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Journal Some Woman's Journal: Sleep Eludes Me 42

Journal by Some Woman

Because I can't stop thinking about the sheer number of assholes who walk the face of the earth. I wonder if there are enough good people to counter them, or if that's even possible.

More specifically, I just found out what caused one of my friends to drop out of college and move back home more than a year ago. And if I ever encounter the person responsible, you can bet there will be a dull, rusty knife involved.

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Sleep Eludes Me More

Sleep Eludes Me

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  • ... although judging by your anger, I can guess the nature of the offence - and if it's what I think it is, I'd hold the bastard down while you insert said rusty knife.
  • forced your friend out of college how? harassment? fraud? something else?
  • More specifically, I just found out what caused one of my friends to drop out of college and move back home more than a year ago. And if I ever encounter the person responsible, you can bet there will be a dull, rusty knife involved.

    So, it was a romantic entaglement, that didn't work out very well? (It couldn't be a random rape case--that would have been reported.)

    One thing that I've noticed is that there is ALWAYS another side to things. The best examples I can think of are two friends of mine, J and
    • I don't really feel like finding out if he has side to tell. It's generally accepted that an unconscious person can't consent.
      • fair enough. Just know that it does happen to us males, too. Not all of us are looking to get laid at all times no matter what. Waking up naked after a night of HEAVY drinking** next to a woman you can't stand with certain "womaly secretions" as evidence does not bode well for one's psyche. It took me a month before I started sleeping in my bed again. If you ever find the bastard. Stab him once in the groin for me.

        ** The lady I'd been seeing told me that night that she couldn't see me anymore because
        • I don't mean to in any way say that what happened to you was okay, but I would just like to take this opportunity to remind people of the mechanics of rape. The lack of consent causes a lack of said "womanly excretions" which causes rape to be a particularly painful, and often bloody, crime. I know from personal experience that if there isn't enough lubrication, sex really, really hurts. And in those cases, we stop immediately. I can't even imagine how painful it must be to have extended intercourse wit
          • I know from personal experience that if there isn't enough lubrication, sex really, really hurts.

            This is something that has always puzzled me. Yes, it really, really hurts. And not just for the female. So how do rapists manage? Even assuming that I had the desire to go out and rape someone, I couldn't physically manage it because it would just be too painful. Am I just particularly sensitive to these things, or are rapists so desperate that they can just grit their teeth and deal with it?

      • ... it will be hard to dredge it up in court, but for the sake of others, this bastard needs to be brought to justice. He probably doesn't even think he did anything wrong - after all, if she was unconscious she didn't exactly say "no" either - that's how the twisted reasoning of bastards works.
        There are too many bastards who think like this, and the more are prosecuted for rape, the sooner they realise that that is what it is.
      • Y'see, that's exactly what I'm talking about, actually.

        Did she have an existing relationship with this person? Were they engaged socially and then she fell asleep?

        There's a world of difference between going home with a girl from a bar and having sex with her when she passes out, and stalking a woman, sneaking into her bedroom, and molesting her after she falls asleep. But if you don't get the perp's side of the story, you won't be able to tell (1) from (2) if the girl has decided to screw him over.

        (FWI
        • She was at a party. Got drunk. She passed out. A person she had never dated/slept with/possibly never met before began having sex with her. She woke up in middle and started screaming for him to stop. He did not.

          Yes, that is rape as much as somebody sneaking into a person's bedroom and having sex with them while they are asleep.

          I agree that there are far too many people who scream "rape" when in fact they had a regretful sexual encounter, but in the case when one of the parties is unconscious, the ac
          • Normally I'm wary of these discussions, since I had a situation once in my life where a woman initiated foreplay with me and then claimed afterwards she was asleep and I took advantage of her (okay, I woke up to her kissing me, and I stopped when she did say "no". Am I in the wrong here?)....but you seem to have a nice (and rare) awareness of the subtleties of the problem.

            If you need someone else to hold down the target of your rusty knife, gimmie a call. I've already thrown someone through a window for
          • That's disgusting. Asshole is too generous a word to describe the filth that would do such a thing. He's a worthless piece of shit.

