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GIMP, Civ:CTP, and low-cost box Coming to BeOS 313

In a frenzy of porting, Be.com has unveiled that both the GIMP and Civilization:Call to Power will be ported to BeOS. With the news of a new low cost Be system, I'm gonna have to look closely at getting one. Update: 06/22 11:14 by J : flaggz writes "We've posted a screenshot of the GIMP toolbox for BeOS. "
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GIMP, Civ:CTP, and low-cost box Coming to BeOS

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  • Just a side note: I should've clarified my original post. Booting in 20 seconds is not just a thing to flaunt and throw around. It's more of an indicator of how slick and refined the whole operating system is. Everything is smooth, responsive, consistent, and logical. Be's listened to many ideas from users and added options to make your system work the way you want. It's just a better OS than Windows. Judging from the 210 (and growing) comments, Be's a hot topic!

    And, if you want "Ooooh, Aaaah" or more 'hidden agenda' (?) stuff:

    - Audio that *never* skips - Replicant apps that can embed into the desktop as well as other applications - 99% efficient with multiple processors - Stable as all hell .... Ah well, I've run out of steam. "About time", you think. :)

  • The two totals combined will probably be less than the number of copies sold for Windows in Rhode Island.
  • some of you commented that be's server was down, but as of about 6:20 central (US Daylight) time, I could load entire pages without web-server-socket problems.

    hopefully it will stay up for the remainder of my little browsing excursion.

    Smitty
  • What was the point of replacing tracker? I seriously doubt that they added anything that is any better.
  • For free.. is that what it comes down to? Be has a
    money-back guarantee if you aren't happy with the BeOS. If you want to keep it for free, then I guess you won't be happy. There *is* a place in this world for products that aren't free you know.
  • Isn't it obvious? Haven't you noticed that anytime someone posts something controversial it gets moderated down and marked as "Flamebait"?
    I think a new moderation reason is required, "Controversial" -- at least then it will be the truth. Apparently a moderator who likes BeOS got offended, what a shame.

    But, I agree completely. Although I may not agree with everything he wrote, he's certainly entitled to his opinion.

    This reminds me of a Simspons episode, when they were listening to the radio in the kitchen and the guy on the radio was talking about politics and Marge said "That sounds like controversy, I don't like controversy in this house". (It's satire, damnit)
  • Looks like you'd like the XFree license then. Similar to BSD but with no advertising clause.
  • The multimedia speed is there, but I didn't like the interface, nor the networking, nor the lack of
    decent apps for it.


    Um... well... you can change parts of the interface quite a bit... what can you not like that much to turn you off the whole OS? If you want, you can run it all just from the command line... what can you not like?
    Please don't rattle off that tired crap about there being a lack of apps. Quake2/3. E-Pictuer. CivCTP. There are no shortage of apps for it, and in development. Simcity 3000. Gobe Productive. Be Basics. Sheepshaver (for you lucky PowerPC owners :) ) If you want to see a selection of them, check out http://www.be.com and go to the store link. If you want to see the freeware available already, go to http://www.be.com/beware
  • One of the most important aspects of an OS that is used by users is the User Interface. This should be obvious. In this respect, BeOS (although still extremely young) is growing in popularity if only due to the fact that it looks gorgeous. It's not hard to impress onlookers when you are playing 10 mp3s and at the same time full-motion video flawlessly. It's harder to do the same for Linux (open flame invitation) when what you want to show off is a stable, multi-user server OS.

