The M.S. Degree vs. Everything Else?

salad_fingers writes "It has been said that the Bachelor's Degree is the new High School Diploma: everybody has one. It is taking a greater investment of time, money and effort on behalf of the individual to give oneself that needed edge in the professional world. I have noticed that in technical fields, specifically engineering, employees are flocking in droves to MBA programs to capitalize on the upcoming retirement of the Baby Boomers, and have largely considered pursuing a graduate degree in a technical field as a waste of time and effort. What does Slashdot see as the future of the M.S. degree versus other available and somewhat non-traditional degrees? What path should engineers pursue for maximum future employability?"

Foot in the door

[PIPBoy3000]

I ended up with a masters in biology education, with no intention of teaching high school science (my student teaching was that bad). Fortunately having a master's degree provides a nice foot in the door. Later on I got several Microsoft certifications, which helped me move from being a programmer to a SQL Server administrator.

There are some professions that are specific to a job, but any master's degree helps in a competitive field. Once you're in, of course, it's all about what you can do.

how to improve your resume

[Anonymous Coward]

1. M.S.
2. Certification (CCNA, MCSE. etc)
3. Actual impressive looking program
4. Bull during the interview on how great you are. That's how I got my job.

The issue here is that degrees are the only way most HR people actually grade prospective employees. And most of them are not even technically inclined. Getting the job is one thing, actually keeping it is another. But still you gotta impress to get the job before you can worry about keeping it

It doesn't matter how good you are, only how good they think you are. In which case all four of the above may be necessary.

My impression

[jellomizer]

As one who is starting an MBA Program. Ill share my insights on this. Getting an M.S. In Computer Science is generally designed for you to enter the PHD program and become more focused in one area of study within Computer Science.

Especially for technology unless your are planning more of a research type job say at Google R&D an M.S. and PHD is a Risky Job venture. Technology changes way to fast what first takes a high level of education to master is soon available as a class library, which you just need to include and it will work out all right or if you are a little more professional about it you see the source, or just see how it work and see in real time the advantages and disadvantages and go "Oh Yea! Why didn't I think of that". Technology based High Level Degrees tend to get out of date faster then say a Physics or Engineering Degree.

The MBA while a Masters level classes are more broad based allowing you to expand your career opportunity vs. limiting your choices. With an MBA it allows you to stay in technology but get higher positions such as management or team leaders, but also it allows you to move away from the technology field if you need or want to.

Party Card

[Anonymous Coward]

Back in the USSR, people talked about "getting your Party Card." It was a validation that showed you had jumped a particular barrier to entry into the elite - didn't matter what you knew, it showed you had the Right Stuff to be allowed entry into that small group that actually got to set the agenda.

Getting an M.B.A. in our culture is like "getting your Party Card." I know, I've got one. People who only have technical degrees are journeymen and tradesmen, they know how to do something but not why. Having your M.B.A. means you've got what it takes to understand The Business, and that trumps anything technical, any time. Having an M.B.A. means that after great effort - it ain't easy - you've learned the language, you've learned the secret handshake, so you can be counted on to understand The Business - be an operator at the level where money is created and decisions are made about investing in all those engineers, operators, plumbers, and carpenters below you.

try Alberta (Canada) for a couple years

[aoteoroa]

What path should engineers pursue for maximum future employability?

seriously

High prices for crude oil are going to stick around for a while. Oil companies litterally can not hire enough people to work. I'm not just talking about push hands and drill pigs. They need engineers, welders, geologists, software developers. Every company out here is starving for employees. If you have a pulse you're hired. Don't have a resume? No problem. Completed a University or Technical program. . . great you're hired. No education? Companies out here will pay for courses.

The economy here in Alberta is so hot that the word "booming" doesn't seem to describe it well enough. Of course there are downsides. Line ups everywhere are huge. If you walk into a coffe shop expect a minimum of 15 minutes to get your latte. Labour shortages have affected every industry.Of course every boom will have a bust. But I don't see that happening in the next couple years and I would hire somebody with two years good experience over somebody with two years more general education.