            That said, do people think that nothing will happen to "me" when they get drunk in a public place, conceivably with people they cannot trust? I never get drunk in mixed company among people I don't explicitly trust to look after me. I find that to be part of personal responsibility. If she was among people she trusted and this guy was just an outsider, they're the assholes
            • Another thing we agree on -- not that people "ask for it," but goddamn, folks! Please get your heads out of you asses and don't PUT yourself in the position where you're SO freakin' vulnerable!!

              I'm not blaming the victim, 'cause once you've been attacked you deserve not to be 2nd guessed. But that's a really hard way to learn a lesson, I think.

              ....Bethanie....
              • Yeah. You can't trust people, which is a very unfun lesson to learn. Ditto on what I said to Rob. I'm glad that I just picked up my cynicism somewhere along the way without any effort on the part of the assholish underbelly of humanity.
                • Yeah, pretty good for you (I think); however, it's bad to be TOO cynical too. :) I didn't learn it until I was 30 years old and was divorced. Divorce taught me a lot about my naivety. Still, though, I never felt comfortable drinking excessively unless I was with some really close friends (usually at my home or their home).

                  That's a really horrible horrible lesson she learned. I hope she gets some help right away for dealing with this because that's so traumatic that she could spiral out of control just
                  • I learned when I was 9 years old. My best friend convinced me to climb a tree by saying that she would go up after me. Then she laughed at me because she had tricked me into climbing a tree. In retrospect, I think she didn't know quite how to handle the fact that I was moving to Minnesota after 5 years of bestfriendship, and the best that she could do was drive me away, but still. The message was clear; my crusty cynical outer layer began to develop in earnest. I may yet become the crotchety old lady k
            • That's what really makes me angry about the whole thing. She was a very open, trusting, friendly person. She would make anybody feel welcome and never questioned people's motives. It pisses me off that somebody took advantage of that. I'm cynical, untrusting, and somewhat embittered regarding the nature of people. Maybe this is why I've never been raped or mugged/assaulted, but I hate that you have to think so little of people in order to avoid such situations. What a way to realize that no, in fact p
              • Maybe this is why I've never been raped or mugged/assaulted, but I hate that you have to think so little of people in order to avoid such situations. What a way to realize that no, in fact people are not essentially good.

                I was just thinking about this and, although true, misses the compensating factor. The people you love. The people you *can* trust. It makes it so much easier to cope with life and the majority of assholes to know who you have in your life that you do love and trust. 1 good person who
                • I think my parents are the only people who I truly completely trust. I like to think that I completely trust my boyfriend, but I don't know how true that is. I definitely trust him where the big things are concerned, but I have trouble trusting anybody with regard to things like planned events or promises to be somewhere at a certain time.

                  But your sappy lovefest is admirable. :^)
                  • Oh man. I don't wanna be sappy. Fuck.

                    Fuck you! Yeah. There. I'm not sappy. ;)

                    Really, I think I'm trying to convince myself that there are people worth trusting completely. I don't think I do either anymore, except for my folks--and that's a challenge even too because even my mom has ulterior motives. She honestly thinks I should move in with them and live with them the rest of their lives and that she can take care of me (like I really would want that). I don't think so. She always slips in littl
          • A person she had never dated/slept with/possibly never met before...

            Ok. His side of the story is as gotten as I need.

            Rusty knife sounds OK. If anyone asks, you were visiting me in Albany.

            And I don't think either is a lesser charge of rape. Both are equally painful, bloody, and emotionally scarring. Additionally, both of your examples would be called "nonconsensual sex" by your definition, because the people in both cases are incapable of giving consent (in the first she is passed out and in the seco
            • The woman who wakes up to find that her boyfriend has sex with her before she was ready[1] is much less wronged than the woman who wakes up to find that a stranger has sex with her[2], who in turn is much less wronged than a woman who is assalted and violently molested despite her concious struggles.[3]

              Scenario 1 may or may not be rape depending on the circumstances (which would be hard to prove.
              Scenarios 2 and 3 are both rape, with a separate crime of assault in scenario 3. The assault is in addition to r
              • Scenario 1 may or may not be rape depending on the circumstances (which would be hard to prove.