    Another way of looking at it:
    If BeOS were a woman, it would be Rebecca Romijn.
    If Linux were a woman, it would be your wife.
    If Windows were a woman, it would be serving time.
  • by jtn ( 6204 )
    Is this yet another anti-BSD flamebait?
  • I take it that the Ethical Treatment of Animal Bytes doesn't simply involve clubbing the biting animal to death.... heh
  • BeOS for Intel is barely over a year old. My Microsoft mouse and my SCSI2 (oh no, I'm not on the bleeding edge!) card were detected just fine. Same effect for many other people who use BeOS every day; it does "just work" for them. Did you even bother to check the hardware compatibility list? Do you just stick in any hardware for Linux and complain when it isn't autodetected? Or do you consult a list of currently supported hardware?
  • Why would you port the Linux version of CivCTP to Win32 when it was already out for Win32 last year?
  • Well... I went out and bought a new video card (Millenium II) and haven't looked back. There are always problems like this when changing periferal cards. I remember my Diamon card not working for ages with linux back around 0.97 or whenever I first started using it...
  • You don't have to read the source to care about it. I happen to read some of the source, and I edit some of the source, but I'd say I look at less than 1% of the source I use everyday (for example, it takes a special kind of person to wade through the X11 source). However, the fact that the source is available to the community at large is very important to me, regardless of whether or not I'm reading the source. It is clear to me that having the source available under a Free software license makes a huge difference in the quality of the software. I consider it very important to me. I am quite aware that there is well written software where the source is closed and secret, but over the twenty-someodd years I've been dealing with the computer industry, it is clear that they are the exception, not the rule.
  • Bull. There are examples of driver code available, online documentation, and printed documentation. Why do you need the source to the kernel to produce useful drivers? The drivers attach to well-documented hooks in the kernel. Nothing more is really needed.
  • Have you ever used Irix? Or BeOS itself? THat moment where you get the feeling "This is how I want the world to be". I'd never used Windows when I got it on disks with my first PC. We used DOS for months, and hten I decided to install Windows. I was amazed you could move the mouse while the hdd was being accessed. BeOS is that just over existing Win32 that win16 was over DOS. You justh ave to see it in multiprocessor mode to know. I have a dual P2-350... and when I upgraded the speed in crease to NT (which I also had installed then) was very slight. Very slight. But BeOS became able to play 20 MP3s at once without maxing out the chips. It really takes advantage of the second processor like you wouldn't believe. The consistent interface is a nice change from linux too (I hate fvwm95 more than anything else on this earth).
  • If you want to see what people mean when they say that Be advocates are irritating, look no further than this post. Knowing that the person he is responding probably hasn't taken the time out to read up on just what BeMessage and AppServer are, he just throws them out there in buzzword-like fashion, followed by a nice little taunt ("...that alone would take a very, VERY long time [to implement]") and expects all readers to just cower in awe without giving any substance as to what his cute buzzwords actually mean (not to mention downplaying the fact that Windows95 has a LOT of API calls that have a lot of details that have to exactly match the original or things don't work right). Now, I don't doubt that the technologies behind "BeMessage" and "AppServer" are very real and very useful, here they're nothing but buzzwords. This kind of crap might impress those PHB's, but around here it won't do much but tick people off (like, for instance, me).
  • This hardware support thing crops up every time Be is mentioned in slashdot, regardless of the nature of the post. Other favourites are "They won't second guess apple so they must be rubbish" and "There arn't any applications". Just go out and buy a supported video card! What - do you expect a OS that has only been on the intel for eighteen months to be able to match Windows? Buy a supported video card, get BeOS and you'll never have to worry again!
  • Trenches are no defence against nuclear attack.
  • And, if you want "Ooooh, Aaaah" or more 'hidden agenda' (?) stuff:

    Hey! I've got Hidden Agenda (from Nowhere Man) As my background image. :) :) :)

    ... and without ceasing to live, I will cease to exist...
  • I recently decided to pull out my copy of BeOS r4 and give it another shot. I think the OS is a fairly decent one. The one major problem it has is hardware support. If it is a desktop multimedia targeted OS, shouldnt it support most major graphics cards on the market? I have a TNT2, a TNT, and a FireGL Pro. Of these three there is a beta driver for the TNT that works fairly well. I think Be should really start working on their hardware support if they ever want to go far. Do you think windows or linux or any OS would be able to be a major player if you couldnt install it on almost any PC on the market? I really wish I could get the FireGL to work in anything besides Black and White mode.. sheeessh. Anyways, that was just my 2 cents.

    Tim
  • Try Beos.com, It looks like they moved their site without telling anyone.

    The Gimp = http://www.beos.com/press/pressreleases/99-06-22_e ventloop.html [be.com]

    Civilization: Call to Power = http://www.beos.com/press/pressreleases/99-06-22_w ildcard.html [be.com]

    Low cost Be system = http://www.beos.com/press/pressreleases/99-06-22_i DOT.html [beos.com]

  • I know Linux is getting better and better for games all the time, but it still has a loooooong way to go. BeOS already has a killer multimedia implementation.

    Currently, I dual boot Windows for Delphi and games and Linux for all the work I need to get done. I'd absolutely love it if BeOS stole the game market from Wintendo. BeOS would make a great gaming platform.
    --
    "I got it running, grabbed a rocket launcher, and fired down a hallway." --John Carmack
  • The Old Site Is Here, http://www-classic.be.com/
    I Wonder Why be.com is not up.
  • For the record, the PRIMARY reason we were working on GeTK (a port of GTK+ for BeOS) was to allow us to port the GIMP for BeOS...

