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Journal TechnoLust's Journal: Talked to Boo's dad tonight 63

Her dad just called and told me to come to where he works. He wanted to give me back my baseball cards and talk. When I got there he said that as of right now I am no longer allowed to see Boo, and they are quitting the church. He said that we are all 4 going to sit down and talk about it whenever her mom decides it is time. He said Boo sat down and did a lot of listening last night. Which most likely means her mom told her what a terrible person she was for wanting to date me. I gave him the number of an ex-gf so he could call her. (See two JEs prior to this one.) He said that isn't enough he wants more. (I told him I didn't date a lot.) He told me the only reason that I ever tried to befriend him was to get to her. I guess I'm going to be doing a lot of praying the next little bit.

I hurt so bad I can't describe it. The closest thing I can think of would be an elephant standing on my chest and head. I can't breathe. I've barely eaten all day. I keep trying to make myself, but I can't. I hate this. I can't believe he told me all that shit about it was ok with them if we wanted to date. I'm just sick of them. I'm not going to say anything about what I'm going to do because I'm too emotional to make any decisions. I know I will wait on Boo if that is what it takes, but I hope it doesn't come to that. And as always I will try to do what God wants. It has just never been this painful before. Heh. Funny thing is, I know Mom is praying for us right now. I can feel it. I'm starting to feel better already. Not great, but bearable. I hope Boo can feel it too. I miss her so much already.

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Talked to Boo's dad tonight

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  • This is definitely some kind of test for you. I'm sorry you have to meet up with so much adversity, but the only thing I would say to Boo is to really buckle down at school and make sure that once she turns 18 and graduates, that she's out of there. Her parents are making poor decisions and on top of that, they're not trustworthy. As a father of two girls, if one of my daughters was dating a 26-year-old when she was 17, I'd be very suspicious, too. However, if he were as honest and forthright as you are, an
    • Re:Sorry, TL. (Score:1, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward
      hes not so honest and forthright. he snuck around with her against her parents wishes, he has countermanded their wishes at every turn. in the name of god, that its what god wants him to do? this was coming, we knew this was coming way back when we found out how young she is. how many people told him theyd face him down with a shotgun if he came near their daughters? this whole situation is part and parcel of dating a girl who is still a child in all manner of the word, except perhaps physically. her parent
      • Insightful my mother fucking ass. Didn't you ever hear of "if you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all"? Nobody saw it coming, and the only reason we know any of it is because he tells us so in this journal. He could not tell us a thing. And if you don't want to know about it, don't read.

        As far as what god wants him to do, it's between him and his god. As far as I can tell, he's done nothing "wrong" except fall in love with a girl that our society deems "too young". In other parts of the wo

        • I'll first say that I sincerely hope that things work out for the best for TL and Boo. But, the facts don't exactly support "honest and forthright". Up to a point, perhaps. But what we've been reading in TL's journal is mostly how he and Boo sneak around behind her parents' backs. What would your reaction have been if a daughter's boyfriend had agreed to a set of rules, then had systematically gone behind your back and broken all of them?

          I don't think that Boo's parents are doing the right thing, b
          • I agreed that we would not sneak around and she would not call me from school as long as they allowed us to see each other. While they were abiding by the deal, we did also. Once they stopped letting us see each other, we began to sneak around. Does that make it right? No. Did I hate sneaking? Yes. Would I do it again? Damn skippy.

            The only one that can really improve things is Boo
            That's why I'm trying to encourage her to be totally honest with them. I can't MAKE her, but I can encourage her. She

          • What would your reaction have been if a daughter's boyfriend had agreed to a set of rules, then had systematically gone behind your back and broken all of them?

            His "sneaking around" was in direct proportion to them going back on their various words to him and her, as I recall. As far as I can tell, he was responding not all that outrageously to them lying to him. And he would then try to talk and be honest with them, only to have it blow up again. And having talked with TL, there are things making it even

    • It's actually only been relatively recent in human history that we as a species have extended adolesence into the 20's. And perhaps merely the Western world.
      Not to change the subject, but... I think that's as a society, not as a species. I'm 22 and I still feel like a kid. I think moving out on my own and being self-sufficient will determine when I become an adult, but I sure don't feel like it now or anytime soon.
      • Wow... I'm 21 and I've lived on my own since I was 18 - 17 if you count a very short stint in the USAF (They say I've got asthma). I couldn't imagine living with either of my parents longer than I did... of course my family is dysfunctional so that might have something to do with it.

