Slashdot is powered by your submissions, so send in your scoop


Forgot your password?
DEAL: For $25 - Add A Second Phone Number To Your Smartphone for life! Use promo code SLASHDOT25. Also, Slashdot's Facebook page has a chat bot now. Message it for stories and more. Check out the new SourceForge HTML5 Internet speed test! ×
User Journal

Journal Journal: Deeper and deeper... 2

It's interesting (as much as any of this is interesting :-/ ) how much space Pamela is now using to discuss Pamela, and to discuss the "attacks" on Groklaw.

Yes. More "attacks".

  • "An Enderle Blow by Blow

    Dated: Thursday, August 12 2004 @ 12:57 PM EDT

    I should probably preface my remarks by explaining that by "blow by blow" I don't mean anything physical, and this is not a threat against Rob Enderle. He seems a bit on edge lately, and I surely don't wish to send him over the top, while he's brooding about Groklaw. Because he went on and on about carrying guns in his keynote speech at SCOForum last week, I expect keeping him calm is the prudent course. At least, that is what my friends are telling me. The word blow can mean many things. The wind can blow, for example, or think blow as in blowhard. Here I use blow by blow to mean step by step..."

huh.. After expending so much effort explaining her choice of words, and how Pamela is *not* trying to imply any correlation between violence and Robert Enderle, all the while bringing up guns, and how he's "brooding about Groklaw", why not just use different words?

Could be that the entire monologue is deliberate and self-referential. "I've got to use these words, because they convey just exactly what I want to imply about Robert Enderle, even though I'm also going to expend a lot of energy explaining that while I said *this* I didn't mean *that*."

But why not just say so? Doesn't make as good press, perhaps, now that Pamela is a "journalist".

Pamela finishes off with this descent into more self-referential paranoia:

  • "...Why All the Attacks on Groklaw?

    So, bottom line: why all the attacks on Groklaw all of a sudden? And why no Enderle apology? He didn't even apologize for his foul language. I will give you my theory. I noticed that Darl McBride in his speech at SCOForum made some predictions, after he took a jab at Groklaw too. He said he commended "open blogs" and sites like Slashdot, where everyone is free to say whatever they wish. He falsely claimed that any time anything positive is left as a comment on Groklaw, I remove it. Actually, I have no recollection of ever seeing a positive comment about SCO here on Groklaw and I certainly haven't removed any as a result. Really. And he predicted that "open blogs" like Slashdot will start to tell SCO's side of the story, and then the media will get to understand what is really going on.

    I interpret this to mean that SCO is arranging an astroturf campaign. How else could he predict future behavior on Slashdot? I also understand that they must have left comments on Groklaw that got deleted by moderators. I can't recall that I have ever seen any comments deleted that were positive toward SCO. I do delete bad language and obvious trolls.

    They call it astroturf because it's phony, as in phony grass.

    Ah, yes. The corporate version of free speech. So, I suggest that if and when you read nonsense about Groklaw ("I used to love Groklaw, but now PJ [fill in the blank]"), just consider the likely source. Of course, an astroturf campaign depends upon a non-moderated site, which explains McBride's sudden fondness for Slashdot.

    I do promise them one thing. I'll report on any SCO astroturf campaigns I see, as I now believe McBride's prediction indicates they will happen. This is why Enderle really can't say he's sorry, I expect. If the campaign is set to go forward, and this speech marked the kick-off, an apology would get in the way."

It's all about Groklaw, all the time.

Groklaw: a legend in Pamela's mind.

And, yeah, that's the way it is now: if you disagree with Pamela, suddenly, clearly, obviously you're a nasty AstroTurfer®

Clearly on the payroll, clearly just doing what you're told, clearly a nasty, nasty person.


OK, Pamela, whatever you say.


User Journal

Journal Journal: Interesting, interesting... 3


What *really* got Pamela pissed off at me was my suggestion/question about whether OSRM was taking the information produced by the posters to Groklaw and incorporating that information into their "product".

That question generated several angry emails from her, and really (OK: IMHO..) was the cause of the famous Pamela-shaming:

  • "I'm also ashamed of some of you. Next time, I suggest you get all the facts before you speak..."

OK, OK, so I *won't* go into the question as to just how the hell it is that Pamela has the guts to be shaming anyone, but any way time (a week?) passes...

