If the game supports generic flight sticks, sure. But that's true on PCs as well.

Yes, there is joy2key, but, holy crap is that a bad experience.

Shouldn't games be fun to begin with?

Vita, 3DS and PS3 can run their web browser while playing games. Not sure about 360, XB1 or PS4.

Also if I'm going to be doing that I'd rather just look down at the tablet that's as likely to be in my lap.

The overheating PS problem was fixed in the 2nd rev of the console. The rest of this screed is basically, "Optical media sucks." Which it kind of does, but, again, not a console specific problem. How else do you ship a large volume of data when customers may or may not have broadband?

Numbers? 360 failed at a rate of 33%, and over many different revs of the console. PS2 and PS1 both were sorted out by the 2nd and 3rd revs of the console and at much lower rates of failure.

Had you bought a PS3, you could've just opened the latch on the side, pulled the disk out, put a new one in and transferred your data. How is this a problem with consoles on a fundamental level? You bought a console that was designed by people with no taste.

TF2 has the save behavior. Although I don't think that's endemic to PC gaming specifically, but I do see it more often on PCs rather than consoles.

Except games design isn't an engineering problem where you worry about 'use cases.'

Games design is about the expression and engagement of human being in a virtual world. It's not like you're driving a damned spreadsheet. Imagination and engagement have a place here.

This isn't a, "Who's really got the crappy driver problem? nVidia or AMD?"" kind of question. The input issue and the internal storage issue are squarely problems with Microsoft and Nintendo. This isn't anything inherent in having a console itself. Kiss my ass.

Some games like Minecraft lend themselves well to modding. However, I don't see the general purpose, "MODS! MODS EVERYWHERE!" attitude is a benefit for PC gaming. I want to play the base game. That someone can replace the dragons in Skyrim with The Macho Man Randy Savage isn't exciting to me because the base game isn't exciting to me.

Further more, mods open up an avenue for cheating too. Which is rampant in PC gaming.

This is so subjective it hurts.

Again, why are you crucifying all console gaming with the problems Microsoft had? That's an Xbox problem, not a console problem.

Just because a PC can check email, go on IRC or be used to order pizza doesn't mean that I think it's lacking that the Xbox One or PS4 can't do either of those things. We're talking about a games console. For playing games on.

The thing you're missing is that there's a deep experience in the ability to just put in a disc and play.

Further more, on a lark, when I started getting in on this flame war, I decided to reboot into Windows so I could try some PC gaming. Fired up MWO and waited 2 hours for the game to patch itself with several gigs worth of patches. Generally console games don't see those kinds of updates. How the hell is that acceptable? Console games can get maybe 1 or 2 gig sized patches but it's never been PC gaming levels of bad.

Further more, games have been hanging, crashing and choking since the NES days. Sometimes rendering games completely unplayable. This has nothing to do with consoles being PCs with fancy memory architectures.

Also, I'm not sure what that means; this has been the case since the 2600. The 2600 and NES used 6502 variants, similar to what was in the C64 and Apple II. Genesis used a 68k chip, similar to the Mac and x68k. SNES used a 16 bit variant on the 6502. N64, PS1 and PS2 used MIPS chips. They're all just PCs with fancy architectures. This fact hasn't changed in 40 years.

You're missing my point. That games feel different with different control schemes. That not relying on WASD and a mouse can make for a very compelling experience.

Really, your only valid point. However, many MMOs still cling to subscription models. Plus the Wii U has free online.

This isn't a console problem specifically. That's a nintendo/microsoft/3rd party dev problem. Ps2, Ps3 and Ps4 all support standard devices over USB should the developers so choose. Unreal Tournament, Dust, Silent Scope and a bunch of other games supported using standard devices on the PS.

...and? They're actually bad for the industry It's not like console games broke the bank to begin with. Not unless you were crazy and imported.

That's a feature on consoles. Games should be able to stand on their own.

Graphical fidelity isn't bad to begin with on consoles. There's also a human limit to which graphical fidelity can be achieved. Making more graphical detail costs money, time and man power.

Also, at what cost? Fiddly drivers, OSes and other things to futz around with? Not to mention to power all of that means I need some big noisy video card and CPU or fiddle around with low noise cooling solutions. Generally, not my idea of fun.

I also can't imagine how the PC gaming world is sustainable with games being so cheap, but yet somehow also looking so much better.

This is an Xbox/Nintendo problem, not a console problem.

Other than controllers, and even then developers can opt to support non-officially supported peripherals, the PS4 can use all manner of standard USB devices. Same with PS3, PS3 even goes further with controllers.

Again, that's not feature.

Seriously, not having to deal with other processes running in the background? Feature.

Any worth playing? Any worth making the absolute remark that PC gaming is superior? Should I trash my PS3 because I can't play Papers Please on it?

Sure, but, again, like point above, should I completely ignore other gaming outlets over this? Some AAA titles are still worth the hype because they're lead by really smart people with a lot of resources at their fingertips.

Yet somehow I still get called racial, ethnic, sexual and sexuality based slurs online. The abuse is actually worse on PC than it is on either XBL or PSN.

Sure, if it makes you feel better about it.

I'm not discounting the PC as a gaming platform where fun games can exist, but *superior*? You PC gaming people are nuts.

Flight sims? better with a keyboard and mouse instead of a HOTAS? You're bugnut fucking crazy. You also just dismiss Super Mario out of hand as a worthwhile game experience so, I don't know what to make of that. I can't sleep, so here goes a screed.