    At the time it was started, I was under the impression that no one else was working on a port of the GIMP to BeOS. Our approach was to get a working version of GTK+ on BeOS so that we could leverage the ongoing development of the GIMP and it's plug-ins with minimal effort. Additionally, we planned to add extensions into the GeTK framework to allow for better integration into the BeOS application/desktop environment, thus minimizing the impact of using a non-native toolkit. We also planned to use themes to make the GIMP look more like the rest of the apps on the BeOS desktop...

    EventLoop is taking an entirely different approach to porting the GIMP to BeOS. The only redundant effort was the fact that we were both trying to port the GIMP...

    :-l
  • Microworkz announced that its up-comming low cost ($200) web appliances will be powered by BeOS, also metacreations is porting Bryce 4 to BeOS, Bryce 4 is a nifty & fun to use program that will fit nicely with BeOS.

    Way to go BE!
  • Wow. Perhaps you might do a little research into that terminology which you so carelessly toss aside before you set your flamethrower on "crispy". What does "ext2fs" mean to anybody outside Linux? Or RPM? I guess they are nothing but buzzwords here. It comes down to research, bub. Hypocrisy still abounds on Slashdot it seems..
  • by arielb ( 5604 )
    it IS big news because gimp is open source and EventLoop Inc will sell support (yay another example of selling open source software) and add back to the source.
  • You are right. The same logic should be applied to Windows port. After all, there is native, powerfull GUI API available there. Why reinvent the wheel ???
  • That's not quite right.

    From what I read, not only is all of the work being contributed back into the normal GIMP development tree, but the BeGIMP people (for lack of a better title) are going to be modularizing the GUI code, something that's been on the list of things to do for a long time.

    So the overall GIMP project benefits by getting a major item done (granted, the Linux version of GIMP needs to be redone with the modularized system, but at least it's there now), and BeOS gains the GIMP.

    Give and take - just like what you wanted.


  • That sounds kind of like an honorable title.


    I just thought it was funny people were using it in a negative way against others.

  • There's shipping support for high-end audio cards like Emu's ASP, Echo's Gina/Layla/Darla, Emagic's I/O card and Yamaha's "midrange" 192XG.

    that's what i'm looking forward to. my roommates get a layla system and we're looking at building a new system to run BeOS/Layla on. i am really looking forward to seeing how many tracks we can push through it.

    --seamus

  • What I have a problem with is people who feel that just because a stand is
    different from theirs; it is automatically wrong.


    Sometimes this is the essence of a position; eg, someone who believes that it is wrong to kill is likely to consider someone who allows killing in self-defense to be wrong. Of course I suppose that this doesn't count as a 'non-injurious idea' :-)

    I've noticed though that a large proportion (I suppose maybe not a majority) of people denouncing the "zealots" and the "extremists" on any particular issue are the ones who have a stand which can be followed by going along with the status quo. This really bothers me -- you just happened to get in the way of a pet peeve. Hope it didn't bite too badly :-)

    Daniel
  • Maybe some of us don't want another MS?

    If we wanted another Proprietary OS, OS/2 would be the one, it's much more flexible, and is rock-solid, and proven. Be is just an OS/2 wannabe without the stability, but with pretty graphics (A more stable Mac).


    -- Keith Moore
  • This is basically correct, except that the 'Linux version of GIMP' will be 'redone' at the same time. We are modularizing the UI components. That means we are abstracting the central GIMP code away from GTK+ to be toolkit independent.

    Once completed, we will have 'modules' (dynamic libraries) for GTK+ and the BeOS interface kit. This should allow much more rapid development of additional interfaces in the future, including versions of GIMP that run with no user interface at all (batch/server processing.)

    James
    EventLoop
  • I think this is similar to the stuff Precision Insight is doing with their DRI. Not necessarily greyscale fonts, but you can have direct access to the video card to make it faster.
  • Well, it looks as if old Slashdot really drives traffic. I've visited be.com [be.com] a number of times and never had problems, but it seems to be rather dead right now...

  • Hmm. Are ports, areas, and servers similar to entities in the Hurd? [ it occurs to me that they might map better to that system.. ]

    Daniel
  • "Please don't respond to this with "BeOS is great because blah blah blah." "

    I just have to point out that it's totally annoying when someone comes up with stupid guidelines for how people should respond to their post. If you really don't want a certain anticipated response to something, refrain from including it in your post or just don't post. The great thing about slashdot is that it is an open forum and people can reply however they want. The minute that changes will be the last minute I spend here, and I would guess that I'm not the only one that feels this way.

