marian (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @05:50PM
  • Re:Print manuals are always best by alleria (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @03:23PM
  • Re:I should give a shit about the poor? by Rares Marian (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @06:01PM
  • Re:Just a few facts for you.. by Rares Marian (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @06:05PM
  • Excellent! by Estanislao Martínez (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @06:08PM
  • Look further (still offtopic)... by SvnLyrBrto (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @06:27PM
  • Re:Just a few facts for you.. by Municipa (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @06:32PM
  • Don't you love technology? by Rares Marian (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @06:44PM
  • Re:I like game manuals... by sykik (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @02:07AM
  • Re:Yeah... by Greyfox (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @06:56PM
  • 'Slashback' category by JPelorat (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @02:18AM
  • Barking up the wrong tree by Rares Marian (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @07:02PM
  • Re:I like game manuals.. by z84976 (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @02:27AM
  • ALERT!! VIRUS!! by Pseudonymus Bosch (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @02:45AM
  • Reading on screen vs. on paper by ben_ (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @02:45AM
  • Software that comes with books by Dungeon Dweller (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:15AM
  • Re:I like game manuals.. by Cycon (Score:2) Thursday June 29 2000, @02:54AM
  • concerning mattel.. by hoffey (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:13AM
  • Free speech by KeyShark (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:16AM
  • WTF? by Count Spatula (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:16AM
  • Nanodot by michael.creasy (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:13AM
  • Re:Game packaging by Cycon (Score:2) Thursday June 29 2000, @03:13AM
  • CyberPatrol by moderation (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:13AM
  • Re:umm.. whats up with this? by hoffey (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:14AM
  • Re:Game packaging by tweek (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @03:18AM
  • Print manuals are always best by MostlyHarmless (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:23AM
  • Re:Game packaging by Surak (Score:2) Thursday June 29 2000, @03:50AM
  • That last thing... (Score:5)

    by Greyfox (87712) on Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:27AM (#970197) Homepage
    I was just talking to a friend about encryption stuff the other day. He's of the opinion that if encrypted information on your hard drive is supoenaed, you have to provide the passphrases to decrypt it or face jail time for contempt of court. I'd think this would violate the 5th ammendment here in the states, but IANAL so what do I know? Discuss.

    While we're on that topic, if they're looking for evidence that you killed OJ's wife and find that you're innocent of that crime (Headline: Real Killers Still At Large!) but found that you bought a pound of crack and are the primary provider of Live Goat Porn for the east coast, can they legally convict you on those things? Touchy stuff, eh?

    Meanwhile, I'm merrily encrypting data from /dev/random to (similarly random) keys and mailing it off to an assortment of random UK Citizens with various amusing filenames like "murderconfession.txt.pgp," "your_herion_is_in.txt.pgp" etc. Guess you guys will be pretty fucked when they come a knocking and demanding that you provide the keys. God I'm a bastard sometimes, really.

    On the plus side, perhaps this would persuade people that it really IS a good idea to set the expiration date on those PGP keys. Nothing worse than being locked up for a couple of years because you can't remember the passphrase for the key you generated 8 years ago. And I expect Belgium will welcome the exodus of businesses leaving the UK. Have you been to Belgium? Every cloud has a silver lining, eh?

  • Come sirrah Jack Straw! by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:15AM
  • Slashback some more by Wah (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:29AM
  • Game boxes aren't getting smaller... by SecretAsianMan (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @12:31PM
  • You're probably right, of course. Still, they first have to:

    1) Find out a way to make browsing easier. Don't get this confused with searching, which is _much_ easier on the computer because you don't have to look things up in first the contents, then the index, while spending 10 sec. inbetween each step to find the page. Browsing, OTOH, is a _lot_ easier in a book, where you can just flip through and look for interesting stuff. As a programmer, I have no clue how this would be implemented, but it would help a lot.

    2) Make it easier to read. Despite all the hype recently surrounding e-books, they still strain your eyes after a few hours.

    3) Figure out how to display the manual without flipping away from a fullscreen game, something that will never be possible due to the nature of the beast. This is the biggest time when print manuals still rock.

    Of course, the obvious solution is just to make the learning curve shallower... but hey :-)


  • Do you think I don't know my own name? by Estanislao Martínez (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @12:51PM
  • by orpheus (14534) on Wednesday June 28 2000, @01:03PM (#970203)
    The 'CPU power' [lfw.org] chart disgusted me. If it really reflects the data in Kurzweil's book, I fear for humanity, because it was ludicrously rigged, and should have caused an outcry for such a highly regarded bestseller, yet apparently even the geeks didn't notice.

    Yup, you heard me. The chart is rigged. Both with carefully selected points and with outright fabricated data.

    First, point selection: Where are the mini's and mainframes and supercomputers of the 80s/90s? ("They aren't the most cost effective!" you cry) Okay, then where are the wang and other desktop (sometimes desk-sized) programmable calculators of the 60's/70's? The HP and other pocket calculators of the 70's/80's? ("They aren't the same thing," you argue, weakly.)

    Second, bad data: "Fine," I say, "then do you really expect me to believe that a Hollerith tabulator took 3-30 hrs per operation? 10^(-4) to 10^(-5)ops/sec (according to the chart) = 10,000-100,000 seconds/op. In fact, there isn't a single computer capable of 1 op/sec until 1950 in the chart. Am I to believe that business spent millions on computers that were far slower than a moderately bright child using an abacus?

    And how about the Apple II, the first personal computer I owned -- a 6502 used two clocks (out of phase) at roughly 1 MHz to run 500K single cycle ops/sec. I don't recall any common op codes that took more than 5-6 cycles, but there may have been one or two oddballs at 7-8 under worst case scenarios. (Most took 2-3.) Yet the Apple is listed as being roughly 30K ops/sec? (log(ops/sec) = 4.5)?