The overall point you're missing is that not all games are designed to be played with a pointing device. Music games SUCK on a keyboard. Fighting Games suck on a keyboard. Mech and Flight/Space sims suck on keyboard. Puzzle games can make wonderful use of a joypad.

Having to design a game where the guaranteed input device is a keyboard and mouse means you're designing games that are limited by the limitations of keyboards and mice. Games like Virtual On and Katamari Damashii don't work on mice or keyboards. They're designed with control schemes that are clearly NOT KB/M friendly. Beatmania doesn't work on a keyboard and lord knows I've -tried-.

Being able to move in non-discrete increments and move the camera also in non-discrete increments is something you can't do with a mouse and keyboard. Metal Gear works really well on a joypad, for instance. When you're not worried about shooting someone in the face, and worried more about sneaking around? The KB/Mouse combo becomes a liability.

The only games that benefit from a KB/M are games where the camera's fixed and being pixel perfect is an advantage. So RTS and FPS work out very well in those cases.

TPS? TPS games benefits from having the camera be on another non discrete control. MMOs that sit in the third person perspective are a mess of modifier keys that change how the mouse interacts with the UI. How MMO players deal with this is really beyond me. Granted, these games tend to also feature auto-targeting systems so you have one less thing to worry about too...

Game design in the aggregate shouldn't be locked into some soulless orthodoxy where you have to design your game this way or else you'll have players at your door with pitchforks and torches because they don't want to learn how to engage in diverse ways. I mean, games like Senjou No Kizuna just wouldn't work on a KB/M setup.

It's bad enough WASD is what ships standard and rebinding to ESDF means a lot of keys get bounced around(Seriously, who has their hands shifted off the home row? Doesn't anyone touch type anymore?). Heaven forbid you're not using a US style layout and suddenly keys aren't where you expect them to be. Poor French players who have to figure out what to do when games don't support rebinding.

There's this bizarre orthodoxy with you PC gamers. If things aren't exactly the way you demand them to be, everything's terrible and somehow no progress can be made. The only progress we can make is more polygons and more DPI on mice. Clicky keyboards too, make them clickier. more of the same! more of the same! It's ridiculous. I can't stand you people. You're what's wrong with gaming. Console gamers, as a culture, do have their orthodoxy, but it's not this bizarre cult like obsession I see with the Glorious PC Gaming Master Race.

Between your post and the parent post, tell me again why PC gaming is superior?

Which is it, AMD drivers suck or not?

So if you change the game in favor of the mouse then mouse players will win?

Not all games benefit from being pixel perfect. Nor should all games be designed like FPSes. Mechwarrior Online kind of sucks because of this weird focus on the mouse rather than on a joystick. The immersive feeling of holding something that feels otherworldly is amazing. Instead of feeling like a mech simulator, it just feels like COD with LRMs.

This is what I mean by saying that the KB/M limits gameplay.

Uhm?

Source?

True for FPS games, but not all games are FPSes.

Because the type of interaction you have with a joypad is different than a keyboard/mouse. More games should try different input types.

For instance, Katamari Damacy doesn't work on a mouse, period. I mean you could try, but I don't imagine it ending well.

I didn't say it was a great gaming device, just that it was aimed at gaming. I think Nintendo undershot the ROI curve on the investment in hardware. I don't think the tablet/gamepad combo was a terrible idea, I think they just executed poorly on it with regard to size and battery life. The fact that it has a sub 1 frame latency shows they care, but they have their priorities mixed up.

I did say that you can use gamepads on PC.

But there aren't many, if any, high visibility PC games that go out of their way to be hostile to KB/M. In fact, if you are, that's generally seen as a Bad Thing by PC gamers. That's the limitation. Further more, there's no unified controller to design against.

Valve's controller looked interesting, but I don't know if it'll register "Slightly up and to the left on one pad, and all the way down and to the right on the other pad"

That works nearly every single time? Every laptop finger print scanner I've used SUCKED. Accuracy was always terrible AND slow. Granted, I've had limited experience. On a Gateway laptop from 2008 and a Lenovo Thinkpad from 2010.

Touch ID was the first time I've used biometrics and it wasn't a total crapshoot if it'd work.

Two things. First, the PS4 didn't even do video playback on day one. It's a games focused machine. The Wii U is entirely games focused as well. The fact that both can do Netflix isn't so much a statement about consoles becoming entertainment centers, but rather, the dogged determination of Netflix to be EVERYWHERE. The XB1 on the other hand... Well. That's another thing entirely.

(This is also true of the Vita and 3DS. Both of which are strongly focused on games.)

There really is a diminishing return on graphics. At some point, making better graphics just requires more human power.

The problem with the PC is that the control scheme is REALLY limited. Say what you will about two analog sticks and some buttons, but, you get more variety of game play out of that, than you can with KB/M. Moving along 4 dimensions with smooth analog controls is nicer than 2, and using something other than a mouse.

Playing something like Armored Core or Metal Gear just feels nicer on a game pad. Sure, it's less precise, but, more precise isn't exactly more fun. When you're aiming at high speed targets, i'd rather have auto-lock than a mouse.

Samsung doesn't do a pico projector phone anymore.

The problem Samsung has is that they're throwing a lot of shit at the wall hoping something sticks. Like the humidity sensor in the S4. The only thing that has stuck so far has been the Note's SPen. Even then, I don't ever actually see many people use them.