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Journal Em Emalb's Journal: Finally watched Passion of the Christ 58

Journal by Em Emalb

and there are a few things I don't get.

Shotgun style as always:

A lot of people in reviews and in talking to them stated they were openly weeping during the show.

I only came close once, when Mary went to Jesus when he fell and she "flashed back" to when he was a little child. That was a double gulper.

I didn't really feel as much sadness as I did anger...what was he doing that was so wrong?

Maybe that's what people meant.

The way the event was portrayed in the movie, the soldiers were way over board. I know if the Pontif told me to make sure the soldiers didn't kill him, I'd set my ass down right there and make sure. In those days, you didn't play around!

I had always thought Pilate was to blame, but it seems he literally washed his hands of the entire affair. I don't remember reading this anywhere else, that's a rather interesting viewpoint.

It also seems like the Jewish leaders were not trying so much to get rid of a blasphemer, but were more going for the control the crazy guy before he takes away our congregation method. It also shows how sheep-like a mob of people can be.

Obviously, none of us will know exactly how it all went down, but I find Gobson's vision to be quite interesting.

The film was really well done, just like everything else Gibson has directed.

I would like to have any debate center around the movie rather than religion, if at all possible :)

I give this movie a 4/5. Was a very good movie, and a great insight into how one man views his religion and the crucifixion in particular.

(yeah, I'm like a year late on this movie. Sue me.)

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Finally watched Passion of the Christ More

Finally watched Passion of the Christ

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  • do you think the speaking done in aramaic and latin lent anything to the movie, or was it distracting?
    • I thought it lent an air of authenticity to the movie.

      Didn't distract me at all. Subtitles were nice.

      What did you think?
      • dunno. haven't seen it yet =)

        the last movie i saw in a theater was american pie 1. once the mpaa and riaa started in on customers, and coupled with the fact that nothing really good (imo) has come out, i haven't gone back

        the roomies have netflix tho ... hmm
    • I agree that the Aramaic and Latin made the movie seem more authentic. There is just something not right about Jesus speaking English...... :-)
    • Should've been Aramaic and Greek. When Alexander took over the world, he hellenised it so Greek became the lingua franca. When the Roman empire took over from the Greek empire, Greek was still widely spoken, especially in the eastern side of the empire. The western side of the Roman empire spoke Latin, of course. That is why the New Testament was written in Greek (Koine Greek - the language of the man on the street - rather than the fancy greek found in greek literature).

      For authenticity, I would have expe
  • I had always thought Pilate was to blame, but it seems he literally washed his hands of the entire affair. I don't remember reading this anywhere else, that's a rather interesting viewpoint.

    You're kidding, right? BTW, if you get a chance, read Grave's I, Claudius. Good read of contemporary times.
    • nope, not kidding. But, there's plenty of texts out there, maybe I haven't read the same as you have.

      Educate me man. :)
      • Wiki It [wikipedia.org].

        Seriously, it was in the Bible. I just figured everyone knew that.

        And I did take a course in college with a comparative Bible, which basically shows each book and how a story is representated in each and where the gaps are.
        Pretty slick.

        FWIW, haven't seen the movie yet. Dunno if I want to.
        I hear he dies. Is that true? Bummer.
        It's not like he can come back or anything. Unless they treat him like JR in Dallas.
      • that's what some of the hoopla was about, all the blame on the jews none on PP (unfortunate initials).

        I thought the movie was a bit boring, but then I don't particularly enjoy half hour long torture scenes.

        My movie going experience was marred by the couple in front of me (in a packed theater so could not move), one of which did not speak Arameic nor could read English subtitles so the one that could read translated the entire movie to Spanish.

      • Forgot the most important reference (which is why this was buzzing in my head this morning):

        Made damn sure that Pilate
        Washed his hands and sealed his fate

        From Sympathy for the Devil. Heard it this AM.
        Weird, huh. Or did you know that already?
  • But then again the event being portrayed was supposed to be pretty harsh. I am horrified that some people took small children to see this movie; it was not appropriate for younger children. I wish I could answer some of your other questions, but alas my biblical background is pretty sketchy. I did enjoy the movie and I liked that they portrayed the time period accurately (well, as accurate as I can imagine, not being an expert or anything). I do remember that at the time the movie was released, many Jewish
    • According to Christianity, it was not because of the Jews that Jesus died but because of all humanity; Every person that has ever lived contributed their part to the reason for the death.

      As far as "who killed who" it doesn't matter. It had to happen, and the Romans provided the means, while Jesus's felow Jews provided the prosecution.

      Everyone forgets that it wasn't "The Jews Killed Jesus" because JESUS WAS A JEW. How can that be viewed as racist?

      jason
      • According to Christianity, it was not because of the Jews that Jesus died but because of all humanity; Every person that has ever lived contributed their part to the reason for the death.