                At least in NY, it isn't.

                Woman (or D.A.) convinces jury that she didn't say "yes."

                Man is unable to prove that woman did say "yes".

                Man gets thrown in jail and is labeled "sex offender" for life.

    • It couldn't be a random rape case--that would have been reported

      Ask any women's crisis centre how what percentage of rapes are unreported. The answer will shock you.
      Also - when the issue of consent is not clear-cut (incidents that take place at/after a party, where the victim is not fully sober/conscious), some victims feel they don't have a case.
      The bastards who take advantage of these situations know that they will usually get away with it.
      • Ask any women's crisis centre how what percentage of rapes are unreported. The answer will shock you.

        No, it won't. Many women's crisis centers have an inflated definition of "rape."

        If a woman goes out drinking with her boyfriend, goes home with him to their apartment, passes out, and then he has sex with her, then that's legally rape even though he had no reason to suspect that she would ever say no.

        A significant number (I won't say "a lot") of so-called rape victims don't have a case, and they insult
      • Yeah, that's what I was going to say. It isn't just when consent isn't clear cut. Even when it was done kicking and screaming saying no, women still generally feel ashamed. Sometimes they are threatened that if they tell there will be repurcusions. And in some cases the people it gets reported to write it off as a grudge against a date or probably the worst of all, "Well, you were asking for it dressed like that."

        SW, you are right, the world is full of assholes. It makes me want to cut off the genetal

      • Ask any women's crisis centre how what percentage of rapes are unreported. The answer will shock you.

        That was exactly my first thought. It's a very naive attitude to assume that random rapes will be reported. I know several women that have been raped, and the only one that reported it managed to beat the guy off (albeit being stabbed in the process) before any intercourse could take place. In my experience, it's far more common for it to go unreported. Sad but true. Also understandable, given the apalling

        • In my experience, it's far more common for it to go unreported.

          Wholeheartedly agree. I know very few women who were raped or molested and reported it. I can honestly say I know none where it was reported and the perpetrator was convicted. And it's fairly easy to see why, the number of rapes that are reported is much lower than the number of rapes committed. The number that are arrested or prosecuted is much lower than the number of reported rapes. The number who are convicted is much lower than the number

          • And to add to this, if a friend of mine was raped, I'm not sure I'd advise going to the police.

            I do know of a woman who was alledgedly raped (I don't know if she was, probably though) and instead of going to the cops, she went to her mates. The perp got very badly beaten. The problem with this is that the perp doesn't get a chance to prove his innocense, if he was innocent.
            If he did the crime, then he got what he deserved. If she was lying, it's a nasty lie that had nasty consequences for an innocent man.
  • I wonder if there are enough good people to counter them, or if that's even possible.

    In fact, I'm great! Since great=good*2, that means that I counter 2 whole assholes! Hurray! I'm being usefull today.
  • That is one of the best. Some people lose sleep over who is going to get knocked out in the next episode of some reality TV show. Is it any wonder the world is so messed up when people have no idea what is trivial and what is important?

    A better compensation would be to find a way to get your friend back into college (if that is still an option) and start making up for lost time.

  • That is truly a horrible story - I don't blame you for wanting to avenge your friend. Do remember that there are many more people who are not assholes. We just don't hear about them constantly because they haven't done anything.

    The best I can do is to talk to my son seriously about topics like rape and make sure he will not be one of those assholes. I also talk to both of them about the consequences of drinking too much and other situations in which the assholes of the world would take advantage of them
  • i've read through this thread. i'm sad for your friend. i do not understand the complete lack of humanity that allows people to do such things.

    the knife can still be rusty, but you can do so much more with it if it's sharp. with a good blade and a basic knowledge of pressure points, a lot can happen.

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Ignorance is bliss. -- Thomas Gray Fortune updates the great quotes, #42: BLISS is ignorance.

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