Figure out what's important

[Meddel]

I struggled with the same questions, both when I was in school getting my Bachelor's and later while working (I'm 26 now, and still haven't come to a conclusion). I was doing my Bachelors in CS at Stanford, and having a great time of it. I didn't see a reason to stop, so I applied for the coterminal Masters program, in which you just keep right on taking classes. I started being a TA for CS classes, and enjoyed teaching. During the summers, I did internships all over the place, and had a good time doing it.

After a couple of years, though, I started thinking about what the goal was. I didn't actually have a reason to want the Masters: it was just a way to keep taking classes. So after five years I had my Bachelors and was partway to the Masters, but I'd had enough. I took a job at Microsoft as a developer, and have been having a great time at that, too.

But lately I've started to think again about what the goal is. Do I want to be a dev forever? I have friends here where that is absolutely their goal. Do I want to run the company? If so, I can either get an MBA, or try to start working my way up through the management chain (there are a bunch of VPs at Microsoft without MBAs). Do I want to do something completely different? I've thought about joining a start-up or working for a consulting house. Maybe I could swing working in another country for a while. The good news is that there's no deadline... I don't need to have this all decided by the time I'm 30.

So look around and figure out where you want to be in five years, and then figure out where that points you for twenty years out. If you're unhappy with that, start thinking with longer horizons in mind. I'll be honest: I've never missed my CS Masters. If I go back to school, it'll be for an MBA.

If your only goal is employability, you're barking up the wrong tree anyway: lawyers are basically always employed, and make more than I do as well. So start figuring out what's important to you besides being employed... I'm guessing it's a longer list than that.

Re:What do you want to be doing?

[tverbeek]

If you're going back to school, get a second degree (bachelor, master, associate, doctor... science, arts, fine arts... whatever) in whatever field you wish you'd gotten the first one in. If you're asking the question, you probably have some dissatisfaction with whatever you spent those first four years studying and where its gotten you. Now that you're not a drunken adolescent, you have a better sense of what you'd really like to be doing. Apply for whatever program of study you qualify for, in that field.

Several years ago when I was at a crossroads in my career, my parents suggested I go back to school. They were thinking I'd follow my BS in CS with an MS in CS. Instead I went for a BFA in Digital Media/Illustration. It hasn't been the road to riches, but I sure am happier with what I'm doing now than what I would have been doing if I'd just stayed in the job market or if I'd returned to the same educational track.

We have a real problem with that

[Sycraft-fu]

I work for a university engineering department and we have a real problem with grad students, particularly foriegn grads, doing that. They get in the masters program without any clear idea why. They aren't interested in research, they jsut want a master's degree. They see it as just another hoop to jump through to get more money. The upshit of this is that they tend to have very fragile knowledge. They are all book smarts. You ask them a question in terms of a formula they learned and you get an answer. You ask them the very same question in terms of the real world you get a blank stare. I mean there's a lab full of peopel that do networking that can't properly work out the subnet their computer is supposed to be in, when you give them the subnet (they kept putting it as a /16 since we are in the class B part of the IP space).

I think your advice is very good: Decide what you want to do, and see if a degree (I'm talking undergrad here) really matters. For some jobs, it's manditory and it has to be in the correct field. For others, it's highly beneficial, but doens't really mater what it is. Still otehrs it helps a little bit, but no more than a year of experience and a good refrence.

For master's, unless it's something that the place you want to work for really wants, you need a personal reason to get it. A master's degree SHOULD be because you enjoy learning about something, and want to work on some orignal research for it. A master's thesis is supposed to be you going out and exploring something. Unfortunately many places (like where I work) will instead let you take a comprehensive exam which is just a hoop to jump though. If that's all you want to do, you shoudln't be getting a master's.

While an undergrad is, for the most part, just a continued somewhat specialized education, a master's is supposed to be mroe research oriented. It should be the kind of thing you do out of personal love, not professional intrest. Because, when you get down to it, what employers REALLY care about is if you can do the job they want. Having a master's degree that is backed by no skills to apply it isn't useful and even if they don't know when interviewing you, they'll figure it out.

