How will you enforce this short of installing spyware on PCs which companies are doing in increasing numbers ...the ones using that to justify RTO. Remember people can use mouse jugglers and just use their USB ports like the ones caught at Wells Fargo.

Also, real estate values. Many renewals have butts in seats requirements as the landlords feel left out not collecting at the deli in the basement and parking lots. So it's 5 days a week to make the one landlord richer

I could see if I were a CEO or leadership and saw this over a large sample set I would freak out and implement a RTO. I would realize it is true that clocking in and clocking out may work great on an assembly line a century ago in a factory and people clocking in 15 minutes would hit numbers FAST, however I can't have people logging in only 4 to 5 hours a day.

We have spyware at my employer in which I HATE so my boss let me know when he caught me tired using my phone to log into teams and it was 8am and not 7am that one day. But the other option is he sends me into the office 5 days a week.

But how do you measure productivity? This things are hard. Is it projects? How do you determine the correct labor hours for a project? A previous employer had this drop and they got rid of hybrid work and it is one of the reasons I left.

I like to think we are all adults but I do admit I goofed one day and so has everyone else every now or then. I also have a friend at a bank and he said RTO fixed IT issues like a bank manager needing to get a block removed for a new credit card for a customer. No one would answer in Teams and it was hours later. After RTO instant contact. So return to office was a success and leaders agreed remote work is just not effective and we debated this.

Internal data and other sources such as the Bureau of Labor Statistics showed workers averaged 2.6 hours less than their in office counterparts. AAA touted WFH as the great savior of new talent until their spyware revealed people logged in less than 4 hours a day. Now it is BUTS IN SEATS after the CEO saw this.

Microsoft said they would continue their WFH and hybrid policy unless there was a drop in productivity. I guess part of their new collaboration aka PHB term for micro managing people to track attandance, potty time, and phone use, is now all the rage.

Part of me is so angry. A few bad apples blew it! I work in IT like many ./'ers and met people who worked multiple jobs in secret and weren't available in Teams until like after 11am.

The data now vs 2020 is polar opposite and people took advantage of it. Now I have to commute and waste 30 hours a month driving and tearing up my expensive car so I can be watched at work like I am 12 because people lack accountability and self discipline. I am also dissapointed as I thought society would evolve in a new era as the office was an outdated 19th/20th century concept. Oh well.

Socialism with American Characteristics

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Indeed, I fully agree. The funny thing is, monthly numbers would help us move away from the distortions of the quarterly cycle. If key data reporting becomes frequent enough, you can't get into a cycle of "do adverse-numbers stuff early in the quarter and then cram positive-numbers stuff into the end of the quarter". You have to - *gasp* - just run your business normally.

Some businesses could still manage to switch to a monthly cycle, but anyone who deals significantly in transoceanic feedstocks/parts/goods shipments won't be able to.

BLS numbers aren't some sort of dark art. They're literally just the compiled numbers reported by companies. Numbers are what they are. To fight against jobs numbers is to fight against reality.

People get confused by the existence of revisions. The problem is that not all data gets reported in a timely manner. When late data comes in, it causes revisions to the earlier reported numbers, either up or down.

Firing the head of the BLS because you don't like what numbers US companies reported is just insane Banana Republic-level nonsense.

We have hybrid now yes but I knew one colleague who worked a 2nd job in secret and got caught and over employed was huge on Reddit so you are right.

IT did have remote roles pre COVID but these mandates hit them too as no one is allowed to work anymore at home for a lot of these companies. We waste so much on gas and time just to take calls an hour a way each day

If everyone and their brother is RTO now. Target and Klarna also justed all all WFH this week as well then there is a good reason.

I really do think login hours and reports like I described is why and theory X not Theory Y management is the main factor. If every employee works 2 hours a day that is 40 hours of lost productivity a month assuming a 20 day work week in the eyes of management every month

How is Linux, kubernetes, and other open source advancing without an actual office ... You know for collaboration?

Collaboration is code for micro managing as they don't trust their employees to work independently.

If there is a deadline I don't want my employees leaving at 3pm to beat the 2 hour commute with traffic and pick up a kid. I don't want my employees to have stress from their marriage but forcing them to come home late so I can watch them work.

In such an event working late at home together gets it done more efficiently

They don't exist anymore. It's all in office now or hybrid if you are very lucky. It's so frustrating

I don't buy it. That might have worked for Twitter and Amazon back in 2022 when there was places still remote to jump but not today.

Name one employer that is remote? Salesforce RTO, Amazon RTO, Oracle RTO, Meta RTO, etc. Target and Klarna joined the return to office bandwagon too.

Literally that and Musk forcing the government to RTO destroyed the phenomenon and it's all pre COVID. Bosses don't trust people to work at home anymore is why

What by being watched like children to make sure they are not 5 minutes late or have their phones with managers staring at their screens? That is how they progress?

Every tech giant is 5 days a week or hybrid now. These places are the best to work at and prestigious?! If even they can't trust their employees to stay productive then what hope does anyone else? I blame you all (mostly WFH techies ruining that)

BLS and AAA showed employees login 2.6 hoursless hours per day than their in office counterparts. AAA as a result ended their great WFH perk and have butts in seats 5 days a week. I know one college who worked 2 jobs remotely in secret. Reddit has sooo many over employed posts. It makes me angry

Productivity is not where it needs to be with Remote workers and we have ourselves to blame. In 2021 yes it was higher but who seriously iogs in for a full day?? No one. They login with their phones and sleep until their first meeting.

Anyway end rant. I still work from home but I expect a call back to the office soon. Who does remote anymore?

Yes, he fired the same person who was ultimately responsible for putting out crap numbers.

US reporting has always been the gold standard. Nobody has accused the BLS of "crap numbers" until Trump decided he didn't like them. It's is so way outside the norms it doesn't even resemble something that could conceivably happen in the US; this is banana republic-level stuff.