    I will go on to go against the guidelines for replying you set in your post and say that BeOS is great because it is another OS out there and it is usable for some people that want to use it. Linux is the same way as is Win32 and MacOS... usable for some but not for everybody. Competition is good for everybody. Personally I use them all on a daily basis.

    I'm just replying this way because I can... even if you ask me not to. :) Honestly I could care less about influencing anyone's views on BeOS - or any other OS for that matter. I nearly included a whole list about why BeOS is great along with a list why other operating systems are great (just because I can), but instead I decided to exercise a little self control today. :)

    As for being disgusted with what you are reading, if it is really that bad perhaps you should stop reading the thread... nobody is forcing you to read it.

    "Reply to this however you please, even if it offends me or goes against what I think... I just might learn something from what you have to say."

    --SONET

  • Well, that's not necessarily true. Civ:CTP is not a very fun game (IMO), and it certainly doesn't have much to do with its namesake (i.e. the Civilization series). I honestly don't know exactly how well it's doing right now, but when after I bought it and found I rather hated it, I checked out some of the gaming sites and many other people were feeling the same way.

    I seriously don't mean this to sound like flamebait, but I do wonder if they might not sell a decent amount just because of the general lack of games available for the OS? C.f. many mediocre (at best) games selling extremely well for the N64 because of the sheer lack of numbers of different games available at and shortly after release.
  • "With the news of a new low cost Be system, I'm gonna have to look closely at getting one."

    $500 for a Cyrix MII 333, 32M, 3.2G, unnamed video and sound cards, and no monitor? That's not much of a bargain.

    A true "MediaOS" machine should have dual processors, gobs of RAM and high end video/audio hardware. And a monitor.
  • "ext2fs" and "rpm" are not inherently buzzwords, and neither are "BeMessage" and "AppServer." Nonetheless, all could be used as buzzwords if someone wanted to (i.e. "Microsoft will take years to catch up with RPM technology" and offering no further explanation and also there being a good chance that the people you are talking to don't already know what RPM is). When I said they are nothing but buzzwords here, I meant "here" as in "here in this post I am replying to," not "here on slashdot."
  • some people deserve to be unemployed and starving. it's what we call evolution. i'm serious.

    Actually, that's Social Darwinism. It has nothing to do with evolution, and is primarily the product of apologist thinking regarding the disadvantaged.

    And it hews very closely to eugenics, which explains its unpopularity amongst the itelligentsia.

    Much like pampheleteers who insist the Nazi Holocaust nver happened.
  • I agree with the idea of modularizing the UI components. However, what are your plans for addressing the GUI issues surrounding plugins?

    I understand that all the Script-Fu stuff seems to use a generic dialog mechanism which shouldn't be a problem. The plugins which I'm concerned about are those which fall into the Filters category;

    • CML Explorer
    • Dynamic Text
    • Flame
    • Fractal Explorer
    • Gfig
    • Mosaic
    • ... (there's a bunch more in this category)

    Any thoughts on how this problem might be solved? Do we need a new SDK so that these types of plugins don't need to be written against a specific GUI toolkit?

    :-l
  • Bigot (one g) means that you believe others to be inferior to you with no grounds to base it on. Ignorance should never be applauded.

    If BeOS were open source, it would die. It may be better supported by those who used it, but everything cool would be stripped out of it, and it would be left a hollow shell.

    Use the right tool for the job. If I want to run a server, I'll use Linux. If I want to do graphics, video editing, audio production, or any other media based work, I'll use BeOS. If I want to suffer, I'll use Windoze or MacOS.



    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    I run BeOS. The rules don't apply.
  • it's because multiple people use my machines. So being multiuser is a big plus.
  • hey, i just posted the url to the second reality demo.

    i'm not responsible for it's content

    :)

    no worries,
    dave
  • I believe Closed source has a role in Applications, But not in the OS. It is too easy to get another MS, with hidden APIs and Stock-price controlled Features in the future. It's just not worth it.


    -- Keith Moore
  • Oh so you mean Be doesn't have the standard disclaimer about how it's not their fault if the product isn't "fit for purpose" like Microsoft??? I suppose it would be a definite plus point if there was actually someone you could sue when/if it all went wrong.