You'll get far more jobs through experience and personal references than with a peice of paper. I can't emphasize the personal reference thing enough. Find someone who knows someone who works where you want to. Meet that person, have them give you a reference. It goes a looooong way. Really, I've only ever gotten one job cold, all the rest were because I knew someone who knew someone. Sometimes, there was no interview at all just a "This the guy? Good, you're hired." People trust the opinions of those close to them more than the trust the paper from your alma matter usually.

Delayed Masters!?

[TaoPhoenix]

My career path has been fairly simple. I put more weight to "pick slowly and wisely" than "it's never too late to change".

Some high schools have a Mood. Ours was Pro Science, and somewhat disparaging to business. I did passably well in Freshman year in college, took one glance at the upcoming "only sophomore" Organic Chemistry book, and wilted. I learned I'd rather *read* Scientific American articles in a day than take a year to write one.

I set about good sharp DeepRead of the future, and picked Accounting as a base. Right out of school in 1999 the quick way to some basic experience was in temporary positions. I started well, got a couple basic years down, and ran afoul of the slow economy of 2002-2004. After a bumpy couple of years, my current position is half Accounting blended with half Entry-IT unsquirreling the silly glitches in the accounting software.Sure, I COULD have whipped through some masters classes straight out, but I now feel there are several problems with that approach.

First, Dilbert made famous the Manager Without a Clue. I think that's an easy trap for newly minted MBA's to fall into, because it's easy for that course material to drift into generalities, and wither away at the center. "Look, he thinks he's a hotshot, but he doesn't even know ...." All the best Senior Team crews I ever worked for were the *best* in the office at the line position, and then grafted the managerial stuff on top of it.

Second, it will probably take some time just to grind your way to a solid position in a company somewhere. "6 months to pay off some bills, 6 months to try some stuff, 1 year of bad luck, 2 years getting the foot in the door, 2 years to start to rise."

I graduated with my B.S. in Accounting. My bad luck was a little extended; it's now 2006 and I'm nearing my 2 years of Foot-In-Door. Say a year to plan... Wouldn't a Masters Started in 2008 be worth so much more than one finished in 1999? Accounting is pretty stable, but CS... oh, the horrors of knowing More Than the Universe about Windows 98...

I picked well; I can and do read ravenously for recreation. But my Degree has to pay the rent. My B.S. in Accounting is plenty. I do not wish to be a CPA, or the CFO. Since my interest is slowly veering towards the Comp side of my duties, the ten years quiet delay means that when I finally pin down the perfect course set for a Masters of something, it will be FRESH.

--TaoPhoenix

Comment removed

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

Re:My impression

[Mateito]

"People Skills"

As (yet another) MBA candidate, who also had started a Masters in another discipline (Gas Plasma Physics), I can attest that there is a huge difference between a Masters designed to further your knowledge in your area of speciality, and one designed to give you a broad grounding in a complementary subject.

Anybody who tells you that an MBA is a short cut to a million dollar career is either lying, or attending one of the top 7 or 8 business schools on the planet (spread throughout the USA, Europe and maybe one in Asia). People at that level have probably been managers in the financial and/or operations side of Fortune 500 type companies for several years, or are the offspring of people with lots of money. One way or another, they don't have the time to post to slashdot.

The rest of us, attending normal business schools, might make a few contacts, but the real benefit is learning about how business thinks and works, the jargon behind it, and allow us to identify what the core drivers behind business and business process are, which in turn helps us design our IT infrastructure to move with the business. In the end, if the business doesn't understand how IT can help move it forward, we aren't going to have jobs.... or at least not interesting jobs.

I recommend an MBA to everybody in IT. In the end, we all have to integrate with business at some level. Don't go into it expecting miracles or to be satisfied in the same way as learning a new language or protocol or architecture, but it won't be as bad as you anticipated either and doesn't deserve the cynicism.

Matt