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Comment Re:This was not a screw-up (Score 2) 397

yet puts their own military headquarters smack in the middle of Tel Aviv.

And yet, you know exactly where it is. It is not used for civilian purposes.

I realize you are trying to make the two sound the same, but they really are nothing alike. Placing a distinctly military base in some proximity to civilians is not the same as using some poor shmoe's house as a weapon storage, and then instructing him and his family at gun point not to leave, even when the IDF is phoning in telling them they are about to bomb it.


Comment Re:Israel hasn't vowed to "wipe Iran off the map" (Score 1) 441

I'd ask you to tone down the ad hominem in order to further a constructive discussion, but I get the feeling you are not interested in a constructive discussion.

Can you explain what an operation designed to prevent a ship filled with refugees from leaving, but ended up killing them by mistake has to do with terrorism?

Are you serious? It's not supposed to instill terror in deportees or the British authorities that deportee ships were active bombing targets? LOL!

No. It was supposed to prevent the British from deporting Jews that Haganah wanted to stay in Palestine by disabling the ship's motor. It was miscalculated, however, and sunk the ship.

Now, you either disagree with that statement, or agree with it but still see it as an act of terror. If the former, please cite your sources. If the later, well, I'd have to agree with you that there is intellectual dishonesty in this thread and leave it at that.

Yes, you're clearly intellectual dishonest.

Ad hominem.

Just a few of Palmach's terrorist activities, the Night of Bridges, the Night of Trains, Numerous ambushes against British and Arab personnel, numerous bombings (especially radar installations,)

I see it as one army fighting another

Of course you do, that's how you lie to yourself that it wasn't terrorism.

Ad hominem again. Also, you did not point to any criteria by which you distinguish between what I said and what you said.

If that isn't terrorism, then there is no such things as terrorism.

Terrorism is targeting civilians. Terrorism is targeting individuals unrelated to your "cause", whatever it is. What's your definition?

Really, Arabs shooting at a bus with Jews on it. That's the foundations of modern terrorism - LOL. Not bombing hotels. If that's the case then "modern terrorism" was invented in the 18th century in America.

Targeting a civilian bus is terrorism. Targeting the British army headquarters, which, yes, resided in a Hotel, is a legitimate military act. I cannot be more clear on what marks one as terrorism and the other as not. You, however, seem to sling insults as a way to settle the discussion. Oh, and write "LOL".

If you're looking for a discussion on the points, please feel free to reply.


Comment Re:Israel hasn't vowed to "wipe Iran off the map" (Score 1) 441

Can you cite any terror acts carried out by Haganah?

What a very carefully phrased question. Something the Iranian government would likely ask "Can you cite any terror acts that we have carried out?"

You mentioned Haganah specifically, citing its foundation of the IDF as the reason for continuity. So I asked about Haganah. For the record, I fully consider Palmach part of Haganah, and would love to hear terror acts done by it in this reference, too.

If you didn't want to be asked this specifically, you shouldn't have phrased your accusation in this way.

Fortunately, it's easy to point out where the Haganah actively and directly used terrorism to achieve its goals - try learning about the SS Patria.

From Merriam Webster:

Terrorism(n): the use of violent acts to frighten the people in an area as a way of trying to achieve a political goal

Can you explain what an operation designed to prevent a ship filled with refugees from leaving, but ended up killing them by mistake has to do with terrorism?

Read up on their Palmach unit.

I know about Palmach. Again, I'd like you to be specific, because it seems our understanding of what constitute proof is vastly different.

Learn what happened after Ben Gurion's famous October 1st (1945) decision.

I see it as one army fighting another. I understand you don't. Personally, I think you'd be hard pressed to convince people that military actions, directed solely against military targets, and attempting to avoid hurting civilians where possible are "terrorism". If you do not agree with that, you will find that every single army in the world that has ever participated in any armed conflict is a terrorist. I doubt that's where you're heading.

By the way, were you aware that the Haganah explicitly approved the bombing of the Hotel David? Explicit as in "carry out the operation" explicit.

Are you aware that the hotel was the British army's headquarters (thus, a legitimate military target)? Are you aware that an advance warning was given (though not properly passed through and acted upon) in order to minimize casualties? Again, it's a hard press to call attacking a military target "terrorism".

The bombing of ships known to be carrying deportees, and the bombing of civilian facilities (e.g. King David Hotel) is the foundation of modern terrorism - ironically adopted by the very people the State of Israel displaced and marginalized.