    One of these days I will work out who to report Microsoft to (Trading Standards Office I think) over their illegal(*) licensing agreement.

    * Illegal in that it attemptes to violate my statutory rights, which you're not allowed to do!
  • Be cannot be run command line only.
  • Amen brother!

    If I had a penny for every time a snotty Linux user came on, I could.. hell, I'd have a lot of money.

    Whatever happened to Strenght Through Diversity?

    I justlove the Puritanical Feeling here on Slashdot!

    "I NEED FREEDOM!" "Hey! That isn't the OS I use, thou heathen."

    Get off your high-horses, people.

  • The multimedia speed is there, but I didn't like the interface, nor the networking, nor the lack of decent apps for it. I'm no Open Source bigot, but I fear BeOS will go the way of OS/2 unless it itself goes Open Source...BeOS and OS/2 are both high-class OSes, one died, one isn't gaining popularity as rapidly as it should.

    I'm sure someone will jump in here and point out that OS/2 isn't really dead.

    Practically speaking, it is dead, though. I know; I used to be one of the biggest OS/2 advocates around (yes, member of Team OS/2 and all). OS/2 is, of course, proprietary/closed. As a result, the OS/2 user base is unable to take the good parts of OS/2 (and there are many) and roll them into Linux/BSD/Hurd (actually, more likely into KDE and/or GNOME) because of the closed nature of OS/2.

    Who wins by OS/2 being closed source? IBM? Not really, since they're just trying to make it go away as quickly as possible. OS/2 users? Nope. They're stranded with an operating system that seems likely to become less and less maintained. OS/2 commercial developers? Hardly. IBM is leaving them holding the bag. The answer is: no one wins with closed source software, at least in the long run.

    That is why I am never going back to using a proprietary operating system. I really want to move away from closed source software for any kind of important work, but in some cases that's not practical. For the OS, however, I cannot go back to a situation like the OS/2 situation. BeOS users may scoff at the idea now, but in a few years, they could well find themselves in a similar situation to OS/2 users. Believe me, we OS/2 users didn't believe IBM would ever throw in the towel on OS/2, either...but here we are, with no real upgrade path on the horizon.

    Is Linux (or BSD, or the Hurd) the be-all, end-all solution for every use? No. However, for the things I use a computer for, Linux works quite well, supports my hardware (allowing me extraordinary platform flexibility), and has programs available to do about anything I can think of doing with my computer. And, thanks to its open source nature, it just gets better and better, at an unbelievable pace. BeOS may well have some advantages over Linux, but I believe that any shortcomings in Linux will be addressed by the open source community, and in a way that benefits the users, not the interest of a particular company.

    If BeOS works for you, fine. I don't criticize people for using it. I just hope people will look before they leap, and realize what they may be getting themselves into with a proprietary operating system. Some of us have learned what can happen the hard way.

    --

  • you've got that wrong. It's People Eating Tasty Animal Bytes.

    This makes much more sense.
  • > Well, they're giving away Linux Civ:CTP, so at
    > least the BeOS version will more money... 8)

    Since when? It retails for the same price as the
    Windows version (excluding stores using the
    Windows version as a loss leader to get foot
    traffic).
  • Probably. But I wonder how Linux will do relative to the BeOS and also the Mac version, and what fraction of the Windows sales it will hit. Most of the stores I tried in the area (Boston/Cambridge) were sold out within a day or two of getting the shipment.

    I had to drive all the way to Marlboro (consult Mapquest for an indication of how far this is) to get a live copy.

    Of course, stores probably ordered a lot fewer Linux copies than Windows copies, but this is still an interesting data point.

    BTW, to the other poster who said he didn't think it was a fun game, I disagree... it's quite different than the other Civs but I think it is
    still cool.
  • We don't know that they're really using BeOS. The news article was realllly unclear. (One of those over-the-author's-head kinda things.)

    --

  • Is Quake 3 Open Source? *evil grin*

    Now there's a way to get people to really think about their position on the subject.

  • I know this isn't a post about Be. But I've been thinking.... Linux is finally starting to get Games and Multimedia apps. Is there an actuall game distro of Linux? Yes, I know, a lot of people are already rolling their eyes saying "another distro." I can't help to mull it over though. Get the Linux kernel and strip it way down. Keep what you need for gaming and include the latest utilities you would need. Include a number of the better freeware games, and maybe even a commercial game or two. You can have a small window manager and tweak the hell out of the file system... I already have a system I set up where I killed 90% of the services (NFS, Samba, Named, Ect.) so I could devote it to a few games I enjoy under Linux. It works extremely well, but it could be taken a lot further...
  • I've been reading this thread and have been pretty disgusted with all the Be zealots badmouthing Open Source.