        Also, if I were to ever fail at what I do, I could always go back and live with one of them. So maybe that's why I flew the coop at the earliest possible convenience.
  • this is a time when boo has to figure out how to deal with her parents on her own. i'm not saying you should avoid a talk if given the opportunity. but she isn't going to learn to handle these things on her own if you are there backing her up.

    how long until she is 18? do you think her folks have considered the chance they may not have control of her after that?
    • sorry, i forgot to say anything comforting. i think you're looking in the right place for comfort. if you let divine will guide you, you'll be fine.
    • She's been handling it for years. She doesn't need me, but it's always nice to have someone there to hold you. I know I could use her touch now.

      She turns 18 on March 18th, so 9 months and 12 days. I think they think they will still be able to control her, but they won't.

  • Sorry, TL, that really sucks. From the sounds of it, she's not gonna stick around with them after her 18th birthday, so remember - this whole mess will be resolved to the satisfaction of you two, and her parents can delude themselves about her departure being your fault.
    • I know. We only have to deal with this for 9.5 more months. But I'd like to have a nice 9.5 months and want to have a relationship with them later on. But, with my last little bit of humor, I think, "At least we'll never argue over who's parents to visit on holidays!" :-)
  • I know that you can make it through this, but I'm sorry that you have to.
    • Thanks, SW. I feel the same way. It's crazy how God has blessed me so much with friends, family, money, etc. But I would give up all my worldly possesions to be with her. The only thing I would regret about doing that is that I'd want her to be better off than that. I want her to have things even though I know she only cares about me. It's just strange to me that everyone struggles in a different way. This way is ours, and I hope that by doing what God would have us to do, He will bless us with a lon
  • You'll make it. Hang in there.

    Proverbs 3:25, 3:31, and my personal favorite, 15:1.

  • I cheated on the love of my life, while she wore my mother's engagement ring. I have all but lost her, she is all I think about even 4 months later. I have tried to kill myself 3 times. Don't do anything stupid. I know I would move on if I thought I could. We still talk everyday and some days she seems like she can forgive me, she still only sees me, not moving on either. Damn I feel I am whining. Anyways, faith is something I do not have, use yours.
  • They are just that, hard lessons.

    These people aren't trustworthy - you realize of course that you marry your woman's family, in some respects.

    TL, the heart isn't a good enough reason to make yourself suffer. Lots of fish in the sea man. It's painful now, but it seems to me you'd be saving yourself a lot of trouble now and later if you broaden your horizons a bit.

    I mean, dude, you are only 26. You do not HAVE to be married anytime soon.

    Do some dating. Hook up with some chicks.

    I know you aren't going
    • Do some dating. Hook up with some chicks.

      Do some praying. Hook up with God. I know you're arleady doing that. Keep on doing that. HBI's advice is good for some, but not your situation.
      • No blue bolt of lightning is going to come down from the heavens and change wretched people into non-wretched people.

        Common sense indicates you defend yourself from such people by excising them from your life.
  • I like that word. Delayed. Your relationship with Boo is merely delayed.

    I won't give you the old cliche of "if it's meant to be, then..." blah blah blah. No. I will say that this is simply a delay.

    A stumbling point.

    You still feel the same way about her. And she you.

    The parents are pulling out of their church in order to more easily exert what they believe to be "good" control over their daughter. The bottom line is that in due time they HAVE to release her to the world - every parents job - and "pr
  • But seems it's not in good shape your relationship. Sorry to hear, but I read in the comments thats she's nearly 18...

    Oh, and, strange idea to change church just because you're there. Boy that are some extreme measures.

  • I first thought that they were being stupid for no reason, then I read the previous JE.

    I'm sure that Boo's parents are freaked out about the marriage conversation, but they're also most likely freaked out about her brother and his gf. And yes, I know they blame the girlfriend, because it doesn't take 2 to tango.

    Asshats. People like this are part of the reason I left the south. Women are held to a different standard, and are both responsible for their partner's sexual activity, and need to be protected fro
    • If they're willing to CHANGE CHURCHES (or stop going altogether) to keep her away from you is entirely stupid.
      My thoughts exactly, and he said I'M the one not doing God's will.
    • I'm sure that Boo's parents are freaked out about the marriage conversation, but they're also most likely freaked out about her brother and his gf. And yes, I know they blame the girlfriend, because it doesn't take 2 to tango.