        Actually, Mel Gibson is the hands that put the first nails in Jesus in the movie. When asked why, he said "Because I did put the nails in Christ... we all did." Our sins are what do it... but Em wants to shy away from religion, so I'll leave it at that.
        • Oops.. Some where else in this journal I got OT on the religious end, but that is because I was answering the "would it affect me if it wasn't Jesus" question which by nature requires an explanation. I think I kept it short and informational.

          jason
      • I don't want to be picky, but as you know I am very picky.

        If the Jews had killed Jesus they could have stoned him to death.

        The Romans killed Jesus, crusifiction is a Roman punishment.

        My sisters boyfriend looks like Jesus, and he's a carpenter. Altough I've been called a Jesus look alike too. I guess everybody with long hair and a beard looks like Jesus.
        • And he probably wasn't Jewish, but Nazarene [wikipedia.org].
        • The Romans killed Jesus, crusifiction is a Roman punishment.

          I dunno, that seems a sophistic sidestep. The jewish leadership (note: not "The Jews") wanted him out of the way, but they didn't want his blood on their hands. They manipulated the Roman system to get the Romans to kill him for them. So if we ignore all the religious stuff about "we all killed Christ", it seems pretty clear that the jewish leaders and the roman leaders collaborated, regardless of Pilate's attempts to dissociate himself from it

          • I don't want to be funny, but Pilate was absolutely NOT Jewish, you might think so with him being the rules of Judea. If he had been Jewish it begs the question why he would enact so many anti-Jewish laws. The whole the Jews killed Jesus was an attempt by the gospal writer to make Jesus palitable to the Romans.

            You might think it's a sophisticated sidestep, but it's actually a documented and accepted sophisticated sidestep.
            • Pilate was absolutely NOT Jewish

              And where did I say he was?

              And I was trying to use sophistic as in "sophistry" not as in "sophisticated".

              Finally, you need to get a grip on the difference between a people and their leaders. I never said "the Jews killed Christ" but it'd be pretty hard to claim that the Sanhedrin had no role. That's what you appear to be doing.

              • Well if you take the gospels word as truth, which I wouldn't, it would be pretty hard to believe that the Sanhedrin had much to do with it at all. Firstly it's inconsistent in that it says that the Sanhedrin met outside the Temple, which was expressly forbidden. Secondly they state that they met in the evening on the day before the sabbath to discuss the fate of Jesus, which is even more strange as the sabbath starts at sun down the day before the actual day and as you know there is no work on the sabbath.
  • I mean, if it were on, and I was there, I'd probably watch it, but I'm not going to go out of my way to do so.

    But, in the slashdot tradition, I should probably join your debate anyway. The Passion of the Christ sucks. Discuss.
  • This is in the Gospels.
    • thanks for the info.

      Good ole Catholic upbringing didn't ever hit on this part that I remember.
      • Only one of the gospels (Matthew - see blazin [slashdot.org]'s reply) specifically mentions Pilate washing his hands. It's interesting to read all four accounts of Pilate's actions side by side [biblegateway.com], and get an impression of what was going on on all sides. I think you're very right about the Jewish leaders' motivations, they weren't worried about the religious aspect so much as the political challenge to their leadership. The people following Jesus as king (see the "Triumphal Entry [biblegateway.com]" into Jerusalem days earlier, where the mob t
      • To me, Pilate sounds like he's pleading with the Sanhedrin and the people to let Jesus go -- he repeatedly says he sees no crime here and only agrees to crucify Jesus when the people choose Barabas over him (the "choose between them" setup itself was sort of an attempt by Pilate to get Jesus off the hook).

        Only when nothing else works does he (literally) wash his hands of the whole affair, refusing to take on any guilt for Jesus' death.

        Thus, interestingly, Pilate could be seen as the voice of reason in t

        • My wife didn't cry during this movie either.

          She came very close, but we both went in to the movie expecting gruesome senseless violence.

          I get the sadness people felt, really.

          But all in all, He had to die. Had to. Therefore, I can empathize with His suffering, but it had to be done.

          Got me through the movie easier.

          Braveheart had a few moments too. Mel is g00t.
  • New International Version (NIV)

    When Pilate saw that he was getting nowhere, but that instead an uproar was starting, he took water and washed his hands in front of the crowd. "I am innocent of this man's blood," he said. "It is your responsibility!"

  • A lot of people in reviews and in talking to them stated they were openly weeping during the show.
    I only came close once, when Mary went to Jesus when he fell and she "flashed back" to when he was a little child. That was a double gulper.

    I'm one that openly admitting to weeping. That part is what did me in. The lashing were tough to watch. What you saw as anger (ok, I think he realizes he's in f-in pain!), I saw in sadness (Geez... I get it... can't you stop now??). I got a very hopeless feeling ab
    • I actually had an interesting (to me at least) question. If you had seen the exact same thing, but it was about someone other than Jesus, would you have been as emotionally affected?

      I'm curious as to whether your religious views played a large part in the sorrow, or just what was happening in general. I would assume both I guess. Although, I'm not really a Christian, I could see it making me cry or choke up just because of the brutality.
      • I dunno... I'm guessing a little of both, also. I haven't seen anyone brutalized like that before so I can't tell you how I feel about it. Now-a-days, if someone did that, though, I may feel more like Em... extreme anger and desire to smack said person around...
      • If it where any other person in history that wrongly died at the hands of a mob with a government just wanting to restore order, it would not have affected me near as much. The reason is that if any other person was being executed in such a way, it would have no bearing on me personally.