    Hm. There are certainly Be zealots out there, but most of us like Open Source. We badmouth the "Open Source is the only way to salvation" mindset. I respect the choice some people make to go open source all the way, but I don't buy the "you are enslaving yourself to proprietary software if you use it" mindset. I am fully aware of all the advantages of open source development. But just like I buy products with "no user serviceable parts inside" if that product does what I want, I will buy "closed" software if it is a superior solution. If you won't, that's fine, but I'm sick of having the more... mmm... energetic free software advocates tell me I'm an idiot for my choice.

    I could go on, but the point of this message isn't to flame...

    As evidenced by your use of "BeOS lusers."

    So far I've found Be users to be the most obnoxious of any group.

    To me "who gives a shit if it's not open source" is more obnoxious than "BeOS is really cool, let me fanboy about it," even if the latter is irritating.

    ...maybe if Be were open source I'd be developing for them instead.

    If you're developing open source software for Linux, you just might be developing open source software for BeOS, too. That's part of what "open source" means. Isn't that ironic?

  • Heh. Thanks for pointing that out. Guess the copy got mangled between here and Be. Should be fixed on our website now at least.

    James
    EventLoop
  • it doesn't help user related problems
  • The reason they're working on games are because games tend to be really great showcases for multimedia. Think about it - you've got all of that 3D, high speed rendering combined with incredible sound effects and background music.

    As for the other things, they've been couting a lot of places, and if you go look at their press releases, many companies are in the process of developing/porting programs over. Unfortunately, almost all are still being developed. Another six months or so will yield a vast trove of very high performance software.
  • Such as the standard way of giving your money to a company for buggy software? Oh I see....
  • There may be a place, but it won't be on any of my systems. :)

    To quote the Culpepper Minutemen's slogan: "Freedom or death" ;)
  • Actually, I can back up Brian here. I work for a printer company, and WE write the drivers for out products. BeOS doesn't support the [snip] printer line because WE haven't written one.

    Be has crappy hardware, it is true. But it isn't all Be's fault.
  • Who wins by OS/2 being closed source?

    Microsoft.

  • I don't think it's bad.


    I unquestionably regard equality between people as right. I unquestionably regard freedom of expression as right in spirit.


    Same goes for software, being free to use it as you wish and do with it as you wish are unquestionably right. I can't see how they could possibly be wrong. I am a bigot in my committment to freedom, in all things. Now I'm not a total biggot, I do use a few non-free applications (3 of them) but I think it is noble to sacrifice for the cause if you're more committed than I am or if you don't need any non-free (oppressionware? I've heard freedomware a couple times and I like it) software.

  • Actually BeOS is designed to work wiht multiple users. The API already has support for multiple users in it and they are planning on adding in the code to finish it in a future release I think R5 or R6 is supposed to have it. Still I would not use it as a server yet, FreeBSD does a much better job. For the record I run R4.5 and it's great. I'm in awe at all the audio capabilities in the media kit, I think if you show the 3dsound demo to any Linux/Windows user they would start drooling immediately.
  • They actually do have multi-user support designed into the various APIs, they just haven't implemented it yet. They've had important things like device drivers that had to be written. I believe the time frame I last read for multi-user is R5 or R6.
  • by arielb ( 5604 )
    I think it's the hardware. I've seen many linux servers fall apart by slashdotters
  • ...nice try, trollboy.

    (And before anyone else responds, no, BeOS isn't a good server platform. Blah blah blah single-user blah blah blah TCP/IP stack blah blah blah Linux roolz. Happy? :) )

  • I'm willing to help the permedia 3d port effort if simon from suse puts out a new tar ball. Two more months and if no this tar ball is not out, we'll start on our own porting.

    :)
    --
  • Since they are so strongly posiioning themselve as a "media OS" .. why are they worried about games at this point? Are they courting the major midi and audio software houses? What about movie production stuff? Even under windows and Mac this stuff isn't very good.

    Does anyone know what is going on with Be in this regard?
  • Point well taken. I should have caught that...