      Damn, KshG... beat me right to the punch.

      We have to remember we are hearing only one side of the story (not to say you are lying TL, but its a perspective thing).

      Think of it this way... you have a 17 year old daughter, she's dating a MUCH older man. You see her as a child, yet
    • Rather than write the same thing myself, I'll agree with this. The changing churches thing is more than a bit loony.

      TL, Angie and I were broken up for about seven months. No problem. You can do it standing on your head. But I suggest drinking a lot in the meantime.

      And I must say that when/if you have a daughter, you'll be able to empathize with some of their actions. (Note: not agree with or accept or repeat, but empathize.)
  • and this once, i promise not to brick you. I'm home in the evening and will listen.

    but mostly, i want to say that i think this is appropriate for right now. It hits you hard but you need to be backed off, she needs the time to crystallise a bit, and her parents will leave her alone a little more maybe while she gets older if they feel like they've won.

    In the meantime, you stay calm and live your life with her in it as a long-distance relationship for a little while.

    At least this puts an end to the sneaki
    • and her parents will leave her alone a little more maybe while she gets older if they feel like they've won.
      No Sol, they won't. I wish they would, but they won't. I have asked her several times if I should just back off completely to make it easier on her. She told me they always find something to complain about. She said being with me made it bearable, and it is just as bad if I'm not there, but then she has the added pain of me not being there. They keep her locked at home doing chores because they
      • Hm. There's something sowmehat more humbling for you in realising the fact that you apparently NEED most of the major religions praying for you...
        • I didn't say I needed it, it just makes me feel good that people of different belief systems are mature enough to say, "Even though this guy isn't 'one of us', I still care about him enough to do something that I think will help, even if he doesn't think it will help." It isn't that I think your gods can help me, Sol, it's that you do, so you are asking them to. You could be praying to a grasshopper, and as long as you believed that grasshopper would help me, I'd feel just as honored. I hope that didn't
          • *i'm* saying you need it. And my insult is that you consider our 'gods' to be different, which you kNOW is not my belief. *sigh* i think love is meeing with yer mind, my friend, so i'll give you some slack.. but boy, eight months ago would you be getting a brick!!
            • Thanks for the slack. I don't want to lose you while I'm dealing with this. Like I said, I don't mean to insult your beliefs, but it's hard to phrase something so that it agrees with both of our beliefs since they are different.
  • I hurt so bad I can't describe it. The closest thing I can think of would be an elephant standing on my chest and head. I can't breathe.

    I felt the same way when my ex-wife told me that she was leaving and we couldn't resolve our problems. Hurt like hell and totally sucked. I'm sorry you get to experience that.

    The good news is that it gets better. It's amazing how things have a way of working out. Just hang in there and remember what's important to you in life. You can't appreciate the high points in life
  • This may very well sound formulaic and cliched, but that doesn't make it any less true.

    Not only so, but we also rejoice in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance character; and character, hope. And hope does not disappoint us, because God has poured out his love into our hearts by the Holy Spirit, whom he has given us. --Romans 5:3-5 NIV

    If you take a lump of coal, subject it to high temperature and pressure one of two things is going to happen. Either it is g

    • No it's not cliche. I actually thanked God last night, not for the suffering, but for the growth that will result from it. I know He is still with me, I can feel His presence. And if He wasn't I would have already given up hope. I'm praying for God's will. That all 4 of us will hear His voice and accept the answer, even if it isn't what we wanted to hear. I'm also asking God to protect her and comfort her, because I know she's hurting, I can feel it.
  • At the risk of sounding preachy...I really haven't weighed in on this subject much, so I'm taking the opportunity to do so now. The funny thing is...nothing I'm going to say has anything to do with Boo, or the age difference, or anything else. It's pretty much all about you. Read at your own risk. :)

    Ya know, TL -- if you read back through all your journals, I think the one thing that's most prominent through all of this is that you're an eternal optimist. Look back at how you write about her parents.

    • by btlzu2 ( 99039 ) *
      Yeah, what she said!

      That was good. Really damn good. Especially the Yoda and Lloyd Dobler shout-outs. :)

      I'm just now starting to work at finding how others may not be thinking of my welfare. It's hard for me as well because I always think the good will come out, but life really ain't that way.