And then we have:'t%20over%20yet...&type=article&order=ASC&hideanonymous=0&pid=182424#c182460

  • "In the OSRM paper, it mentions the plan. We are preparing some educational materials to teach anyone who wishes to learn how to do a search for prior art, from a legal perspective, and we will then go hunting..."

To which I replied:'t%20over%20yet...&type=article&order=ASC&hideanonymous=0&pid=182460#c182818

  • Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, August 11 2004 @ 01:16 AM EDT

    >>> We are preparing some educational materials to teach anyone who wishes to learn how to do a search for prior art, from a legal perspective, and we will then go hunting. <<<

    will the people who are doing OSRM's research be paid?

    or will they be expected to volunteer their labor toward the "Good of the Cause"?

At the moment (Wed Aug 11 13:17:31 PDT 2004) that post has not been answered.

Of course, it hasn't been deleted, either, so we're making progress!


User Journal

Journal Journal: Groklaw: point, counterpoint

trolls getting smarter
Authored by: PJ on Tuesday, August 10 2004 @ 03:17 AM EDT

They, the trolls, are still here. I do nuke them when I see them. Look for discussions about Groklaw and how awful I am and how our stats are going down and people are leaving blah blah. SCO is seriously fighting us now. I delete trolls when I see them and they are obvious, but that is the tack they are taking. I should say resuming. Old timers here will remember they also said Groklaw was going down hill about 9 months ago, the last time we had a major troll invasion. Groklaw did not go down hill.

I absolutely will not allow Groklaw to be abused the way Slashdot was the other day, with heaps of trolls writing about how they want to get paid instead of writing software for free, etc. It's stupid to let ourselves be used. So, to the trolls: either get so smart I can't identify you or leave voluntarily or get tossed out the door. You are not welcome here. We're too busy working to defeat you to get sidetracked into troll discussions. And just so you know: we have hundreds of new members since SCOForum. Notice the new award we just won? We are not going downhill at all.

And to the troll who said all the lawyers have left, you are so mistaken. If you raise your eyes up to the top of the page, you will see that this article was contributed to Groklaw by a lawyer. He is by no means the only lawyer regularly posting here. That's what I mean about getting smarter. Of all days to say the lawyers have all left, you pick the day a lawyer sent me an article to post. Sheesh.

There are lots of places you can attack me on the Internet. Sincere criticism is sometimes sent to me by email, and I don't mind. Groklaw isn't about Groklaw, though. All that is off-topic here. That's not the topic we are discussing. This is a working site. We are busy doing research, not having discussions about life or Groklaw's merits or demerits. If you can do a better job, have at it, by all means.

Anyway, Groklaw is mine. It's like you are invited to my house for dinner. You can't sit down and then tell all the other guests my cooking isn't what it used to be and you don't much like my decor. You can leave and say that any where you wish. But it's rude in my own place at my own table eating food I prepared. Anyone who doesn't like the steaks Groklaw's cookin' up is free to leave and pay for a Big Mac down the road apiece.

My reponse, soon to be deleted, I'm sure...

trolls getting smarter
Authored by: talks_to_birds on Tuesday, August 10 2004 @ 09:44 AM EDT

You deleted some of my posts, PJ.

I'm sure you know this. I'm sure you keep a list of IP addresses of all those "trolls" and other criminals who dare to disagree with you attitude and your policies, and who are completely put off by your growing hubris and paranoia.

I cannot, in good conscience, continue to lend my considerable efforts ( ) to a place and a person who is daily becoming more and more the diametric opposite of what she professes to hold so dear: the principles of "free" as in freedom and "open" as in available.

There is now, thanks to you, PJ, neither freedom nor openness practiced here at Groklaw.

Instead, we have narrowmindedness, blaming, and censorship.

Your narrowmindedness *is* putting people off, PJ, people are visiting Groklaw less, and fewer are posting mainly because they dislike the increasingly narrow-minded and intollerant mindset that has taken over here, entirely with your approval and your actions.

Groklaw is becoming, to repeat some of the deleted posts, an echo chamber, an ingrown "club" for same-thinkers, and a place of intollerance and narrowmindednes.

You should be proud of yourself, PJ: you really screwed this one up.

In closing, even though you persist in the mindset that you are somehow doing all this deeply hidden within the most personal and private sanctity of your own home, ponder for a moment or two, if you possibly can, that the whole world has been watching what you've become.


APA analysis, SCO Unix "timeline" and more, see:

User Journal

Journal Journal: Beyond Groklaw: the SCO battles without the baggage

There are other ways to stay on top of the SCO versus world+dog scene without having to use Groklaw.