    --
  • multi-monitor support is a Must and I'm sure BeOS R5 will support it by the end of the year or so
  • I agree with many of the ideals of the Free Software movement. I'm just mentioning that if all the claims of open-source software being superior are true, then there should be no need to choose it based on philosophy, since it will be the technically better piece of software.
  • 1. GUI - Assuming one is using fully supported card (say Voodoo 3)is BeOS GUI faster, more responsive than X on Linux ?
    2. What are choices for someone who would like to develop for BeOS ? Free compilers ?
    Documentation ? Is this available off the net ?

    Thank you
  • the press release on be.com is pretty clear but be.com doesn't work for me yet. We also know that iDot will have BeOS
  • They are worried about games since users have been screaming for them. More people want to use Be as a 'general' OS than Be originaly thought. I know that I do....
  • Kind of ironic that people complain about there not being enough Linux apps. And at the same time, there seem to be so many great Linux apps that now they're being ported to other Operating Systems.
  • it makes more sence to port glib/gdk/gtk so that all gtk apps are easier to port to the platform, after all gtk is a very nice toolkit.
  • Technically, I guess I am more of a "UNIX" + X supporter, and I personally don't like BeOS, Mac OS X, etc... even if they are "UNIXlike Microkernel." I guess I would rather see GNU X evolve, like a licence change to XFree86 + OpenGL + GLX + more 3D support...

    I like the "UNIX + X" portability that exists now, with ease in compiling between all the BSD's, Linux, IRIX, Solaris, DEC-UNIX (whatever it's called now), etc... and I don't like seeing applications being ported out, when I would rather see support for existing GNU/GPL or BSD licenced UNIX + X OS's comming in.

    Feel free to correct me technically, but it seems like "portability" between the existing "UNIX + X" OS's is very very good, it's just these "consept non-X microkernel" things that are fringe and difficult to port to, and I just don't see the advantages to these new OS's. I see merit to new open source (lower case generic, not "Open Source") OS's if they are UNIX + X, some are more secure, some are slicker, some are.... But, if were going to say it's "UNIX" but ditch X and make everything difficult to port, why not look at Berlin or something that could potentially be the next generation X for ALL UNIX, not just some new thing?

    Aside from my potential mistakes in determining the differances here, I would like to hear someone support my view with some hard fact, or convincingly argue that a TOTAL diversion is needed and a small unpopular (even if it is cute and slick) startup OS is the answer?

    QNX GPL'ed, or maybe HURD, and a next generation X that runs on all legacy UNIX boxes seems the smart move to me. But those things need to come from an open source community itself through evolution, not a startup indepenant OS, IMHO.

  • by Anonymous Coward
    The iToaster is also runs beOS, and is based on an intel celeron 300 Mhz, with 32 M RAM, 2.1G hard drive, USB, serial, parallel, 56.6 modem, no floppy, no CD-ROM and no display, and comes for $199. With the USB port other peripherals could be hooked.

    URL:
    http://12.18.142.10/Products/iToaster/iToaster.c fm
  • second reality demo:
    http://ftp.hornet.org/pub/demos/demos/1993/ 0-9/2ndreal.zip

    dave
  • by Anonymous Coward
    After seeing some weird discussing about GIMP on Be and Be not being open source I wanted to know...

    Are Open Source advocates against Oracle, Sybase, Microstation, and other non open source apps from developing apps for Linux?

    I think a realistic view of the future is there will be commercial (nonOSS) apps running on Linux and there will be OSS apps running on commercial (nonOSS) operating systems like Be. Well that's not the future that's today.

    I really don't understand this extremist view. Many Linux users seem pretty violent on this.
    Can't we all just get along?
  • by Anonymous Coward
    I wonder if they ported GTK+ or just Gimp. If they ported GTK+, that would open up a lot more possibilities for software running on Be.
  • Yeah, except "single-user" isn't something to say "blah blah blah" about (and neither is "TCP/IP stack" but BeOS has one of those). Count me in as someone who might try BeOS when it's multiuser if it fits in my 250 mb empty partition (yes, despite all the "advocates" posting trash under this /. article).
  • I know Intel based processors are cheap, but wouldn't it pay for a "Media OS" to support something with a more long-term approach? Intel is giving x86 the boot for merced (soon they say). And there's all that PPC code already done. (Of course I've not been able to run Be on any system I own yet, so maybe the x86 has surpassed the PPC?)

    Also, Be started making PPC computers, so they have the blueprints, minus some upgrading.