Aside from the flaws I already mentioned in this argument, it is simply false. The foundations of modern terrorism is targeting civilians, striking targets based on affiliation rather than military relevance, indoctrinating populations that death is a high cause, and that achieving it for both yourself and your enemy is worth more than preserving and cultivating life.

You are correct that these foundations are found in actions carried out in Palestine as far back as the early 20th century. You are, however, missing the culprit. Firing at civilian buses merely because its occupants are Jews and accidentally killing an innocent, unrelated Arab with a bomb, and then declaring him Shahid are actions that Arab radicals in Palestine were doing well before the 1930's. These are the foundations of modern terrorism.


In other words, perhaps you should learn a little bit more about what happened before.

That's what my previous reply was meant to be. You were specifying actions I was not aware of, and I asked for citations. Turns out, I disagree with your analysis (or, possibly, you were more ignorant on those matters than you thought you were). There is no reason to sound smug about your answer. This is how discussion is supposed to go.


Comment Re:Intimidate Iran or Undermine the Iran Nuke Deal (Score 1) 441

Israel have stated they won't be the first to introduce weapons to the middle east.

I'm assuming you meant nuclear weapons, rather than any weapons. The ship has definitely sailed on that.

Still not true, though. Israel has stated that they won't be the first to use non-conventional weapons.


Comment Re: Arab-ISraelis - conscription (Score 1) 441

The real test is when Israel demands conscription from them. Only when Arab Israelis are trusted to guard their fellow Jews can Israel claim to be a democracy.

This I agree with, and there is already talk of changing this, but not clear if reforms will actually be implemented.

Any MKs who dares to suggest mandatory service of any kind (even merely community service in lieu of actual military service that Jewish citizens are required to do) is immediately labeled as a racist.

You make it sound like Israel is racist for not letting Israeli Arabs serve in the army. The truth of the matter is that this is a point of honor for Arab political leaders to head off any attempt of any mandatory service, of any kind whatsoever.


Comment Re:Israel hasn't vowed to "wipe Iran off the map" (Score 1) 441

I'm not anti-semetic by any stretch of the imagination

So far, all I see is ignorance.

try examining the roots of modern 'terrorism' followed by the role of the Haganah

Now, if you said Ezel or Lechi were terrorists, I'd at least see where you came from. Can you cite any terror acts carried out by Haganah?

Also, can you cite the connection you draw between those actions and modern terrorism?

Making assertions in a self-confident tone is easy. Do try to keep them accurate, however.


Comment Re:Class-Action time? (Score 1) 268

It's expensive to line the hall's walls with digital photo frames.

Will it become less so in the future? Maybe. Not in the near future. Also, putting a nail in the wall (and then covering the hole if you want to move it later) is much simpler than making sure there is an electricity outlet nearby. Will remote charging fix that? Maybe, but that is an even more distant future.


Comment Re:Class-Action time? (Score 1) 268

They are not as dirt cheap as inkjets, that's true, but the printer we bought is a very far cry from "bloddy expensive". We bought a low end HP color laser jet. It is painfully slow to start up and to print stuff (I think it's rated at 4 pages a minute, and you can actually see it mulling the PCL commands it is receiving and turning it into a page), but for our purposes (my wife is getting a teacher's certificate) this is more than enough. B&W printing is actually faster, unsurprisingly.


Comment Re:Class-Action time? (Score 1) 268

inkjet printers are built for photos while laser/LED printers excel at text and business graphics.

I keep hearing that, but my personal experience is almost reverse. When I'm printing photos, I always do that on a color laser printer, as the quality is higher.

After some investigation, I came to the conclusion that it's the paper. Normal paper has fibers that cause the ink dots to squash. A laser printer, that presses the ink on the paper, does not cause the ink to smudge.

So I'm faced with either getting really good pictures for cheap (per page), or pay lots more for both more expensive ink AND more expensive paper. I end up simply using a laser for photos, and getting quality which I'm quite satisfied with.


Comment Re:I wait until it quits printing (Score 1) 268

I did that with the cartridges that came with my wife's printer (HP color laser printer). We bought the replacements as soon as the warning came up, but actually replaced them only when it started going bad, which was several months later.

Then the replacement cartridge (black, original HP) started printing with stripes while the printer said it still has 60% left!!!

I went out and bought a replacement (non-original) cartridge.

How's that for extreme YMMV sports?


Retirement means that when someone says "Have a nice day", you actually have a shot at it.