        But Jesus died because of ME. If the entire world of humanity were perfect, but I was the only sinner that needed salvation for my deeds, then God would have done the same thing.

        From that point of view the flogging and d
      • What made me cry was the realisation that it was my fault He went through that. I came home in a daze horrified that my weakness is to blame for his suffering, and that I will continue to sin still even after seeing that film. "Why do I do that to you?" That was my prayer that night.

        • Well I know I'm not doing anything to hurt Jesus. I had nothing to do with any of that whatsoever and I don't feel like we should have guilt hung over our heads for something we have NO control over.

          I'm trying my best to be a good person for me and my loved ones. Guilt would destroy that for me.
          • It's really not about guilt. The message of Christianity can be boiled down to a fairly simple statement:

            You aren't ever going to be good enough to earn your way into Heaven. However, because God is merciful, He sent His Son to die in your (and my) place, to pay the penalty for our sins.

            One sin is all it takes, and no amount of good deeds you do will make up for it. (If you think that, then you're misinterpreting the book of James). But, by grace we are redeemed.

            • You aren't ever going to be good enough to earn your way into Heaven. However, because God is merciful, He sent His Son to die in your (and my) place, to pay the penalty for our sins.

              That really sounds like a guilt trip to me! "Oh you suck, so I sent my son to die for you 2000 years before you were born you little piece of crap--it's all because of you even though you weren't even born. Oh, and I love you too."

              What an odd message to send.
      • I openly admit to uncontrollable weeping during the last part of the movie. The scene that got me balling is when Jesus is carrying the cross. He stumbles and falls. Mary comes up the ally to his side ot help him up. Then Jesus looks up, with blood all over his face, exhausted, and says "see Mother, I make all things new." At that point, I lost it. Considering that I am pretty darned atheist, and it STILL affected me as such, then yes I could say that if it were any other person I would have had the sa
    • There... allow the flaming to commence!

      Ok, I will. 5-10 tables? Come on, ya wuss. That's not even worth my time. The smallest I play on is the 25-50, usually the 50-$1, and sometimes the $1-$2. You'll find me mostly in Turbo SnGs ($15, $30, and $55).

      Anyways, gimme an IM again (prolly Thurs) and I'll play a few tables at once :)

      -Ab
      • As long as its NL tables, I'm up for it (I find the 5-10 are the easiest, cause you can bully people around easier and a lot of people get their 1k and dump it on stupid hands... easy money). Thursday and Friday I'm in Chicago on business, and probably won't have net access...
        • what limits you play FK?

          I'm still whoring bonuses. :O

          Right now is a good time to get them, if you play break even poker you can make an easy $1k, in a couple 3-4 months.
          • For the record, I'm playing at pokerstars.net. Its fake money.
            I normally play 5/10 no limit. But I can jump up and play with the big boys from time to time, also. Lower limits are better for me. I know how to bully amateurs around and win almost constantly.
            • 5/10 no limit fake money?
              Crikey bro, that's rich. :D

              Fake money games are nothing at all like "straight cash homey" games.

              I found that out the first time I took the plunge.

              fun fun fun.

              Next time you get some spare cash sink $50 or so into poker stars and play the $.10-$.25 NL. You'll like it.

              ta ta.
  • you have to also remember that this movie is not really an adaptation of scripture. it is an adaptation of visions that some mystic nuns had.

    as usual, if you want entertainment, watch the movie; if you want accuracy, read the book [tniv.info].
  • but i did see the south park about it. i liked the south park.
  • I was kinda weirded out by the snakes, and the bald dude/ette reminiscent of smashing pumpkins. And the children laughing like demons. Those parts were weird and I don't remember the bible having any of those occurrences.

    I brought my mom to watch the movie and she was in tears. I was close, but knowing the story and in addition knowing the reason why he died made me enjoy this film. Very powerful direction, but not sure if I like the supernatural stuff.
    • I thought it was the Devil basically saying here I am, I can stop all of this if you just say the word.

      I liked it. As I said, a very very well done movie.

      I thought Mel did an awesome job, and the Devil being there the whole time was a nice touch.

      I think the children laughing and tormenting Judas was a nice touch too, because he just kinda gets glossed over after he gives up Jesus.

      Had no idea he hung himself though. I'm thinking more creative license there, but I'll wiki it and see...

  • Yes, I weeped several times through the movie. Several people have wondered aloud, "Would it have affected you the same had it been anyone else?". Speaking as a Christian, I'd have to say "No." Seeing someone treated like that would have upset me, yes, but I can't say I would have been affected in the same magnitude.

    As a Christian, I believe that his death had personal meaning for me. As others have said, the Jews didn't kill Jesus, I did. He stepped out of the glory of heaven to take on human form

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