    Anyone hear anything?
  • These people are "very excited" to be working with GPL'd software. On the whole, this looks like a Good Thing. Checking the company website, it looks like a pair of university students who are into free software. Hope they can make a go of it.
  • that's pretty funny...i reckon though that...
    • If BeOS were a woman, it would be elle.
      If Linux were a woman, it would be
      weird science.
      If Windows were a woman, it would be
      as good looking as a blow-up bill doll
  • Let me get this straight. BeOS is being pitched as a snappy multimedia OS for intensive image and audio processing tasks. It has fewer consumer apps than Linux and no mainstream web browser, but this is made up for by its wonderful suiatbility to multimedia production. Fine.

    So here it is being sold on $500 PCs with low-end CPUs and low-end audio and video hardware to a market that generally goes with 15-inch monitors.

    Who is a low-end Be system for?
  • It always seems that every time some new development involving the BeOS gets coverage here at Slashdot, almost a third of the comments have some reference to Open Source and Be's lack therof. Give it a rest, people! Open Source is cool, but there's other things out there too.

    Closed-source coding does not necessarily equal bloated Microsoft software. Because of the hard work and coordination going on at Be, Inc., the BeOS is slim and quick. As an example, the BeOS boots in under twenty seconds on a PII 400 machine. Including the BIOS checks. As an OS, it's polished and honed in a way that is very hard to accomplish with the Open Source philosophy. I'm sure you all know of the merits and disadvantages of the BeOS (read: no software), but would you leave the Open Source maxim in the cupboard for once?

  • Who cares if it is "open source" (which doesn't mean anything anyway, BSD or public domain software are the only types that are truly free and open) -- the important thing is that it runs well.
  • by flaggz ( 62493 ) on Tuesday June 22, 1999 @11:15AM (#1838502) Homepage
    It has long been a goal to modularize the UI in GIMP for purposes of portability and server functionality. We are doing the port as a 100% BeOS interface kit application. Porting GTK+ to BeOS would be useful, but we thought GIMP wouldn't really be a first-class Be application in a non-native toolkit.

    James
    EventLoop
  • by flaggz ( 62493 ) on Tuesday June 22, 1999 @11:26AM (#1838516) Homepage

    Hey folks, we've added a bit of content to our web pages. There's a preliminary screenshot of the main GIMP toolbox here [eventloop.com].


    James
    EventLoop
  • I'd say 98% of the Slashdot crowd doesn't care about the source other than to follow the "if it's not source, it's crap" mantra. BeOS just plain works. An added bonus, I can compile a great many available utilities typically meant for the Unix world on my BeOS/x86 machine at work thanks to the available compiler that ships *with* BeOS. Heck, the shell is a slightly modified "bash", and if you look in /boot/beos/bin on a properly setup machine, you'll find a lot of your typical Unixy utilities.
  • by clump ( 60191 ) on Tuesday June 22, 1999 @11:41AM (#1838549)
    I had some conern about Be. I am a converted-to-Linux WinSheep and I felt that another OS might overshadow Linux and my platform would be forgotton. Small wonder that when I saw things along the lines of more people supporting Be, I was concerned.

    Then I got to thinking. What was the whole reason I decided for Linux as opposed to Win32? I wanted an OS that:
    1.) Played Quake

    2.) Was stable

    3.) Was customizable

    4.) Did what I wanted it to do.


    So now came this BeOS as an alternative to Win32 and, of course, my Linux. I felt this was bad and all people porting to it would ruin my way of computing. Then I began thinking a bit more..

    The development to other platforms is not *bad*. Lets say Be does shadow Linux and can do things Linux cannot. I feel that competition in this instance will be good for everyone, even if Be isn't free. If it does some neat feature, some Linux people might like it and support/emulate it. If Be raises the bar in technology, well... they raised the bar and now the world has more technology and Joe user has another choice. I feel that choice is much more important than my sentiment for Linux.

    Just thought you would like to hear what a Linux user thinks.
    -Clump
  • jtn wrote:

    I'd say 98% of the Slashdot crowd doesn't care about the source...

    I'd disagree with that number, but I'd be guessing just as badly as you are. I think it's a good topic for a /. poll:

    Having Source available under a Free/Open Source license is:
    * Essential or I won't use the program
    * A good thing, but I run a few programs without it
    * A nice idea, but I really don't care
    * Unimportant
    * Bad
    * Cabbage
    * Huh?
  • I can't speak to the rest of those titles, but Quake 3 is already ported and being demonstrated right now at PC Expo.

    -jwb

Much of the excitement we get out of our work is that we don't really know what we are doing. -- E. Dijkstra

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