      Sorry, just re-hashing, but this posting was dead on I'm afraid. I've been there too--beating my head against the wall, too naive to realize it doesn't matter that I'm beating my head against the wall and just hu
    • One hundred percent agreement. I hadn't seen it until Daoine pointed it out, but it's there, TL--they're actively toying with you, and you need to stop playing by their rules and start playing by yours (and society's).

      All in all, you're doing better than my other 27-year-old-acquiantance-who-was-dating-a-17-yr-o l d...
      He's in jail right now, because her parents found out. OTOH, they had been having sex and there were nude pictures etc involved (all this came out at the trial), so never let anyone tell yo
    • I have wanted to several times. It would be so nice to just cut them out of my life until she's 18 and then swoop in and rescue her, but there are problems with that.

      1) I don't believe that is what God would want me to do. He says to keep forgiving. Yes they hurt me, yes, they are doing it intentionally, and they may never stop trying to. But I will continue to love them and forgive them, because that is what I am supposed to do according to my beliefs.
      2) Boo can't cut them out of her life, and if I c

      • and if I am to call myself Christ-like then I have to act the part.

        Small correction, you need to *be* the part. :)

      • It would be so nice to just cut them out of my life until she's 18 and then swoop in and rescue her

        Not quite what I meant. So I'll clarify...although we'll probably have to get into a much deeper religious discussion to get to the bottom of what I'm saying, since it's deeply grounded in my beliefs.

        I never said that you would stop forgiving, loving, and hoping for them. What I did say is that you need to break the cycle of abuse.

        Right now it's open-hunting season on you, and their actions are predict

        • You want to comfort her, you give them more ammo for abuse.
          It isn't just my decision though. We are in a relationship. Boo is my partner. The decisions affect her too. This particular decision affects her more. I have explained to her that it would be easier. She told not to leave her, even for a minute. So I will not. I let myself be hurt because of my love for her. I don't resent her for it or for asking me to go through it, because she is, as you say, getting it worse. the part of the verse y
    • If this slashdot thing doesn't work out, consider going into Therapy/Social work.

      No, no no. I'm not saying YOU need the therapy! ;)

      If I had mod points, you would get a hard earned "+5 insightful."

      P.S.: I love the above post and want to have its children.
      • P.S.: I love the above post and want to have its children.

        Don't you wanna take the post out for a drink or something? Make sure that it's really the post for you? What if the post thinks you're moving too fast?

  • At that point, if you think you can support her, head off to Vegas.
  • While I suspect that your locale is nothing like New York (highest per-capita lawyer in the nation), I think it'd time to pay $200 to a member of your local bar to find out exactly what the laws are.

    If they're being that drastic, it behooves you to investigate to see exactly when "the soonest possible time to leave home" is. And once you have that, determining when is simply a matter of passing enough time nad deciding when the pain of leaving exceeds the pain of staying.

    (Don't forget to ask "what can I
  • When you've been married 50 years, this time of seperation will seem very short :-)

  • Feel free to disregard or argue with me. I'm sure I don't have all the story. I have placed additional comments in footnotes because they are so long they were messing up the flow.
    When you sit down with her parents, remember that this is - at some level - a business-like negotiation. Be prepared to accept some blame (1) for the actions that they, as parents and guardians (2) perceive to be negative. Demonstrate respect (3) for their feelings/positions. Remember that some lies are perceptions, even if th
    • We haven't had the sit down talk yet. I did accept the blame Saturday night. In fact, I told her dad that it was wrong of us to hide it, and as the male in the relationship (I believe the man is the spiritual leader and is therefor responsible for the moral actions of the couple) I should have been more adamant that we be more straightforward with them. I admitted that we had let them perceive things a certain way on purpose and manipulated them using generalized statements.

      I will DEFINITELY use the "Wh

  • Let me try a riff off daoine's post [slashdot.org].

    It's okay to be an eternal optimist. It's okay to forgive Boo's folks unconditionally. It's maybe okay -- I doubt it, but maybe -- to deal with this as a battle of wills.

    It's not okay to think you can deal rationally with people who are delusional.

    What you're getting from her parents are not reasons. They are justifications, rationalizations, words they're making sound good so they can get what they want. You cannot win an argument with them, because they aren't really
  • One thing that always brings me comfort, from the Lord's Prayer:

    "Thy will be done."

    It tells me everything will turn out alright, because God is in control. You cannot be where God is not, and His will cannot be undone.

Mathematicians practice absolute freedom. -- Henry Adams