    "Oh but we're talking about 64-bit adds" you argue, whipping out your abacus "...er, make that 'multiply's!"

    I could invent justifications for each point on the chart, but by the time you're done, you'll realize, as I did, that the chart isn't worth the paper it's written on, and that it is utterly shocking that this hasn't been pointed out and ridiculted a million times by now.

    3-30 hours for a single operation? C'mon!
  • Re:Time to use StegFS by Chandon Seldon (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @03:34PM
  • Re:That last thing... by Detritus (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @01:06PM
  • Re:Game boxes aren't getting smaller... by rootofevil (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @01:11PM
  • Re:Print manuals are always best by Frater 219 (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @03:36PM
  • Re:Do you think I don't know my own name? by Estanislao Martínez (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @03:38PM
  • Re:Do you think I don't know my own name? by 348 (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @03:47PM
  • Re:Do you think I don't know my own name? by TheReverand (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @03:49PM
  • Re:That last thing... by Zomart9th (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @07:03PM
  • Re:Incorect (drifting offtopic)... by SvnLyrBrto (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @04:09PM
  • Re:Incorect (drifting offtopic)... by SvnLyrBrto (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @07:21PM
  • Re:Do ACs know how to form an arguement... by TheReverand (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @04:18PM
  • Re:Time to use StegFS by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @07:32PM
  • Yeah well listen... by Rares Marian (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @07:37PM
  • Re:Public Statement by kapella (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @07:39PM
  • The COPA Decision... by sconeu (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @08:17PM
  • Re:Incorect (drifting offtopic)... by Estanislao Martínez (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @08:24PM
  • I didn't lose, I went to bed... by SvnLyrBrto (Score:2) Thursday June 29 2000, @05:08AM
  • Re:CyberPatrol by Phroggy (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @06:14AM
  • Re:The net is a clique of the privileged. by dr_strangelove (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @06:16AM
  • Re:That last thing... by bluGill (Score:2) Thursday June 29 2000, @06:25AM
  • by Danse (1026) on Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:34AM (#970224)

    I'd be perfectly happy if manuals for most apps were in digital form only, but when it comes to games, the printed manual is much preferred. This is mainly because when I'm playing a game, it's rather difficult to switch to a text editor to read up on how to do something, and then switch back to the game. Much easier to just keep the manual in my lap.

  • Re:I should give a shit about the poor? by keyeto (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @06:35AM
  • children's rights by purefizz (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:34AM
  • Ok. I read this entire thread... by John_Prophet (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @07:06AM
  • Re:Software that comes with books by FFFish (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:35AM
  • RIP bill and Human Rights by u02sgb (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @10:14AM
  • Re:Print manuals are always best by acfoo (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:36AM
  • Browsing: sorry can't resist by monkey # omega+1 (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @12:48PM
  • Re:Nanodot by zeck (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:39AM
  • Re:Software that comes with books by Azog (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @01:15PM
  • The net is a clique of the privileged. by Estanislao Martínez (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:39AM
  • Re:Single CD Games by geekoid (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @01:17PM
  • Single CD Games by HomeySmurf (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:42AM
  • Just a few facts for you.. by BandSaw (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @01:22PM
  • Re:Come sirrah Jack Straw! by jonnythan (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @01:26PM
  • Re:That last thing... by Anonymous Coed (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @01:35PM
  • Incorect... by SvnLyrBrto (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @01:54PM
  • Re:That last thing... by cpt kangarooski (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @01:56PM
  • Re:That last thing... by NaughtyEddie (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @01:59PM
  • Pretty Picture (now with improved math) by orpheus (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @08:43PM
  • wow (offtopic) by SvnLyrBrto (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @08:58PM
  • Re:****TROLL ALERT**** by jlb (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @09:19PM
  • Re:Come sirrah Jack Straw! by Igirisu (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @10:12PM
  • Re:Software that comes with books by Rovaani (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @10:34PM
  • Re:wow (offtopic) by Kimble (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @02:48PM
  • Re:****TROLL ALERT**** by jlb (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @02:52PM
  • Re:Come sirrah Jack Straw! by jonnythan (Score:2) Thursday June 29 2000, @03:36PM
  • Re:That last thing... by helfire57 (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @04:12PM
  • Re:Nanodot by fluffhead (Score:2) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:42AM
  • Re:No "Community Standards" by khog (Score:1) Thursday June 29 2000, @05:02PM
  • Public Statement (Score:3)

    by periscope (20296) on Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:49AM (#970254) Homepage
    Hi, I'd just like to let you all know publically that, should the RIP Bill go through Lords and become Law in its present state, I WILL TAKE THE BRITISH GOVERNMENT TO THE EUROPEAN COURT OF HUMAN RIGHTS. In addition I will seek to have Jack Straw arrested and locked up for a very long time for his insistance to commit human rights crimes.

    Jack Straw is introducing a LOT of new legislation that gives the Home Secretary (him) a LOT of power. In a way this is worse than dictators such as Hitler because Straw is doing this silently under the guise of protecting the public interest. He must be stopped from committing human rights crimes and I will try to do anything possible in the courts that I can to stop him.

    Perhaps we do need some kind of new provisions in the law, but let's do it by extending existing laws not introducing new laws . I will not ever hand over my computer decryption keys and if the British Government don't like it then I'll have the ECHR remove them from office.

    -- Jonathan.

  • Re:That last thing... by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:50AM
  • Re:Print manuals are always best by alleria (Score:1) Friday June 30 2000, @06:02AM
  • Re:That last thing... by Monkee (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:52AM
  • Re:That last thing... by Russ Steffen (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:52AM
  • Re:Print manuals are always best by Coz (Score:1) Wednesday June 28 2000, @11:53AM
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