(And interestingly, these alternate methods are becoming faster at delivering the information than Groklaw is...)


Going to the source requires a bit more reading, which implies that you have been|are going to|will from now on put a bit more effort into keeping up with what's going on.

I know it makes my head ache some times :-/

Anyway, here's two good, up-to-date sources for the real skinny:

and, of course:

Here's another one; this is LamLaw, and it's interesting because the guy *is* a lawyer.

He mostly follows Micro$oft and that, but he's been covering SCO as well:



User Journal

Journal Journal: Groklaw, and Free as in Speech 2

Having been on /. for what is now quite a while (although not posting very often for various reasons), and having been on Groklaw as talks_to_birds roughly since mid-winter, I thought maybe this might be a good forum to express my growing concerns about what's been going on at Groklaw, regarding:
  1. censorship
  2. intolerance
  3. a group-think, shark-attack mentality
  4. and the cult-of-personality that's grown up around Pamela Jones, and that is the cause of 1) 2) and 3), above.

    IMHO, of course...

OK: so, at this point, to establish some sort of cred as to having been an active contributor to The Cause® at Groklaw, and not just your random poster there, here's what I've done so far:

Particularly, I've done an extended breakdown of the ( APA and Amendment No. 2 which are what *might* have conveyed something from the Old SCO to Novell around 1995-96 -- something that's still a work-in-progress, and something that I may not get back to, now that all this OSRM/Linux patents shit has hit the fan.

Also, I came across a rather startling revision ( to Eric Levenez' Unix ( Timeline, wherein TSCOG seems quite clearly to be fabricating a direct, unbroken lineage from some Unix variant that TSCOG holds some title to, through Minix, and into Linux itself.

And other than that, I used to hang out on Groklaw *way* too much, adding background to a lot of the posts there, putting the lie to FUD, and just generally fending off the trolls.

But that's "used to" 'cause I've just about bailed entirely.


Because I cannot, in good conscience, support with my presence and my participation the censorship, intollerance, and group-think that's set in at Groklaw, and I won't be associated with Pamela Jones's continued descent into paranoia and blaming. For whatever good Groklaw is performing, there's a case to be made that it's doing damage as well.

Of that last (paranoia and blaming), here's an example from today (08/06/2004) - if it hasn't been deleted already :-/

  • Pro SCO FUD
    Authored by: PJ on Friday, August 06 2004 @ 07:17 AM EDT

    Cute. The truth is I have never yet seen any pro SCO comments on Groklaw.

    Actually, not anywhere. The SCO trolls attack me and Groklaw instead of saying pro SCO stuff.

"..attack me and Groklaw.."

That's the way it is now, at Groklaw.

If it's anything that Pamela doesn't want to hear, or doesn't want to deal with, it's an "attack".

Here was my reply:

  • Pro SCO FUD
    Authored by: Anonymous on Friday, August 06 2004 @ 09:14 AM EDT

    >>> The SCO trolls attack me and Groklaw instead of saying pro SCO stuff. <<<

    So, anyone who has a difference of opinion with you is now an "SCO troll"?

    Pamela, you really need to stop talking to yourself in the mirror, or to that very, very ingrown group of people you trust as "friends".

    Get out into the real world, and try to realize that just because two adults disagree, they aren't attacking one another.

    Now, let's see how long it takes:

    1) for this post to be declared a troll
    2) for me to be told to go away "'cause it's PJ's blog"
    3) and finally, for this post to be deleted, along with so many others that have been deleted in the last few days.

    /* gasp! did he really say "deleted"? It must be Darl hisself! */

    Ready, set, Go!

This was the immediate (six minutes) response:

  • Pro SCO FUD
    Authored by: Latesigner on Friday, August 06 2004 @ 09:22 AM EDT

    Cute, very cute. I assume you have a twisted sense of humor but just in cast I'm wrong it is now 9:25 AM.

    Go away troll.

And so it goes, at Groklaw.

My response to *that* was this:

  • Pro SCO FUD
    Authored by: Anonymous on Friday, August 06 2004 @ 09:25 AM EDT

    Groklaw: home of intolerance and censorship..

    What's that got to do with open and free?

Anyway, whatever...

More later, maybe :-/


Slashdot Top Deals

"If it's not loud, it doesn't work!" -- Blank Reg, from "Max Headroom"